Flintlock76 BaltACD Electric Stoves. Referring to my last paragraph where's the juice supposed to come from since the Greens can't even come to a common cause on the subject? PS: We've got an electric stove and have no problem with it, although Lady Firestorm would have preferred gas. Me too in fact, gas stoves still work during blackouts. Oh well, there's always Sterno.
BaltACD Electric Stoves.
Referring to my last paragraph where's the juice supposed to come from since the Greens can't even come to a common cause on the subject?
PS: We've got an electric stove and have no problem with it, although Lady Firestorm would have preferred gas. Me too in fact, gas stoves still work during blackouts. Oh well, there's always Sterno.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVBR3HNjlYw
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
VERY clever! And very entertaining!
Good to know, we all may wind up doing something like this!
Flintlock76 Backshop Now, natural gas is being seen as "bad". Yeah, go figure! NG was considered a godsend as it didn't pollute like coal or even oil did, now it's BAD! Can you imagine if all the gas kitchen stoves in this country were coal-fired like they were in the 19th and early 20th Centuries, and that gas stoves were considered "The answer to a maiden's prayer!" when they came on the scene? PLUS you could turn a gas stove off instantly while you couldn't turn off a coal stove without extinguishing the fire and then could only start the fire again with difficulty? And THEN you had the ashes to dispose of? Where do these idiots who haven't a CLUE come from? Coal is bad, gas is bad, oil is bad, hydro-electric is bad, windmills are bad because they kill birds, solar panels are bad because they're eyesores and take up green space. And you can't even mention nuke plants without giving some people an attack of the vapors. Isn't there some way we can tell these people to just shut the hell up and go away?
Backshop Now, natural gas is being seen as "bad".
Yeah, go figure! NG was considered a godsend as it didn't pollute like coal or even oil did, now it's BAD!
Can you imagine if all the gas kitchen stoves in this country were coal-fired like they were in the 19th and early 20th Centuries, and that gas stoves were considered "The answer to a maiden's prayer!" when they came on the scene? PLUS you could turn a gas stove off instantly while you couldn't turn off a coal stove without extinguishing the fire and then could only start the fire again with difficulty? And THEN you had the ashes to dispose of?
Where do these idiots who haven't a CLUE come from?
Coal is bad, gas is bad, oil is bad, hydro-electric is bad, windmills are bad because they kill birds, solar panels are bad because they're eyesores and take up green space. And you can't even mention nuke plants without giving some people an attack of the vapors. Isn't there some way we can tell these people to just shut the hell up and go away?
Everything is good at first. When it comes to a scale of developement where it is or might be viable, and thus not requiring all deplorables to change their ways of living, it then becomes bad.
Jeff
Flintlock76 n012944 Which is an ignorant meme not backed by facts. As Foghorn Leghorn used to say: "It's a joke, son!"
n012944 Which is an ignorant meme not backed by facts.
As Foghorn Leghorn used to say: "It's a joke, son!"
Except some people believe it. When they are not parking their jacked up pick up trucks in front of car chargers or ranting about wanting people wanting to improve the environment.
An "expensive model collector"
n012944Which is a ignorant meme not backed by facts. In 2023 only 16.2% of the electricty produced on the US came from coal. faq.php A number that continues to drop. 2022 the number was 20% 2021 21.9% 2020 22.5% and that was the 1st year that more power was produced by renewable energy than coal. However those facts doesn't get the blood going of the "rolling coal" ideologue, so it doesn't make a good meme.....
You're so right. Even on here, a forum supposedly about modern transportation, the posts are mostly contemporary contrafactual Luddisms disguised as wit.
Somebody say wit?
https://www.instagram.com/toprank_ivi_sean_morris/p/Cj0Vx8AL_Jf/
https://www.reddit.com/r/terriblefacebookmemes/comments/yxtacq/driving_an_electric_car_makes_you_less_of_a_man/?rdt=53907
Then of course there's Philly, where a cheesesteak is either "wit" or "witout."
https://www.tastingtable.com/1190244/when-ordering-cheesesteak-in-philly-be-ready-to-answer-wit-or-witout/
I see his point about puerile memes, though... funny though they might be.
