No beef. The train show this weekend has a "Thanksgiving Dinner Wrap" with turkey, mashed potato and cranberry sauce with gravy on a big tortilla wrap. Yummy.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
Not entertainment???? Horse Poop!!! We ran the Timonium show for over 30 years with almost the same staff for the duration. All of us had other things we could have done...and for lots more pay, but I can honsestly say for myself and dozen staff folks, we all looked forward to the shows and yes indeed all aspects were about entertainment. Some helpers would not take pay, but we did insist that all would be paid equally and fairly. Ask the new management about the fun factor, and they will concur immediately.
Occasionall we had to deal with idiots, but we were ready as we all knew about factor A...."In a given number of people, there is usually going to be one who is an a..hole"...and we were ready! but these encounters were rare indeed. In my 30+ years with the show, the number of "whatevers" can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Not so in my other careers! Dealing with the truly wonderful folks who attended the shows over the decades....entertainment?? You betcha!!!
Some asked why we sold.....simple age (78) and Ken my partner moving to Arizona. He would have been impossible to replace as he was the brains behind the shows....I was just better known for my model railroad and great personality.
HZ
Paul3 riogrande5761,The portable layouts are entertainment, yes. The show itself (and every dealer there) is not. Do you think there would be a train show without any dealers?
riogrande5761,The portable layouts are entertainment, yes. The show itself (and every dealer there) is not. Do you think there would be a train show without any dealers?
Obviously no.
Do you think there'd be any dealers if every attendee left their wallet at home?
Thats an absurd retorical question. If every attendee left there wallet at home, there would be no attendee's at the train show - they wouldn't be admitted. Dealers choose to go to shows based on the long term financial benefit - common sense. Some show are duds and some maybe decent for them. I wouldn't want to do that, but there are a lot of occupations I wouldn't want to do.
I've been to train shows without any layouts. I've never been to a train show without any dealers (and club open houses do not count).
They exist, I've actually stumbled into one or two over the last 10 years. I don't think I found anything to buy. Lets just say those shows are pretty much "out of scope" of this conversation IMO, but enjoy yourself.
I will add that if a layout is paid to be entertainment for the duration of the show (and I think paying a layout to be there is a crock),
I've been told by the clubs that come, they are paid - it's nominal but they do get paid. And they should be. It's a lot of work and yes, some expense to haul these layouts in, set them up and man them for two days. And it's a draw to get people to come. The show benefits, the attendee's benefit.
A show has got to be in the black "most of the time"? Try all of the time.
I said most of the time because thats probably factual. There are occasionally shows that are a bust - such as when a big snow storm hits Baltimore and hardly anyone can get there - probably those "one off" shows like that do lose money. I remember a Timonium show withing the last couple years which exactly that happened to. I'm sure people who have run shows can tell you occasionally they are up-side-down, but those are probably "one-offs".
HZ,I have to disagree, it is not "entertainment" for a hobby shop or a dealer.
It isn not suppose to be. SMH. The whole topic is from the customers perspective.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
mlehman ... I will say that if you willing to pay for admission at the end of the show ...
...
I will say that if you willing to pay for admission at the end of the show ...
And further, if you expect to only have to pay a fraction of the general admittance fee near noon on the last day....ditto. If Howard's crew lets you in for free in the last hour, double ditto....you get watcha paid fer.
riogrande5761,The portable layouts are entertainment, yes. The show itself (and every dealer there) is not. Do you think there would be a train show without any dealers? Do you think there'd be any dealers if every attendee left their wallet at home? I've been to train shows without any layouts. I've never been to a train show without any dealers (and club open houses do not count).
I will add that if a layout is paid to be entertainment for the duration of the show (and I think paying a layout to be there is a crock), then yes, they should be there until closing. However, dealers do not get paid to be there. Instead, we pay $25-$100+ per table. If we dealers were paid to be at the show as entertainment for the masses, then yes, we'd stay set up until closing...but we do not get paid by the show.
A show has got to be in the black "most of the time"? Try all of the time. It's not a charity. If it doesn't make money, it will change quickly or die. But even a small show makes money unless a snow storm keeps everyone home. The dealers never get a refund, so the show always gets their table fees upfront. A 100-table show will see at least $2500 income just for that. Get a 1000 people through the door at $4 a head, and you're talking another $4000. Out of that $6500, you have the hall rental (unless the show org already owns it) and table rental (unless the show already owns them), but otherwise it's usually profit.
