Convicted One And, despite whatever some might choose to believe, I do think that habitat destruction plays a significant role in the perception of "overpopulation".
And, despite whatever some might choose to believe, I do think that habitat destruction plays a significant role in the perception of "overpopulation".
greyhoundsThe Grand Kankakee Marsh has nothing to do with the subject pronghorn antelope herd in Canada.
Well, you brought up NE Illinois...I thought you might be familiar with Dan Parmalee?
Convicted OneTo me, it seems like a real shame that they drained the Grand Kankakee Marsh in the name of progress. Sounds as though it was paradise on earth prior to all the "improvements".
The Grand Kankakee Marsh has nothing to do with the subject pronghorn antelope herd in Canada. I have no opinion on draining the marsh.
CSSHEGEWISCHBeing from Chicago, I'm familiar with the deer overpopulation issue, which seems to be a big deal in the North Shore suburbs. Instead of hiring hunters to thin the herd, it might be easier to let the coyotes drift into the area and serve their purpose as predators.
The coyotes are here now.
tree68 SD60MAC9500 The over population mantra has merit.. If that wasn't so. Oakland County, to the west of me. Would not be sending out deputies to cull deer reducing road strikes.. I grew up in western Oakland County, which is rapidly changing from rural to suburban. Even Livingston County, the next county west from Oakland, isn't as rural as it used to be. Still, there are more miles of gravel roads in the town ship I lived in than the very rural township I now live in in NY.
SD60MAC9500 The over population mantra has merit.. If that wasn't so. Oakland County, to the west of me. Would not be sending out deputies to cull deer reducing road strikes..
I grew up in western Oakland County, which is rapidly changing from rural to suburban. Even Livingston County, the next county west from Oakland, isn't as rural as it used to be.
Still, there are more miles of gravel roads in the town ship I lived in than the very rural township I now live in in NY.
Yes it is.. The major issues with deer are around Rochester Hills. Specifically around Livernois between Avon Rd., and Hamlin Rd.. Back in 2015 on I-75 I struck a small doe up in Mt Morris. It leaped right into my path hitting it at 70. I pulled over and walked back about 1300' didn't see it. It got up and dashed off. $7500+ worth of damage to the front end of my vehicle. Thank goodness for insurance.
There's a flock of Canada geese that like frequenting the retention pond in our sub. I don't mind as long as they don't come into the sub, eating lawns and crapping everywhere. I know that they recognize me. As soon as they see me, they turn around and go back to the pond.
Convicted One Murphy Siding I was born in Alaska and lived in a rural area outside of Anchorage until I was 11. Moose were common on the highways and in yards. They are very dangerous to be around. You're talking about a big, dumb, easy to spook cow with huge horns I am envious of your history, and respect your personal experiences. I've never had an opportunity to "chum up" to a moose, and while I am sure it requires an abundance of caution, under the right set of cirmcumstances, I'm probably foolhardy enough to give it a try. This not being a wildlife forum, I don't want to go too far off on a tangent, lest risk upsetting people. But in brief...my own experiences....I've been amazed with how not-dumb wildlife can be.....once you have earned their trust on an individual level. And that requires more patience than most people are willing to invest. I also find that many people are prone to confusing obedience for intelligence....if the animal fails to respond in an expected way, on a certain cue...they dismiss the animal as "dumb". Often that is an erroneous assumption. Truthfully, the biggest risk I have encountered is once I have established trust with such an animal, I worry that some other unscrupulous human will exploit that to the detriment of the animal. There seems to be no shortage of people who amuse themselves inflicting hardship, thinking it is their birthright. But, uniquely enough, I find that many of the animals I've bonded with can distinguish me as an individual....acting calm and relaxed as I enter the scene....but displaying tense, or cautionary behavior when other folks come waltzing down the path.
Murphy Siding I was born in Alaska and lived in a rural area outside of Anchorage until I was 11. Moose were common on the highways and in yards. They are very dangerous to be around. You're talking about a big, dumb, easy to spook cow with huge horns
I am envious of your history, and respect your personal experiences. I've never had an opportunity to "chum up" to a moose, and while I am sure it requires an abundance of caution, under the right set of cirmcumstances, I'm probably foolhardy enough to give it a try.
