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SNSR Layout Build

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  • Member since
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  • From: Bradford, Ontario
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Posted by hon30critter on Saturday, July 13, 2019 11:08 PM

How long is that bridge Robert?

Dave

I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Saturday, July 13, 2019 11:32 AM

Here's a shot of one of the bridges on my layout. A CSX Dash 8 pulls a short stack of double stacks across the canyon just below the dam.

Robert

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Sunday, June 23, 2019 3:12 PM

Pruitt

No implied criticism of your efforts was intended. If it came across as such, my apologies.

Hey Mark-

Not at all. No offense taken and no need for you to apologize. I just hope I haven't offended you with the wording of my previous response.

I just like to remind everyone that I take a pretty expansive view of the freelance part of proto-freelance or freelanced prototypical. My layout plan calls for a steel mill in Kentucky right next door to a dairy farm in upstate New York just down the road from a little town in Florida and a power plant in Georgia which is across the aisle from a paper mill in Tennessee and a chemical plant in South Carolina all sitting atop a deep water port based (more or less) on the Port of Los Angeles and the Port of Miami. At least the barley operation in Ralston and the sugar beet processing plant in Lovell are in Wyoming, seeings how they share the peninsula with Boysen Dam.

Thanks for your interest, and thanks for the historical photos posted here and on your website.

Robert

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Posted by Pruitt on Sunday, June 23, 2019 2:14 PM

Robert,

No implied criticism of your efforts was intended. If it came across as such, my apologies. What you're building looks great, and will provide a very dramatic setting for the trains.

I'm compressing about ten miles of canyon into roughly twelve feet of layout. I'll have a bit of the Boysen reservoir in the southern approach, but the dam will be in the aisleway(!). I'd like to include the bridge, but I don't know if I'll have room.

Interesting note: the reason the first dam was removed is because it was placed badly for water flow, resulting in the reservoir silting up badly at the dam, within just a few years of completion. Here's a picture. You can see how bad the silt is on the shoreline nearest the camera:

So a new location without that same problem was found, and the new dam built. You can still see remnants of the old dam if you know where to look (I'm sure you do). Here's a shot I took years ago:

I'm looking forward to seeing your continued progress on the dam and canyon! 

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Sunday, June 23, 2019 11:00 AM

Pruitt

Looking good, Robert! I really like your arch bridge.

Just for general interest, here's a shot of the real Boysen dam and below it the railroad bridge:

By Greg Goebel - https://www.flickr.com/photos/37467370@N08/7683551874/, CC BY-SA 2.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=32873369

Hey Mark-

Yes, I recognize the photos you posted; I have travelled through Wind River Canyon dozens of times. My plan to include it on my layout was to try to capture the essence of the entire canyon and fit it into the available space. I freely admit that I play a little fast and loose with the rules. I dedicated an entire peninsula (about 25% of my layout area) to this one scenic element, and in doing so I had to compress the scene at least 95%. So that’s a double compression: taking a 12-mile-long-1500-foot-deep canyon and squeezing it into about a quarter-mile stretch, and reducing that significantly to shoehorn the scene into a 17-foot peninsula.

Boysen Dam is an earth-filled embankment that curves upstream, and the simple fact is that such curved structures are more difficult to model. I chose to build the dam as a straight concrete buttress dam; straighter lines, smoother surfaces. The prototype is the Folsum Dam in California, but even so, I modified details for practical and aesthetic reasons. Here are a couple of photos:

 

BTW, the original location of Boysen Dam was a mile or so downstream from its current location in a narrow point of the canyon, pinched between sheer vertical black granite walls.

The construction of the model is still in the rough mock-up stage, assembled from mat board. The building on the left (left, as facing the dam) represents the hydro-electric generating station. It will have spidery transmission towers that take the high-voltage lines up and out of the canyon. The building on the right will be the irrigation water pumping plant, and it features large water pipes protruding through the dam and smaller distribution pipes across the river on concrete support pilings. Neither building matches the prototype, either the Boysen prototype or the Folsum. Sorry.