Wit was the Julia-Louise Dreyfus's Mercedes AA video (from 2016!)
And this is what a witty response looks like:
https://twitter.com/MercedesBenzUSA/status/722143311977439232?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E722143311977439232%7Ctwgr%5Ef5dfff3beb18749572608c929c9802a741d22a63%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theverge.com%2F2016%2F4%2F19%2F11460292%2Fmercedes-benz-snl-aa-battery-powered-car
Just as those folks most opposed to higher and high speed passenger rail have never ridden in a modern ststem, those anti EV and anti PHEV and anti-electric and hybrid freight have never experienced any of them. Coal freaks? Nostalgia addicts?
charlie hebdo anti EV
Not anti - but until the driving experience is equal to an ICE, I won't be buying one.
That means ten minute "fill-ups" and a 500 mile range, which is what I have right now.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
I'm with Larry in that I don't have an issue with EV's in general, but I do have an issue with mandating EV's. My experience with EV's was from using an EV to get to/from work and the Irvine station in 2014. EV's were ideal for this as they could be recharged overnight at the station.
tree68 charlie hebdo anti EV Not anti - but until the driving experience is equal to an ICE, I won't be buying one. That means ten minute "fill-ups" and a 500 mile range, which is what I have right now.
Charge overnight in garage. They sre much peppier driving, quiet and better for the environment. This is an issue that transcends individual choices.
If traveling, an extra 20 minutes won't hurt. You can get coffee or some treats.
Or consider a PHEV (plug-in hybrid).
Nobody is forcing you to buy. The manufacturers are shifting to meet standards.
charlie hebdoNobody is forcing you to buy.
Some states are in fact forcing people to buy EVs:
https://abc7ny.com/electric-vehicle-new-york-zero-emissions-cars/12279246/
charlie hebdo tree68 charlie hebdo anti EV Not anti - but until the driving experience is equal to an ICE, I won't be buying one. That means ten minute "fill-ups" and a 500 mile range, which is what I have right now. Charge overnight in garage. They sre much peppier driving, quiet and better for the environment. This is an issue that transcends individual choices. If traveling, an extra 20 minutes won't hurt. You can get coffee or some treats. Or consider a PHEV (plug-in hybrid). Nobody is forcing you to buy. The manufacturers are shifting to meet standards.
adkrr64 charlie hebdo Nobody is forcing you to buy. Some states are in fact forcing people to buy EVs: https://abc7ny.com/electric-vehicle-new-york-zero-emissions-cars/12279246/
charlie hebdo Nobody is forcing you to buy.
Other states are realizing EV's under current laws are not paying gasoline taxes and are starting to come up with other means of taxation for them.
charlie hebdoCharge overnight in garage.
You're assuming the electrical service in my house will handle it... I know the circuit to the garage (110V) probably won't.
tree68 charlie hebdo Charge overnight in garage. You're assuming the electrical service in my house will handle it... I know the circuit to the garage (110V) probably won't.
charlie hebdo Charge overnight in garage.
You can theoretically charge an EV on 110v, but it takes forever and an EV will not charge properly overnight. It was easy for me to install a charging outlet because my main panel is in my garage, so it was a matter of running a few feet of heavy gauge wire and cost me less than $50 for materials. If your main panel is somewhere else in the house, of course, the whole thing becomes much more complicated and expensive.
I loved my Tesla (had to sell it because we were moving to Eastern Europe where the charging infrastructure doesn't exist yet) but I do understand that EVs aren't for everyone at this time. Nevertheless, much of the complaining about EVs has a distinctly retrograde, Luddite, "get off my lawn" feel to it.
My house - being built in the early 1950's only has 100 amp service feed from the above ground power line along the street.
To even consider an EV would require a totally new power feed to the house as well as likely a new main breaker box, both in the house and garage. When I got my welder, I had to get a 110 unit as the garage is not wired for 220.
My Florida condo does not have any way to provide charging for an EV - parking is outside the unit across the public sidewalk.
Around here also...neighborhood was built in early 2000s and would require a major electrical upgrade to handle EV charging. Personally I don't care..I walk in the winter and cycle in the warmer weather. I drove only 500 km last year..likely will be even less this year. An EV wouldn't make sense for people like me.
