On Wednesday Mark Pruitt posted an item regarding the current shortage of Atlas turnouts. I thought of adding a whimsical reply that he might be interested in some of the turnouts I've been "harvesting" from our club layout.
After more than 40 years in the basement of a former phone company exchange and Masonic lodge, we're being tossed by new buyers of the building who don't want to granfather us in on the purchase, and particularly at the very comfortable rate we've enjoyed for so long. It's a real bummer on many levels. So we're in the midst of salvaging what might be reinstalled on a new layout - if we can find a place that will host us. I'd guess the layout itself is something over a thousand SF.
I've managed to lift more than 90% of the turnouts. Of course, all but those (that are still) in the staging area and approaches underneath are goobered with old ballast, remnants of Homasote, broken or missing ties, yada, yada. Some of the guys think that only the clean ones underneath are worth saving for the rebuild. But being conservative (my wife says "cheap") and thinking of how spendy and perhaps the marginally availability well over 100 new ones would be, I'm willing to try and refurb what I've been able to lift. They run the gambit from 5s and 6s, up through large radius, 3-ways, and a double-slip. On a few the entry rails are loose or have lost their ties altogether.
Any tips out there? Please include suggestions on separating ones that have been soldered to one another in yard ladders, etc.
Thanks, guys.
Attuvian1 John
I saved a bunch of turnouts to be reused in my last move, only reason I did not use them is I was able to buy new ones for a song when Walthers clearanced Shinohara's that they had in stock when Shinohara desided to retire their company. I cut my soldered rail joiners off, then soaked them in a buket to get rid of ballast. Don't try to save the tweaked ones as they will never sit flat but as long as you can get a rail joiner on the turnout, you can really cut them back. It is alway a time vs money question, you can usually find things for cheap if you take enough time and you can get it now with enough money. If you really want to be thrifty you can save all the metal and hand lay new turnouts, at least one person has done this, not me but I have repaired a few in place that were broken.
I think people are wary about purchasing obviously used turnouts because so many little and nearly invisible things can be wrong with them, including problems caused with how they were removed (pried-up) from the prior layout
Ballast sticking to ties and such is a turn off for some because it can be a lot of work to remove, but I think the real problem is that the ballast and such is just the most obvious sign that the turnout was "previously enjoyed."
Now having said that, the right price can make almost anything salable to someone.
Dave Nelson
PS OT perhaps but I was at a railroad historical society meet attended by, among many others, a very familar face and name from midwestern model train shows. He was saying to someone that he can sell used stuff but the one thing that people shy away from and refuse to buy? Used DCC systems. Interesting.
I have salvaged turnouts and flextrack.
For flex track I just cut out the soldered section on both sides.
For soldered flex to turnouts I cut the flex track side leaving enough track to connect a new section of track. These are reused where the extra track is not a problem.
For turnouts soldered to each other I cut as close to the solder section as possible on both sides.
I no longer solder turnouts together or to flex track, just solder feeders to the sides. Makes the salvage operation easier.
Paul
rrebellI was able to buy new ones for a song when Walthers clearanced Shinohara's that they had in stock when Shinohara desided to retire their company.
My story is similar. I was able to buy the old style Walthers/Shinohara turnouts for a song when the "DCC Friendly" turnouts became available.
As for saving old turnouts... It was tried when I dismantled SGRR#4 which had about 25 turnouts on it. None were able to be reused. All track was spiked, ballasted, and soldered. There was just too much damaged getting it all apart.
I have successfully saved turnouts from a few home layouts I removed, but only when they were not ballasted.
IRONROOSTERI no longer solder turnouts together or to flex track, just solder feeders to the sides. Makes the salvage operation easier.
I stopped soldering rail joiners onto turnouts during the construction of SGRR #5. It makes the occassional necessary replacement so much easier.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
Had to dismantle my layout when we moved from Sebring to Ohio. None of my 36 turnouts were soldered, but were ballasted.Had removeable ties at every joint so slipping off the connectors was easy Sprayed alcohol on the turnouts to loosen the matte meduim, turnouts came up easily with minimun ballast. soaked the turnouts in alcohol to remove what little ballast remained. Saved every one of the turnouts
IRONROOSTER I have salvaged turnouts and flextrack. For flex track I just cut out the soldered section on both sides. For soldered flex to turnouts I cut the flex track side leaving enough track to connect a new section of track. These are reused where the extra track is not a problem. For turnouts soldered to each other I cut as close to the solder section as possible on both sides. I no longer solder turnouts together or to flex track, just solder feeders to the sides. Makes the salvage operation easier. Paul
The very same for me. I salvaged enough track from my previous layout to complete a 40' loop, and all but one Peco Streamline Code 83 #6. Also, I still have every one of my hand-laid turnouts from 2006. One custom-built curved #11 is now on its third layout.