Robert

 

 

 

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  • From: Wyoming, where men are men, and sheep are nervous!
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Posted by Pruitt on Sunday, June 23, 2019 7:37 AM

Looking good, Robert! I really like your arch bridge.

Just for general interest, here's a shot of the real Boysen dam and below it the railroad bridge:

By Greg Goebel - https://www.flickr.com/photos/37467370@N08/7683551874/, CC BY-SA 2.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=32873369

Dam Photo By Greg Goebel - https://www.flickr.com/photos/37467370@N08/7683551874/, CC BY-SA 2.0, https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?curid=32873369

Photo taken by montanatom1950.

Note the old tunnel portal near the far end of the bridge. This was for the older rail alignment, before the Boysen dam was rebuilt in a new location and the old dam demolished. The change in the dam's location and higher water level in the reservoir required relocating the railroad, including cutting a new tunnel to the south (left in the bridge photo).

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Posted by Bigjim7 on Sunday, June 23, 2019 6:58 AM
Very well done. So clean and neat. My room is always a mess. The dam is awesome.
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Posted by Colorado Ray on Saturday, June 22, 2019 9:27 PM

Looks fantastic!  I really like the nice clean look.  The canyon and dam are spectacular.  

Ray

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Saturday, June 22, 2019 7:14 PM

Here are a few overall photos of the train room showing the current state of the layout as things stand right now, today. The goal is to finish up all the, for lack of a better word, heavy construction and carpentry; that is, anything that requires shop tools such as hammers, chisels, circular saws, jig saws, chop saws, table saws, Sawzalls, air guns, routers, drills, etc and anything else that might make a mess (dust, dirt, paint splatters, etc). What I am aiming for is to finish the benchwork and have all the bare naked plywood and framing lumber covered with at least with a base coat so that I can claim to be a full notch past the Plywood Pacific stage, and I think I have accomplished that . . . well, mostly. Vegetation and ground cover will soon follow. Getting to this point will now allow me to focus on my favorite part of model railroading . . . building little structures.

 

The milestone is evidenced by the completed upper- and lower fascia trim. A specific design criteria from the very beginning was to have a smooth continuous fascia without visible joints, nail holes, or exposed screwheads (not even those fancy brass oval head screws with matching recessed cup washers). The color is Dry Sage . . . I don’t know if Wyoming has an official state plant, but if we did it’d be dried out sagebrush.

There’s still a lot to do, so don’t focus too much on the tops of the decks. Before taking photos, I thought about removing the clutter of partially-assembled partially-painted buildings and structures as well as the rough (and some say, ridiculous) stand-ins I like to use, but I left that stuff in place. All those blocks, pipes, cans, and mayonnaise jars really help me visualize the space.

 

The trackage on the lower level is Kato Unitrack. I have a ton of it stored in shoeboxes, and I am using it now so that I can piddle around with the arrangement and test out the large and complex yard that will ultimately be constructed down there.

Right now, the trackage is constrained by the geometry of the Kato snap pieces. Later, after I piddle around for a while working out the logic and operational schemes, I’ll install permanent flextrack and will have a lot more flexibility regarding track spacing and curve/turnout radii and whatnot. The entire lower level was conceived and designed as a deep-water port, but it was always intended to serve as a large division point and classification yard. Most of the ‘work’ of the SNSR will take place down there, and the operators can be comfortably seated in rolling office chairs at the convenient 34-inch high benchwork. 

The front two tracks are the A/D tracks, but they will be scenicked as loading tracks for the deep-water port. North Shore Yard West (left side of aisle under the middle peninsula as shown in the photos) will handle general ocean-going cargo and bulk commodities (such as coal, fertilizer, crushed limestone, and other bulk minerals or agricultural grains). There will be two Hulett unloaders and several medium-sized cranes (which is to say, pretty dang large cranes seeings how this is a major port; but not nearly as large as the giant longshore gantry cranes that will serve the container and automobile port of North Shore Yard East on the other (right) side of the aisle). The three classification tracks of the west yard are 10, 11, and 12 feet long (about 25 to 30 cars each) and the three of the east yard are about 16, 17, and 18 feet long (about 35 to 40 cars each).