This not being a wildlife forum, I don't want to go too far off on a tangent, lest risk upsetting people. But in brief...my own experiences....I've been amazed with how not-dumb wildlife can be.....once you have earned their trust on an individual level. And that requires more patience than most people are willing to invest. I also find that many people are prone to confusing obedience for intelligence....if the animal fails to respond in an expected way, on a certain cue...they dismiss the animal as "dumb". Often that is an erroneous assumption.
Truthfully, the biggest risk I have encountered is once I have established trust with such an animal, I worry that some other unscrupulous human will exploit that to the detriment of the animal. There seems to be no shortage of people who amuse themselves inflicting hardship, thinking it is their birthright. But, uniquely enough, I find that many of the animals I've bonded with can distinguish me as an individual....acting calm and relaxed as I enter the scene....but displaying tense, or cautionary behavior when other folks come waltzing down the path.
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
Being from Chicago, I'm familiar with the deer overpopulation issue, which seems to be a big deal in the North Shore suburbs. Instead of hiring hunters to thin the herd, it might be easier to let the coyotes drift into the area and serve their purpose as predators.
SD60MAC9500The over population mantra has merit.. If that wasn't so. Oakland County, to the west of me. Would not be sending out deputies to cull deer reducing road strikes..
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Convicted One tree68 Conservation officials here in northern New York are concerned about reduced numbers of hunters. That translates into a reduced take, and an increase in the numbers of car/deer collisions. I'm not trying to pick a fight with you, but the "over population" mantra tends to get trotted out around here (Northern Indiana) whenever there is a car/deer collision, frequently by guys I know well enough to be sure they have SELDOM bothered to research any fact ouside of a sporting context. If there TRULY was an"overpopulation" problem, I think there would be ample evidence of starvation..... Personally, I tend to think it's more a matter that anytime there is a conflict between man and beast, the beast get's the rap. eg "If I ran into one of them, then that's one too many of them". I more suspect the cause of the collisions we have around here, are due to the animals becoming habituated to human presence. They come nearer to our doings as they become more accustomed to our presence. And are ill prepared to deal with some of our behavior. I really don't think that is so much proof of "overpopulation", as some might be willing to claim.
tree68 Conservation officials here in northern New York are concerned about reduced numbers of hunters. That translates into a reduced take, and an increase in the numbers of car/deer collisions.
I'm not trying to pick a fight with you, but the "over population" mantra tends to get trotted out around here (Northern Indiana) whenever there is a car/deer collision, frequently by guys I know well enough to be sure they have SELDOM bothered to research any fact ouside of a sporting context.
If there TRULY was an"overpopulation" problem, I think there would be ample evidence of starvation.....
Personally, I tend to think it's more a matter that anytime there is a conflict between man and beast, the beast get's the rap. eg "If I ran into one of them, then that's one too many of them".
I more suspect the cause of the collisions we have around here, are due to the animals becoming habituated to human presence. They come nearer to our doings as they become more accustomed to our presence. And are ill prepared to deal with some of our behavior. I really don't think that is so much proof of "overpopulation", as some might be willing to claim.
The over population mantra has merit.. If that wasn't so. Oakland County, to the west of me. Would not be sending out deputies to cull deer reducing road strikes..
Convicted One Really? How many auto/auto collisions did you have? Perhaps it's not the deer population that has grown to non-useful proportion?
Really? How many auto/auto collisions did you have? Perhaps it's not the deer population that has grown to non-useful proportion?
Sometimes the best thing to do is get rid of the fence.
Anyone out west in states like CO and WY knows what sheep jumps are. If antelope or deer (or moose or elk) winds up being chased along the R/W fence on the track or road side, there is a 6 ft dirt ramp and cattle chute to get the critters back on the side they belong on. It is not a railroad standard, but BNSF is trying these sheep-jumps out in some known problem areas.
