Simon Modelling CB&Q and Wabash See my slowly evolving layout on my picturetrail site http://www.picturetrail.com/simontrains and our videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/MrCrispybake?feature=mhum
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
QUOTE: Originally posted by brothaslide Anybody have any thoughts on this system
QUOTE: It seems to be a more user friendly DCC system.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Texas Zepher QUOTE: Originally posted by brothaslide Anybody have any thoughts on this system My first thought is that it has a lot of "toy train" unprototypical features. Show me any real train that the engineer selects a "speed" and the train will automatically go that speed. Another great number of "controls" for the sound, are again a major step backwards. Why should one have to control the sound of chuff rate and labor? This is what one has to do with PFM sound systems built in the late 1970's. How can anyone think this is "advanced". These should be controlled by the load on the locomotive, setting of the throttle, reverse lever, and other engine controls. They don't give any indication of the technology behind it. That is what would make something better than DCC. It almost seems like they just listed every silly software controlable thing they could think of as a "feature" whether it makes sense or not. QUOTE: It seems to be a more user friendly DCC system. What makes it seem like that to you? I don't see anything that indicates it would be more user friendly. In fact, looking at the controller and considering all the functions they are talking about it looks more "video gamish" than the current DCC stuff. To be fair, one would have to compare it head to head with the most current DCC equipment like the Zimo. P.S. After all the legal garbage MTH has been dealing out the last few years, I don't think I would consider their product anyway.
QUOTE: Originally posted by selector I would like the originator to tell us how the DCS is more user-friendly, since he introduced the notion.
QUOTE: Originally posted by selector Is there anything else that places DCS on a higher rung?
Joe Fugate Modeling the 1980s SP Siskiyou Line in southern Oregon
QUOTE: Originally posted by jfugate No matter how good DCS may be it is running counter to the major trend in the digital technology industry today: open source. Lenz saw the handwriting on the wall in the early 1990s and released DCC into the market as an open public domain development. Since that time, open source applications are flooding the market now. And DCC has become pervasive in the hobby. If MTH wants to really get noticed, then release DCS into the public domain as open source. Given MTH's previous positioning on things they invent, the likelihood of that happening is nil to never. As a result, DCS will remain an also-ran.
QUOTE: Originally posted by mthrules The folks who have used DCS in O gauge know how great it is. It's far superior to DCC in every way.
QUOTE: It will take a while to convince people of the advantages over DCC, but once they try it, they'll be hooked.[tup]
"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"
QUOTE: Originally posted by brothaslide Since you asked. Instead of adjusting CV variables, you adjust the horn volume, etc. As an end user, I don't care about CVs, I just want to adjust volume, speed, etc.
QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45 QUOTE: Originally posted by mthrules The folks who have used DCS in O gauge know how great it is. It's far superior to DCC in every way. Really??? Wow! Please tell us HOW it is in EVERYWAY. PLEASE! Do tell in detail. . A forum member offered MTH the opportunity to test DCS and the K4 on his HO layout with uncleaned track.......and of course the test never materialized. So again, the question is how do you know that is is far superior to DCC in everyway? Do you own the HO setup yet? At least JNichols gives some detailed insight. But like the MTH K4, with all due respect, it seems that you're once again belching smelly smoke! [|)][B)] Is That what that smell was???? [:0] I was thinking somebody needed a shower,,,bad!![swg][wow][C):-)][4:-)][:O][(-D][:-,][}:)] Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 12:14 PM QUOTE: [). I've seen one where the user points with a mouse to slider bars on a graph in order to set the CV variables. No idea what CVs they are or what the values are being set to. Just point to where the volume or whatever is desired. That would be DecoderPro..........I Love Mine!!!!!!!!![:D] Reply Edit JerryZeman Member sinceJanuary 2001 From: US 117 posts Posted by JerryZeman on Tuesday, May 30, 2006 12:30 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by mthrules The folks who have used DCS in O gauge know how great it is. It's far superior to DCC in every way. It will take a while to convince people of the advantages over DCC, but once they try it, they'll be hooked.