I would like to add a small excursion train to my layout. My minimum curve radius will be 24 inches and I have been restricting rolling stock to 50 to 60 feet plus four-axle diesel. Looking on eBay, there appear to be many 80-foot passenger cars but few in the range I'm looking for. My layout is early 90's but the excursion train will run older small cars and maybe an F-7 loco or GP 30. Any recommendations on 50 to 60-foot passenger cars? Looking more for a bargain, not top shelf...
Probably the closest you'll get is Athearn's 72' cars. Con Cor has some 72'ers as well. You might have to "shorten" something to get 50' or 60'.
I think with 24" radius, you should be OK with the 72' cars, and they seem to look good with the F7.
Athearn does have an RPO car that is a little shorter than 72'
I'm not aware of any manufacturer that makes shorter passenger equipment. I'll be watching your thread to see what comes up!
Mike.
My You Tube
I’m still being moderated after having to “rejoin” the Forum, so who knows when this will show up, but...
I also have been wanting to run an excursion train with short equipment. I found there are some really short passenger cars that were made by Model Die Casting/ Roundhouse many years ago. They were called “Harriman” cars, and were somewhere around 50-60 feet long. My research indicated they are “mostly” prototypical, even though they are quite short. They have kind of a round roof. I think they have a Southern Pacifc prototype. I haven’t made the jump to get any yet, but I found there are some still available on Ebay or at train shows. I think Athearn reissued them when they took over the Roundhouse brand, and are fully assembled, have improved decoration, metal wheels and knuckle couplers. Maybe this will work for your layout?
Best,
Alan
Hi again,
It looks like I’m a free man again, lol!
I just looked them up and they are 60’ long. I found a MR Forum thread about them, but I’m not sure how to provide a link.
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/13/t/78374.aspx
Good luck!
BubbyThey were called “Harriman” cars, and were somewhere around 50-60 feet long.
There's a some on Ebay right now. I used Harriman in the search, once in HO scale, and quite a few Roundhouse cars came up.
Made it live.
Mike
Thanks Mike!
How’d you do that?
I took your advice and looked at Ebay, and I see Model Power made some too. Unfortunately, they are described as 67’ which might be too long for the OP. Not a brand name associated with high quality but maybe they can be tuned up.
The Harriman cars, by Model die Casting, are 60'-ers, and come with Talgo-style (truck-mounted) couplers, so they'll handle the curves on your layout easily.
I have only one on my layout, a baggage car, but have put body-mounted couplers on it, along with six-wheel trucks...
Another option for shorter cars was also offered by MDC, their Overton cars. I have the ones which are about 58' over the end platforms, and use them in MoW service as retired passenger cars replaced by somewhat newer cars, so I've boarded-over some of the windows.
Here's the coach, with an older-style duckbill roof (all cars were available with either the duckbill or standard clerestory roof), and a couple of boarded-over windows...
This combine has the more modern-style clerestory roof, while the two small windows in the baggage section were added by my road's shops when the car was re-assigned...
This postal/baggage car also has the more modern roof, and several blanked-out windows....
Similar-style cars were aslo offered by MDC in 34' versions, but they're pretty much a fantasy creation, I think.
The 58'-ers would have operated into the early 20th century on some roads, but would have been replaced by longer, more modern cars. However, they could still be useful on a more modern-day excursion train, and with a snazzy-looking old time paint scheme, could look pretty good. I don't think that they're currently being produced, but there seem to be lots available at train shows. A couple or three coaches and perhaps a combine (with open doors for the tape recorder and camera nuts) would make a decent excursion train, and wouldn't break the bank.
Wayne
I am surprised that no one has mentioned Rivarossi passenger cars. Rivarossi made a whole line of 60' passenger cars in several road names, and these passenger cars are readily available on eBay.
On one of my prior layouts with tight curves, I ran lots of Rivarossi passenger cars. They performed quite well and looked great for the price.
Rich
Alton Junction
I've never seen those Rich, and I guess If I did, I didn't realize they were that short.
I've been searching for a "shorter" sleeper car, and ended up bashing one from a Con Cor and an Athearn, as I wanted a streamliner.
The big problem is that sellers don't give that kind of information, as far as length. The last couple of weeks, I have asked probably 15 or more sellers to measure the car for me, only a few have written back.
mbinsewi I've never seen those Rich, and I guess If I did, I didn't realize they were that short. I've been searching for a "shorter" sleeper car, and ended up bashing one from a Con Cor and an Athearn, as I wanted a streamliner.
Also, at one time, Walthers offered 60' passenger cars under the TrainLine series. Lots of roadnames, but only heavyweights. They may have been produced in conjunction with Rivarossi, if I recall correctly.
richhotrainTo my knowledge, the only 60' passenger cars made by Rivarossi were heavyweights, not streamliners.
Thanks Rich, maybe that's why I missed them, or passed them up.
There are other options but they involve hitting the swap meets, online auctions, and other non traditional sources. And the older the stuff gets the more the person who just wants the model as a model might be dealing with collectors and collector pricing.
