OvermodI think that if you set that section of your double main up to run CTC, you could easily have the dispatcher assign the 'drill' section of the near main to be out of the current of traffic, and just treat things as a short piece of single track temporarily
Hi Overmod,
That's pretty much how I thought it would operate, although the CTC will all be in my head at least for a while.
Thanks,
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
SeeYou190Dave, If I understand your goals correctly, your yard is for shuffling cars and fiddling with the train consist with the trusty 0-5-0. If these are your goals, the yard design should be just fine. -Kevin
Hi Kevin,
Actually I do want to be able to switch the yard using locomotives. That's why I put a run around on the bottom two tracks. I figured that would allow me to pull a train in locomotive first and then escape the train.
If I back a train in I could use the second from the bottom track because it has direct access to the top six yard tracks. I could also back the train onto the bottom track but that might involve more fowling of the main when switching depending on how long the train is.
There will certainly be some 0-5-0 activity going on as different cars are placed on the yard track or removed from it. One thing I will be able to build underneath the yard tracks is plenty of storage space. I wish I had kept more of my freight car boxes!
Thanks everyone for your input!
Hi Dave. Questions for you about the yard :
-do you have or plan having several cars?
-do you mind backing up a loco in your yard?
The answers will help you decide whether you want escape tracks, i.e., tracks that allow a loco to pull in the yard, and switch to a parallel track to get out. You can put one escape track between two storage tracks without losing to much space... that's what I would do.
Simon
hon30critterNobody seems to want to tell me if my yard design is functional.
Dave, If I understand your goals correctly, your yard is for shuffling cars and fiddling with the train consist with the trusty 0-5-0.
If these are your goals, the yard design should be just fine.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
hon30critter ... I'm still having trouble trying to figure out where to put a drill track so that I'm not fouling the main line when working in the yard. Given the space limitations I'm not sure that I can avoid that sometimes, but I have the advantage of having a double main line with enough cross overs that I can avoid the fouled track and keep running.
I think that if you set that section of your double main up to run CTC, you could easily have the dispatcher assign the 'drill' section of the near main to be out of the current of traffic, and just treat things as a short piece of single track temporarily (as at some bridge- or terrain-related bottlenecks in the West).
As far as yard design goes, it looks reasonable to me. Lead length may not be enough, but you have to work with what you have, and as you mentioned, with solo operation it doesn't matter if you hold up a mainline train to pull a cut. The other thing si, with fewer yard tracks, if you run shorter trains, each yard track can serve double duty, so you might not have to pull cuts so long as to stretch out onto the main. Not every yard on the real thing had every track shown in the "ideal" yard design - they had to work within space contraints as well. Concentrate on getting the most important tracks in, and if that means something else is left out, or isn't the length you might expect it to be, don't sweat it - with enough digging you cna probably find multiple instances of the prototype doing the same thing just to get a needed classification yard in some otherwise restricted space.
A copy of Andy's book would be a great find if you don't have it. The high prices on the used market seem to indicate those who bought it are not interested in getting rid of it. I will be reviewing things before I put down any actual track in my yard, beyond the main passing through along the wall.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
OvermodSee in particular Dave Nelson's post March 14th or so with a list of articles, and the later post by someone with Digital Archive access who said he was downloading them
Hi again Overmod,
I have access to the Digital Archives so I went through all of the articles that Dave Nelson mentioned. The good thing is that I knew more than I thought I did, or at least that I could remember. The bad thing is that I'm still having trouble trying to figure out where to put a drill track so that I'm not fouling the main line when working in the yard. Given the space limitations I'm not sure that I can avoid that sometimes, but I have the advantage of having a double main line with enough cross overs that I can avoid the fouled track and keep running.
The issue of fouling the mainline is a bit academic since I will probably be operating on my own, so stopping a mainline train isn't a big deal.
See in particular Dave Nelson's post March 14th or so with a list of articles, and the later post by someone with Digital Archive access who said he was downloading them -- he might be one to PM for specific comments or ideas...
OvermodWhat about Sperandeo's book on yard design only a few posts down in General Discussion. Anything in there helpful?
I haven't been following the thread. Another bad on my part. I'll have a look.
hon30critterNobody seems to want to tell me if my yard design is functional. I guess I will go back and re-read Armstrong's Track Planning for Realistic Operation again. I should have started there before I asked. My bad.
