Why are bachman loco's so cheap?

[Anonymous]

Just as the title say says, howcome bacman loco's are so much cheaper than everyone elses?

[Anonymous]

On the standard 10 scale (IMHO) Cheap Bachmann reviewed here, not more expensive pieces
Perfomance - 3
Accuracy - 5
detail - 2
DCC - .005
Quality control - 9 they all have the same quality level, inferior

There are many excellent Bachmann products but the cheap stuff is , well, CHEAP

[dave9999]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DoctorScrypt

Just as the title say says, howcome bacman loco's are so much cheaper than everyone elses?

As with just about everything else, you get what you pay for. I have bought
cheap locos and pricey locos. I don't have to tell you which get to run on
the layout. Try looking into Life-Like Proto 2000 (not the plain, cheap Life-Like,
they are basicly toys). They are smooth running with nice detail and reasonably
priced. Dave

[detting]

Back in the day we call them Botchmann and would stay away from them at all costs.

There are three levels of Bachmann:
1. Bachmann - This is the toy train cheap stuff that has limited use on a model railroad. For example a Bachman gondola became a bridge on my layout after a little creative surgery. Basically this line can be used for anything, except running on the rails.

2. Bachmann Plus - This is an improvement over the plain Bachman line, but the quality is hit or miss.

3. Bachmann Spectrum - These are the more expensive pieces, but this line brough respectability back to Bachmann in model railroad circles.

Later...

[Anonymous]

Bachmann has been a bad word in my RR household for a long time, but recently I have been pleasantly surprised with the Spectrum line from Bachmann. While it does not approach the quality of Kato, Atlas, etc. they are pretty decent engines for a relatively low price. They are easy enough to modify as well. I would say they are at least as good as the standard Athearn offerings.

The only reason I even tried a Bachmann product again was the fact that they came out with the DD40AX and I love the UP heavies from any generation. I ended up with three of them and was impressed enough to try their other models as well. I haven't been disappointed. DD40AXs don't really fit my era since they were retired in the early 80s, but I choose to use my artistic license and run them anyway. I occasionally run my two Big Boys as well double-headed even though I model the late 80s and early 90s. They are just too cool to leave out. I'll just call it an "excursion" run. :)

Happy Railroading.

Warren

[eastcoast]

Like many other companies out there, Bachmann has tried to
improve its products for the times. I have all kinds of Bachmann
and notice these improvements. They must stay competitive to
stay in business, and sometimes I find some excellent deals on
equipment that really does run great with some minor adjustments.
I LOVE THEIR NEW LOCOMOTIVES.

[Jetrock]

I have had good results with the Bachmann stuff I own--three 44-ton GE diesel switchers and one 70-tonner (although I'm probably going to strip down one of the 44's for its wonderful self-powered trucks, oh so useful for powering interurbans!) I also own a smattering of Bachmann Brill trolleys, although I also view those more as kitbash-fodder than good models in their own right. The motor on the Brill runs nicely and is essentially a free-standing power truck. Its slow-speed operation is all right for what I typically pay for them (I think I bought one for $20, the rest were $5-8 each) and the detail, while not fabulous, isn't bad.

I am continually horrified by the lameness of most Bachmann structures--aside from their Signature series of large buildings...

[cacole]

As mentioned previously by other respondents, there are different price and quality ranges of Bachmann products, and Bachmann Spectrum engines are very good. Athearn and Life Like also have different ranges of quality and price. Today, practically everything is made in China regardless of the brand name on it, and most of it seems to even come out of the same factory. If you have a problem with a Bachmann engine, you can send it back to them and they usually just throw it away and send you a new one instead of trying to perform repair work. It seems that Bachmann doesn't even have a repair facility. I know of at least five instances where people sent locomotives back to Bachmann for warranty repair, and they received totally new replacements instead of repaired items. In one case, a man sent them a steam locomotive that had a decoder installed, not realizing that Bachmann would just send him a new loco instead of trying to repair his. When he got the replacement and telephoned Bachmann about the decoder that had been in his loco, they said the loco had been thrown into a dumpster and they would have to try recovering it. Fortunately, they were able to find it and return his decoder.

