Does anyone just snip them off the couplers? I have noticed that a lot of my derailments are because the trip pin bumps up against the ties, especially in a tournout or it interferes with the other trip pin when it is being coupled. I have the Kadee trip pin pliers but it doesnt always work. Any suggestions?
Bear "It's all about having fun."
Yup,just go to Micro Mark and buy the # 80600 trip bending plier . Should fix the problem.
Patrick
Fear an Ignorant Man more than a Lion- Turkish proverb
Modeling an ficticious HO scale intergrated Scrap Yard & Steel Mill Melt Shop.
Southland Industrial Railway or S.I.R for short. Enterchanging with Norfolk Southern.
bearman. I have the Kadee trip pin pliers but it doesnt always work.
Why???
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
Beats me, Ja Bear. I try to be somewhat gentle when I bend the trip pin. Maybe I should be more aggressive.
bearman Does anyone just snip them off the couplers? I have noticed that a lot of my derailments are because the trip pin bumps up against the ties, especially in a tournout or it interferes with the other trip pin when it is being coupled. I have the Kadee trip pin pliers but it doesnt always work. Any suggestions?
Are you using REAL Kadee couplers or the cheap knock off junk that comes with most equipment?
All my equipments has REAL Kadee couplers, no problems. No problem to adjust trip pins, no problems with saggy couplers, no derailments, no false uncoupling.
You do get exactly what you pay for........
I change them out before any piece of equipment ever see the rails of my layout.....
Properly installed KADEE couplers work perfectly, the cheap copies, not so much.....
Kadee makes a guage so you know that the coupler height and trip pin height are correct.
https://kadee.com/htmbord/page205.htm
Sheldon
I am using Kadee couplers and I have the gauge, but I question the gauge insofar as the trip pin is concerned.
bearman I am using Kadee couplers and I have the gauge, but I question the gauge insofar as the trip pin is concerned.
Roll the car SLOWLY up to the gauge, the trip pin should NOT strike the slightly rounded leading edge of the shelf, it should be at or slightly above it, and clear or barely rest on the shelf after the car is coupled to the guage.
The couplers should have minimal vertical play in the coupler box.
This product has been working perfectly for 60 plus years, one simply needs to understand and master its installation and operational requirements.
Is the coupler mounting box secure? If the coupler mounting box is loose or the cover not tight then the coupler will sag and the trip pin will hit the track.
At the cars the right height, are they couplers the correct height above the rails?
When bending the trip pin I find using bending pliers, I use the the second shoulder, much easier to bend them then the first shoulder.
Something is bad wrong if the trip pin is hitting the ties.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
I'm sold. I have been adjusting pins using 2 pliers together, needlenose and another, but that tends to stress the assembly and coupler box. Just ordered one.
https://kadee.com/htmbord/page237.htm
https://www.micromark.com/Trip-Pin-Bending-Plier-HO-and-O-Scale
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Kadee-Coupler-Trip-Pin-Pliers-237/332730470774?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649
Paul
Modeling HO with a transition era UP bent
I bought the Kadee pin-bender a couple of years ago, but haven't used it yet. That's because I get the coupler height correct, first.
It can be a LOT of work. But there's also a great benefit: trains stay coupled unless they're on really bad track. So, when that happens, the track is at fault, and must be fixed.
But no pin bending. And no "track picking".
So, as much as you can tolerate, I urge you to get the coupler height as close as possible to correct. First. Before using that Kadee tool.
But. Going back to the first question about cutting the coupler pins off. I just started doing that about two weeks ago, after resisting mightily for a VERY long time.
Why now?
Because I was just putting Kadees on an Athearn BN SD45 (after raising the coupler height to the proper height of .039" centerline). I'm looking at the front of the engine, where there's a snow plow. And a Kadee. And I'm thinking "I can't run this engine at the rear of a consist." Then I also think:
I haven't used a magnetic uncoupler in at least 15 years--not since I tested my two new concealed Kadee electromagnetic ramps. Well, new 15 years ago.
Also, I've been installing Sergents on all my unit (coal and intermodal) trains--no pins there.
So, in a fit, I cut the pin off the SD45. Which actually fixes nothing, since it's the car that mates TO it that needs the pin cut off. That's why I'm bringing my diagonal cutters to my train-running this weekend.
Oh, yeah. I picked up a pack of those wood skewers everyone says work like "a slick pig" (or whatever). They DO. Wow.
Ed
Agreed, if you get the height right, you seldom have to adjust a trip pin.