The rear track is the mainline, and trains can bypass the entire yard and travel all the way around the lower layout en route to the (hidden) staging/storage yard and balloon track under the Win Littlefield Bridge and Wind River Mountains. The two tracks labeled A and B in the photo are the mainline and yard lead respectively and they go 180-degrees around the end of the middle peninsula and travel up the nolix (0% to 1% grade) where they join together into the single track of the helix (2% grade). The west yard lead is about 15 feet long and allows strings of about 35 cars to be worked. The east yard lead can extend all the way into the staging/storage yard and halfway around the balloon track . . . dang I dunno, at least 15 feet.

Turnouts for the yard are Kato #4 and #6. Kato is very proud of the quality and reliability of their flagship turnouts, and although I have run trains full-throttle forwards and backwards through them (and through the tight reverse curves created by their fixed geometry), the yardmaster will impose a strict 10 MPH maximum speed within the yard limits. Later, after I’ve installed permanent flextrack with a little more control over the geometry, I will still maintain the 10 MPH speed limit.

As currently laid out, the main line around the end of the center peninsula and at the far horse shoe curve of the port looks a little ragged because Kato Unitrack has parallel curve pieces spaced 1-1/4” apart from 9-3/4” radius up to 19” radius, but there are no Unitrack pieces to form a parallel offset 1-1/4” inside or outside the standard-piece 28-1/4”radius curve.

Here's a sketch of the lower yard as laid out using Unitrack.

 

Anyhow . . . progress.

 

Robert

 

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Sunday, February 10, 2019 7:07 PM

A few small support structures that go at the base of Boysen Dam in Wind River Canyon. Cut from 1/8" Masonite hardboard and laminated.

Robert

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Friday, January 18, 2019 6:46 PM

hon30critter

Robert,

Those towers look really neat! I'm guessing that you will only model the portions that stay above the water line, but still quite a project.

Dave

Hey Dave-

Yes, I plan to model only the part that sticks up above the water. About 3 inches (40 N-scale feet). My design calls for two towers, but after fabricating them and placing them on the layout, they look kinda like a couple of salt-and-pepper shakers out there standing guard. We'll see how things turn out when I get more of the dam structure in place. I might go to four with connecting walkways. Right now I'm just trying to block out the scene to see what's what.

Robert

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Posted by hon30critter on Thursday, January 17, 2019 12:29 AM

Robert,

Those towers look really neat! I'm guessing that you will only model the portions that stay above the water line, but still quite a project.

Dave

I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!

  • Member since
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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Thursday, January 17, 2019 12:05 AM

More pieces cut out to fabricate one of the intake towers for Boysen Dam at the upper end of Wind River Canyon.

Here's a historical photo (from Wikipedia) of Hoover Dam under construction showing the four massive intake towers. My dam is a lot smaller and the reservoir is filled with water, so I only have to construct the uppermost couple of inches.

Robert

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Tuesday, January 15, 2019 11:09 PM

I cut out a few pieces and parts for a structure in Wind River Canyon. Dang! I should've put a penny or something in the photo to show relative size. Sorry. Not too small. But the image does show that they need to be filed and sanded and generally cleaned up a bit. Cutting marks and fluff and whatnot.

Robert

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Posted by 7j43k on Tuesday, January 8, 2019 7:10 PM

I think those flags read:

"If you can read this, you're too close."

 

 

Ed

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Tuesday, January 8, 2019 6:15 PM

In case anyone is curious what the weather station flag pavilion mentioned in a previous post is, it looks something like this:

Robert

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Monday, January 7, 2019 7:47 PM

7j43k

Somehow, I've missed seeing this topic.  Now that I have, I will say that I am very much looking forward to seeing more.  This is one of the rare layouts that feels "spacious".  And that is a real treat.  Hooray!

