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Tight frog area.

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 10:12 PM

doctorwayne

Wow!  Eight pages, and unless I missed it because my eyes were glazing over, nobody mentioned that the Bachmann 2-8-0 picks-up power on all eight drivers and two wheels on one side of one tender truck and two wheels on the opposite side of the other tender truck.  The first thing I'd like to know is what's sitting where when it stops.  Smile, Wink & Grin    That should mean that all of the wheels on one side would need to be losing contact for the loco to stop.  Instead, I'd check those plugs and the wires to them.


Wayne

Dr. Wayne, I respectfully disagree.  As a test I took two double-ended alligator test leads.  Clipped one end of each to the rails.  Now I have power at the other ends right?  Then I set the loco to 1 on the CAB.  I touched every combination of wheels on the tender and they all made the main loco's wheels move.  I never once got any movement when I tried the same on the main driver wheels.  Even the aft wheels on the loco are rubberized.  So the main loco does not pick up power, just the tender, at least on this Bachmann 2-8-0.

And sorry for your eyes glazing over.

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Posted by doctorwayne on Saturday, November 24, 2012 9:57 PM

Wow!  Eight pages, and unless I missed it because my eyes were glazing over, nobody mentioned that the Bachmann 2-8-0 picks-up power on all eight drivers and two wheels on one side of one tender truck and two wheels on the opposite side of the other tender truck.  The first thing I'd like to know is what's sitting where when it stops.  Smile, Wink & Grin    That should mean that all of the wheels on one side would need to be losing contact for the loco to stop.  Instead, I'd check those plugs and the wires to them.


Wayne

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Posted by Lehigh Valley 2089 on Saturday, November 24, 2012 9:55 PM

Paul_in_GA

richhotrain

modelmaker51

If all else fails, call up Bachmann, explain the problem, they'll probably tell you to send it in and replace it with a new one, their warranty is one of the best. And don't let one bad loco sour you sgainst a company, most all of the companies have had a bad loco or even a run, they all will try to make good on their warranties.

While that is true about the warranty, the problem is that if Bachmann cannot repair the loco, it will offer to replace it with whatever it has on hand,  Usually, that will be an entirely different loco from what you had sent in.

Rich

That's fine Rich.  But when I spoke to them they seemed a little hostile, like it was my fault.  I got a little defensive about it as I went out of my way to be cordial.  The woman barked at me like a drill sargeant so they left a bad impression with me.  She even barked at me that I'd have to pay $25 if they couldn't fix it.  That's when I WANTED to tell her to power it up at full speed and drive it to a place where there is no sunshine but I didn't.  All I thought was what a lousy person and a lousy company.  I most definately will not pay $25 for them to fix crap, I'll toss it first and buy more expensive, higher quality stuff first.

So all in all Bachmann is on my excrement list.

If they want to send me something I don't care what road it is as I'm not doing a prototype, I would just like something that works.

My dad has a friend who calls it "Bachmann junk", and I don't blame them. I have a few of their items, but the majority of what I have come from Atlas and Athearn, with a mix of Model Power, Walthers, and some other companies. 

The Lehigh Valley Railroad, the Route of the Black Diamond Express, John Wilkes and Maple Leaf.

-Jake, modeling the Barclay, Towanda & Susquehanna.

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 9:42 PM

richhotrain

modelmaker51

If all else fails, call up Bachmann, explain the problem, they'll probably tell you to send it in and replace it with a new one, their warranty is one of the best. And don't let one bad loco sour you sgainst a company, most all of the companies have had a bad loco or even a run, they all will try to make good on their warranties.

While that is true about the warranty, the problem is that if Bachmann cannot repair the loco, it will offer to replace it with whatever it has on hand,  Usually, that will be an entirely different loco from what you had sent in.

Rich

That's fine Rich.  But when I spoke to them they seemed a little hostile, like it was my fault.  I got a little defensive about it as I went out of my way to be cordial.  The woman barked at me like a drill sargeant so they left a bad impression with me.  She even barked at me that I'd have to pay $25 if they couldn't fix it.  That's when I WANTED to tell her to power it up at full speed and drive it to a place where there is no sunshine but I didn't.  All I thought was what a lousy person and a lousy company.  I most definately will not pay $25 for them to fix crap, I'll toss it first and buy more expensive, higher quality stuff first.