HZ,I have to disagree, it is not "entertainment" for a hobby shop or a dealer. It's a business, a retail business. No retail business will be in business for long when they are merely entertainment for the public. People come in to retail shop, look around, and say, "What a wonderful store!" Then they leave without buying anything. Next thing you know, that same person opines, "What ever happened to that wonderful store?"
Michael,You got it.
hon30critter,Good luck with that. Let us know how many dealers will ever do a small show that puts a significant fine/fee on their dealers for leaving early. You want to have dealers stay 'til the end? Refund the table rentals, or maybe even just one table rental. Give the dealers a bonus for staying; don't punish them for leaving early or they'll never come back again.
While we all like it when the world works exactly how WE think it should, as the differing views on this matter demonstrate, humans vary and so do their behavior. Nothing wrong with that and, I suspect, nothing much that can be done about it for those who think, umm, something should be done about it. Enjoy the variety, the world would be a boring place and the lines always long if we all showed up for lunch at exactly the same time and ordered exactly the same thing to eat.
I will say that if you willing to pay for admission at the end of the show for what will surely be the leftovers from hours of previous patronage, you can probably stand to be a little flexible about the fact that you've probably missed more by not getting there earlier than you do from the vendors who leave early.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
What I have always wondered is; Is it generally acceptable to pack up early IF and ONLY IF you sell your entire merchandise for the day?
(My Model Railroad, My Rules)
These are the opinions of an under 35 , from the east end of, and modeling, the same section of the Wheeling and Lake Erie railway. As well as a freelanced road (Austinville and Dynamite City railroad).
Howard ZaneIn all fairness, the review on the new caterer is my opinion,and from what I have observed and heard from others. I'm sure there are folks who love the new food service and pricing.
I'm only recently back into the hobby so I can't compare to the old days, but compared to gun show food or airport food, I was pleasantly surprised at the food at the last 2 Timonium shows. I could eat cheaper if I hoofed it to McDonalds but there wasn't any sticker shock like there is eating at Camden Yards or Ravens Stadium.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
Bayfield Transfer RailwayAnd don't forget, this may be "your train show" but the poor son of a ***** behind the table does two shows a month from March to November and between gas and food barely breaks even most of the time.
Sounds like you was part time..I know dealers that goes to shows every weekend and that means they must book a motel/hotel room, drive xxx miles to get there,set up and hope to make a profit in the process.
I have notice these guys knows each other and seems to lookout for one another as far as finding things.
Dealer A: Billybob,You still looking for two Athearn grey Guliford boxcars?
Dealer B,Yes,Johnboy,Whatcha got for me?
Some times I notice they trade for needed items other times cash is used.
I can fully understand the reason they pack up early when there is very few buying customers on the floor. They been there several hours-usually 3-4 hours before the doors open.
One thing I can't stand is a show runner that rushes through the show in less then 30 minutes then complains about how bad the show was. I know a guy that does that and when he sees me at either Hardees or McDonalds he tells me all about it. I was eating lunch during our show and he was in/out before I finished my coffee. He waltz in around noon and rushed through the show.
OTOH I realize some folk don't like being in crowds and I understand that but,why wait until the last hour of the show? The opening mob is in/out in the first two hours. I recommend going around noon since there seems to be a lull between 12-1 pm or at least at the shows I attend-I usually rest and eat my standard train show lunch(2 hotdogs,apple pie and coffee) then make one last walk though to ensure I haven't missed any goodies or if a dealer broke open another box of goodies..The small one or two table dealers is good at doing this.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
You know what I think?
If a club has gone to the considerable effort to put on a show at which you will make a profit then you as a vendor have an obligation to stick it out until the end. Yes, dinner will be late. Dinner will also be late for all of the club members who have to pack up the tables and chairs, and most likely a portable layout too. I think the show organizers should levy a significant fee for packing up early, refundable if you stay until the end.
My club puts on a fairly large show (by Canadian standards) every year. There are only 14 members. That equates to a lot of hard work for everybody.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Paul3 What do dealers get by leaving early? Maybe they pay their helpers by the hour. Maybe they'd like to go home and have dinner sometime before 8PM. Maybe they've got a date, or they have to wake up at 5AM every weekday and need the sleep. You're correct in that no one is forcing a dealer to be there...except you'd like to force them to be there until closing, right?
