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Show Us Your Weathered Models II ...Critique & Criticism Welcome

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Posted by AggroJones on Thursday, August 20, 2009 7:37 PM

duckdogger

 A lot of gouache back story but how is it used? As a wash?  Same process as an oil wash?  Does it require sealing with Dull-cote for preservation?  Can small amounts of chalk or weathering powders be applied while it is wet to provide texture and depth?

 
As a wash you can mix it with distilled water or Windex depending on what its going over. You can do the same with water mixable oils but the oil is more likely to mar the under layers of weathering so be careful. 
 
For rust spots/patches I mix gouache with chalks and water color so texture is inherrant.

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Posted by Silver Pilot on Thursday, August 20, 2009 3:35 PM

An important tip is to wear latex gloves when working on your project car.  Once you've washed the carbody to remove any dirt and oils from handling it during assemble or from general use you need to avoid handling it with your bare hands.  This avoids leaving finger prints on the car from your skin''s natural oils or having your bare skin remove some of the washes/powders from the weathering process.  As a general rule I wear latex gloves when handling the car until I fnished the weathering process and sealed everything with Dullcote.

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Posted by ProtoWeathering on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 1:01 PM

duckdogger

 A lot of gouache back story but how is it used? As a wash?  Same process as an oil wash?  Does it require sealing with Dull-cote for preservation?  Can small amounts of chalk or weathering powders be applied while it is wet to provide texture and depth?

 

Gouache is relatively opaque and with the rich colors of the powder and gouache, they tend to just coat and leave little depth. Oil paints work much better IMO when blended with powder, using Mineral Spirits as the thinner.

If I was on a budget and was looking to go to Michael's or an Art supply shop to purchase the most for my money I would pick up the smaller tubes of Windsor and Newton Artist Oils and pass on the Gouache. One learning curve at a time is always cheaper than buying some of everything and not mastering something before trying another medium. Wal*Mart also sells gouache and artist oils in starter kits, they are relatively cheap and are fine for learning. Then just waltz over to the paint department and get a can of Odorless Mineral Spirits (Much cheaper than the little bottle they sell near the art supplies.) Pick yourself up a can of lacquer thinner too for clean-up, just make sure you take all the precautions when using some of these volatile liquids.

This was primarily done using just artist oils and weathering powders both blended and applied individually.

Is this stuff perfect? FAR from it. I still have much to learn.

 

 

 

 

This is one of the ways I use Sophisticated Finishes. This car represents a mill gon in captive service at a scrap dealer that hasn't been used for a while. The floor is a steel (nailable) deck, that's why the rust on what looks to be wood, but isn't. 

 

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Posted by Driline on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 11:10 AM

duckdogger
Can small amounts of chalk or weathering powders be applied while it is wet to provide texture and depth?

 

Thats how I used it on the boxcar you see above...

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Posted by duckdogger on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 10:50 AM

 A lot of gouache back story but how is it used? As a wash?  Same process as an oil wash?  Does it require sealing with Dull-cote for preservation?  Can small amounts of chalk or weathering powders be applied while it is wet to provide texture and depth?

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Posted by Driline on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 10:47 AM

Neutrino
Your roof's rust looks too large to represent scale rust.

 

I totally agree.

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Posted by ProtoWeathering on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 10:35 AM

Driline

Neutrino
So being a water color, water or windshield washing fluid makes an excellent thinner. (Windshield washing fluid because of the surfactant and a small amount of alcohol.)

 

So windshield fluid over water as a thinner?

Try both and see how they work for you.

I would tell you to stop dumping your powders too, but I sell them so if you want to waste them that's your business. With powders though, less is more.

Sophisticated Finishes has it's place when thinned and applied correctly and to the right surface. Your roof's rust looks too large to represent scale rust. (An oxymoron!) I thin mine with distilled water and apply it in small batches and thin layers. I see no reason to use it on a freight car truck in interchange, it's just too scaly and unrealistic. Now if the car's sitting in the weeds, that's another story.

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Posted by Driline on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 9:50 AM

Neutrino
So being a water color, water or windshield washing fluid makes an excellent thinner. (Windshield washing fluid because of the surfactant and a small amount of alcohol.)

 

So windshield fluid over water as a thinner?

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Posted by ProtoWeathering on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 8:46 AM

 "Google" gouache.

Driline

AggroJones
Gouache washes are magical.

 

All I've ever done with gouache is to dab it on and dump powder over it. Are you saying you can thin it (with water?) and brush it down as a wash?