So all in all Bachmann is on my excrement list.

If they want to send me something I don't care what road it is as I'm not doing a prototype, I would just like something that works.

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 9:36 PM

modelmaker51

Well I've read through all the posts, and I'm convinced the problem is somewhere in the tender's pickup. I noted that you stated that you screwed down the trucks as tight as possible and they still had some play., but maybe they now don't have enough play. This could cause a wheel to lose contact in a critical spot, especially with such a short wheelspan. Try backing off the screw on the rear truck about a quarter a turn and a half turn on the front truck. Experiment with a little and see if it makes a difference.

If all else fails, call up Bachmann, explain the problem, they'll probably tell you to send it in and replace it with a new one, their warranty is one of the best. And don't let one bad loco sour you sgainst a company, most all of the companies have had a bad loco or even a run, they all will try to make good on their warranties.

Thanks Jay.  I already have one in and haven't heard from them in a long time.  I was told they take a long time to get back to you.

As for the wheels, I'll try that but when I initially looked at them there was a LOT of slop, vertical slop.  There's a stop so you can't get them even close to tight but I'll try it anyway.

I might send it in but that means taking out the decoder and although it may seem easy to you guys a newbie like me pulls my remaining hair out dealing with taking apart those tenders.

Thanks.

Paul

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 9:35 PM

modelmaker51

If all else fails, call up Bachmann, explain the problem, they'll probably tell you to send it in and replace it with a new one, their warranty is one of the best. And don't let one bad loco sour you sgainst a company, most all of the companies have had a bad loco or even a run, they all will try to make good on their warranties.

While that is true about the warranty, the problem is that if Bachmann cannot repair the loco, it will offer to replace it with whatever it has on hand,  Usually, that will be an entirely different loco from what you had sent in.

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by modelmaker51 on Saturday, November 24, 2012 8:27 PM

Well I've read through all the posts, and I'm convinced the problem is somewhere in the tender's pickup. I noted that you stated that you screwed down the trucks as tight as possible and they still had some play., but maybe they now don't have enough play. This could cause a wheel to lose contact in a critical spot, especially with such a short wheelspan. Try backing off the screw on the rear truck about a quarter a turn and a half turn on the front truck. Experiment with a little and see if it makes a difference.

If all else fails, call up Bachmann, explain the problem, they'll probably tell you to send it in and replace it with a new one, their warranty is one of the best. And don't let one bad loco sour you sgainst a company, most all of the companies have had a bad loco or even a run, they all will try to make good on their warranties.

Jay 

C-415 Build: https://imageshack.com/a/tShC/1 

Other builds: https://imageshack.com/my/albums 

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 5:13 PM

richhotrain

CV2.

Maybe set it somewhere between 5 and 10 for starters.

Play with it and see if it will keep to loco moving at speed step 1.

Tried putting all kinds of numbers in CV2.  When I put in 100 as soon as I dialed in 1 it took off like a rocket!  Big Smile  So I reset it back because 5-10 didn't do anything.  at least I got the CV2 to program but I guess I'll just have to live with it at least till I try that frog juice board.

In the meantime I have the tunnel built out of hydrocal but now I have to wait till it cures till I stain it, I have to ballast under the tunnel or at least part of it, then I want to build a cardboard mountain mockup before I start cutting WS foam profile boards and foam.  

Still working on the Mining company, have to airbrush the base of it black as brushing looks horrible so I have to get back up to speed with airbrushing, can't lay the track for IT till I get the mountain built so I can properly locate the mining company.

So I can finish painting the townhouse, and fifty million other things seemingly going at once.

This is a hobby within a hobby ad infinitum...

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 3:42 PM

cjcrescent

Paul, if you are still looking for a solution to the stalling problem, I presented a clinic on tuning up Spectrum's steam loco's several years ago at an NMRA meet. I put a shorter version of the clinic online several years ago.

I have a 2-8-0 from the first run, did this procedure on it and I've had absolutely no stalling problems anywhere on my layout, or others.

