Deputy wrote: I found this thread quite enjoyable. Lots of varied and strong opinions by everyone. zeke: I'm with you. While some of what I own may be in the "collector" catagory, I run it ALL. Dep Dep- I thought it was very interesting to see it go so many ways...i didnt think it would be that big of a deal ....but no matter what i ever own i will run it all.....sure it can look pretty on a self but im all about running them... take care ......the zekeman is out
I found this thread quite enjoyable. Lots of varied and strong opinions by everyone.
Dep
Dep- I thought it was very interesting to see it go so many ways...i didnt think it would be that big of a deal ....
but no matter what i ever own i will run it all.....sure it can look pretty on a self but im all about running them...
take care ......the zekeman is out
BDT: I know the real Pennsy only had one S2 turbine. I will never have more than one on my tracks at one time But it sure is nice to pick and choose from a large variety which one I will run
kpolak: $40 for shipping!!! Makes me wonder if they are shipping it in a wood crate!!!
zeke: I'm with you. While some of what I own may be in the "collector" catagory, I run it ALL.
Virginian Railroad
wow i had no idea posting this would stir up so many interesting comments...myself am not a collector and thinks its alot of money but i understand the collectors point also..
I do not think that anyone is really trying to "bash" the collector market. I am a collector and purchase the most expensive examples of Lionel postwar that I can find. I once paid $1,800 for a mint 313 Bascule bridge from 1948.
The point I was trying to make was that these people are selling JUNK at BEYOND collectors prices. Whether that auction was for a 763E, 700E, etc. in MY EYES from a collectors standpoint it was junk and nothing but junk (I don't care what it was). The crappy pictures, poor description, and ridiculous buy it now price didn't help the situation.
Even if that engine was in pristine collector quality condition with the boxes, inserts, instructions, walnut base, etc. it STILL would not even of scratched the $10,000 mark.
Bob Keller
Don U. TCA 73-5735
Deputy wrote: Buying an empty cardboard box for $5000 IS a little strange no matter how you look at it. I'm still trying to figure out eZAK's excellent/amusing question of "how do you ship it?"
Buying an empty cardboard box for $5000 IS a little strange no matter how you look at it. I'm still trying to figure out eZAK's excellent/amusing question of "how do you ship it?"
If you look down at the bottom of the listing it's a bonus $40 for shipping!
Kurt
Hay Dep,,,,,I know that you like to Model the Pennsy,,, but the real Pennsy only had one S2 turbine!!
Do you have a long tunnel that you can hide these things in,,,Mrs Dep wouldn't think about checking the tunnels, Would She????
still raining here....BDT
jimtrumpie wrote: Dep, I saw that there is a 681 w/ a 2046W on ebay with a buy it now around $150. Looks like its worth it. Maybe if I wasn't saving to buy an Xbox 360...
Dep,
I saw that there is a 681 w/ a 2046W on ebay with a buy it now around $150. Looks like its worth it. Maybe if I wasn't saving to buy an Xbox 360...
Jim: I saw that one. It's okay. This one is much nicer but it may rise in price...
http://cgi.ebay.com/Lionel-681-PRR-Steam-Turbine-Locomotive-Tender-Nice_W0QQitemZ330127030252QQihZ014QQcategoryZ4146QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Any 681 I buy now I would most likely convert to 682 configuration.
jaabat wrote: Deputy wrote: Jim: If I had 24 S2 Turbines I would be in divorce court . No way I could justify to the wifey that kind of expense...DepI guess denial isn't just a river in Egypt! Dep, admit you have an S2 addiction and we will help you! Oh, I kinda look at the accidents for the gore...saw a severed head once. Jim
Deputy wrote: Jim: If I had 24 S2 Turbines I would be in divorce court . No way I could justify to the wifey that kind of expense...Dep
Jim: If I had 24 S2 Turbines I would be in divorce court . No way I could justify to the wifey that kind of expense...
I guess denial isn't just a river in Egypt! Dep, admit you have an S2 addiction and we will help you!
Oh, I kinda look at the accidents for the gore...saw a severed head once.
Jim
Noooooooo...I don't want a cure. I just need the stuff to satisfy my addiction
I saw too much gore working for Uncle Sammie back in the late 60s. I just want to put blinders on and get past accident scenes as quickly as possible.
Deputy wrote:Jim: If I had 24 S2 Turbines I would be in divorce court . No way I could justify to the wifey that kind of expense...Dep
Modeling the Baltimore waterfront in HO scale
Little Boxes
by Malvina Reynolds
Little boxes on the hillside, Little boxes made of tickytackyLittle boxes on the hillside, little boxes all the sameThere's a green one and a pink one and a blue one and a yellow oneAnd they're all made out of ticky tacky and they all look just the same.
elvisp wrote: How many times do we have to hear that people on this forum don't like boxes?
