Paul_D_North_Jr"We've got a little problem here. This tab is for $29 and change - maybe $35 with the tip - but . . . [wait for it] . . . . . . you all gave me $98 !" Well, there was quite a difference between the 'country price' in Upper Bucks Co. and the 'city price' (Philly) for some of those beers ! - Paul North.
[wait for it]
. . .
. . . you all gave me $98 !"
Well, there was quite a difference between the 'country price' in Upper Bucks Co. and the 'city price' (Philly) for some of those beers !
- Paul North.
I was in a similar situation at a group dinner (at a brew pub, no less). One tab, about 12-15 people. Despite the fact that the average individual bill was in the $13-15 range, it seemed that nobody had anything smaller than a $20 bill. That waitress got quite a tip.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Bruce, I was Operating Department, and yes, with the current regulations it's impossible to start another tour of duty with only eight hours' rest. I'm not sure who all is covered under Hours of Service regulations, but I know that signal maintainers are among them.
On a slightly scarier note, I just saw where a UP conductor was injured by a passing train in Boone, Iowa, and had to be life-flighted somewhere. Since we have a couple of folks--and at least one conductor--who regularly post from Boone, I'm hoping that it's not anyone of our--or their--acquaintance.
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
I don't know anything about what happened at Boone. I'm about to get called to go west, and just turned the forums on. I'm pretty sure it wasn't the other Boone area poster. He was bringing in the train I was lined up for until they ran one around another.
About the HOS, don't forget that Canadian HOS may be different than US HOS. One poster who's from and railroaded in Canada on another forum said that until relatively recently, Canada didn't have HOS, at least as we in the US know it.
Phone rang, gotta go.
Jeff
zugmann snipped] So a relief job will work 2pm Tuesday and Wednesday to cover the work that needs done. Then it may have 2 days off, then maybe works 7am Sat and Sun to cover the rest days for the regular first shift M-F yard job. Unlike the extra list, a relief job has regular start times and days off. But the starting times can be varied throughout the week. . . . Again, local contracts vary, and none of them make much sense... So, did you re-do the math, or make some bartender very happy??
So, did you re-do the math, or make some bartender very happy??
The barmaids were nice - but not quite that deserving ! There was about 15 of us, so we went around the group again and adjusted the contribution shares to be roughly proportional to what each person or couple consumed, then called it "Good enough !" (In the field of mathematics called "Numerical Methods", this is called something like "successive approximations converging onto a unique solution"; in engineering, it's called an "iterative solution"; most of the rest of the world calls it something like "trial and error" . . . ) Although, I may have heard at least one person who thought we should just keep ordering until all the money was used up . . .
Paul, it's usually a fairly understandable thing. I'll go through the way things were when I retired for the jobs I worked on. We had three car retarder operators per shift, and all three worked with the same days off. I worked days, and was off Monday and Tuesday. The second shift was off Tuesday and Wednesday, and third shift was off Thursday and Friday. The relief jobs worked days on Monday, afternoons on Tuesday and Wednesday, nights on Thursday and Friday, and were off from 0700 Saturday to 0700 Monday (big whoop...they had Saturdays and Sundays off, but half of Saturday was already shot with getting rest). Tuesday morning was not covered by any job--that was the time during which the hump was shut down for scheduled maintenance.
Jeff, that's somewhat good news, anyway...thanks!
Thanks for that example of "phasing" or staggering, Carl. Viewed that way, it makes more sense than the seeming random pattern of some of the others. Although, that's probably easier to achieve when there are multiple shifts at the same location like that, as contrasted with just a 1-shift operation all by itself someplace - such as:
Back in 1977, I was doing a lot of field work at the Procter & Gamble Paper Products Co. / "Charmin" plant at Mehoopany, PA - next to the former Lehigh Valley RR main line, about 40 miles NW of Scranton, PA, and way out in the country. Around the 4th of July the ConRail crew that was assigned to switch the plant (the locomotive was assigned there 24x7 except for maintenance and inspections, etc.) complained to me that they weren't going to have any days off over the holiday weekend - even though they'd been working that job for over 90 successive days straight by then !
Great example Carl. I know a similar system, informally called "sliding" locally (Neenah), is used. Beyond that system the crew callers work their way down the "rested" list on the Extra Board. Some guys with enough seniority "slide" from one job to another to take advantage of the way the contract works rest days. They will try to get a longer rest period, which I can't entirely blame them for. However, a close friend was constantly bumped in this method because he doesn't have too much seniority and ended up with 9 days off in a row. Sounds nice but he almost didn't make the "guarantee" for the month - through no fault of his own. After he came back to work a bunch the guys tried blaming things being messed up on him.
Dan
The condr injured at Boone was based out of another terminal. I may have met him as he had worked out of Boone at one time, but I can't say I know him.