I have posted this procedure in another forum, but if you're interested in at least reading it, here is the address to the page the procedure is on. I can't seem to insert a clickable link. While this procedure for illustration purposes was done to a Decapod, it applies to all of Spectrum's steamers.

http://www.modelrailroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11415&highlight=Spectrum+tune&page=3

You'll need to copy and paste it into your browser.

Thanks Carey.

I have saved that page.  However, something like this is hundreds of thousands of miles over my head.  First I have no manual to break it down except for the cheesy exploded diagram but to me that's as useless as toilet paper.  Second, I feel that if I try to disassemble it and can't get it back together properly I'll just have to toss it.  Add in the trillions of tiny parts and well, you get the picture.  I have never done anything more major than putting a decoder in that Bachmann loco.

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Posted by cjcrescent on Saturday, November 24, 2012 3:35 PM

Thanks for the info. Hope I can remember that if and when I need to add a link!

Carey

Keep it between the Rails

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 3:31 PM

cjcrescent

Thank you Rich. How do you add a link like that onto the forums?

Glad to help.

There are probably other ways to do it but I did a copy and paste to Notebook and then a copy and paste back into the forum thread.

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by cjcrescent on Saturday, November 24, 2012 3:28 PM

Thank you Rich. How do you add a link like that onto the forums?

Carey

Keep it between the Rails

Alabama Central Homepage

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 3:26 PM

Alton Junction

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Posted by cjcrescent on Saturday, November 24, 2012 3:12 PM

Paul, if you are still looking for a solution to the stalling problem, I presented a clinic on tuning up Spectrum's steam loco's several years ago at an NMRA meet. I put a shorter version of the clinic online several years ago.

I have a 2-8-0 from the first run, did this procedure on it and I've had absolutely no stalling problems anywhere on my layout, or others.

I have posted this procedure in another forum, but if you're interested in at least reading it, here is the address to the page the procedure is on. I can't seem to insert a clickable link. While this procedure for illustration purposes was done to a Decapod, it applies to all of Spectrum's steamers.

http://www.modelrailroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11415&highlight=Spectrum+tune&page=3

You'll need to copy and paste it into your browser.

Carey

Keep it between the Rails

Alabama Central Homepage

Nara member #128

NMRA &SER Life member

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 2:14 PM

Paul_in_GA

richhotrain

CV2.

Maybe set it somewhere between 5 and 10 for starters.

Play with it and see if it will keep to loco moving at speed step 1.

I have a TCS T1A decoder.  It says in the pamphlet that CV2 "Start volts -- Set the voltage when the throttle is first applied."

Rich, CV's next.

I just checked the turnout with my VOM.  Now I'm real good with these meters, used them since 1981.

Here's what I did.

I OHM'd out the turnout by placing an alligator clip lead to both ends of a rail before and after the turnout, ditto on the other rail.  While they were clipped I heard my meter ringing, good continuity.

While I did this I lifted the turnout and wiggled the crap out of it trying to see if there was a loose wire and if there was the ringing would stop.  It passed with flying colors.  I even rang out the frog during a wiggle check and it was fine too.  So in my opinion it HAS to be the loco because it does it on other turnouts, and others have had the same problem.

Bachman, NEVER, EVER again.  Someone could GIVE me a Bachmann and I'd toss it in the garbage.

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 2:07 PM

wp8thsub

Paul_in_GA

Thanks Rob, looking into it [a Frog Juicer] now.  How do you wire it up?  Just one wire to the frog?  Does it come with installation instructions?

The juicer comes with easy to follow instructions.  As I noted earlier, you connect the track bus to the juicer with two wires, and run a single wire to the frog.  You can mount the juicer under your roadbed with screws or foam tape.  Installation could not be simpler.

Hi Rob, on order.  Hopefully this will fix it.

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Posted by wp8thsub on Saturday, November 24, 2012 1:56 PM

Paul_in_GA

Thanks Rob, looking into it [a Frog Juicer] now.  How do you wire it up?  Just one wire to the frog?  Does it come with installation instructions?

The juicer comes with easy to follow instructions.  As I noted earlier, you connect the track bus to the juicer with two wires, and run a single wire to the frog.  You can mount the juicer under your roadbed with screws or foam tape.  Installation could not be simpler.

