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Pre War American Flyer Pictures - An Invitation

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Wednesday, April 22, 2020 3:13 PM

Narrow Gauge

1939  -  No. 19 Train Set

The next car in the consist is a Tank Car.

This is the #410 Tank Car

Here it is with its box

Aha! Another "S"

And the set is begining to take shape

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

Addendum:

This set was cataloged in 1939 and 1940.  In 1940 this car was still numbered 410 but it was called an Oil Car.  Back in June of 2013 I posted photos of both cars and and their boxes. I am reposting those photos here.

Notice that one dome is brass and the other is nickle.

1939 Box

1940 Box

Northwoods Flyer

 

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Posted by Spanners on Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:22 PM

This is a great write-up, NW, thanks for adding. 

I am going to post a picture of my '4321' 0-6-0, as I'd love your feedback as to if you think the decal on the locomotive is original or a redo. 

Keep the goodness coming! 

Jeff 

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Posted by Spanners on Thursday, April 23, 2020 12:42 PM

I think it's a redo based on its location on the cab, but looking at your printed advert, it is moved more forward in that picture as well. Thoughts? 

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Thursday, April 23, 2020 2:52 PM

Jeff,

I think that the decal on your engine is original. Being that it is a decal I am sure that some of them may have been placed a bit differently.  From what I can tell from your photo and from the photos of other "4321" engines that I have seen I think it is original.

The "4321" decal was only used in 1938, the first year that the 0-6-0 switcher was cataloged. The engine number is 4321 (Type XIV die-cast swithcher), the tender is number 4320 (Type XIV tender) and the combination is the #4621 Locomotive-Tender Combination.  You have to love Fyer's numbering system.

I am not sure that your engine and tender started out life together  The white decal with black lettering is from 1940 according to Schuweiler. But who knows for sure.

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by Nationwidelines on Saturday, April 25, 2020 5:56 AM

Northwoods Flyer

Jeff,

I think that the decal on your engine is original. Being that it is a decal I am sure that some of them may have been placed a bit differently.  From what I can tell from your photo and from the photos of other "4321" engines that I have seen I think it is original.

The "4321" decal was only used in 1938, the first year that the 0-6-0 switcher was cataloged. The engine number is 4321 (Type XIV die-cast swithcher), the tender is number 4320 (Type XIV tender) and the combination is the #4621 Locomotive-Tender Combination.  You have to love Fyer's numbering system.

I am not sure that your engine and tender started out life together  The white decal with black lettering is from 1940 according to Schuweiler. But who knows for sure.

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

 

 

I would suspect his engine and tender did not start out together, simply because his tender has the wrong coupler on it for 1938.  

My original 1938 tender does have white lettering and black background.

NWL

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Saturday, April 25, 2020 5:55 PM

Narrow Gauge

1939 -    No. 19  Train Set

O Gauge Switcher

We have now reached the penultimate car in this set;

The #408 Box Car

Here we have a portrait with its box.

 

If we hadn't been following the presence of an "S" on all of these boxes a person might think that there is more than one car in this box.

And here we are one step closer to the complete set and the solution to the mystery of the "S".

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Tuesday, April 28, 2020 10:04 AM

Narrow Gauge

1939 -    No. 19  Train Set

O Gauge Switcher

 

Here we are at the last car in this train. And of course it is the last car of every freight train in this era of railroading.

A caboose is probably the easiest car to find of any in American Flyer rolling stock.

This is the #411. It comes with a light.  This car was always fun to watch at eye level as it travelled around the Christmas Tree.

Here it is with its box.

Oddly, this box does not have an "S" stamped on it.

And now our Switcher set is complete.

Next up will be a proposed explanation for all of those "S" stamps.

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Friday, May 1, 2020 9:09 AM

Narrow Gauge

1939 - No. 19 Train Set

O Gauge Switcher

Here is the story behind this set and the "S"s

The set as I have it today is the result of two purchases.  The train equipment came as one purchase.  I have wanted a 429 switcher for a long time and the entire set became available at a reasonable price.  It ran around the Christmas tree last year and delighted our grandson.

Surprisingly the boxes became available from another source in a different part of the country.  I have been bringing together pieces of sets for my entire collecting career.  It is unusual for me to buy boxes, however this just seemed like the right thing to do.  The only thing that concerned me was that the set box did not appear to be marked with the set number.

When the boxes arrived each of the individual boxes was marked appropriately.

The set box had shipping information stamped on it.

It was shipped from the A.C. Gilbert Company to Wm. H. Hoegee Co. - a sporting goods store - in Los Angeles.

Alas, the space on the box label that would usually have the set number was blank.

A closer examination shows the stamp "19 S" on the upper left corner of the box above the label. 

 

I am making the assumption that it is stamped for Set 19.  I'm not sure where the S comes from, however remember all of the individual boxes except the caboose have an extra S stamped on them. 

 

Does anyone know if this was a common practice?  I do not have many complete boxed sets with their original set boxes to have seen this before.

Set No. 19 has been reunited with its boxes.

This is one of the things I love about this hobby.

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Northwoods Flyer

 

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Posted by Nationwidelines on Saturday, May 2, 2020 7:15 PM

Northwoods,

The 19 not being stamped on the label is correct.  I have a couple of boxes from this era that have the number stamped on the box instead of the label, exactly like yours.  Not sure that the S stand for.  I have not observed that previously.  

NWL

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Posted by wrmcclellan on Sunday, May 3, 2020 5:17 PM

Great looking sets guys! Thanks!

Regards, Roy

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Tuesday, May 5, 2020 12:33 PM

Wide Gauge

#4685 (1929 - 1930)

St. Paul-Style Cab Electric

This engine appeared in the catalog in 1929 and 1930. In 1929 it had no ringing bell , and in 1930 it was upgraded with a ringing bell.  This is the 1929 version.