Until all those silly, silly people who buy boxes remember to take their Thorazine and stop wasting their money like that. It doesn't matter what those collectors want: they pay too much for it and therefore need to be forced into taking mind-altering chemicals until they follow in lock-step the agenda of the smart-'n-same folks who simply throw the old boxes away and sneer at anyone else's enjoyment of the hobby.
And I have to confess my guilt. I bought swome boxes once to go with my trains. But the doctor syas I'm getting better. I may get out of this straight-jacket next month!
<----Laughing maniacally at myself, as per the current recommended operating procedures.
Hey Elvis,
Thank you. Thank you very much for your opinion! TCB, man!
Jim: If I had 24 S2 Turbines I would be in divorce court . No way I could justify to the wifey that kind of expense.
Elvis: again...you are taking these comments WAY too seriously. Guys aren't disrespecting anyone. Buying an empty cardboard box for $5000 IS a little strange no matter how you look at it. I'm still trying to figure out eZAK's excellent/amusing question of "how do you ship it?" That thought alone brings a grin to my face An empty cardboard box that is worth $5000 being shipped by UPS in a cardboard box that costs $6.00 and explaining that you want to insure the empty cardboard box for $5000. Imagine the look on the poor UPS clerk's face when he tries to fill out then shipping form!!! Seriously, I really don't care if Lionel collectors want to pay a gazillion dollars for boxes or the sink used by employees to wash their faces in at the original Lionel factory. It seems collectors know no bounds as far as what they will collect and what price they will pay to get it. But you certainly can't expect the average Lionel owner/operator to watch these E-Bay sales and not comment on them. That is just plain human nature. Like slowing up at a car wreck to see what happened. They aren't staring to see the gore...they're staring because they are thinking "I'm glad it didn't happen to us".
Remember, if you collect, the condition of the item is eveything! If the item has the Original Boxes, with wrapping paper and inserts, it can add 20 to 50 % to the value depending, again, on condition of the Box.
Excellent observation, Dep! And when it comes to laughing at yourself, I'm a pro! Lighten up and enjoy life for Pete's sake, guys! Wait a minute...you have 24 S2 turbines, Dep?! Dude, you really need to get a life!!! That is insane! 24? Have you ever considered a 12 step program? I had no idea you were that far gone... Jim
Excellent observation, Dep! And when it comes to laughing at yourself, I'm a pro! Lighten up and enjoy life for Pete's sake, guys! Wait a minute...you have 24 S2 turbines, Dep?! Dude, you really need to get a life!!! That is insane! 24? Have you ever considered a 12 step program? I had no idea you were that far gone...
Now, all he needs are the Boxes for each of them and the original case Box!
Deputy wrote: yallaen wrote: I don't see this as ridiculing anyone..it's just pointing out some of the "overeagerness" of people to try and collect money in odd things. Is that PC enuff for you sensitive types?I'm so sick of PC...Ditto. Seems like some folks come on a forum wearing their emotions on their sleeves. Turn down the sensitivity levels and learn to laugh at yourselves. You'll go through life with a smile on your face instead of a frown. I sure didn't get all testy when Ben made the comment about me collecting 24 S2 Turbines. I went along with it and laughed WITH it. Dep
yallaen wrote: I don't see this as ridiculing anyone..it's just pointing out some of the "overeagerness" of people to try and collect money in odd things. Is that PC enuff for you sensitive types?I'm so sick of PC...
I don't see this as ridiculing anyone..it's just pointing out some of the "overeagerness" of people to try and collect money in odd things. Is that PC enuff for you sensitive types?
I'm so sick of PC...
Ditto. Seems like some folks come on a forum wearing their emotions on their sleeves. Turn down the sensitivity levels and learn to laugh at yourselves. You'll go through life with a smile on your face instead of a frown. I sure didn't get all testy when Ben made the comment about me collecting 24 S2 Turbines. I went along with it and laughed WITH it.
I can't speak for anyone else in the thread, but I wasn't "bashing" anyone with my comments. I was more joking about the whole "precious boxes" idea that seems to affect part of the collecting group
Balony, go back and read what you wrote. Most of it ridiculing the person who bought the box,, and collectors in general.
While I fully understand both sides of the debate mabey I can shed a humorous explanation of this phenominon.
A friend of mine brought over his five year old and three year old to help another friend move. I laughed at the amount of fun those two were having with the boxes (remembering this thread). Many people collect the trains as a way to remember their childhood. Box collectors may collect the boxes to remember what they might have had even more fun with at an earlier age. Mabey not, I am not a box collector.