Not to be confused with an Oil, Gouache is a fine water color which uses gum arabic as a binder, unlike acrylic water colors such as found at Wall*Mart. Acrylic paint is no more opaque than any other medium. Its opacity depends on the pigment and the pigment concentration. The same is true for high quality gouache (which does not use opacifiers). The differences between acrylic and gouache are due to the binder/medium. Acrylic uses an acrylic polymer emulsion, and gouache uses gum arabic. Acrylic has a tendency to have a glossy or satin finish, whereas gouache is matte. Acrylic gouache is essentially acrylic paint which contains an additive giving it a matte finish similar to gouache. It still has sort of a plastic look, however, and it is somewhat water resistant when dry, unlike true gouache. This is an advantage for layering/glazing but not as convenient for blending.

 So being a water color, water or windshield washing fluid makes an excellent thinner. (Windshield washing fluid because of the surfactant and a small amount of alcohol.)

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Posted by TMarsh on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 8:41 AM

elogger
sometimes i find it helpful to wear latex gloves when weathering...

I did when I was preping and painting. It was later as I was critiqueing myself that I yutzed it up.Banged Head

Like you said it will be only one of many lessons. I'll probably be concentrating on some new technque to me and forget some basic things, (like don't get acrylics wet Dunce, don't touch unfinished model with bare hands, etc.). That's what I usually do. And I'll do it again.Laugh 

 

Todd  

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Posted by Driline on Wednesday, August 19, 2009 7:04 AM

AggroJones
Gouache washes are magical.

 

All I've ever done with gouache is to dab it on and dump powder over it. Are you saying you can thin it (with water?) and brush it down as a wash?

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Posted by spidge on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 11:07 PM

duckdogger

 There's that mysterious term again, "gouache".  What, where, when, and how?  Where does Dullcote come into play?

Supposedly thinner than oils but has a quality that is laking in the oils. Not cheap, At Micheals they were twice as expensive as oils, but hey how much do you need?

I have yet to get some as I am still experimenting a bit. Maybe if I new what effect they would render I may rush down and get some. Aggro?

 

John

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Posted by duckdogger on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 10:42 PM

 There's that mysterious term again, "gouache".  What, where, when, and how?  Where does Dullcote come into play?

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Posted by AggroJones on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 10:28 PM

Driline

AggroJones

Drilline if you want my critique on the BN I can do so.



What I would really like from you is for you to offer ONE and only ONE piece of information on how you weathered your car everytime you post a picture. That way maybe some of us can use it to make ours a bit better.

Critique if you want, like the post says...but I know SOME of the problems, I just don't know how to fixum. Like I'm not happy with the brush strokes present on the white B. Maybe I should not have used a brush with the India Ink and perhaps used a makeup sponge instead? Don't really know.....

 
Mkay I can do that. Use a camel hair soft brush when doing a wash. Less brush strokes.

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Posted by AggroJones on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 10:23 PM

Unitl I can find one of my weathering walk throughs to post here, I'll just shoot some gerneral rules.

 

-Painting a car a faded color looks different than fade lightening a pre-existing color. Example you have a medium blue car... you fade it with white. That has a different starting presence than a car you straight paint baby blue.

-Drybrushing works better on flat surfaces. Not just for highliting edges. In cases you can tone broad surfaces by dryhbrushing.

-Don't put a solvent wash directly over solvent based paint...you might fudge your model. 

 -Gouache washes are magical.

-Always were gloves when handling stuff.

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Posted by elogger on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 5:14 PM

 hey tmarsh... it's all good, we've all learned those lessons... sometimes i find it helpful to wear latex gloves when weathering... just to make sure i don't get fingerprints or the oil from my skin on my work...

 

good luck,

jeremy

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Posted by TMarsh on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 4:37 PM

Page two huh, well let me say something to bring it to page one.

I've learned three lessons today. I'll pass them on for those who may not know. For those of you who do..... Have a laugh on me. But don't use them all up, I'm sure there'll be plenty more to come.

Lesson 1- When applying your fade, be sure to do it in good lighting. What looks good in fair lighting will be too much when you bring it to a well lit place.

Lesson 2- Even after the paint is dry, the moisture from your favorite beverage bottle will be transferred to your fingers and when the model is handled, and will erase what you've done where your fingers where. Use a coolie, or make sure your fingers are dry if you have to handle the model.

Lesson 3- a little paint goes a looooong way. Either mix very little or have another empty paint bottle to store the un used paint for the next time. I would recommend the later.