What do dealers get by leaving early? Maybe they pay their helpers by the hour. Maybe they'd like to go home and have dinner sometime before 8PM. Maybe they've got a date, or they have to wake up at 5AM every weekday and need the sleep. You're correct in that no one is forcing a dealer to be there...except you'd like to force them to be there until closing, right?
Don't forget "this is the tenth show this summer, and I'm so tired of packing and carrying this **** that I'm seriously considering paying somebody to take it away."Just like at a multi-day show like the NMRA convention train show, you can get great deals on the last day. "PLEASE don't make me pack this up, carry it across the convention center, down the stairs to the service dock, three blocks to my van at the back of the parking lot, and it's raining."
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!
Hoo boy, this reminds me of my bad old days as a dealer at wargaming shows. After five years of that I left the hobby for 15 years.
And don't forget, this may be "your train show" but the poor son of a ***** behind the table does two shows a month from March to November and between gas and food barely breaks even most of the time.My GOD I hated working retail.
HZ here....As mentioned, we once required vendors when they signed up, they also commited themselves to stay until show closing for both days. And yes we had attendees come one hour prior to closing, and two hours prior to closing we went to half price, and should some arrive an hour to maybe 30 minutes prior to closing, we let them in free.
When a vendor starts packing up early, others follow in suit and then some. Our show on the second day usually emptied out around 3PM, and although we required vendors to stay until closing at 4PM, we never pushed the issue as mentioned, we just did not have the bargaining power and it was not fair to ask them to play to an empty hall. Now on Saturday or the first day of the show, we never had a problem....actually the real issue was getting attendees out of the hall so we could go home and take our Saturday evening baths.
One thing that helped was having a real large door prize drawing late in the day. The new owners have continued with this...only upping the prize quite a bit.
Another important issue to keep folks in the halls longer is to have great food service at reasonable prices and more than ample seating for folks to enjoy their fine cusine. The Timonium show is doing great under the new management since 2014.....matter of fact, under Scott Geare, I feel it has improved greatly since my day..............but there is one problem...food service. Due to possibly behind the scenes skull duggery by the venue, the once really great caterer is gone and has been replaced by the caterer from hell. Since this change in late 2014, many attendees have not been staying for lunch, and rarely return should they go out for chow at noon. The attendance has not been affected, but the staying power most definitely has. If you are planning on attending future shows, just bring a simple small cooler with lunch or order out ( the staff will call when order arrives). To see the show takes the better part of the day, and to walk it once is 1.2 miles. In all fairness, the review on the new caterer is my opinion,and from what I have observed and heard from others. I'm sure there are folks who love the new food service and pricing.
Also the new management has been running clinics all day....and by very excellent clinicians. This has proven quite effective in keeping folks until closing.
I completely stick to the issue, the show is about entertainment...over 20 operating layouts in most scales, great clinics, and meeting other train nuts????
Folks go to hobby shops and train shows to purchase....is not that entertainment?? Man, it sure is for me............has been for 70+ years!
Train shows today are becoming our last ambassadors for promoting our hobby first hand as the LHS is rapidally earning a place in American folklore and history.
Let's do our best to keep them alive.
riogrande5761I've run some trains at shows and you do get tired. It's enough of a grind going to shows - being there all day both days - no thanks. But there are a lot of past times that are not for me.
Jim,Now imagine a man like me that gets bored to tears after the first two hours of mindless loop running 4 or 5 hours can be a pure torture.
Why put myself through that? Somebody has to step up to the plate and help simply because many find excuses why they can't or maybe they can't let go of their wife's hand long enough to help three or four hours once a year..
Paul3 tommymr,A train show is not "entertainment", it is a retail business that is held to make a profit.
tommymr,A train show is not "entertainment", it is a retail business that is held to make a profit.
Hold the phone. Why do train shows pay modular clubs to bring layouts and run trains? Could it be .... drum roll, entertainment? Why yes. So there is something to be said for both sides. People do pay to get in, and they don't pay only to go browse table (which may be slightly entertaining) but to go watch trains too. Thats part of the reason I go to Timonium which appears to dedicate maybe a third of their space to some rather large layouts.
Sure, the show runners would not run the show if there wasn't a least some profit in it; certainly they aren't going to keep running a show that loose money so it's gotta be in the black most of the time.