Some of our yards use a daily mark up. The yard jobs themselves don't have rest days, the board slots have the rest days. When you bid the board, you bid your rest days. People not on their rest days would call a bid recorder phone line and state their preference for the jobs available. You called, for example, on Monday by a certain time to bid Tuesdays jobs. After stating your name, etc you stated the job(s) you wanted. The jobs are assigned by seniority. If you don't get your first choice, maybe you get your second or third. If you can't win any of your preferences or forgot to place a daily bid, they assign you to any unfilled job. On some days there were more jobs than people on the board, any unfilled jobs then went to the extra board. If no extra board available, they would then call people on days off and offer them the open jobs. (Supposed to pay time and a half on your off days. Sometimes you had to fight to get it so I heard. Because of that and the fact the few times I was asked there were people cut off, I always refused.) If they still couldn't fill jobs they start going to nearby terminal extra boards or to the road pool board. Only once while I was working this board do I remember them annulling a job because no one available.
Before the HOS change, the yard had a 22 1/2 hour rule. If you started a second yard job within that time, the second tour of duty was all at time and one half rate. Now with the required 10 hrs off, it's hard to be rested to line up with jobs that are normally 8 hrs apart.
In a typical week, there are 4.25 full-time 'jobs' of 40 hours each (7 days x 24 hrs. = 168 hrs. / 40 hrs. per 'job' = 4.25 jobs.). I'm now recalling that within the past couple of months BaltACD had a post somewhere on this Forum (perhaps not this thread, though) here with a similar explanation of how a dispatching office 'protects' those slots with 4 people for each one, plus a little extra help.
On another website - the Yahoo! Pittsburgh-Altoona one, which is owned and moderated by David J. Williams who is also a member here - the folks have now even figured out the names, regular days on, and 'off days' of each of the 4 persons who work the Pittsburgh East Desk - and that 'rotation' is similar to what is explained above. As I understand it: Kevin - 1st, Hannah - 2nd, Jennifer - 3rd, and for each of their 2 days a week off: "Gary is the other regular, doing 1st on Su/M, 2nd Tu, 3rd W/Th. Normally Monday 2nd Trick is the one where there's a fill-in of some sort." per Josh Hollands on there on March 25, 2011.
then again, maybe I'm recalling the wrong forum, thread, and poster. Here's one from that same website, by "hbgdispatcher" on March 26, 2011:
Another example of moving from shift to shift was that of the operator in Brookhaven, Miss., forty and more years ago. The swing man worked from 7:00 to 3:00 on Saturday and Sunday, had twenty-four hours off, and worked 3:00 to 11:00 Monday and Tuesday, had another twenty-four hours off, and worked 11:00 to 7:00 Wednesday night-Thursday morning ( he was said to have four days off every week). Another man worked the twenty-first trick; I never did learn where he worked the rest of his week; he may well have been a real "suitcase man" going from station to station fill his workweek--there may have been that many three-trick stations on the Louisiana Division of the IC.
Johnny
Deggesty [snipped] . . . ( he was said to have four days off every week) . . .
3:00 PM Sunday to 3:00 PM Monday = 24 hrs.;
11:00 PM Tuesday to 11:00 PM Wednesday = 24 hrs.;
7:00 AM Thursday to 7:00 AM Saturday = 48 hrs.
Yeah, I can see why zug compares it to being poked in the eye . . .
Well, I went to the list, but took a hold-down on a utility gig. There's a couple of jobs open in the next few weeks, that I can hopefully stay away from being on-call.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
jeffhergert About the HOS, don't forget that Canadian HOS may be different than US HOS. One poster who's from and railroaded in Canada on another forum said that until relatively recently, Canada didn't have HOS, at least as we in the US know it.
I was hoping someone would have posted the current Canadian HOS rules by now. From the time I was old enough to understand the concept, until I got hooked up to this internet thing in the late nineties, I always knew it as 12 hours on, 8 hours off.. There were rules about maximum number of miles and minimum guarantees, but that would change as business conditions warranted.
Things all started to change after the Canadian Operating Rules and other documents came out in the early nineties. The point the poster Jeff mentioned was making, was that what had been agreements between the employers and the unions became codified in law. Periodically, I see mentions of a major revision to Canadian railway regulations done in the mid nineties, but I have never actually read it. This all happened after my Dad passed way in November 1992.
And about the three station swing jobs, the stories my Uncle and Dad could tell. By the time my Uncle hired on in 1959 he traveled from station to station using his own car. My Dad's seniority date was in May 1948, and he never bought his first car until May of 1954, a month after I was born and we were living at Hatton, SK. Like the song says "he'd been everywhere, man", and it was all on trains. He traveled in cabooses, passenger cars, baggage cars, and locomotives. It all seemed to work out, except he said no sane human being would ride a 5700 2-10-0 series engine twice, unless he was paid to be there. I guess the ride was so bad it walked the fine line between rough and terrifying.
Bruce
So shovel the coal, let this rattler roll.
"A Train is a Place Going Somewhere" CP Rail Public Timetable
"O. S. Irricana"
. . . __ . ______
zugmann Well, I went to the list, but took a hold-down on a utility gig. There's a couple of jobs open in the next few weeks, that I can hopefully stay away from being on-call.
One of the more senior guys at a local terminal likes the day U-man job. There's half the trains in/out over the course of the shift and all the locals switch their own trains in and out. Plus it rests on Friday/Saturday.