And since we are talking collectors, don't forget that Tenshodo sold brass Japanese made 60' passenger cars that probably bring outsized collector prices.
But one clarification: the Rivarossi 60' "standard" passenger cars that Walthers cataloged for a time were actual prototype length (C&NW coaches and a combine). Most other "shorty" passenger cars out there, including the old Athearn blue box cars that are often seen at swap meets, are not accurate prototype length. 60' cars in particular look absurdly shortened but make sense for super sharp curves such as 18" radius.
Mantua/Tyco had a line of streamlined 60' passenger cars, a combine, coach, and observation. At one time the older Mantua cars were actual extruded aluminum. Tycos were plastic.
Penn Line had shorty standard and streamlined cars. Gone for nearly 60 years but not unheard of at swap meets.
Varney had shorty streamlined cars including a full length (well, full 60' length) dome car. This might have been old Penn Line tooling.
John English had shorty streamlined and standard passenger cars. Rarely seen at swap meets.
Model Power had 67' Harrimann cars often seen at swap meets painted in "military" paint schemes.
Con Cor has streamlined passenger cars - the corrugated side ones are full 85' length but the smooth side ones are shorties, about 72', rather like Athearn blue box. Con Cor has become such an iffy supplier that who knows if they are actually being made or not.
One brand that might not occur to folks is the old Kasiner/Herkimer/OK line of metal passenger cars. I believe they still are available in full and 60' shorty length.
http://www.okengines.com/news.shtml
If the OP has 24" radius curves the the Athearn blue box and Con Cor smooth side streamlined cars would work just fine and more importantly, look more plausible that a 60' shorty car. The main thing is that passenger cars SHOULD look longer than freight cars. Unless there are full length 80' or 85' cars nearby for comparison it is surprising how plausible Athearn and Con Cor shorty cars can look.
Dave Nelson
I guess we'll have to wait and see just what time period the OP wants.
I leaned about the Kasiner cars, and there are a couple of them out there right now.
I needed a streamliner sleeper to go with the Athearn set I'm building, so I bashed a Con Cor sleeper with parts from an Athearn coach, to give it a streamliner appreance.
I have no problem with the 72'ers on a 24" radius. It works fine.
There was a lot of the Harriman cars on Ebay last night, all Roundhouse.
There's stuff out there.
Currently several cars are listed on MB Klein's site including Roundhouse Overton cars (34 ft), Athearn Archroof (looks like the old MDC 60' Harriman), and several open platform cars from Bachmann that appear to be about 50'.
Paul
I have 72' sleepers by Athern, running on 22" curves. A little light as purchased, but no problems now.
Dave
Thanks for the suggestions! Always helpful to read the experiences of others! Not sure which I'm going to go. Using a couple 50 ft Durango and Silverton cars by Roundhouse is appealing as "vintage people carriers" for an excursion line. However, for appearance sake, I'm thinking one needs to go the full route and use a steam locomotive for motive power. I don't know anything about steam, which loco would be appropriate, who makes a decent/affordable steam engine, etc. But on the flip side, if go with Athearn streamliners, I would still need to purchase an appropriate loco for those cars. All my locos are 4 axle EMD's and a BN or CR loco just would not look right at the head of a passenger trail... Since I'm dreaming, any recommendations on a steam loco for a pair of 50' pullman cars? If I go athearn, which is a better choice: F7 or FP45?
IDRick If I go athearn, which is a better choice: F7 or FP45?
I'll let the steam experts answer the first part, as I only have two. Actually, if your modeling modern, any steam loco would look good! I mean look at the tourist railroads that use steam.
As far as the streamliners, it's your call, there is no "wrong" answer. I'm partial to the F7, but the FP45 would also work.
Actually, to tell the truth, even the steam loco part, there really would be no wrong answer.
I do think if a tourist line had a refurbished/restored steam loco, I doubt it would be something huge, like a Big Boy.
Porbably what would decide exactly what your motive power would be, is the cars, and if your need a head end power supply, sumer time operation? electricty needed? for lights, heat, etc.?
IDRickI don't know anything about steam, which loco would be appropriate, who makes a decent/affordable steam engine, etc.
Just about anything that's not articulated seems to be used from 0-6-0 on up - 4-6-0 or 4-6-2 would be a good middle choice.
Bachmann make pretty good locomotives that are usually heavily discounted from online dealers and at train shows.
richhotrain I am surprised that no one has mentioned Rivarossi passenger cars. Rivarossi made a whole line of 60' passenger cars in several road names, and these passenger cars are readily available on eBay. On one of my prior layouts with tight curves, I ran lots of Rivarossi passenger cars. They performed quite well and looked great for the price. Rich
IDRick richhotrain I am surprised that no one has mentioned Rivarossi passenger cars. Rivarossi made a whole line of 60' passenger cars in several road names, and these passenger cars are readily available on eBay. On one of my prior layouts with tight curves, I ran lots of Rivarossi passenger cars. They performed quite well and looked great for the price. Rich Thanks for the tip! I like the looks of the 60 ft Rivarossi cars. They come complete with updated tooling, knuckle couplers, metal wheels and complete interiors for 20 bucks + shipping. The Ebay description confirms that they will run on 18" radius curves and my minimum will be 6 inches wider radius.