Hey Ed-

You hit the nail on the head. 'Spacious' is what I was going for. From the very beginning, a specific design criteria was to have a very low track-to-scenery ratio. I prefer open space, panoramic vistas, and long continuous runs that allow trains to stretch their legs. I also wanted a low layout-to-room ratio, and that meant wide comfortable aisles (minimum 36") to accomodate several operators and spectators.

Glad to hear that you found this thread. It has been here for quite a while, and I try to make regular periodical updates to chronicle my progress, but sometimes progress is slow and the reports are far between. I occasionally make reference to things I posted here in other threads that address wide-ranging and related topics, but I guess my presence on this forum is not all that influential.

Anyhow, thanks for your comments. You've given me plenty of stuff to chew on for a while.

Robert

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  • From: Just another small town in Ohio
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Posted by Erie1951 on Monday, January 7, 2019 3:33 PM

Robert...

In addition to being a Junior Assistant Rookie Apprentice, you are certainly a Master Bridge Builder, too. Thumbs Up That's one of the finest big steel bridges that I've seen modeled.

Russ

Modeling the early '50s Erie in Paterson, NJ.  Here's the link to my railroad postcard collection: https://railroadpostcards.blogspot.com/

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Posted by 7j43k on Monday, January 7, 2019 2:51 PM

Somehow, I've missed seeing this topic.  Now that I have, I will say that I am very much looking forward to seeing more.  This is one of the rare layouts that feels "spacious".  And that is a real treat.  Hooray!

 

Mike brought up an interesting point about switching the steel plant.  It got me looking at another couple of locations; and I, too, have a couple of suggestions:

 

Consider the switch that ties the lead to the paper and chemical plants--the one "above" the intermodal tracks.  I recommend moving the tie-in point from that location up the main track aways, either to just before the curve or just after.  This gives a lead for a switcher to work those two plants without fouling the main so often.

The same could hold true for the intermodal yard.  It's tie-in switch could move around the two 90 degree bends and tie in over there.

 

Over at the sugar and forest products area, I recommend changing the handedness of the two crossovers, and then positioning them as far apart as possible--right up to the curves.  This will give you a larger run-around track for making up a train.  And also make the switching more convenient.

 

Just below the town, over on the right, there's a track cutting over from the far track to the ones in front.  I recommend, just above where it ties into the latter, that you add a crossover, so that a train can come from this track and go around a train stopped on the other main. 

 

I think it would be a good thing to add a couple of double crossovers into the two-track mains.  One location leaps out:  way up at the top.  Another could be above the intermodal yard.  These give you flexibility of train running.  I strongly recommend you use "paired" crossovers, rather than the kind with a crossing in the middle.  They are much more common, especially out away from dense trackage.

 

Ed

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Monday, January 7, 2019 1:25 PM

Hey guys, thanks. Kind words are always helpful and encouraging.

Robert

LINK to SNSR Blog


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Posted by RWSlater on Monday, January 7, 2019 5:00 AM
The Bridge is looking great. Robert
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Posted by hon30critter on Sunday, January 6, 2019 8:30 PM

I have to say it again, that bridge looks fantastic!

Dave

I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!

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  • From: Foster, RI
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Posted by mammay76 on Sunday, January 6, 2019 8:22 PM

Just read through your thread! Excellent looking layout, Looking forward to more!

Joe

Modeling:

Providence & Worcester Railroad

"East Providence Secondary"

HO scale

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Saturday, January 5, 2019 6:14 PM

Updating . . . Here're a few photos showing the test-fit of the high-level bridge and rough-in of landforms around the north abutment. The north bank is where the town and industries are located and, therefore, this area needs a little more infrastructure. By way of contrast, the south bank is barren and rocky, which is appropriate because that side quickly transitions into mountains and high desert.

Some features of the north bank include: North Shore Drive, with two-way traffic and bike lanes (I model the modern era, and that means having to accommodate the granola-and-Birkenstock crowd); a riverfront walking/hiking/jogging trail; concrete seawall with guardrail and cyclopean rock breakwater; a wooden dock with small craft berth and facilities for rowers and kayakers; and on top of the high bluff, the lighthouse and lightkeeper's quarters (including weather station flag pavilion) and a maritime museum (housed in an old Florida-style mansion designed with cracker and conch architectural influences).