Chatted with a buddy who worked a local last night. The crew debated changing the informal name from "The Oshkosh Rocket" to "The Lakefly Express" as the Oshkosh Yard is about as close to the shore of Lake Winnebago as they could get without getting wet.
Yesterday wasn't a good day trackside for me, really - I missed about 9 trains by less than a minute each. Guess the timing wasn't there. This afternoon I get to change a water pump on the Blazer and then hopefully the coolant stays below 200 degrees for a while.
Hope you can do it under shelter, Dan! The sun's been up for two hours here, but you wouldn't know it. Shouldn't be needing artificial illumination by this time, but we're all lit up.
Everything but the "T" word is in our forecast...severe storms? Hail, yes! But it's still tentatively Grandkid Day, and we have to go find a new handle for our lawn mower, too. The old one broke clean off during some hard use yesterday, and the old push mower is no good without a handle to push on!
It's a little early for the lakeflies, isn't it? Our family cottage is at about your latitude, and late August is the worst time for them. Tried to enjoy a nice stroll on the beach once, and got eaten alive!
No chance at the railroads for a while. I spent most of yesterday working on the history of 20 former Santa Fe box cars that are now on their fifth or sixth (and probably last) reporting mark, some old MoPac covered hoppers in their fourth life, some secondhand center-beam cars, and some thirdhand (at least!) P&LE gondolas.
Makes me want to go out and see something new for a change! But for now, I'd better check the pumps...our street is becoming a river!
I couldn't sleep last night, so about oh-dark-thirty as one of the regular posters used to say, I got up and searched the internet and found the Canadian Hours of Service Rules as enacted by Transport Canada. I will just hit the highlights.
Now we all know.
For the facebook users here: I just had to laugh at this one.
I suppose it is just good business to like one of your biggest customers!
Well, I suppose that's better than it would be if it were the other way around . . . NS "Likes" Hulcher ?!?
Back in the 1970's or so one of the southern US railroads - L&N or ICG or similar - had a 'display ad' in the trade press (including Trains, as I recall) - for a "Derailment Coordinator" (or a similar title). Of course the need for and unfortunate selection of the title for that job description was the subject of at least 1 caustic commentary in the "Railway Post Office"/ Letters to the Editor section, which also noted that one of the 'selling points' was "Opportunity for Advancement" ! (or similar)
Derailment Coordinator at work:
"All right--which one of you wants the next wreck?" (Don't laugh--we used to have a CRO who asked that, then delivered!)
"Let's put one down over here--things have been running 'way too smoothly!"
"This guy owes me one." Or, worse yet, "I owe him one."
"Slow news day? We have a Key Train that can fix that!"
"Just can't get the timing right on those washouts!"
...You operating guys are making me nervous again.
(This being the same day that Operation Lifesaver is applied to the already dead in the newswire by and for NS.)
Actually, MC, I thought a "derailment coordinator" sounds like an obsolete job description from your department!
(Sun's out now...too late to get much done. I did get to see two tampers and related equipment at work in the area of the new control point.)
On the railroad I worked for, the wreckmasters were always Mechanical guys, which made for some weird situations.
MC, on my very first day, I was told by a fella that in the event of the dreaded derail, it was to be referred to ONLY as 'a mechanical problem,' and NEVER, EVER be called a derailment when within earshot of the public. Obviously, to prevent overreaction and/or panic, esp. in this day and age, you'd have CNN, etc there before your own people!! (I should say, I'm referring esp. to when a wheel slipped off the track, not necessarily a major malfunction.)
Nance-CCABW/LEI
“Even if you are on the right track, you’ll get run over if you just sit there.” --Will Rogers
Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right! --unknown
It has been brought to my attention that a very important birthday was missed yesterday. So, a day late, happy birthday to Kathi Kube, Trains' esteemed Managing Editor!
(And, just to tie this in to the discussion, Kat has an interesting piece on accident investigation on page 16 of the new [July 2011] issue of Trains.)
And I'll add my belated wishes to Kathi, as well. Hope it was a good one!
Well, now there's two things to remember May 25th for - Kathi's birthday, and Towel Day!
CShaveRR It has been brought to my attention that a very important birthday was missed yesterday. So, a day late, happy birthday to Kathi Kube, Trains' esteemed Managing Editor! (And, just to tie this in to the discussion, Kat has an interesting piece on accident investigation on page 16 of the new [July 2011] issue of Trains.)
WMNB4THRTL MC, on my very first day, I was told by a fella that in the event of the dreaded derail, it was to be referred to ONLY as 'a mechanical problem,' and NEVER, EVER be call a derailment when within earshot of the public. Obviously, to prevent overreaction and/or panic, esp. in this day and age, you'd have CNN, etc there before your own people!! (I should say, I'm referring esp. to when a wheel slipped off the track, not necessarily a major malfunction.)
MC, on my very first day, I was told by a fella that in the event of the dreaded derail, it was to be referred to ONLY as 'a mechanical problem,' and NEVER, EVER be call a derailment when within earshot of the public. Obviously, to prevent overreaction and/or panic, esp. in this day and age, you'd have CNN, etc there before your own people!! (I should say, I'm referring esp. to when a wheel slipped off the track, not necessarily a major malfunction.)
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.