Is the hobby shop doing the right thing? I want your opinion... (SOLVED)

[peterjenkinson1956]

i was down at the beach reading the latest copy of M R and i noticed the ad for TONYS store... thanks to this forum i read the advertisement for the first time... (i had never noticed it before).... i even looked at his web page when i got home... SO someting good did come from this forum...peter

[Anonymous]

Personally I greatly appreciate what the topic starter did. He brought up a problem and we were able to see it through and how it was solved (or not solved for awhile). Tony's service is good, better than your average itnernet store, but things happen. In the day and age of Internet it can take very little to ruin your reputation if you screw up but the other side of the coin is true - if you keep up good business people will find out and with all the other businesses screwing up you'll come on top, which is what happened to Tony's. Let's face it, Tony's prices are not much better than everyone elses, but he does a lot more business due to his good name in the community.

If more people would post bad experiences about their online train shopping than a lot more of us, especially newcomers would not get burned. I, as a newcomer got burned several times (HobbyCircle was the worst, that guy isn't even capable to be a cashier) and if it lasted a little longer, I would've probably dumped the hobby. No one would miss me but then again, I hear last thing this hobby needs is high attrition.

[Anonymous]

Jim,

I heve NO idea about how good or bad the USPS is; they heven´t let me down yet, so it is not up to me to critisize them.

There seem to be some differences in, like, how to track a parcel, whom to contact if things screw up, stuff you need to know if you are only familiar with the way things work in Europe.

But nowhere have I stated that the USPS is "bad", or "screws up things".

[Anonymous]

I've bought many things from Tony, have delt with Ken and Tony, had them ship it by USPS and received everything in good shape. This is not their regular way to do business, they've always been very helpful and courtious. I WILL CONTINUE TO DEAL WITH THEM AND HOPE THAT OTHER PEOPLE WILL ALSO

[Virginian]

The US Postal SYSTEM is the world's best, bar none. US Postal Service employees are most noted for shooting each other up.
IF one follows the official protocol for doing something, the system probably works 99.99999999999999999% of the time. If you were to call a Postal Employee for them to do something, unless they were a personal friend, I wouldn't give you a 0.0000000000001% chance of success.
I happen to believe the US has the best of everything, but those trying to create a "New World Order' by giving it all away are winning. May they populate hell.

[Anonymous]

Funny thing .......

much talk here about how poor and dishonest the US Post Office, is especially compared to those of Sweden and Germany

The New York Times recently had an article about the world's nation's post offices ........ they stated that the US Postal Service is *by far* the best in the world for service and security, and close to being the least expensive (ounce for ounce).

And the New York Times is often an America basher, too, just like many Europeans.

I can't figure this stuff out.

My 2 cents ..... I've dealt a few times with Tony's on different matters ....I like them. And I blame no merchant for not sending out replacement product until they recieve the incorrect stuff back first, unless you have a real personal relationship going on.

Jim

[SilverSpike]

[:D] Great news electro! [:D]


Glad to see this issue is finally resolved.

[railroadyoshi]

thats good to know

[SpaceMouse]

Great! All's well that ends...

[electrolove]

Just want to inform you all that my problem is solved. Ken at Tony's emailed me today. And they will send me the right track. My 140 USD is back again. I'm very satisfyed with this solution. Will I buy from them again? Maybe... End of story...

[Anonymous]

With all due respect IRON: you should read my post nowhere in there did I state who was the quilty party or parties.

I am only looking at the possiblity that the shop in question may or may not have made the error as well as the customer, Since nither of us have been involved in the actual conversations I do not have all the facts and I feel I can not place any blame on either party. If my post made you feel guilt I aplogize for that openly here in my reply.

I do not feel any person or company no matter how good are unable to not make mistakes.

[ham99]

I may be mistaken, but a Post Office tracking number only tells them [or me] if it has been delivered. Unlike UPS or FedEx, it does not tell us where the package is at this precise moment. And, yes, packages do simply disappear. Earlier this year, and entire day's shipment [four packages] simply disappeared. They have never been found [they had tracking numbers, too]. Why? One reason could be because of something like this local happening. Fourth of July weekend. Someone dropped a firecracker in the outside letter box. Fire destroyed all the mail. Who knows what was still in there. A couple of years ago, I mailed a check -- airmail. It was never cashed. Explanation -- a plane crash. Have you seen the TV commercial with the elephants in the plane? Strange things do happen.

[rexhea]

Fellow MR's,
I have been following this thread each day since it was posted and now believe it is time to make a comment.

I have been dealing with Tony's for over 11/2 years buying several thousand dollars worth of locomotives and DCC equipment and have always received a courteous and helpful service. Shipments have been immediate and accurate. The few times that I was not quite satisfied with MY order, Tony's Trains was always willing to make an adjustment, exchange, or refund. Yes, they did have to receive the returned item first before they could take any action. No problem! One BIG PLUS is the staff of Tony's willingness to help you solve locomotive or DCC problems without any sales pitch.