110 v is slower but overnight could probably give you a decent enough charge unless you have a long daily commute.
My wife only puts on about 10 miles RT commute plus we make other trips for appointments, visiting, shopping, etc. We charge for free at a fast charger once every 2-4 weeks.
The car, a VW ID 4, is a pleasure to drive.
Backshopwhile also saying it's an issue that "transcends individual choices". It sure sounds like you'd like to be able to force people.
No, I didn't say anything like that. It was a nice way of saying our environment is a shared resource and we live (most of us) live in society. So even though you might be driving a behemoth pickup truck such as a Ford F450 with 6.7 L engine, maybe an F 150 Lightning would be ok and do more for your fellow man?
okay boys ...
Back to railroading ..
I have been watching the cam and posted photos and it looks like BNSF has been getting new Tier-4 ET44C4 while UP, CSX, NS and others have been rebuilding or getting BNSF rebuilt AC4400s or C44-9W.
https://railpictures.net/photo/854120/
charlie hebdo110 v is slower but overnight could probably give you a decent enough charge unless you have a long daily commute.
No garage or driveway at my house, so makes charging at home pretty much a non-starter. I did look at some charging maps, but my end of the county is pretty sparse. Just the oddball charger here and there tucked behind this and that that may or may not work, charge slow, and charge money. I think many were installed with grant money, then quickly forgotten about.
Other end of the county has a couple of banks of ~8-10 Tesla superchargers, but that's about 20 miles the wrong way from me and work.
I always wondered why the dealerships don't get more chargers for people that buy their EVs from them. Seems like an untapped revenue stream.
Now if the RR provided us charging, there'd be a F150 lightning parked outside my house right now (not really - still way too much money). Or at least a plug in something hybrid something or other.
Couple years ago, we were supposed to get state money to get a few of those ECO-motor locomotives that you would shut down and plug in when you were done with them (so they wouldn't have to idle in cold weather). But PSR lite happened, and the eco-motors didn't.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.
To digress a moment: the thing I waited for all the way from the '70s was the truck described by the 'four-door Bronco' people as front seat, full back seat, eight-foot bed in a closed body -- essentially my '76 Colony Park station wagon with a proper diesel engine and heavier suspension. For one brief shining moment I thought we were going to get it when the Excursion was announced. (That turned out to be a huge, overweight, overpriced lump with less room inside than my '94 Sub, and only a short 'bed' after all... BUT Ford did produce a hybrid demonstrator of it.) I suspect this involved the Brazilian 4-liter version of the PowerCerebrovascularAccident engine, which would have given nearly 40mpg performance in sustained cruise with little to no loss of effective towing capacity for anything other than sustained heavy grades. I still find I want one.
In those days (~2000) the idea of plug-in hybrids was a pipe dream, but as more and more support for large electric trucks and 800V rapid charging starts to come in, the idea of large private vehicles using the infrastructure looks more and more attractive...
I love hybrids, both on the road and potentially on the railroad. But battery-only anything is... well, just ridiculous for many of the real-world situations that are going to come up. Until AAA has fleets of rapid-recharge emergency trucks, which I think will be a 'thing' but currently isn't, the likelihood of getting dangerously close to being stranded on a regular basis is too high even if every charger everywhere works perfectly -- and that is something far from true even today when the charging infrastructure is still comparatively new.
Millions of people across America live in rental property. Very few rental units have charging capability, or are particularly equipped to be converted to have it. It's an amusing thing even to contemplate charging an EV parked on the street with an extended charging cord out across the sidewalk... especially left unattended in many 'usual' sorts of rental neighborhoods. What's a solution for those people that makes better sense than a PHEV does?
The eventual 'answer' for electrification on the railroads is increasing punctuated catenary, with 'dual-mode-lite' hybrid locomotives consisting of powered locomotives and FLXdrive-style battery engines for the 'traction battery'. Nothing else aside from Iden's powered tender approach is going to provide sensible transition to electric without ginormous capital expense, much of it of little use until completely built out. But there are many ways to ensure enormous numbers of cascading service failures and delays, particularly in a PSR-centric race-to-the-finance-bottom world.
