eagle1030 On a more serious note, will this loco end Amtrak's practice of putting two engines on a 110 mph train (i.e., Illinois, Michigan)?
I hope NOT! For a variety of reasons Amtrak can't seem to maintain its loco fleet well enough to risk running one engine per train. Last night the eastbound Sunset Ltd was over an hour late out of Lost Angeles. Until some fantasy time when their uptime improves, the power should be split between two engines even if it is a higher marginal cost.
I see that this new product is powered by a Caterpillar C175-20 - any long haul track record on this engine? Maybe CAT could build up some good will and useful experience by letting AMTK run a couple for a year gratis; have another engine DIT or positioned as spares (hah).
I say, get function (reliability) before form (looks).
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I don't think this one will do; it does not even have the artempt a ditch lights.
Johnny
MikeF90 For a variety of reasons Amtrak can't seem to maintain its loco fleet well enough to risk running one engine per train.
For a variety of reasons Amtrak can't seem to maintain its loco fleet well enough to risk running one engine per train.
I didn't bother to do the math yet, but I'd wager that more than half of Amtrak's trains do operate with one engine per train.
Yuck!
No railroad wants to risk having a unit break down without having a back up on board. Amtrash on the other hand has issues that are typical of a government trying to run a business. They have no business doing so.
Seems I've seen that nose before. Yeah, no, not that, yep, it could be. (Light bulb) My Hoover Vacuum Cleaner...that's it!
Gosh, if only we could see a new order of locomotives that resembled the PA's, FA's, or even the F and E types. I'd even go for a reproduction of the FP45 types.
However, they didn't ask me what I thought.
RickH
BarstowRick.com Model Railroading How To's
The Japanese Bullet Trains look much better.
Norm
NittanyLion I didn't bother to do the math yet, but I'd wager that more than half of Amtrak's trains do operate with one engine per train.
IMO they should buy / use two units with lower power prime movers rather than one 4700 HP monster, especially for the long, thin LD routes. 'Two' is a number I like to see in reliability engineering.
Mr. Railman Powered by CAT.Look at the locomotive...what is the first thing that comes to mind when viewing this locomotive? http://www.emdiesels.com/emdweb/products/pdf/2-sidersENG_LTR_proof_rev5RevE.pdf
Powered by CAT.Look at the locomotive...what is the first thing that comes to mind when viewing this locomotive?
http://www.emdiesels.com/emdweb/products/pdf/2-sidersENG_LTR_proof_rev5RevE.pdf
Folks; I think that EMD is about to usher us into another new era...
The original F's and E's were IMHO pretty stylish for their time.
They worked hard, looked good on the job leading the rail industry into a more modern era as they put steam into the markers of time. Then came the G Ps and they were truly General Purpose products..They were the JEEPS of their time.
What they are offering the Industry now is a FLYING BRICK BAT
While EMD's bulldog nose is considered to be quite stylish, it was expensive to fabricate and as such is not a real example of good industrial design, which considers production techniques in addition to esthetics. The GE-Alco flatnose (in all of its permutations) was a better example since it was much easier and less expensive to fabricate.
Impressive stats but ugly. some nifty industrial design would be much appreciated.
You know what would be real cool? Since the heritage concept has been a winner everywhere it has been tried, why not have them produce a generation of passenger locomotives with the sheet metal resembling the old "E" series of the 40s and 50s?
samfp1943 Mr. Railman Powered by CAT.Look at the locomotive...what is the first thing that comes to mind when viewing this locomotive? http://www.emdiesels.com/emdweb/products/pdf/2-sidersENG_LTR_proof_rev5RevE.pdf Folks; I think that EMD is about to usher us into another new era... The original F's and E's were IMHO pretty stylish for their time. They worked hard, looked good on the job leading the rail industry into a more modern era as they put steam into the markers of time. Then came the G Ps and they were truly General Purpose products..They were the JEEPS of their time. What they are offering the Industry now is a FLYING BRICK BAT I think this means you are agreeing with some of our expressed observations...right? Oh, and how right your are.
I think this means you are agreeing with some of our expressed observations...right?
Oh, and how right your are.
1959 VW Bus
Milk carton on wheels..
TooeyB You know what would be real cool? Since the heritage concept has been a winner everywhere it has been tried, why not have them produce a generation of passenger locomotives with the sheet metal resembling the old "E" series of the 40s and 50s?
The compound curves of the bulldog nose are expensive since they have to be shaped virtually by hand. How much of a premium would the builder charge for this sort of option?
CSSHEGEWISCH TooeyB You know what would be real cool? Since the heritage concept has been a winner everywhere it has been tried, why not have them produce a generation of passenger locomotives with the sheet metal resembling the old "E" series of the 40s and 50s? The compound curves of the bulldog nose are expensive since they have to be shaped virtually by hand. How much of a premium would the builder charge for this sort of option?
The compound curves are shaped by die forming in a press. The dies are custom tooling which adds cost, but special tooling is also required for large radius straight bends found on many locomotives. There are also compound curves on smaller parts of most locomotive bodies.
The hand work on EMD F and E unit noses was adding the fillet radius at the base of the headlight casing. I understand that detail was made by placing bondo and hand grinding to form. The headlight casing was a separate formed steel part that was welded into a hole in the nose form, and then the fillet radius was hand-made around the casing over the weld.
There is a finanacial incentive to eliminate compound curves because it avoids tooling cost, but there are still several of them in the EMD rendering of the new passenger locomotive shown here. If you try to eliminate compound curves, you end up with that edgy Russian locomotive look.
MidlandMike They seem to make a point of "fabricated trucks". As opposed to cast(?) trucks?
They seem to make a point of "fabricated trucks". As opposed to cast(?) trucks?
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
CSSHEGEWISCHThe compound curves of the bulldog nose are expensive since they have to be shaped virtually by hand. How much of a premium would the builder charge for this sort of option?
Once the die is made, the cost of running them shouldn't be that much more. The up front cost of making the die might run a little more, and once the dies are worn and require replacement the questions of "do we want to pay for this again?" might come up.
But, "retro" has it's appeal to the aging boomers
MikeF90 NittanyLion I didn't bother to do the math yet, but I'd wager that more than half of Amtrak's trains do operate with one engine per train. That may be true, but it doesn't make me happy. IMO they should buy / use two units with lower power prime movers rather than one 4700 HP monster, especially for the long, thin LD routes. 'Two' is a number I like to see in reliability engineering.
This is a corridor locomotive. Fuel capacity is too low for LD trains.
4700 HP, less a couple hundred for HEP should be enough for one unit per train on the 110 mph Michigan and IL trains. They are buying "California Cars" for these routes so they'll be cab cars on the other end of the train. Might actually make these trains more energy efficient than driving.
I'd guess we'll be seeing P42s and Superliners on the LD trains for several more decades. There is no new technology that renders the current equipment obsolete. Just keep rebuilding in kind... Save the capital for new corridor services.
NittanyLion MikeF90 For a variety of reasons Amtrak can't seem to maintain its loco fleet well enough to risk running one engine per train. I didn't bother to do the math yet, but I'd wager that more than half of Amtrak's trains do operate with one engine per train.
...or should. To your point, all the Empire Service trains are single unit, as are Piedmonts, Pennsylvanian, Carolinian, Palmetto (?), and all the California Amtrak trains. The Maine trains have one unit plus a "cabbage" as do the Talgos in WA/OR. Others?
It needs a better paint job. White paint? Bad idea. Anyone remember NJT's first "disco" attempt?
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