Obviously the dealers are there to make money and it's not good for a show when that doesn't happen, and I'm certain I've seen some glum dealers at many a show over the past 30+ years I've been going to them, since I started attending shows way back in Houston TX in the early 1980's, and later Indiana, Kentucky, New York and Virginia.
OTOH, a model railroad club open house is entertainment. They sell you a ticket and maybe some soda/coffee and that's about it. The looking at the layout is the purpose of the event. But a train show with dealers is no different from a retail shop with a cover charge at the door. They are there to sell, not to show you stuff.
So we've established large train shows are there to both sell you stuff and show you stuff (operating layouts). So both are true for most shows I've been to.
BTW, did you see the irony in your own post? "OTOH, since I am paying, I'll make the decision to walk out whenever I want." The dealers feel the same way you do.
Maybe HZ can chime in here but I thought I recalled at his shows, dealers were expected to stay open until the official show closing, probably because he viewed it as - yes, the show was advertised to be open from A to B, and customers paid money to get in and should be able to browse the tables for the advertised time.
I mean, sure, you could say nothing is certain except death and taxes, and as a customer I would say - I've been burned by dealers closing as early as 2:30 pm at one show and just go to the Saturday show when most are there Sat and Sun and usually will be their till closing on Sat at least. Or if I have to go Sun, go early while the gettin is good.
For the layouts, it takes some a long time to clean up and break down. And running trains can get old. I know it's hard to imagine, but some people get tired after 4 or 5 hours of running trains.
I've run some trains at shows and you do get tired. It's enough of a grind going to shows - being there all day both days - no thanks. But there are a lot of past times that are not for me.
davidmurray Hope to make it to your show in December. Dave
Hope to make it to your show in December.
I hope to see you there (even though it's not my show). I'll be bringing a layout and it will be operating until the doors close! :)
Barry
Enzoamps So does anyone share my frustration at this, its it common? or do I just have unrealistic expectations.I have attended this show in several years past, and while any show might have a few early closers, I don;t recall it being this blatant before.
So does anyone share my frustration at this, its it common? or do I just have unrealistic expectations.I have attended this show in several years past, and while any show might have a few early closers, I don;t recall it being this blatant before.
I wish people would stop trying to compare this to a movie theatre. It's not even remotely the same. Remember: the dealers are paying to be there, too. There's no one at a theatre that is paying to be inside it except for the audience. There is no dealer analog in a movie theatre.
tommymr,A train show is not "entertainment", it is a retail business that is held to make a profit. Let's imagine what would happen if everyone that attended a train show didn't buy a thing from the dealers, just there to be entertained looking at everything. Do you think there'd be a train show the next year? Dealers aren't there to entertain you, they are there to sell you something. If you get entertainment from that, good. But it is not why they are there.
Barry,Again, there is an early-afternoon surge in business at most every train show I go to. That makes it worth being there for the dealers. There is no post-3PM surge at any train show that I've ever been to for the last 25 years. It's all a trickle by that point.
Most movie theatres are required to roll the projectors, even if the theatre is completely empty. If someone shows up 5 minutes after the film starts they can still see the rest of it. If they show up 70 minutes late, they still get to see how it ends. Because they paid to see it. That's a classy way to run a show.
If you want to please vendors want to pack up early because the first couple hours are the most lucrative, set the show hours from 10 'til noon.
I'm surprised that layout operators want to pack up early. Are they that bored? Wasn't model railroading supposed to be fun? And with all the complaints I hear about spouses who don't appreciate their hobby I would expect they wouldn't be in a rush to go home.
Vendors don't show up if the weather is bad where they are driving from. They also leave early when bad weather is approaching. These aren't mailmen. They don't have to risk their lives to honor a train show agreement. Vendors are free to come and go.
However, the sponsor of the show or the venue should waive an entrance fee once a certain number of vendors have left. And, if a vendor has a habit of busting out early, just because.....perhaps the sponsor should think twice about inviting him to the next show.
- Douglas
tommymr I think enzoamps has it right. I expect vendors to be there until the show closes. ... As a vendor, I understand you are paying also, but, no one is forcing you to be there...
I think enzoamps has it right. I expect vendors to be there until the show closes. ...
As a vendor, I understand you are paying also, but, no one is forcing you to be there...
Neither is anyone forcing you, the person arriving late, to be there.
tommymr ...Since this seeme to be quite the heated topic, letting someone in for free for the last hour makes a lot of sense.