The lightkeeper's house is Barb's Bungalow, a nice little Atlas kit. It kinda matches the prototype, except for the fire-engine-red roof. It is molded in four colors, which is the specific reason I bought it, and I didn't want to paint it.


Which brings up . . . the thing about that photo of the St Augustine Lighthouse posted earlier: the colors are so vibrant and the scenery is so clean and tidy that it looks more like a model than my model does. They (whoever they are) used gloss red paint on the upper levels and on the tower cap as well as on the roof of the aforementioned lightkeeper's house. All in all, the prototype looks pretty spiffy. I used Tamiya flat red on the tower, which I had on hand, and as a result my model is dull by comparison. Oh well.

 

 

 

 

Robert

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Tuesday, November 27, 2018 1:15 PM

The technical term for those barber pole stripes shown in the previous post is day markings. When sailors approach unfamiliar shores there might be several lighthouses within their field of view, and the distinctive colors and/or patterns of the towers help identify which is which. At night, the lights have different patterns and sequences to distinguish them. All this info is included on navigation charts.


Horizontal layer cake stripes or solid colors would be the easiest to fabricate, but why bother with easy? One phrase I hear pretty often in this hobby is something along the lines of " . . . we don't need no math, we can eyeball it!" Yeah, well maybe we can, but I like to work out the math.

 

Robert

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Saturday, November 24, 2018 10:35 AM

Here's the latest:

So, what's the housing for a 4-inch popup sprinkler head doing on an N-scale layout? Fair question. Here's a clue: San Juan River Inlet, strong tidal currents, high craggy cliff, busy deep water port . . . Yes, it's a lighthouse. Or at least it will be soon.


It is inspired by visits to the lighthouse on Anastasia Island in St Augustine, Florida when I was a kid. Inspired by, not a direct copy of. There are many other interesting lighthouses all over the place from which to get details here and there.

My lighthouse is not as tall and slender as the one in St Augustine, but by way of compensation it sits atop a 130-foot cliff. Some quick and fuzzy math indicates that the beacon would be visible 16 or 18 miles offshore from a rowboat or maybe 25 or 30 miles from the bridge of a very large container ship.

Robert

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Monday, November 12, 2018 6:11 PM

I'm still working on the bridge and inlet at the bottom end of the layout, but I took a little break to cut out some pieces and parts that will form the pavement and parking lot for the prompt service restaurant at the other end (shown at the top of the upper level layout plan). There will actually be two restaurants there: one truly fast-food (with ubiquitous drive-thru window), and the other a sit-down restaurant (such as Perkins or Denny's or Applebee's or Red Robin hmmmm). Modern era.

Cut from 1/4" Masonite hardboard.

Robert

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Posted by Erie Lackawanna in Georgia on Sunday, November 11, 2018 4:46 PM

Thanks Robert - you’re right of course!   I will look at one of the hosting sites later in the week.  A business commitment will rule out getting to it for a few days.

Mike

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Sunday, November 11, 2018 4:01 PM

Erie Lackawanna in Georgia

Hi Robert,

I did mark up a couple of ideas but I’m not sure how to get them to you.  Perhaps you could shoot me an email to:

( I removed email address )

Mike

Hey Mike 

You should not post your email address on this, or any other, public forum. That is Internet Safety Rule #1. I removed it from this reply, and you should edit your post as well.

Have you ever posted photos or sketches here before? There are sticky posts with instructions on how to do that. You'll need access to some other hosting site because this forum does not provide for direct attachments to posts. I don't think you can attach files to PMs, either.

If you can figure out how to upload your ideas, I'd like to see them.

Thanks, Robert 

LINK to SNSR Blog


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Posted by Erie Lackawanna in Georgia on Sunday, November 11, 2018 10:38 AM

Hi Robert,

I did mark up a couple of ideas but I’m not sure how to get them to you.  Perhaps you could shoot me an email to:

Mike

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