[Anonymous]

I am amused by the word "cheap" I think a $200 dollar engine "Not Cheap" and BLI (GASP $340-) very pricey. And so on. I remember buying a Bachmann GS-4 for $35- in the late 80's and it is sooo cheap in the pulling power etc (Classic Botchman) I never did buy Bachmann again until the new spectrum line came out.

I still use BLI, Genesis and others (Particturaly Life Like Proto 2000) for my roster to fit my Late steam and early diesal roster.

I am waiting for the words "Model Power" to come up... since no one has mentioned it..

Buy what you want run what you want to and good luck!

Lee

[Anonymous]

In a nut shell, it's whats under the shell that counts

[Anonymous]

ok, well i guess ill just buy their loco's to practice paint schemes :)
Thanks everyone, btw, whats the best brand loco? Proto 2000? I ask because id like to have maybe 1 or 2 "Flag ships" for my fleet.

[Anonymous]

I totally agree that what is under the shell is very important, but sometimes the shell itself can be a sticking point. My dad has wanted a Northern class SP&S engine that he took an excursion ride on a couple years ago. He even got to play up in the cab and talk to the guys that restored it. Anyway, of course an SP&S northern isn't really made by anyone, so it became a project of mine to make it for him. The standard Bachmann line has a very good looking Northern class engine so I bought one cheap off of EBay. I expected it to run very poorly and of course it did. In fact, the wheels actually go in different directions as only one set is geared and the rest rely on the connecting rods for the correct motion. Needless to say it's a poor design.

Anyway, I now had the Northern class shell that I needed but the tender was completely wrong so I went back to EBay and won a Vanderbilt tender for it that is very close to the one they are using on the restored SP&S Northern. Now that I had all the shell pieces I needed, I called up Bowser and ordered a complete drive system for the Northern. These work great.

I then stripped the shells and painted them but the decals were a bit trickier as no one actually makes a set for the Northern in SP&S, so I ended up buying several different freight car/caboose sets and piecing it all together. It's nearly finished and looking pretty good.

Of course this is a pretty non-standard example, but without the Bachmann shell I would still be stuck. ;)

Warren

[BentnoseWillie]

QUOTE: Originally posted by warrenjbellIn fact, the wheels actually go in different directions as only one set is geared and the rest rely on the connecting rods for the correct motion. Needless to say it's a poor design.

In Bachmann's defense, I think it's nornal for HO scale steamers to have one axle geared and the other drivers powered by the rods. After all, that's what the connecting rods are there for...

That said, regular Bachmann engines run poorly and have little detail. The Bachmann Plus models are better runners, but still lack detail. I don't recommend any non-steam Bachmann - not even Spectrum - unless it's something unique like the E33 electric. Oddly enough, they do a fabulous job with the Spectrum steamers.

The above is based on my experience in HO scale only. Your mileage may vary, void where prohibited by law, on approved credit, etc.

[Anonymous]

Guess I wasn't very clear on the connecting rod issue. What I meant was that their connecting rods were a poor design...not the fact that they used connecting rods to move the drive wheels. Communications is a skill too, lol.

Warren

[baniaj2]

Some one mentioned model power in this thread...

They have had some good models over the years...Their shark and their E unit had huge fly wheels that put them in a class by themselves when they were released. I believe they had FAs with the same good motors as well...

The new 2-8-0s and 4-6-0s looked to be good models...have not run one to see.

Then there's the other stuff...

model power crazy slovakian junk...german switchers painted santa fe etc...

Bachmann

Have to agree with other people

straight bachmann...good for everything but running (every engine I had that was plain bachmann ended up as a dummy unit....)

bachmann plus...had an f-7, ended up a dummy unit...I still have hopes to get the old 2-8-0 they had up to snuff (wide fire box is useful for what I want...)

spectrum...steam light years better than diesels. I sold off my 44 tonners and have a 1 truck powered 70 tonner...they may be better know but....

spectrum steam...I have run consolidation and the light mountain. I have a light mountain DCCed, one of the most reliable runners I have...takes alot of miles and still goes. A minor flaw with the spectrum steam is some of the driver contact wipers need adjustment to hit the driver and not the spokes...