[tup] www.mthhotrains.com Jeff and I had a rather lengthy discussion on this subject about one month ago. Perhaps you would care to re-read it if you're really concerned about getting to the cruxt of people's concerns with DCS instead of making baseless and inane statements that you choose not to back up with facts. For your convenience, the thread address is posted below: http://trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=2&TOPIC_ID=62890 regards, Jerry Zeman Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 1:09 AM Whereas DCS looks promising, do see a lot "will" on the web site, as in what the HO version "will" do once it's released. Probably better to reserve judgement until there's actually production models to try out. As far as it being superior to DCC - Betamax outperformed VHS. MicroChannel outperformed ISA. DCS outperforms DCC. All of the former items were/are closed-source and proprietary. Although a derivative of the Betamax format lives on in professional world. Reply Edit jnichols Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Salt Lake City 388 posts Posted by jnichols on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 1:18 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by jsmaye Whereas DCS looks promising, do see a lot "will" on the web site, as in what the HO version "will" do once it's released. Probably better to reserve judgement until there's actually production models to try out. DCS has been available for over 3 years now in the O scale market. While the locomotive and electronics in HO scale are smaller, the DCS command system and features are identical from what I can gather. I've seen the HO scale model in person (although it wasn't running), and I've seen several videos of it now running and smoking away so I have no doubt it will do everything they have promised... [;)] Jeff Jeff ww.trainshoppeslc.com Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 1:29 AM The web site might just be behind - I noticed it said these models were available summer of '05. Well, good for the Pennsy steam modelers. Reply Edit cmarchan Member sinceJanuary 2004 From: Tarpon Springs, FL 331 posts Posted by cmarchan on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 8:01 AM see my reply here on the sister thread: http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=66570 Carl in Florida - - - - - - - - - - We need an HO Amtrak SDP40F and GE U36B oh wait- We GOT THEM! Reply dinwitty Member sinceAugust 2004 2,844 posts Posted by dinwitty on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 8:22 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by mthrules The folks who have used DCS in O gauge know how great it is. It's far superior to DCC in every way. It will take a while to convince people of the advantages over DCC, but once they try it, they'll be hooked.[tup] www.mthhotrains.com were talking HO. and I am not convinced. I like my QSI DCC 2-6-6-4. Reply AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,635 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Thursday, June 1, 2006 8:19 AM I'm with you there Dinwitty.[;)] I've enjoyed seeing QSI equipped BLI HO steamers running at the club I joined. Am very impressed with the quality, performance, and the beautiful body & chassis detailing these locomotives came with. Those Mallets are show stoppers for sure! Not trying to be pessimistic about the MTH unit, but IMHO it's going to take quite a bit more than synchronized chuff to make lasting impressions with some BLI owners (likely a lot of them). As stated by some modelers before, smoke units may or may not be welcome at some clubs or homes. In fact, I had wondered about introducing smoke units for diesels (dark colored smoke of course); especially since prototype GE U-Boats and Alco diesels were "torrid" smokers. However, the same issue of smelly smoke coating the track with an oily film came up. Moot issue. But of course, to each his or her own.[;)] BTW: I may be mistaken, but from my understanding synchronizing a steamer's chuff is already possible with the Tsunami. Hopefully Cmarchand will chime in with info on this. "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply BRAKIE Member sinceOctober 2001 From: OH 17,574 posts Posted by BRAKIE on Thursday, June 1, 2006 10:16 AM AntonioFP45,BLI's diesel sounds leaves a lot to be desired as well judging by hearing them in person. Larry Conductor. Summerset Ry. "Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!" Reply tsgtbob Member sinceDecember 2004 From: Shanksville PA 311 posts Posted by tsgtbob on Thursday, June 1, 2006 5:42 PM QUOTE: Originally posted by mthrules The folks who have used DCS in O gauge know how great it is. It's far superior to DCC in every way. It will take a while to convince people of the advantages over DCC, but once they try it, they'll be hooked.