OvermodYou can use a combination of magnetic Chuck technology and that British strip setup for magnetic adhesion assist to keep other trains in one place during the flip -- you don't have a pacemaker or excessive metal in your body, right?
I do have lots of metal in my body! I have at least a dozen screws and some fancy titanium rods to hold my back together, and I have some screws and cables in my left ankle too! Thankfully none of it is magnetic.
I don't think I want to get into helicies and magnets. I hope I can make a single yard work, although there is a second very small yard recently added to the main layout. It will only handle 6 or 8 cars max.
Nobody seems to want to tell me if my yard design is functional. I guess I will go back and re-read Armstrong's Track Planning for Realistic Operation again. I should have started there before I asked. My bad.
rrinkerWhat you need is another yard like this, going the other way. Trains from the east come in from the yard, make a few laps for miles, do work, etc, and then head in to the west yard. ANd trains fromt he west do the same, the opposite direction. I mean, if you're going to build one rolling, detachable yard.....
Or put in a holding helix like the one Dr. Wayne was proposing, and put yard #2 on the other side of the helix. You can use a combination of magnetic Chuck technology and that British strip setup for magnetic adhesion assist to keep other trains in one place during the flip -- you don't have a pacemaker or excessive metal in your body, right?
I got the LED strips for the control panels today. They will be built into the tops of the control panel frames. The illumination is nice and even, and they can be dimmed so I will be able to control the brightness when running at night:
They will be installed in a groove so the actual strip won't be seen. I'm only putting them across the top of the frames. I think that will provide plenty of light.
rrinkerWhat you need is another yard like this, going the other way.
Yes!! Absolutely!! It would only require a 15' addition to the front of the garage. Mind you it would take me all day to walk from one side of the layout to the other, but why not?!? Go big or go home!!
Oh, wait a minute.....I am home!! And, I want to keep it that way!! Somehow I don't think Dianne would approve of me spending another $20,000 to $30,000 to put an addition on the garage! The town wouldn't be too happy either!
Besides, if I build this yard the total layout length will fill the garage from front to back with just enough room to comfortably walk around the ends.
Any other comments?
Next: Dave fixes the layout in place and takes over the ENTIRE garage.
What you need is another yard like this, going the other way. Trains from the east come in from the yard, make a few laps for miles, do work, etc, and then head in to the west yard. ANd trains fromt he west do the same, the opposite direction.
I mean, if you're going to build one rolling, detachable yard.....
Hi gang,
I need your opinions on a slightly larger yard design which will be used as a removable addition to my layout. Quite frankly, my brain is in a fog when trying to figure out whether this yard will work or not.
Given the fact that there are no reversing loops on the main layout, I want to be able to deal with trains that will be run into the yard from both directions. In other words, some trains will come in locomotive first and others will be backed in with the locomotive pushing the train. I think I can use the bottom track as an AD track for trains arriving engine first, and the second from the bottom track as an AD track for trains backing into the yard.
I also want to have a caboose track which is on the upper right side of the yard.
Thank you for your observations and recommendations.
Deleted by Track fiddler
SeeYou190Back to Dave's nifty layout... No more black widow discussion. Sorry Dave.
Nothing to be sorry for! We have Black Widows here in Ontario but they are pretty rare. In fact, we are blessed to have very few insects or snakes or animals that pose a threat to life. The worst preditors are the polar bears in the far north. They will hunt you down and kill you, although that actually doesn't happen very often. Dianne and I have a trip planned in mid October to visit a polar bear sanctuary in Cochrane, Ontario. I can hardly wait to see a polar bear up close! Yes, they have fences, big fences!!
Speaking of spiders I don't think this one looked very friendly Dave.
He has two arms out in front of him and walked across the patio like a crayfish on six legs like he owned the joint, ... Wait a minute, he is walking on eight legs and has the arms too. He's just missing one leg on the left side and I bet he's pissed off
I don't think I would want a family of these on my layout
Squash
TF
OvermodWidows die relatively easily; it's just that getting the 'agent' to where they live involves far more spraying or squirting of poison than most people like. Some kind of fogging is your likeliest approach
I can assure you, that is not true. Black Widows do not move onto their next life without a lot of resistance. This is real experience speaking here. I have had the opportunity to battle these nasties too many times.
Direct saturating spray with mulitple forms of bug killer, soaking them with wasp spray, and even Brake Clean will not kill them. They need to be squished as the final coup-de-grace or they will recover.