[dave9999]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DoctorScrypt

ok, well i guess ill just buy their loco's to practice paint schemes :)
Thanks everyone, btw, whats the best brand loco? Proto 2000? I ask because id like to have maybe 1 or 2 "Flag ships" for my fleet.

I wouldn't say they are the best, but they rank pretty high. There are better out there,
but I like 'em. Take a look at http://www.trainworld1.com/lifelike/lifelike_proto.htm You can find some good deals here. Dave

[Anonymous]

Why, because they suck big floppy donkey D**k! thats why!!
both of the the N Scale blechmann units i started with 13 yrs ago that got me into this great hobby were both Destroyed!! one due to infamous calif. earthquakes
the other via Co2 pellet pistol
i currently have 20 plus Atlas/Katos online at this time the best there is was and ever will be!!

Regards
Larry

[CBQ_Guy]

Doc,

Just my two cents again but my suggestion for a good brand of starter loco would be a Proto 1000. They run as well as the 2000 series, but just not as highly detailed and they cost less. Having said that, there is nothing wrong with the 2000's at all, they just cost more. The decision is yours and there are a LOT more different models available, a lot more, in the 2000 series versus the 1000.

Also, many are VERY happy with Athearn. They have been in the hobby for many decades and were kind of the standard for many years. I'm not sure if the engines they are happy with are the newer Genesis series or are just talking Athearn in general. The Genesis ARE very good. The old standard Athearn units, IN MY OPINION are just that...OLD standard...as in they were pretty much the only half way decent running and low cost locos IN THEIR DAY. If you are planning to just let the trains run around and around, they should be fine, but in my experience they just don't cut it if you want more realistic, slow speed running and switching operations. This is just MY experience with them. Maybe the newer "cheap" Athearns have been improved, at least motor wise, I don't know. But I think they use the same drive components. Others more knowledgeable will have to chime in here.

Of course the Atlas, Kato, Stewart and possibly Walthers line of locomotives run well, too, but they're going to cost more as well. One suggestion, I believe you indicated you live in Bloomington, Illinois, if I recall. They have a monthly train swap/show there, as well in nearby (to you) Peoria. Take your time and check these meets out and see what the various vendors have available. Compare prices and look for a good deal pricewise, and you just may find a very good running engine at "reasonable" cost. Look in MR magazine, and possibly at their website, for show schedules. Your local hobby shop proprietor may/should have info on where and when the meets are in your areas, as well.

Regards,

[BentnoseWillie]

QUOTE: Originally posted by baniaj2model power crazy slovakian junk...german switchers painted santa fe etc...

Slovenian, actually. Czechs or Slovaks would have built better models than these. [;)]

These were made by Mehano, and are still available under the Mehano and IHC names. The C628 (with a decent flywheel drive) was also sold as Life-Like way back when. Mehano have improved a lot, but I still consider their diesels as shell donors only. Their steamers are fairly well-regarded as good value.

The Model Power flywheel-drive FA, E units and Baldwin Sharks were made by Roco, and were quite good for the time. Roco also made the earlier Atlas and Con-Cor GP38, GP40 and SD35, and the more recent Atlas metal-bodied S2's and S4's.

[Puckdropper]

Bachmann locomotives are excellent for the amount of abuse they can take. Probably in the life span of my Bachmann locomotives, they've taken 3+ feet drops to the floor, bad rewiring, etc... After each drop, I put the locomotive back on the rails and off it goes, never missing a beat.

They're noisely little things, but aren't the prototypes? If you wish, you can reduce the noise by putting a drop of oil on the bearings.

[Anonymous]

I have an old Bachmann Chessie GP30 that is the smoothest running of all of my old locomotives. Of ocourse smoothest is a realative term since the others are old Tycos, AHM and one unidentified brand switcher.

I do agree with Puckdropper about the amount of abuse they can take though. I remember some bad derailments that would have destroyed other engines.

DT

[Anonymous]

Bachmann is great !!! even thier standard line stuff is pretty good ( I've never had any spectrum or plus ) but my Challenger train set I've had for 6 years and it's still going strong.