What I have read in this thread has been a lot of hindsight, but lets not cast blame on either party. What exactly went wrong may be as simple as the package is hung up in customs or on a "slow boat to China" all compounded by a procedural misunderstanding from one country to another. Frustrating? Yes! But, give it some time and patience and let us learn from this experience and hope the outcome will be satisfactory to both parties involved.

[:)] REX [:)]

[Anonymous]

Mike, and palallin, quit it. Your aggrevated tone is imho inappropriate.

Electro did nothing wrong, he did what the guys at the store told him to, and yet he is stiffed for $140,-- plus several overseas phone calls. Maybe he was a little too trustful, but the whole trouble has been initiated by Tony´s sending the wrong track. From that point on, Electro simply did what he had been told by Tony´s.

I am aware that ethics seem outdated these days, but to me it seems is is still the moral duty of the store to sort this out, no matter if they (yet) received the stuff or not. This may lose them a few rails, but win them a satisfied customer. The way Tony´s is handling the problem, both sides lose.

When I make mistakes at work, which happens, I feel that it is my obligation to admit it and to solve the problem I have created in a satisfactory way for our clients. No matter what it takes. If I can do it, Tony can do it, too.

Afaik, the Swedish postal service is as efficient as the German one, so Electro may very well be able to prove that he instantly returned the wrong order and sent it back. This should provide enough proof for Tony´s that the raild have been sent back, if he chooses not to trust his customers.

Tom

[Anonymous]

Polizi,

With all due respect, please think before YOU reply, or at least review what I've actually written.

I've never said it was all his fault. I've never said Tony's isn't at fault for shipping him the wrong item. I (and others) have pointed out where electrolove contributed to the problem of getting the correct item to him.

Who knows why the track hasn't gotten back to Tony? But it sure as heck isn't Tony's fault! But electrolove keeps slamming them here. That's what bothers me.

Why is Tony's ignoring him? Based on his postings here, I think I can guess.

Mike "Please note the lack of the word we" Tennent

[electrolove]

I will not answer any more questions regarding Tonys before I have heard from them. I do NOT want to be a part of this. I respect everyone, and I love this forum. That's it!

Happy modelling to everyone.

[palallin]

No, what electrolove wants is sympathy--and revenge: "Let me ruin theis business by causing other people to not buy from the" (don't bother denying it: he has stated that is his goal). The problem is, no matter how chummy he is with the local postman, he screwed up the business side of it. Whatever the guy at Tony did wrong in the shipment, electrolove screwed up the return. If he has to eat the tax, he can complain to his government or start a revolution over it (there is precedent). Otherwise, he simply has to eat it as a cost of doing business overseas.

We (I'll use "we" because my judgment is not mine alone, given the number of posters who agree) are trying to point out to him that his hasty action contributed significantly to the mess in which he finds himself, and, though it may comfort him mightily to smear the business in public (which business, I might add, has no way of defeneding itself), those of us who have dealt with other sides of the issue may sympathize with him, but we'd like to educate him, too, (or at least someone else who might actually pay attention) so he can avoid such a mess in the future.

And the posts are not "stupid": it may be painful to hear that you've screwed up, but that's how you learn. In any case, as the saying goes: "Don't ask the question unless you can stand all the possible answers."

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: One more thing. There is a lot of 'we' when you are explaining what you think. Remember that it's only your opinion. Not everyones. So stop using the word we all the time.

LOL.

Dude, I haven't used the the word "we" once. Check it out.

Mike Tennent

[Anonymous]

Elecro I agree with you!

People please think before you make a reply!! Electro was posting to make know what happened and for advise on how to handle it not ask for you to slam him and tell him its all his fault and how a company couldnt possible be at fault.

No person or company is perfect and I see no good comming from the harassment to electro over this by a few persons who feel it easy to blame him for doing as he was told. These are only my views so I will not even pretend to speak for anyone else but to you Electro my aplogies for you having to endure this critisism over this issue I hope it works out for you....

[electrolove]

ironpenguin:

Can you please stop your stupid posts now?

Ken at Tony's told me that he did a mistake, he told me that he shipped the wrong track. Is that not enought for you? So why should I bother verifying what I got?

I live in a very little town, where everyone knows everyone. So a phone call to the post office is nothing wrong, that's the way it works here. How can you be so sure that it's the people at my post office that is the ones to blame? It can even be Tony that received it, who knows? Or anyone in between. And it's a fact. The postal system in Sweden is a very good system. No system is perfect but you can't compare the US system to the Swedish.

There is one more reason I did not touch this package. If I had touched it, it had costed me tax as well as someone else stated earlier.

I talked to a lot of people a couple of days ago about this. I was on the phone for several hours trying to sort it out. So it's not true that I have done nothing at all. But as far as I know Tony has done nothing. They didn't even answer my email about the shipping number.

One more thing. There is a lot of 'we' when you are explaining what you think. Remember that it's only your opinion. Not everyones. So stop using the word we all the time.