Please do not send Dave's thread into the nether world of debate about arachnid biological structure.
If someone knows of an actual better way to kill black widows, that they have actually used, and they can give brand names, I would love to hear it. Please PM me the answer.
Back to Dave's nifty layout...
Sorry Dave.
SeeYou190If anyone knows a spray that will kill black widows, I would love to know. Brake Cleaner will stun them so they can be squished, but other than that, they are tough customers.
I occasionally get black widows in my garage along with the common long-legged-cobweb-building-spider.
If anyone knows a spray that will kill black widows, I would love to know. Brake Cleaner will stun them so they can be squished, but other than that, they are tough customers.
Raid works fine on the long-legged spiders.
Dave the spider murderer
I wouldn't imagine layouts and spiderwebs mix very well One was hanging from the ceiling doing the yo-yo dance the other day and made Judy Yelp. That spiders Dancing Days Are Over Now!
I have some severly annoyed spiders in the garage (i.e. the layout room)!
There are lots of very long legged spiders that have decided that my garage is a good place to call home. Obviously they will play havoc with the layout as the scenery and structures get installed. They are already covering the benchwork with webs. So, I decided to eliminate them! I had a can of 'OFF' fog spray that I thought would do the trick so I emptied it into the garage a couple of days ago. Had I read the label carefully I might have noticed that the OFF spray was a repellent, not an insecticide. It is designed to discourage insects from hanging around outdoor gatherings, but it doesn't kill them. So, the spiders are alive and well and no doubt upset with the landlord!
Amazon has come to the rescue! I just received two spray cans of Raid insecticide specifically aimed at eliminating spiders. It claims to kill on contact and I believe it. I had a fly buzzing around me as I was opening the package and one quick shot dropped the fly to the floor almost instantly.
Next step is to go out to the garage and attack the spiders again!
Wish me luck!
Cheers!!
Edit:
The spiders dropped like flies!!
Track fiddlerI'm still a big fan of your Rotisserie Layout Dave. It's just a great idea.
Gosh gee golly TF! You are making me blush!
Thank you for your kind words. Hopefully my brain will start working properly again soon so I can get back at it.
I'm still a big fan of your Rotisserie Layout Dave. It's just a great idea.
For now I rebuilt my bench work on wheels because the deck and foam of my layout is light. I can tip it on the side and wire it after my track is laid.
Being a lifetime carpenter. If I ever start another layout someday, your idea will be appreciated as it is now and put to use.
hon30critterI had ordered them from China back in May but obviously the postal system has ground to a halt.
All my eBay orders from China in Feb/Mar/Apr all disappeared.
I began ordering from China again in late June, and things are starting to show up. Maybe we are getting shipping back to normal.
Dunno how they are in Canada, and of course it costs a lot more than the free or ridiulously low shipping for the slow boat method, but I ordered a new design PCB from CHina last week, shipped DHL, and it got here in a week - including MAKING the PCB. They do offer a cheaper option but also say it can take 6-8 weeks shipping. It's not THAT much cheaper - 10 PCBs was like $20 DHL, $12 the cheap way - no brainer.
SOmething else I've seen, at least in the US< is there are many obviously Chinese suppliers on eBay that have "ships from the US" in their listing and quote an expected delivery in line with a basic parcel post mailing, as opposed to the typical 6-8 weeks on 'free' shipping from China. The few times I have ordered from such people, it did come much more quickly and as far as was visible, the package origin was a US post office. Good, until you order more than they have on hand so they have to wait for another shipment from China, so you're back to 6-8 weeks wait time. I use those numbers because that's what it's always been for those low priced items with free shipping that come from China, at least in the US. They quote those times, and they are fairly accurate. Usually by the time something arrives, I forgot what I ordered.
I got the plastic drill dits today as well as a scriber for cutting the panels out of the larger sheets. I also got a hole saw for cutting the holes for the Rapido uncouplers. I'm still waiting for LEDs and bezels. I had ordered them from China back in May but obviously the postal system has ground to a halt. I reordered the switches from Amazon.
Tomorrow I'll start making the panel frames.
Just FYI, layout construction is paused while I wait for some things to arrive so I can make the control panels. I want the control panels in place and the wiring roughed in before I put the plywood and foam on the benchwork. I should be able to get all the buses and the connections between the control panels in place before the foam. If I can do that, it won't take too long to drop the track feeders and install the Tortoises once the track is in place.
At least, that's the theory.