Rob Spangler

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 1:13 PM

richhotrain

CV2.

Maybe set it somewhere between 5 and 10 for starters.

Play with it and see if it will keep to loco moving at speed step 1.

I have a TCS T1A decoder.  It says in the pamphlet that CV2 "Start volts -- Set the voltage when the throttle is first applied."

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 1:11 PM

Paul_in_GA

richhotrain

Lube the gears and set the CVs higher to kick start that little sucker.

 

Gotta wait till next week to go to the LHS.

Pick up two items.  Gear lube and light motor oil.

Alton Junction

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 1:10 PM

richhotrain

CV2.

Maybe set it somewhere between 5 and 10 for starters.

Play with it and see if it will keep to loco moving at speed step 1.

OK, will start with that.  Will let you know in a little while.  I have real world stuff to do for now.

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 1:09 PM

CV2.

Maybe set it somewhere between 5 and 10 for starters.

Play with it and see if it will keep to loco moving at speed step 1.

Alton Junction

  • Member since
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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 1:00 PM

richhotrain

Lube the gears and set the CVs higher to kick start that little sucker.

 

Gotta wait till next week to go to the LHS.

Have to figure out how to do the CV's.  I THOUGHT I knew when I tried before but it never "took", I suppose all decoders are different?  I have the insert that came with the decoder and the NCE guide is easy to follow.  I'll have to try that.  Which CV should I adjust?

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:56 PM

Lube the gears and set the CVs higher to kick start that little sucker.

 

Alton Junction

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:54 PM

richhotrain

Just smear it on lightly with your finger.

 

I used a toothpick and put it inside the frog and it still does the same thing.  Angry Sad &*^%$#* Bachmann urinates me off!!!

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:50 PM

Just smear it on lightly with your finger.

 

Alton Junction

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:48 PM

richhotrain

Paul_in_GA

richhotrain

Paul_in_GA

All I have is some old 3-In-One oil which I am loathe to use.

Remain loathe.

Use only plastic compatible light oil.

Although, as a test, I would not be reluctant to use a silicone stick or petroleum jelly.  Then wipe it off.

We are just trying to determine if it will ease the resistance enough to prevent stalling at the slowest speeds.

Rich

Well, I have no silicone, could use vaseline, BUT, it still stalls slightly even at higher power settings but only on that one switch.

Hmm, I thought it only stalled at the slowest speed step?

Nope, I posted earlier that at that same spot it now stalls for a second and the light goes out even at a setting of 10.  I'm ready to use vaseline, should I still use it?  I can apply a tiny amount with a toothpick.

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:48 PM

Incidentally, I checked and petroleum jelly is totally compatible with plastics and synthetic rubbers.

Rich

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:46 PM

Paul_in_GA

I will never buy Bachmann again.

LOL

While I feel the same way, others don't.  Sheldon?

 

Alton Junction

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Posted by richhotrain on Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:45 PM

Paul_in_GA

richhotrain

Paul_in_GA

All I have is some old 3-In-One oil which I am loathe to use.

Remain loathe.

Use only plastic compatible light oil.

Although, as a test, I would not be reluctant to use a silicone stick or petroleum jelly.  Then wipe it off.

We are just trying to determine if it will ease the resistance enough to prevent stalling at the slowest speeds.

Rich

Well, I have no silicone, could use vaseline, BUT, it still stalls slightly even at higher power settings but only on that one switch.

Hmm, I thought it only stalled at the slowest speed step?

Alton Junction

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Posted by Paul_in_GA on Saturday, November 24, 2012 12:42 PM

richhotrain

Paul_in_GA

All I have is some old 3-In-One oil which I am loathe to use.

Remain loathe.

Use only plastic compatible light oil.

Although, as a test, I would not be reluctant to use a silicone stick or petroleum jelly.  Then wipe it off.

We are just trying to determine if it will ease the resistance enough to prevent stalling at the slowest speeds.

Rich

Well, I have no silicone, could use vaseline, BUT, it still stalls slightly even at higher power settings but only on that one switch.  I guess it's a poor design of either the track or the loco, ESPECIALLY the loco.  Two Bachmann's with problems.  Sent in the 44 tonner and STILL haven't heard back from those people. I will never buy Bachmann again.

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