All kidding aside, if I had no limit on my train purchasing, you would ridicule my purchases as I would by anything and everything. I am sure many of you would do the same.. It is still fun to see stuff like this.
elvisp wrote: I know that the majority of people on this form are operators, but let's stop bashing the postwar/prewar collectors. I operate and collect post and prewar. I mainly collect items in their origianl boxes. I get as much enjoyment looking at my collection displayed with their boxes than I do running trains on my layout. It is quite rare for a 40+yr old toy to come complete with its original package. As stated before, most kids tossed away the boxes when they opened the trains. For a rare set box to exist in that conition is amazing. While the buyer may have paid a large sum on the box, if he has or will get the components, he will have a rare and valuable set. It will probably the center of his collection. The box significantly increased the value of the set. I am not saying that that price wasn't outragous, only that to that collector it was worth the amount paid. I bet that many collectors would think it is outragous to pay $500, $1K or $2k new engine. (especially when many thread compliant that the did not work out of the box) While I appreciate the modern engines, I would rather have the mint 682 (that most people bashed) in stead of a modern loco of the same price. Does that make me "stupid"? Keep in mind: how "stupid" you are depends on what side of the fence (tracks) your standing. On persons junk is anothers treasure. Can we appreciate all the aspects of this hoppy instead of complaining about each other.
I know that the majority of people on this form are operators, but let's stop bashing the postwar/prewar collectors. I operate and collect post and prewar. I mainly collect items in their origianl boxes. I get as much enjoyment looking at my collection displayed with their boxes than I do running trains on my layout. It is quite rare for a 40+yr old toy to come complete with its original package. As stated before, most kids tossed away the boxes when they opened the trains. For a rare set box to exist in that conition is amazing. While the buyer may have paid a large sum on the box, if he has or will get the components, he will have a rare and valuable set. It will probably the center of his collection. The box significantly increased the value of the set. I am not saying that that price wasn't outragous, only that to that collector it was worth the amount paid.
I bet that many collectors would think it is outragous to pay $500, $1K or $2k new engine. (especially when many thread compliant that the did not work out of the box) While I appreciate the modern engines, I would rather have the mint 682 (that most people bashed) in stead of a modern loco of the same price. Does that make me "stupid"? Keep in mind: how "stupid" you are depends on what side of the fence (tracks) your standing. On persons junk is anothers treasure. Can we appreciate all the aspects of this hoppy instead of complaining about each other.
I can't speak for anyone else in the thread, but I wasn't "bashing" anyone with my comments. I was more joking about the whole "precious boxes" idea that seems to affect part of the collecting group. I would also like to have a mint 682. But I'm not gonna pay a gazillion dollars for it. And I'm certainly not going to pay double (or more) of the loco's value just because it comes in the original box. And I WILL run it. One thing I've learned from being an old gezeer is that life's too short to keep a beautiful loco sealed up in some box on a shelf or to will it to a relative or kid that will most likely sell it at a loss to get the cash to buy an MP3 player. Do collectors think I am crazy for buying a loco that cost $1000+. Probably. I've got a bunch of them and like them all. NONE of them are going to be "wallhangers", although they are certainly nicely made machines with a lot more detail than the postwar stuff. Do I care if they laugh at me? Nope. If we can't laugh at the weirdness of our hobby, what's the point?
Here's a thought...if I throw away my U-Haul box, then tomorrow go back to the garbage and get it, will it be worth MORE than before I threw it away???? Heck, if I keep throwing it away and retrieving it, it may get REAL valuable after a short period of time.
And what about all those Christmas presents we got last year that were boxed. Would they go up in value if I KEPT the box? I wonder if there is a hobby of JUST collecting the box and throwing away what's inside???? Is there a Rare Box Collecting Society?
eZAK: Those are some EXCELLENT questions!!!! If it were me and I just went off my Thorazine and bought a $5,100 empty box, I think I would have to make a special trip to the seller and pick it up in person. No way I would trust any shipping outfit to not squash my precious piece of cardboard filled with 1950s air. Imagine spending all that money and when it arrives it looks like Uncle Sam was using it for a target for an Abrams tank!!!! And just HOW are they going to verify that this box IS what the seller says it is??? We know full well there are fake Lionel boxes out there for individual items like box cars and locos. But those have paint and printing and all kinds of quirks that an experienced collector would be able to verify. Are we now to believe that collectors can verify that a plain brown cardboard box is an original made in the 50s as opposed to today??? I doubt very much the seller was willing to tear off a section to send in for chemical analysis or allow the buyer to inspect it before purchase. For insurance, perhaps Lloyds of London would insure it. But considering the reputation of US shipping companies, I kinda doubt it. And what do you do with this rare item once you take possession of it? Toss a bunch of train stuff into it and store it in the cellar or attic??? I think not. You'd have to insure it (Lloyds again) and then you'd have to get some kind of airtight temperature-controlled container to store it in. Oh man...a box protecting an empty box. Does it never end???
How does one ship a $5,100 box?
Do you bubble wrap it and put it in an even larger box?
Do you tell the shipping co. that your shipping a box and whould like to insure it for $5100?
It must be nice to have money!
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