I thank you for your opinion. But I know what you think about this now so please don't answer.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Sorry Mike but you must realise that in many foreign countries the Postal systems have a much better reputation for efficiency than the US post apparently has. Electrolove's action to me is quite reasonable particularly if his PO is a small town one.

This isn't about the Post Office. This is about a guy who, as dwRavenstar has pointed out, didn't even bother to verify that it WAS the wrong track. Then he told someone else (by phone) to take care of something that was his responsibility. And now he's blaming the hobby shop.

The shop (may have) shipped the wrong track and they have agreed to replace it when he sends back what he got. They've done their part. The blame for the rest of the mess lies elsewhere.

Mike Tennent

[Derailedtoosoon]

Previously having an embroidery business and doing lots of returns to manufacturers, I can tell you this much about returning merchandise to any large business. RULE NUMBER ONE: allways ask for a "RETURN AUTHORIZATION NUMBER" from the retailer, wholesaler or manufacturor and be sure to personally apply the number to the package. Here's the reason. When they receive the package back in the receiving department, without a R.A.N. no one receives the information and the merchandise is generallly replaced in stock and everyone looses; the customer money, the business a good customer. Any number the post office might apply is only for their tracking purposes, not information the business needs to properly credit their customers account. I'm sorry you are learning this lesson the same way I did the first time I returned several hundred dollars worth of sweatshirts. Even though I realized the misstake was mine, I still was angry with the distributor but eventually sent them more orders for merchandise.
I understand your anger, but try to understand the retailers point of view.
I hope someone finds your package and the matter gets resolved favorably.
[banghead]

[peterjenkinson1956]

when you buy from overseas as i do i have to pay tax on the item when i recieve it ..so.. if i had touched the package and returned it i would have still had to pay for the tax 30%.. it would have been approx $40.00..so by not accepting the item and sending it straight back i save$40..00,,,, perhaps it is the same where electrolove lives... ps i find this topuic good..just like days of our lives...,,peter

[Virginian]

Thanks to this thread, I hope everyone in every country now realizes that anytime you trust anyone else, at anyone's post Office or whatever, with the equivalent of your $140 US, that you have just rolled the dice and you may well be trying to make it the hard way.
Being smart is learning from your mistakes. Being intelligent is also learning from other's mistakes.

[tutaenui]

Quote
"And you still seem to be in denial about your part in the whole thing - leaving it up to a munchkin in your post office (via a phone call, no less) to return $140 worth of merchandise.

Mike Tennent"



Sorry Mike but you must realise that in many foreign countries the Postal systems have a much better reputation for efficiency than the US post apparently has. Electrolove's action to me is quite reasonable particularly if his PO is a small town one.

[ARTHILL]

The hobby shop should give you a full refund!!!! Matt Hill

[dwRavenstar]

"I didn't even touch this package, just called the post office and explained the situation."

Perhaps the person who packed the track did it correctly and the one who issued the invoice made a mistake. You'd never verified that the wrong track had been shipped and did nothing personally to return it to the hobby shop. If you had opened the package perhaps the whole matter would have been moot. If you had taken it home, made a proper shipping label and then posted it you would have accepted responsibility for tracking and verifying it's proper return.

The hobby shop can't verify that you actually received an improper shipment and neither can you. If they had sent an email stating that they had never shipped anything and yet the package had arrived on your door step you'd think they were idiots. One can only imagine what they are thinking when told the customer didn't even open the shipment to verify its contents. I don't know the Swedi***erm but I can almost hear your local postmaster, as he/she loaded the track into the backseat of his/her car whistling and saying "yeah, right" while thinking of your directions for returning an unaccepted shipment.

Having dealt in retail and product shipment in my checkered past, I don't imagine i would ever tell a dissatisfied customer to return a supposedly mistaken shipment without checking it out first.

"I didn't even touch this package, just called the post office and explained the situation."

Even a journey of a million miles begins with the first step. Some may say you've yet to put down your map and left the house. Good luck and I hope it all turns out to your satisfaction. "Wish I knew the Swedish for that."

Dave (dwRavenstar)

[Anonymous]

I'm not being rude, just telling it like it is. Posting repetitive "Still haven't heard from Tony" messages was getting tiresome.

And you still seem to be in denial about your part in the whole thing - leaving it up to a munchkin in your post office (via a phone call, no less) to return $140 worth of merchandise.

Mike Tennent

[Pruitt]

I can understand electrolove's frustration - the vendor made a mistake, electrolove made a good-faith effort to correct it, and now the product has apparently disappeared in transit somewhere, and he is screwed. The package could even have arrived at Tony's and been erroneously credited to someone else or stuck on a shelf by someone who was involved in something else when the package arrived, and they simply forgot. Perhaps in his own country the postal workers are generally trustworthy. I know better than to ever trust the Post Office in America.

I hope this can finally work out, but right now electrolove is out $140, and Tony's is probably waiting for the product to be returned so he can issue the appropriate refund. Both parties will probably suffer.