So, these must be the heavyweight type cars? or maybe the Harriman style "round roof" cars?
I recently bought a Bachmann 2-6-0 (with the new tooling and sound) and for the price, it is a sweet little engine. I use it to pull MDC 60 ft passengers, which is pretty much prototypical.
Simon
Mike, yes they are heavyweight cars. Search for Rivarossi 60ft 3370 car.
Simon, thanks for posting! I was intrigued by the 2-6-0 model when searching around on the internet last night. Which version did you buy: dcc ready, EZ app equipped, or DCC+sound? The EZ app sounds like a cool feature as I do not have DCC and plan to purchase Rail Pro in the future. Rail Pro does not send commands via the rail. I think the EZ app and Rail Pro would work together so would not need to buy a decoder for the steam loco. Do you have the EZ app version and do you like it?
Oops, oldheimer disease, you said you have sound so you must have purchased the DCC+sound version...
In the above post, I mentioned a 2-6-0 that comes with the EZ-app. Sounded like an interesting idea but appears to be dead technology. The Bachmann EZ app board is dead and the Blue Rail webpage basically says they are collaborating on new technology but won't say what it is or when it will be delivered. Okay, clunk (tossing idea into a circular file).
I guess I'll stick with my Digitrax.
So this Blue Rail only worked with the Bachmann EZ App.?
I'm not part of the smart phone crowd, as I still use a flip phone. But I only use it for phone calls.
It is interesting to see all the new stuff come along. I guess JMRI is about all I have that allows you to use anything other than a regular throttle, and hardly use the JMRI. It's not even connected to my layout, it's up in my office, on a lap top, along with a section of programing track.
I find it just as easy to program with my throttle. Although I do have a future Mars-type light project in the works, in which I may use JMRI to program the lights, much like programing different ditch light effects.
Yup, 2-6-0 with DCC and sound. Keep in mind that this is a small loco with limited pulling abilities. But excursion trains can be quite short, something like 2 or 3 cars. I am recommending it because I know it is available new, and the price is right in my opinion. A 4-6-0 is also a nice model, but more $$$ if you want sound. The 4-4-0 is also a nice little engine (the Richmond model, with new tooling), but it can also be hard to find new. The 4-6-2s are also quite nice, but they are more pricey. I actually double-head my 2-6-0 with a 4-6-0 that I already had, and the effect is quite nice... Long live steam!
The 60' Rivarossi cars have been made/sold under the Walthers name and one other (perhaps Hornby after they took over Rivarossi). The coach and combine are based on real C&NW "utility" cars which were 60' long. The baggage and RPO 60' cars are also I believe based on C&NW cars, but many railroads had similar 60' head-end cars. (Interestingly, Walthers made craftsman kit versions of these cars at least as far back as the 1960's, maybe much earlier?)
The old MDC (now Athearn) 50' Pullman cars are cars from the 1870's-1880's. To be accurate for a historical recreation you'd want a 19th century steam locomotive like a 4-4-0 I would think.
Keep in mind Walthers full-size passenger cars are supposed to be able to take a 24" radius curve, so you don't have to go with teeny tiny cars. You also don't have to have a steam locomotive to haul heavyweight cars! An excursion train of an F7 and several heavyweight cars would look fine.
The Athearn heavyweights are good cars, but don't come with interiors. I'd maybe look at picking up a couple of old (not the 60' ones discussed earlier) Rivarossi coaches, which you can sometimes find with a plastic one-piece interior with seats and dividers.
wjstix The 60' Rivarossi cars have been made/sold under the Walthers name and one other (perhaps Hornby after they took over Rivarossi). The coach and combine are based on real C&NW "utility" cars which were 60' long. The baggage and RPO 60' cars are also I believe based on C&NW cars, but many railroads had similar 60' head-end cars. (Interestingly, Walthers made craftsman kit versions of these cars at least as far back as the 1960's, maybe much earlier?) The old MDC (now Athearn) 50' Pullman cars are cars from the 1870's-1880's. To be accurate for a historical recreation you'd want a 19th century steam locomotive like a 4-4-0 I would think. Keep in mind Walthers full-size passenger cars are supposed to be able to take a 24" radius curve, so you don't have to go with teeny tiny cars. You also don't have to have a steam locomotive to haul heavyweight cars! An excursion train of an F7 and several heavyweight cars would look fine. The Athearn heavyweights are good cars, but don't come with interiors. I'd maybe look at picking up a couple of old (not the 60' ones discussed earlier) Rivarossi coaches, which you can sometimes find with a plastic one-piece interior with seats and dividers.
Why would you stay away from the 60 ft Rivarossi? They have new tooling, knuckle couplers, complete interiors and metal wheels for $20 + shipping. Seems to be a great buy and I have read several posters describing excellent performance with these cars...