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
I converted many of the old style Walthers/Shinohara turnouts from a previous layout to "DCC Friendly" for use on my current layout. Over time I noticed that the soldered joint holding the points to the throwbar had a tendency to break. While this is fairly easy to repair, the thought of always fixing turnouts was not in my game plan.
So I started looking for a cause and found that I had been setting the Tortoise machines to near-maximum throw to ensure a good electrical connection between the points and stock rails which put undue stress on the point rail / throw bar connection. So I adjusted all the Tortoise fulcrums up so that the point rail was snug, but not too tight against the stock rail - and haven't had a problem since.
But, in keeping with my "belt and suspenders" approach, I did replace any hard-to-reach turnouts with new ones.
Jim
I'm familiar with the layout the original poster is discussing and was very familiar with it in the early 1980s. Many of the switches were used items in so-so condition when they were installed almost 50 years ago and it may be a false economy to reinstall them in a reconstructed railroad.
On a brighter note, I understand that original (prospective) buyers couldn't get the money they needed to complete the deal, and the sellers of the building are now talking to a possible buyer who is more sympathetic of the club staying.
A new layout in the same place is a chance for them to up their game.
I have salvaged track and turnouts from some of my old modules. Desoldering the joiners is easy. The hard part was the ballast and glue. I submerged mine in a bath of hot soapy water with a fish tank heater in it to keep it warm. A small scrub brush and some easy strokes took 99.9% off. If not just keep soaking.
Some call it cheap. But I prefer thrifty. Just not as thrifty as my ex father-in-law. He would wash, bleach, and hang dry coffee filters. I got him a package of 1000 for a present. When he passed ten years later, it was still unopened.
Pete.
In my 20 years in the hobby and five new or modified layouts, I have never tossed a turnout.
When I take down a layout, the first thing that I do is to separate the turnouts into piles. If two or more turnouts are soldered together, a fine point red hot soldering iron will quickly separate the turnouts without melting the adjacent ties.
If the only issue is ballast, I soak those turnouts in a pan of isopropyl alcohol which is guaranteed to remove matte medium holding the ballast to the ties.
If ties are missing, I replace them. The easiest situation is where the rails have lifted out of the ties at the tail end of a turnout. Since the plastic spikes are probably destroyed, I cut the ties back to the first good set of spikes and then replace the cut ties with undamaged ties. A good source of undamaged ties are the ends of short lengths of sectional track which I keep on hand.
If ties are missing or damaged inside the turnout, I replace those areas with good ties salvaged from flex track. I simply shave off the spikes for a good fit and then glue the section of ties to the area where the ties were missing or damaged.
Rich
Alton Junction
Just soaking in water for a week will remove ballast adheared with matt medium.
You can clean up turnouts...removing glued ballast and most caulk....by soaking them in 91% alcohol. It doesn't bother metal and plastic. Use an old flat baking pan and cover a little more than the bottom of the pan.
As far as replacing ties, I don't know what to say. If its just the odd one here and there I suppose using an old tie and CA would work.
I have successfully re-formed "spikes" by using a low wattage soldering iron to melt the tie and push the plastic onto the base of the rail, holding it in place. It of course ruins the look of the tie, but weathering and ballast disguises it pretty well if you don't use one of those locomotive cameras.
- Douglas
rrebell Just soaking in water for a week will remove ballast adheared with matt medium.
I have never done this to a turnout, however, flex track yes. I lined the track up out on the driveway, gently placed my foot on the end and gave it a pass with the pressure washer, flipped it over, and did it again. One pass and it removed all ballast, glue, and other crap. The track was like new. I can't see why turnouts would be any different.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
BATMAN I have never done this to a turnout, however, flex track yes. I lined the track up out on the driveway, gently placed my foot on the end and gave it a pass with the pressure washer, flipped it over, and did it again. One pass and it removed all ballast, glue, and other crap. The track was like new. I can't see why turnouts would be any different.
I have saved some turnouts by soaking brushing away ballst. I have also salvaged pesky Shinohara turnouts into DCC friendly by cutting the metal throw bar and soldering the point rails to copper clad PC board ties. I also isollate the frog and hardwire the frog to a slide switch that also controls the points, to maintain accurate polarity. I have even done this to turnouts without removing them from the roadbed. A good referece is a video by the "DCC guy" on you tube.
While this will take some learning plus time, it is doable. However, doing it for 100 turnouts may be too long. The first one is hard, after that, you get faster. The point in this hobby, is to dare to try something. I am always surprised how much I learn and can achieve success. Blessings, Andy Chandler
Realy not needed to make Shinohara turnouts DCC friendly, they work fine with a frog juicer, my whole layout is like that.