Alex in the sooner state

[Gunneral]

The old adage ` Horses for courses` applies! My N gauge Spectrum 2-8-0 runs a whole lot better than my Kato 2-8-2! It is hard to change some opinions!

[cacole]

I've worked on many different Bachmann products for members of our local club, primarily installing decoders. The really cheap Bachmann locomotives that come with a Christmas train set, and the Plus locomotives are not worth the cost of a decoder. My most recent installation was a SP Daylight steam engine, and I will never, ever, attempt that again. The frame had to be totally disassembled and milled out (actually ground out with an electric grinding wheel), and the smoke unit was a big problem. The light bulb had to be replaced with a different type. Even newer Spectrum diesel models use the same construction technique as the cheaper Plus line, with the motor mounted between two cast frame halves, which makes decoder installation extremely difficult. Spectrum steam models, on the other hand, are about as easy as it can possibly get. The steam models run much better than diesel models, too, but don't have much traction due to their light weight plastic boilers. One member of our club purchased three Bachmann Spectrum diesel models, and two will need to be sent back to Bachmann for repair or replacement because they make a terrible grinding noise, as if the gears are not meshing properly.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by train boy

Bachmann is great !!! even thier standard line stuff is pretty good ( I've never had any spectrum or plus ) but my Challenger train set I've had for 6 years and it's still going strong.

Alex in the sooner state

I agree! I've got a Hogwarts Express set and after 3 years it still runs great. I'm also planning on getting the Overland Limited set. But, the Spectrum sets appear to be better, the ones I want, The Explorer and the Frontiersman both come with Spectrum's excellent 2-8-0. But the E-Z mate couplers.............

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BentnoseWillie
[
The Model Power flywheel-drive FA, E units and Baldwin Sharks were made by Roco, and were quite good for the time. Roco also made the earlier Atlas and Con-Cor GP38, GP40 and SD35, and the more recent Atlas metal-bodied S2's and S4's.

The Atlas S-2s and 4's on the yellow boxes were from Roco, stamped Atlas, Made in Austria, The "classic" S2s and 4s (black box) clearly say China on the bottom of the fuel tanks. That being said, I have disassembled both, and other than the wording of the fuel tank, can find no appreciable difference.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DoctorScrypt

ok, well i guess ill just buy their loco's to practice paint schemes :)
Thanks everyone, btw, whats the best brand loco? Proto 2000? I ask because id like to have maybe 1 or 2 "Flag ships" for my fleet.

Doctor, you'll get as many answers to this question as there are modelers. It boils down to personal preferences. For the record, I think the PROTO 2000 series is awesome and have several of their diesels. Quality over quantity however wins out every time. Best to save your dollars for a model from a manufacturer with a sterling reputation for quality than to pick up three or four inexpensive models at a swap meet...only to be disappointed within a week over poor performance, etc.

[Anonymous]

I think it is because Bachman doesn't attend to details like others. I have a Bachman G-scale 4-6-0 Mogul, now that is rather a good sized locomotive so you would think they could do a little better since they had more room to work with. On this model, only the piston rod goes in and out, no slide rod action. Now I also have a HO Roco 4-6-0 that the slide rod does what it is supposed to do. Little things like this is what affects the price but also the looks in performance.

[lyctus]

I've been stocking up on Spectrum K4 Pacifics to develop a Division Point steam depot and I just lurve 'em. Great detail, great running, and very affordable. I have a few 44 Tonners and they run great as well. I'm a real Bachmann Spectrum fan after being fairly hang back from expereince with Mr B's products yeards back.
In Hong Kong recently I spotted the Bachmann China National Railways offerings and I am in agony.My impression was Wow!. The diesel, which I have travelled behind, was an awesome looking model and the steamers were impressive,in a Chinese sort of way, and I had to fight the desire to start another darn collecting thread which I just don't need. I have had more therapy and seem to have supressed this irrational desire. But .......

[Anonymous]

don't u know to avoid the cheap stuff! Now their spectrum line is awesome, and they cost some mmmmooooooo laaaaaaa