In the Powder River Basin, often have had coal trains chase antelope at us on the R/W between the fences. We got in the habit of placing our survey trucks to protect our GPS equipment and us so they diverted around us instead of through us.
Have seen plenty of antelope run staight though fences like the fence isn't there, between the wires and at a dead run. Deer don't do that. (and cattle )... What we saw many times were the adult antelope on the wrong side of the fence with the young on the opposite side keeping pace.
In Glenwood Canyon, the issue is Elk and Mountain Sheep instead of antelope.
Murphy Sidingur city had something like 33 automobile / deer collisions last year- on town.
greyhoundsIn this northeast corner of Illinois there have been problems with deer overpopulation. They’ve hired professional hunters to limit that population. (This drove some people nuts.) The deer don’t starve but they do harm and destroy native vegetation. They have no natural predators here, so the deer population does get too high at times.
To me, it seems like a real shame that they drained the Grand Kankakee Marsh in the name of progress. Sounds as though it was paradise on earth prior to all the "improvements".
Murphy SidingI was born in Alaska and lived in a rural area outside of Anchorage until I was 11. Moose were common on the highways and in yards. They are very dangerous to be around. You're talking about a big, dumb, easy to spook cow with huge horns
Convicted OneI'm not trying to pick a fight with you, but the "over population" mantra tends to get trotted out around here (Northern Indiana) whenever there is a car/deer collision, frequently by guys I know well enough to be sure they have SELDOM bothered to research any fact ouside of a sporting context. If there TRULY was an"overpopulation" problem, I think there would be ample evidence of starvation.....
It was an article in the paper the other day.
One must remember that I live in a part of NY state that many don't realize exists. I can stand on my back porch and view the Big Dipper while listening to the only vehicle in motion for miles as while it's still a couple of miles outside of the hamlet where I live. And, I live not far from the six million acre "forever wild" Adirondack Park.
I've been hearing multiple car/deer collisions daily on the scanner - and responded to one a few nights ago.
And we do get reports from time to time about the deer herd suffering due to overpopulation.
Convicted OneI'm not trying to pick a fight with you, but the "over population" mantra tends to get trotted out around here (Northern Indiana) whenever there is a car/deer collision, frequently by guys I know well enough to be sure they have SELDOM bothered to research any fact ouside of a sporting context. If there TRULY was an"overpopulation" problem, I think there would be ample evidence of starvation..... Personally, I tend to think it's more a matter that anytime there is a conflict between man and beast, the beast get's the rap. eg "If I ran into one of them, then that's one too many of them". I more suspect the cause of the collisions we have around here, are due to the animals becoming habituated to human presence. They come nearer to our doings as they become more accustomed to our presence. And are ill prepared to deal with some of our behavior. I really don't think that is so much proof of "overpopulation", as some might be willing to claim.
Murphy Siding Convicted One And, I'll admit that I am somewhat of a freak when it comes to wildlife. I don't expect everyone to have the same feeling that I do. When I see some of those pictures that guys take out of their living room windows, where it looks like Beaver Cleaver's neighborhood, except there is some big moose standing in his driveway.....it makes me jealous. I was born in Alaska and lived in a rural area outside of Anchorage until I was 11. Moose were common on the highways and in yards. They are very dangerous to be around. You're talking about a big, dumb, easy to spook cow with huge horns. The deer that eat under my apple tree evey night, on the other hand, are quite harmless.
Convicted One And, I'll admit that I am somewhat of a freak when it comes to wildlife. I don't expect everyone to have the same feeling that I do. When I see some of those pictures that guys take out of their living room windows, where it looks like Beaver Cleaver's neighborhood, except there is some big moose standing in his driveway.....it makes me jealous.
And, I'll admit that I am somewhat of a freak when it comes to wildlife. I don't expect everyone to have the same feeling that I do.
When I see some of those pictures that guys take out of their living room windows, where it looks like Beaver Cleaver's neighborhood, except there is some big moose standing in his driveway.....it makes me jealous.