...Since this seeme to be quite the heated topic, letting someone in for free for the last hour makes a lot of sense.
I see nothing heated about this...it's a perfectly civil discourse going on. Apart from that, if there were no displays or dealers left, I would agree that a patron should be admitted free of charge. I have never run a train show, but I would guess that the cost of renting the venue is not entirely covered by the fee charged to vendors; some of the patrons' proceeds would be needed for that purpose.
I think enzoamps has it right. I expect vendors to be there until the show closes. I'm not getting my moneys worth if the vendors leave.
The guy arrived 1 hour before the show was scheduled to close. So how was he supposed to get "his money's worth" by paying for a full day, not to mention parking? There's an upcoming two day show in Pleasanton, CA. Adult ticket prices at the gate are $9 for a one day and $10 for both days. Parking is extra and by day (I forget the price and am not looking it up). You can buy discounted tickets up to 4 days before the show starts. http://trainshow.com/pleasanton/ . So, by your reasoning, if the OP goes to the Pleasanton show on the second day, arriving an hour before the show closes until the following year, pays for a day's worth of parking as well as a ticket, goes into the show to find vendors beginning to pack up, he should blame the vendors rather than kicking himself for not arriving earlier (maybe even just as the doors opened on the first day)?
What if you went to the movies and half way through, they shut the movie off because they weren't making enough at the concession stand.
That's a bogus comparison. The concession stand is a revenue generator wholly separate from the movie itself and does not generate revenue while the movie is in progress, but before the movie starts. When I go to a movie, the only revenue generated off me or my wife is the ticket itself. No doubt we should be barred from the theater altogether as we're not contributing enough to its bottom line. Oh wait a minute. Some revenue is better than none whatsoever.
As someone who is paying for entertainment, (and I will consider a train show entertainment) that wouldn't be right.
But you're OK with with the OP when he arrives towards the end of the movie (to use your analogy) and then gets all butthurt because the snack bar is closing up due to the fact that the last movie of the day is already in progress and the prospect of additional snack bar revenue is rapidly approaching zero, not to mention the fact that the snack bar's inventory may be seriously depleted? I mean, for crying out loud, if I wait until the absolute last minute to try and buy popcorn, it's their fault if it's not available any more, not mine for not thinking ahead, right?????
Andre
If you are a serious buyer looking for specific items, you go early. While living in Dayton, Ohio, for about 8 years I set up at 6 to 8 shows a year, size from 40 tables to several hundred tables. The first few hours were always the busiest. This may be apples to oranges, but since moving to western Colorado my wife and I make and sell hand made soap at art and craft fairs and farmers markets. We also handle the vendors at two shows. Entry forms are very specific about early break downs. If a vendor breaks down early, many shoppers think the event is over and leave. This is unfair to the remaining sellers. Offenders will not be invited back.
I think enzoamps has it right. I expect vendors to be there until the show closes. I'm not getting my moneys worth if the vendors leave. What if you went to the movies and half way through, they shut the movie off because they weren't making enough at the concession stand? As someone who is paying for entertainment, (and I will consider a train show entertainment) that wouldn't be right. OTOH, since I am paying, I'll make the decision to walk out whenever I want (movie no good, I'm done being entertained), but the business did get my money and certainly will offer no refund.
As a vendor, I understand you are paying also, but, no one is forcing you to be there. You know how long the drive is and how long it will take to set up/tear down. Your costs are sunk no matter what sales are. I'm sure you don't get a rebate on your table for leaving early, and I'm pretty sure you aren't rushing back to your store to be open those last couple hours that you now 'gained' by leaving the show early.
Since this seeme to be quite the heated topic, letting someone in for free for the last hour makes a lot of sense.
My club usually has one or two layouts at shows we attend. Whether it is in writting or implied, we keep trains running right up to the time the show closes. Sometimes we recieve a stipend from the promoter but we always have something running from the start to the finish even if we don't. I see vendors packing up early lots of times and it is always the same guys with prices right out of the Walthers catalog, not selling much. Greenberg had a couple of shows in my area with some vendors packed up and gone by 1pm on the first day. High table prices, no advertising by Greenberg shows and high entry prices kept the people away so the vendors just gave up.
Enzoamps I wonder if the club operating session is scheduled from 6 until 10, and I get bored after 8, I could just leave my train on the track and walk away.