ECP is another issue entirely. But why on God's green earth is powerline data modulation of the required 220V trainline supposed to be a bad idea? It's not like it's the 'only' modality that's going to be used for brake control...
charlie hebdo Charge overnight in garage. They sre much peppier driving, quiet and better for the environment. This is an issue that transcends individual choices.
The "better for the environment" assertion is not as clear cut as many people think, with new ICE vehicles being cleaner and somewhat more efficient than older vehicles.
This brings up a problem that's not discussed as much as it should be. A round number for EV mileage is 4 miles/kwhr, so charging after 200 miles would require 50kwhr. To be able to charge in 20 minutes would require 150kW per charging station, and the equivalent of a small gas station woulld be 8 charging stations with a sustained demand of close to a 1MW during rush hour. To get the equivalent throughput of a Costco gas station (typically 22-24 pumps at maybe 10 minute dwell per pump) would be 50 charging stations and 7.5MW demand. To keep the electric utility happy, this station would likly need the equivalent of 6 to 10 hours of storage. At 8 hours, we're talking 60MW-hrs. At $400/kwhr for total cost of a battery installation, we're now talking $24million just for the local storage.
For battery electric locomotives, let's assume the battery can hold ten hours worth of juice at run 8, this would work out to 30MW-hrs. With a 20 minute re-charge, the demand per locomotive would be 90MW, and a train with 3 of those would require a total of 270MW. The latter is a typical peak demand for a city of 200,000 to 300,000 residents.
Erik_MagFor battery electric locomotives, let's assume the battery can hold ten hours worth of juice at run 8, this would work out to 30MW-hrs...
First, I suspect any sensible operation would involve something like 20-80 charging to maximize battery life. So 3/5 of that 30 Mw/h for each charge. I suspect that the need for "20-minute" recharge will not be great for much battery-driven passenger equipment of that size; if it is commuter equipment there may in fact be a comparatively long time between 'peak load' trains in the morning, their counterparts in the evening, and perhaps relative lack of demand at high density or high speed during midday and nighttime periods.
Meanwhile the locomotive will not be at the equivalent of 'Run 8' for very long after each stop, and it will regenerate a reasonable percentage of its kinetic energy in the subsequent deceleration. Something that was a bit of a hot topic several decades ago was a perceived concern with sourcing and sinking large starting and braking currents to 'the grid' from catenary electrification; careful consideration was made toward the use of wayside-power installations including those using KERS to recapture the braking 'surge' close to a station, and then provide it back to the same consist to aid reacceleration. This remains an option to provide on battery power.
rdamon okay boys ... Back to railroading .. I have been watching the cam and posted photos and it looks like BNSF has been getting new Tier-4 ET44C4 while UP, CSX, NS and others have been rebuilding or getting BNSF rebuilt AC4400s or C44-9W. https://railpictures.net/photo/854120/
Other the rail photos, your post has nothing to do with the thread title or its directions taken by members.
charlie hebdo rdamon okay boys ... Back to railroading .. I have been watching the cam and posted photos and it looks like BNSF has been getting new Tier-4 ET44C4 while UP, CSX, NS and others have been rebuilding or getting BNSF rebuilt AC4400s or C44-9W. https://railpictures.net/photo/854120/ Other the rail photos, your post has nothing to do with the thread title or its directions taken by members.
It does in the sense that other CARB requirements are mandating newer T4 units.
Instead of complaining, just post your pictures.
charlie hebdo Just as those folks most opposed to higher and high speed passenger rail have never ridden in a modern ststem, those anti EV and anti PHEV and anti-electric and hybrid freight have never experienced any of them. Coal freaks? Nostalgia addicts?
Not necessarily. There are some of us (I know, very few) who actually worry about how the new technologies are being made.
How many of the people driving an EV or installing solar panels on their houses know, or even care, where the materials come from?
How many EV drivers care that some of the materials in their batteries probably come from Africa where children as young as seven-years-old are being used as labor in the mines?
How many solar panel users care that some of the materials being used in the production of those Chinese panels come from actual slave labor in re-education camps?
It seems that many in our country are willing to overlook the human cost to get these things.
York1 John
I asked my doctor if I gave up delicious food and all alcohol, would I live longer? He said, "No, but it will seem longer."
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