I was born in Alaska and lived in a rural area outside of Anchorage until I was 11. Moose were common on the highways and in yards. They are very dangerous to be around. You're talking about a big, dumb, easy to spook cow with huge horns. The deer that eat under my apple tree evey night, on the other hand, are quite harmless.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72awOuWcfAA
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
BaltACD Get a motion activated 'wildlife camera' and be amazed at the animals that come around your property - especially in the dark.
Get a motion activated 'wildlife camera' and be amazed at the animals that come around your property - especially in the dark.
I put one up next to the cat food dish to figure out why we were going through so much, and was rewarded with hundreds of shots of mice. They were there literally every minute through the whole night.
There were also lots of photos of the oldest, fattest cat sitting beside the dish, watching the mice eat.
After that we moved the dish on top of a table the mice can't climb.
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
SD70DudeAround here the deer, elk and moose like to hang out in town because they have learned that wolves, bears and cougars do not.
SD70DudeI've had a few close encounters when stepping out to go to work during dark hours.
I was walking through the yard (dirt road - no tracks involved) one day, browsing some publication or other, and nearly ran into a doe. They are known to wander through on a regular basis, sometimes fascinating passengers waiting on the platform as they duck under the train...
We see some bear in the area from time to time...
Around here the deer, elk and moose like to hang out in town because they have learned that wolves, bears and cougars do not.
I've had a few close encounters when stepping out to go to work during dark hours.
Convicted OneAnd, I'll admit that I am somewhat of a freak when it comes to wildlife. I don't expect everyone to have the same feeling that I do. When I see some of those pictures that guys take out of their living room windows, where it looks like Beaver Cleaver's neighborhood, except there is some big moose standing in his driveway.....it makes me jealous.
blhanel Murph, one thing that planes can do that trains can't is alter the flight path in any one of four different directions, hopefully gradually enough not to wreak havoc with the passengers and/or flight attendants...
Murph, one thing that planes can do that trains can't is alter the flight path in any one of four different directions, hopefully gradually enough not to wreak havoc with the passengers and/or flight attendants...
Tell that to Sully and see how he replies.
(Miracle on the Hudson)
tree68Conservation officials here in northern New York are concerned about reduced numbers of hunters. That translates into a reduced take, and an increase in the numbers of car/deer collisions.
Euclid Convicted One Just speaking from my personal perspective, the most disturbing thing of all about the video is the appearance that the locomotive appears to remain under power throughout the episode, as though no effort whatsoever was made to mitigate the carnage. Like Euclid, I don't expect any perfect solution exists that could totally eliminate this sort of thing, but merely writing it off to "stupid animals!! oh well" doesn't appear to be a responsible outcome, either. As I mentioned, I think there is more to this than meets the eye. No matter what the excuse is, the video stands on its own as being really creepy precisely because there was no attempt to prevent what obviously would be a wanton slaughter. It almost looks like a grudge murder.
Convicted One Just speaking from my personal perspective, the most disturbing thing of all about the video is the appearance that the locomotive appears to remain under power throughout the episode, as though no effort whatsoever was made to mitigate the carnage. Like Euclid, I don't expect any perfect solution exists that could totally eliminate this sort of thing, but merely writing it off to "stupid animals!! oh well" doesn't appear to be a responsible outcome, either.
As I mentioned, I think there is more to this than meets the eye. No matter what the excuse is, the video stands on its own as being really creepy precisely because there was no attempt to prevent what obviously would be a wanton slaughter. It almost looks like a grudge murder.
Man is the most predatory of all predators on Earth.
Other predators do it for food, but not man.
Convicted OneJust speaking from my personal perspective, the most disturbing thing of all about the video is the appearance that the locomotive appears to remain under power throughout the episode, as though no effort whatsoever was made to mitigate the carnage. Like Euclid, I don't expect any perfect solution exists that could totally eliminate this sort of thing, but merely writing it off to "stupid animals!! oh well" doesn't appear to be a responsible outcome, either.
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