Been there and done that during the week of the county fair..We arrived around 8:00am and by 4 PM I parked my train on a siding and called it a day while some stayed until the crowd thin out around 10 pm and then they called it a day and a lot of the food stands was already closed due to the lack of customers.The next morning we started over.After the first two hours I got sick and tired of watching trains run loops but,when there was only three that shows up every day then one does what he can to help.Some others showed up later in the morning or afternoon.
Being the co-promoter of the huge Timonium MD show for over 30 years, I may be qualified to add to this thread. There is always a delicate balance between attendees and vendors. Although we cared quite a bit for the attendees, and tried to offer as much as possible, our first allegiance went to the vendors. Without them, the show simply dies. We were always aware of early packers, and yes we tried contracts to keep them to show closing, but on a slow Sunday and the crowds have gone south, we never pushed the issue. We just did not have the bargaining power, and we certainly understood the efforts they put in setting up and then the take-down.
We realized that our job as promoters besides managing a good show was to bring in the attendees, offer clinics, displays, operating railroads, fine food and with ample seating areas....and still more which we did for three decades. Having a conflict with a vendor is not much fun, so we avoided these whenever possible...which was most of the time. The show is about entertainment...for attendees, vendors, and staff. Still we ran it as a business, but enjoyed being light in many issues.
Anyone who goes to an event an hour before closing should expect folks beginning to pack, and although I feel his frustration....simply go earlier next time!!!
I may add a bit of advice to show promoters and to future promoters...........If you do not love, model trains, this business, and working with people of every possible spiecies, get out ASAP ! Forget about passing "GO" and the damn $200...just run!!!
Enzoamps,So what's your solution? If a small show decides to kick out every dealer and layout that starts packing up early, it will easily be 50% fewer dealers/layouts the next year. Some other dealers will see a dying show that punishes dealers and next year they'll stay home, too. Do you think a small show will be back the next year after that? Most small train shows are barely holding on. I used to do 8 train shows a year just 5 years ago. Now it's down to 5 (a museum closed, a group retired, and a club disbanded). One show we do has their building for sale, so who knows how long that show will last. Another show location I have is a railroad club that we do twice a year, and they put the show tables in the layout room. They're going to commence filling in that layout room soon with more layout, and that would kill two more train shows. I can see that in only a couple years my train shows per year will be down to 2, and there aren't any new shows in range of me and the show crew. There are fewer and fewer dealers willing to do small train shows these days. Only the 2-day big shows will bring some of them out.
And yes, model railroad club operators leave early all the time. No, they don't leave the train in the middle of the mainline (any more than a dealer would leave their stuff in the exhibition hall), but pack up and leave early? Heck yeah, especially if the operators had some, shall we say, frustrations with the layout and/or trains (IOW, "rage quit").
Let me put it this way: as a dealer, I will stay set up for as along as I have customers. If I don't have any customers (not even browsers) for over an hour, then why am I the bad guy for going home? Can you promise me that you will come to my table a 3:59PM and spend enough money to make up for the nothing I just sat through?
You say you don't take too kindly to dealers that leave early. How about people that go to a train show and don't buy anything?
Lion,At every train show I do, I think admittance is free in the last hour. Heck, at my last show, the table where the tickets are taken was gone before 3PM.
Sir Madog,I hope you feel the same about customers. They bought admittance to the show, so they should also stay all day right to the end, right? If that was the case, every dealer would stay 'til the end, too. It's not like dealers are chasing away customers; the customers are chasing away the dealers by not staying/showing up. The dealers are not slapping the face of the customers; the customers are slapping the faces of the dealers.
Robert,There's no Catch-22. The crowds all leave well before any dealer packs up. No dealer will look at a busy show and say to himself, "Even tho' the hall is packed, I'm going to go home now." That simply won't happen. A dealer leaves because there are no customers. Period. You make money, you stay. You don't make money, you want to leave. And short of chaining us to the tables, that's going to happen.
It's the chicken-or-the-egg Catch 22 kind of thing. The crowds don't stick around till 4 because the vendors have packed up, and the vendors pack up because the crowds don't stick around. Ideally everyone should stick around with high enthusiasm till the very end, but I have no expectations things will be that way. I go early. Of course, the early crowd is still in the coffee-and-donut phase so there's always the possibility of sticky fingerprints on stuff . . . but that's another matter.
Robert
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