[tup] www.mthhotrains.com Seems this statement is refered to a lot in this thread. Here's my .02 on the issue. So far, speaking with the HO guys here, the consensus is a big fat SO WHAT!?!? Too many K4s for one, a reputation from the 3 rail side for strike two, and strike three is that it's a propriortary system. I used to use Keller's Onboard many years ago, yeah it was good for it's day, but the open source DCC came out, and now I have a really neat box of nearly useless crap sitting under the layout! As a 2 rail O scaler, I see the fighting between the 3 rail manufacturers actually hurting the hobby. Some MTH stuff is nice, close to scale, and very convertable to 2 rail. Problem is, I really don't like to convert something that is never going to be 100% "right" for O scale. Plus, I don't want to be dictated to as to what I have available to buy for my layout. There is an arrogance to the 3 rail world, one that seems (note the word SEEMS) to have the attitude "you WILL buy because we say so" I sometimes envy the HO world! Reply AntonioFP45 Member sinceDecember 2003 From: Good ol' USA 9,635 posts Posted by AntonioFP45 on Monday, June 26, 2006 9:06 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by BRAKIE AntonioFP45,BLI's diesel sounds leaves a lot to be desired as well judging by hearing them in person. Brakie, I was referring to the BLI Steamers since the comparisons have been speculative as to what the MTH HO steamer will present as far as detailing, performance, and sound. I may be a poor judge, but the sounds from the T1, the Mallets, and the J class Hudsons are sweet and enjoyable! Now, if you remember I was critical of some of BLI diesels. The BLI SD40-2 was dissappointing, but some of the other units like the AC 6000 and the E units, IMHO, sound great. The GE C30-7 FDL16 series prime mover sounds, IMHO, are right on target. (As a railfan, I've seen and heard loads and loads of GE locos) Of course no product is going to be perfect. But "leaving a bit to be desired"? We should remember that before BLI hit the market just a few years ago; while sound in HO decoders were available, it wasn't as widespread as now, the quality was not as good, and it was very expensive. Soundtraxx's premium decoder was the DSD150. Many of us could not afford $170+ sticker price then (and that wasn't even including the speaker). Soundtraxx was on top of the food chain and was easily able to set those prices since competition was pitiful back then. I understand what you're saying but in retrospect BLI/QSI will likely, and should be recognized as the company that really brought ready-made HO sound equipped locos out onto the market. We've benefited greatly as a result. IMHO, it pushed Soundtraxx off of its comfortable laurels out onto the realm of serious competition. The MTH vs. QSI lawsuit provided another incentive to produce a top quality product. Digitrax jumped onboard recently and LokSound targeted the U.S market. Win-win for us![;)] "I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!" Reply 123 Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! Login Register Users Online Coastie71 see all » Search the Community ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT ADVERTISEMENT Model Railroader Newsletter See all Sign up for our FREE e-newsletter and get model railroad news in your inbox! Sign up
. A forum member offered MTH the opportunity to test DCS and the K4 on his HO layout with uncleaned track.......and of course the test never materialized. So again, the question is how do you know that is is far superior to DCC in everyway? Do you own the HO setup yet? At least JNichols gives some detailed insight. But like the MTH K4, with all due respect, it seems that you're once again belching smelly smoke! [|)][B)]
QUOTE: [). I've seen one where the user points with a mouse to slider bars on a graph in order to set the CV variables. No idea what CVs they are or what the values are being set to. Just point to where the volume or whatever is desired.
QUOTE: Originally posted by mthrules The folks who have used DCS in O gauge know how great it is. It's far superior to DCC in every way. It will take a while to convince people of the advantages over DCC, but once they try it, they'll be hooked.[tup] www.mthhotrains.com
QUOTE: Originally posted by jsmaye Whereas DCS looks promising, do see a lot "will" on the web site, as in what the HO version "will" do once it's released. Probably better to reserve judgement until there's actually production models to try out.
Carl in Florida - - - - - - - - - - We need an HO Amtrak SDP40F and GE U36B oh wait- We GOT THEM!
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
QUOTE: Originally posted by BRAKIE AntonioFP45,BLI's diesel sounds leaves a lot to be desired as well judging by hearing them in person.