A few thoughts on the trip pins:
I was a member of an operations oriented round robin group for 15 years. Personally, I never cared for sticking a skewer in the knuckle.
I much prefer to use a skewer or small, long screwdriver to pull the trip pin to the side. Which can even be done on diaphragm equiped passenger cars or in crowded freight yards, just as easily as using the skewer in the knuckles.
Macro vs micro, what is your modeling style?
I'm a big picture kind of guy, long trains, large layout, 800 freight cars. For me the trip pins stay.
I don't use magnetic uncoupling, but the pins do look like coupled air hoses from the "macro" view.
And as noted, they are useful for manual uncoupling with a "tool".
If I were a "micro" style modeler, I would use Sergents...........
Somewhere i think that changed - when I first started using Kadees, even though the coupler head matched up perfectly with the gauge, the pin was often too low and needed adjustment. Also, bulk packs in those days seemed to come with as many knuckle springs loose as were actually on the couplers. More recent ones - I haven't bent a trip pin in ages, and most every coupler in the pack has had the knuckle spring installed.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
As others have said, the height of the coupler knuckle needs to be correct first.
I have a test track with a Kadee gauge at each end. One gauge is modified to remove the little shelf for checking the trip wire. I run the car up to this gauge first to check the knuckle height. If that's correct, then I run the car to the other gauge to check the trip wire.
This process eliminates the issue of a trip wire influencing the knuckle height.
I have a pair of boxcars in which the previous owner did clip off the lower part of the ‘hose’ at a height where the hoses still connected but didn’t overlap a lot. I have never had any problems uncoupling them using the Lionel Strang designed uncoupling tool which grabs the one of the hoses and pulls it to the side to uncouple the cars. I prefer not to cut the hoses on other cars. Instead I use jewelry pliers to bend the hose slightly. I use them just because it is the tool I already own and they work ok. I have tried needle nose pliers but they can be a little to crude of a tool for what is needed. I adjust the couplers before I install them. It makes it easier. I know every coupler needs a bend which is slightly more than the factory bend. The majority of my cars are Athearn blue box kits or old Roundhouse MDC kits.
I just use needle nose pliers and give the trip pins a slight squeeze to bend them up just a little bit. I've been doing that since I was a starving college student and the cost of a special Kadee tool was not in my budget.
Do people cut off their trip pins? Sure, some do. Mainly because they feel the trip pin is unrealistic in appearance.
Bending a trip pin has been a standard part of any kit builders bag of tricks as long as I can remember.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
Lone Wolf and Santa Fe I have never had any problems uncoupling them using the Allen Strang designed uncoupling tool
Who? Lionel, maybe?
Bearman,
Not being ugly here but you are obviously not doing the setup correctly. KD's have been around forever and when properly adjusted provide flawless service. They aren't generally open the package, slap them in and go run though. They need to be installed in the coupler boxes correctly and the trip poins often need teaking. Those adjusting pliers are great and make it easy but you have to use them correctly. Use one direction to widen the trip pin curve and the opposite direction to close up or tighten the curve of the pin. Notice the jaws have stepped segments to get different curve radii. It's a trial and error thing and has to be used in conjunction with the couple gauge. Lots of good information from the previous posters.
Take your time and you can do this. It seems harder than it really is. Time will get you up to speed and if you want reliable operation it's vital to have them set perfectly.
The Athearn Blue Box cars are the only ones I've had any issues with once the couplers are set. The lousy clip that retains the couplers in the box can become loose and let the coupler droop. Crummy, cheap way to do couplers. Everyone else used a screw to retain everything.
Yes, some folks cut the trip pin off as it isn't very prototypical looking. I don't like folks sticking the uncoupling tools between my cars as many people don't have good coordination or eyesight and I don't appreciate my cars getting scratched up or knocked over and many operators just don't care about your equipment.
Go back and try to adjust the pins. Take your time and be patient and it will come to you just how much tension to use to get the curves right.
oldline1
oldline1...The lousy clip that retains the couplers in the box can become loose and let the coupler droop. Crummy, cheap way to do couplers. Everyone else used a screw to retain everything....
Actually, a lot of manufacturers used coupler box covers with an integral pin that simply pushed into a hole in a mounting boss inside the coupler box - too loose and it would drop out, too tight and it would break off if you ever needed to remove the lid.The Athearn metal clips were a good design, but it was often necessary to re-bend those clip-on sides so that they were at 90° to the cover itself. I've never had a problem with them falling off when they're installed correctly.The worst covers were those which needed be be glued in place. Nowadays, all of my non-Athearn cars get screwed-on coupler covers...