Whether to refurbish or not is - in my experience - an individual piece by piece decision. On my last layout (built 2008), I reused a number of Atlas code 100 pieces of flex and turnouts (3 or 4 generations). All had ballast remaining on them after pulling from the previous layout.
For the flextrack, I only worked with the longer pieces (say 24 inch plus). First, using a track cutting pliers, I snipped off each soldered or jagged end. Then - working in the garage over a large trashcan - I used a shop brush to get off all the looser pieces of ballast.
I followed that with a brushing using a brass bristled "tooth brush" which is normally used for firearm cleaning. My intent was not to remove all the ballast, but to remove any inside the rails, touching the outside of the rails, and any pieces that were on the bottom of the ties. I followed all this up with an alcohol soaked rag, running over the tops of all the rails until no brown/black residue remained.
What I ended up with was a whole lot of weathered tracks that I used for sidings, loco terminal, and secondary trackage on the new layout.
I followed the same procedure with the turnouts, but realized that the very early generations just didn't hold up to "reuse". And, I found out the hard way that a few of the older generations were not built to handle the sensitivity of DCC. By that I mean that some loco wheels would lightly touch two tracks when going thru the frogs, and either stop or screw up the sound.
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
richhotrain BATMAN I have never done this to a turnout, however, flex track yes. I lined the track up out on the driveway, gently placed my foot on the end and gave it a pass with the pressure washer, flipped it over, and did it again. One pass and it removed all ballast, glue, and other crap. The track was like new. I can't see why turnouts would be any different. Yikes! Rich
Yikes!
Attuvian1 richhotrain BATMAN I have never done this to a turnout, however, flex track yes. I lined the track up out on the driveway, gently placed my foot on the end and gave it a pass with the pressure washer, flipped it over, and did it again. One pass and it removed all ballast, glue, and other crap. The track was like new. I can't see why turnouts would be any different. Yikes! Rich Thanks for the tip, Brent. I tried it this afternoon on some flex. In the case where the ballast was still affixed to a layer of homasote, I pre-treated by spraying both sides with 99% alcohol. It worked great and is a real time-saver (once you get set up for the job)! Rather than expose the rails to the concrete when doing the underside, I did both sides against a 4-foot piece of 2x8. As I recall, my pressure washer runs about 2300psi nominal. Wide spray nozzle, about a foot above the board. I have about a dozen more sticks to do tomorrow that escaped my notice first time around. That might include one or two of Atlas code 83 that was affixed to cork with Liquid Nails. Perhaps a bit more problematic as it's some sort of gummy resin. While I'm at it, I'll hit up a couple turnouts that will likely be trashed for other reasons. An Atlas can probably handle it. A Shinohara, maybe. Blow off the excess water and let 'em air dry. Stay tuned . . . Attuvian1 John
richhotrain Attuvian1 richhotrain BATMAN I have never done this to a turnout, however, flex track yes. I lined the track up out on the driveway, gently placed my foot on the end and gave it a pass with the pressure washer, flipped it over, and did it again. One pass and it removed all ballast, glue, and other crap. The track was like new. I can't see why turnouts would be any different. Yikes! Rich Thanks for the tip, Brent. I tried it this afternoon on some flex. In the case where the ballast was still affixed to a layer of homasote, I pre-treated by spraying both sides with 99% alcohol. It worked great and is a real time-saver (once you get set up for the job)! Rather than expose the rails to the concrete when doing the underside, I did both sides against a 4-foot piece of 2x8. As I recall, my pressure washer runs about 2300psi nominal. Wide spray nozzle, about a foot above the board. I have about a dozen more sticks to do tomorrow that escaped my notice first time around. That might include one or two of Atlas code 83 that was affixed to cork with Liquid Nails. Perhaps a bit more problematic as it's some sort of gummy resin. While I'm at it, I'll hit up a couple turnouts that will likely be trashed for other reasons. An Atlas can probably handle it. A Shinohara, maybe. Blow off the excess water and let 'em air dry. Stay tuned . . . Attuvian1 John Hey, John, whatever happened? Rich
Hey, John, whatever happened?
Whatever you can't salvage is worth tossing. I agree with others about trying to get the turnouts off by putting a damp towel over them and carefully liftingnoff. If they first won't come up, I would not bother.
kasskaboose Whatever you can't salvage is worth tossing. I agree with others about trying to get the turnouts off by putting a damp towel over them and carefully lifting off. If they first won't come up, I would not bother.
Whatever you can't salvage is worth tossing. I agree with others about trying to get the turnouts off by putting a damp towel over them and carefully lifting off. If they first won't come up, I would not bother.