I was intending to take a before picture but after finding the wifes camera I discovered the battery was dead and the son has the charger at his house. However it may still happen as I will be removing the fade which should be fairly easy after learning lesson 2.

Todd  

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Posted by ProtoWeathering on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 12:32 PM

 It's a fantasy car for a number of reasons.

It represents a 53' Evans car.

It is an Athearn car. The Athearn car has the wrong roof and is too short by about three feet. It also lacks the brake rigging/detail that the proto obviously has.  The Atlas car is correct for the prototype, but I didn't have time to strip/paint and decal a GT scheme Atlas example. Atlas has never done the 53' Evans car in the GT scheme.

 The weathering was done using multiple proto photos, but it isn't an exact replica of an actual car. So while the car is about 90% correct, it doesn't fit into any category other than fantasy. This isn't a bad thing. All I do are fantasy cars and never claim anything else. The weathering on my cars is always based on real weathering processes and I try to use artistic license with restraint.

The lettering is a bit off too. I used a RR Gothic, reversing the "t" in order to make the "I" and the rub-on lettering is not something I use all the time. I am moving in two weeks and wanted the car finished for the customer before then.

 

 

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Posted by Driline on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 11:55 AM
Why is it called a fantasy car?
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Posted by ProtoWeathering on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 10:00 AM

Fantasy weathered car.

 

Athearn Evans 1

Athearn Evans 2 

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Posted by blownout cylinder on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 7:31 AM

Driline
Like I'm not happy with the brush strokes present on the white B. Maybe I should not have used a brush with the India Ink and perhaps used a makeup sponge instead? Don't really know.....

My attempts so far seem to work better with the sponge----but then in N scale----??Confused

BTW--does anyone know what will cause pitting on a Mehano E7/8 body? I used the usual washes and such but-----? 

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Posted by Driline on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 7:22 AM

AggroJones

Drilline if you want my critique on the BN I can do so.

 

Aggro.....Question about the 3 foot rule. As you know some modelers say that if it looks great at 3' its good enough to display.

In your honest opinion would you be able to tell the difference between say, one of your prize models and my obomination at 3 feet or would mine stick out like a sore thumb???

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Posted by Driline on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 7:14 AM

jwhitten

 Did you remove the trucks when you did (airbrushed) the body or just mask/block it off?

 

Yes, trucks were removed before I airbrushed the body. They were painted a grimy black using FLOQUIL brand paint including the underbody and then I used a little bit of sophisticated finishes on the springs, and then A.I.M. chalk from there using dark rust and browns, kind of mixed around.

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Posted by Driline on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 7:11 AM

AggroJones

Drilline if you want my critique on the BN I can do so.



What I would really like from you is for you to offer ONE and only ONE piece of information on how you weathered your car everytime you post a picture. That way maybe some of us can use it to make ours a bit better.

Critique if you want, like the post says...but I know SOME of the problems, I just don't know how to fixum. Like I'm not happy with the brush strokes present on the white B. Maybe I should not have used a brush with the India Ink and perhaps used a makeup sponge instead? Don't really know.....
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Posted by jwhitten on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 6:42 AM

 Did you remove the trucks when you did (airbrushed) the body or just mask/block it off?

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Posted by AggroJones on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 12:28 AM

Drilline if you want my critique on the BN I can do so.

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Posted by AggroJones on Tuesday, August 18, 2009 12:26 AM

Laugh

Neutrino

Driline

Geared Steam

The boxcar and flat look great, I don't see how you could improve them much more.

Robbie, Aggro, Grampy and others, nice work.  

 

Ha! Remember my car was a 2 day job. You want to see a Pro look at Aggro's stuff. There is NO comparison. He's Rembrandt, and I'm in First grade using fingerpaints Smile Although Robbie is fast on his heels.

 

LaughLaugh 

 
Laugh Laugh Laugh Laugh
 
Nothing you can do to demean me. In the words of Mayo, peace out. Laugh

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Posted by spidge on Monday, August 17, 2009 7:46 PM

Check out page 2 of my N scale examples. Maybe not quite where I want to be but in time and with more practice and shared techniques I will get there.

John

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Posted by Jimmydieselfan on Monday, August 17, 2009 7:30 PM

Lets see some N Scale examplesCool

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Posted by Driline on Monday, August 17, 2009 6:07 PM

 As promised, a few better close up pics.

Remember........with the right tools, you can make your cars look just like this on your 2nd try too.


 

Modeling the Davenport Rock Island & Northwestern 1995 in HO

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