Wayne
Make a simple "go/no-go" gauge from two pieces of 0.020" scrap styrene.
.
If the trip cleares the first step but snags on the second you know it is adjusted between 0.020" and 0.040" above the rail head, and you will never have a problem.
Of course, use genuine Kadee couplers, and in Kadee boxes if possible.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
SeeYou190 Make a simple "go/no-go" gauge from two pieces of 0.020" scrap styrene. If the trip cleares the first step but snags on the second you know it is adjusted between 0.020" and 0.040" above the rail head, and you will never have a problem. -Kevin
Or break the bank and get a Kadee coupler height gauge which really should be a standard item in your model RR tool box. It has a trip pin built in.
riogrande5761Or break the bank and get a Kadee coupler height gauge which really should be a standard item in your model RR tool box.
The Kadee trip pin gauge is not a "Go/No-Go" style, so it is not as accurate.
Of course I have a Kadee coupler height gauge.
I, for one, will keep my trip pins. I model a railroad that had a number of car body-type locos that all have diaphragms. It's darn near impossible to uncouple anything with working diaphragms. This also applies to my large fleet of passenger cars.
Besides, I enjoy the "hands free" magnet uncoupling the trip pins give me and the ability to uncouple inside buildings if I have to (using a magnet). That and they are much faster to classify a yard with.
Spend the time to set Kadees up correctly and you'll have literally decades of flawless operation out of them.
For a good go-no go gauge, get the MicroMark one:https://www.micromark.com/Coupler-Gauge-for-HO-Standard-Gauge
For $10.95, it's a wise investment. The back of the gauge has the trip pin shelf (which the trip pin should not touch). BTW, I have found that the MicroMark gauge is actually more accurate than the Kadee gauge. The Kadee gauges I have are actually a little lower than proper.
No trip pin, no problems. If you are considering cutting them off, then the affore mentioned appendage of the Kadee is not required, and you can replace them entirely with a better looking coupler (IMO). Sell the Kadees on Ebay.
http://www.sergentengineering.com/
For diaphragm equipped equipment, there is a Sergent uncoupling tool for that too.
I use skewers to uncouple, so I don;t really need the trip pins, but I haven't been brave enought o clip any off. None are too low, some may be too high to work with a magnet, but I did sit down and paint a lot of them - couplers and the pin, couplers with rust (did not have any problem with the paint causing them to stick - just work them back and forth a few times and they are not stuck), the hoses get oily black, and as a final touch I use a silver paint marker to dab one side of the cut off end of the pin with to make it look more like the glad hand at the end of the hose. From normal viewing angles this looks 10x better than bare unpainted Kadees. Simple and fast to do - I assembly-lined it, the rust on the coupler head takes the longest but by the time you work through a bunch of cars, the first one is dry enough to to the hose. Then by the time you finish all the hoses, the first one is dry enough to use the silver marker. I did cheat and had a helpwer - it's in the construction progress section of my web site, I sat outside on a nice day working through a couple of boxes (Spring Mills carrying cases) of cars, and I had a squirrel hanging out so close I could have pet him.
bearmanBeats me, Ja Bear. I try to be somewhat gentle when I bend the trip pin. Maybe I should be more aggressive.
SeeYou190 The Kadee trip pin gauge is not a "Go/No-Go" style, so it is not as accurate. -Kevin
The only "go no-go" I've ever heard of is a point on the runway airplane needs to abort a take off or proceed.
Anyway, I've just used my eyes to check my trip pins for the last 35 years and never had a problem with trip pins causing derailments. Works for me.
Da heck with couplers, ... LION uses DRAWBARS
Can you say 48 wheel pick-up?
ROARING
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
General Rule. If the trip pin is low, then the coupler itself is low. A pair of #6 flat washers under the trucks will raise the coupler up to proper height. As with all rules, there are exceptions, but not many.
David Starr www.newsnorthwoods.blogspot.com
I clip the pins short. I have the Micro Mark tool, but once I bent the pins into a curl they would catch on each other. Like you, I had a problem with the trip pins snagging on stuff as the cars rolled along, especially at grade crossings. So, now, I just clip them all short.
Rich
Alton Junction
maxman Lone Wolf and Santa Fe I have never had any problems uncoupling them using the Allen Strang designed uncoupling tool Who? Lionel, maybe?
Oops I don't know what I was thinking. I meant Lionel Strang. Allen Strang is a fictional character in a play.