The engine has plenty of brass.

Each end has an "American Flyer Lines" plate near the top.

In 1929 the #4685 headed up The Lone Scout.  Set #1494 (see the red outlined box in the catalog illustration)

So lets take a closer look at this set.

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Saturday, May 9, 2020 9:33 AM

Wide Gauge

#4250 Club  (1929 - 1931)

American Flyer  Lone Scout set

This is another set that I bought early in my collecting career. It is also from a printed list and there were no photos. I probably would not purchase it today, however it is a place holder until I find a nicer set.

There are only two variations of this car; this one with brass air tanks and one with gray truss rods.

It has lots of nice brass and plenty of tags. Its been packed away for several years and when I took it out I discovered that it is missing one of the brass doors.  Anyone have one to spare in their parts box?

At least with the door missing you can see what the underlying lithography looks like.

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by Nationwidelines on Saturday, May 9, 2020 5:21 PM

Northwoods,

Actually there are also two variations of the lithography (and I don't know if they vary with the trusses or air tanks or not).  One variation is a more greenish color to the lithograph and one variation is a more blueish color to the lithograph.

NWL

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Monday, May 11, 2020 8:36 AM

NWL,

Thanks for the heads up on the color variation. I will have to keep my eyes open for an example.  Perhaps it will be that the cars with truss bars will be different in color from the cars I already have.

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Wednesday, May 13, 2020 11:15 AM

Wide Gauge

#4251 Pullman  (1929 - 1931)

American Flyer Lone Scout Set

 

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Friday, May 15, 2020 9:37 AM

Wide Gauge

#4252   Observation  (1929 - 1931)

American Flyer  Lone Scout Set

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by JonEddy on Friday, May 15, 2020 7:55 PM

Northwoods, I found a heck of a deal in a local ad for someone selling old trains. Everything on this retangle of track I got from this ad. The guy threw in the box with all of the lamps and accessories and the tunnel with the trains. The table is what I've been working on while in quarantine.

    Jon

This is a Hudson right?

This one was hard to see:

 

 

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Posted by JonEddy on Saturday, May 16, 2020 2:00 AM

Some pics of the 1680 Hudson and Tender, which works! Only thing missing is the firebox bulb. Also a few of the other O-gauge Flyers I got:

 

No photo description available.

This one I didn't see any marking on it any where, it does have a ringing bell inside the cab though which I had seen in this thread as a 3308.

   JonEddy

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Posted by JonEddy on Sunday, May 17, 2020 8:06 PM

Here are more pics of the tunnel and lights I got. It is a Cascade 4267, the tunnel has been played with a bit and is missing the telegraph poles on top. There are several cracks like someone stepped on top of the tunnel, has anyone ever repaired paper mache or should I keep it original?

 

 

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Monday, May 18, 2020 12:45 PM

Wide Gauge

Lone Scout   Set #1494    1929 - 1930

Here is the entire set.

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Northwoods Flyer

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Thursday, May 21, 2020 4:25 PM

Wide Gauge

Tender #4671

I recently purchased a number of pieces of Wide Gauge American Flyer equipment from a hobby store that was closing. There were a number of pieces that I didn't have and I purchased what I thought were some common pieces to fill the holes in my colection.  I didn't have a great deal of time to examine all of the pieces and I packed them up and put them into storage.  I have finally had some time to examine what I bought.

At first glance this looks like a common #4671

 

Those of you who are more alert than I was at the time I bought it know that the tender usually has an "American Flyer Lines" brass plate or decal on the sides. Mine has an "Ambassador" brass plate on each side. (Think 11" red Narrow Gauge passenger cars). I went scrambling to my Greenberg Guide to find out if it is legitimate. Greenberg does not list it as a variation.  

I went back to the tender and did a closer examination.

The top of the tender matches the photo in the Guide.

The bottom of the tender shows it to have the 4671 stamp.

And something else...

It is difficult to read but this is the "Sold as Shopworn" stamp that usually appears on items that were sold from the store in the factory.  Its hard to know the whole story but for some reason Flyer was using up some old brass plates on a tender sent back for repair, or sold through the factory store.   

Does anyone else have an "Ambassador" Wide Gauge tender?

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Posted by Nationwidelines on Friday, May 22, 2020 8:59 AM

I have seen a wide gauge tender with Ambassador plates before.  I suspect they were there from the factory, as opposed to being installed during a repair.

NWL

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Saturday, May 23, 2020 4:57 PM

Wide Gauge

Here is the Brass Piper that came along with the "Ambassador" tender above.

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Posted by Penny Trains on Saturday, May 23, 2020 7:19 PM

What a drop-dead gorgeous machine!  Big Smile

Trains, trains, wonderful trains.  The more you get, the more you toot!  Big Smile

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Posted by Nationwidelines on Saturday, May 23, 2020 9:34 PM

Northwoods Flyer

Wide Gauge

Tender #4671

It uses the Ives casting that American Flyer got in the bankruptcy sale.

 

Northwoods Flyer

 

 

That is not the "Ives Casting" tender

The Ives Casting tender looks completely different, see below.

 

NWL

 

 

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Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Sunday, May 24, 2020 7:55 AM

Thanks NWL.

I should have checked my photo archive.

Correction made.  I deleted the statement in my original post.

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Posted by JonEddy on Tuesday, May 26, 2020 10:47 AM

Hey Northwoods do you have any catalog pages for the 1680 Hudson with the set options? I posted some pics above of the Hudson I picked up. Can you tell me what the tender has wired up? It looks like a nother set of brushed underneath. Was this a whistling tender or something else? 

   Thanks for any info.

           Jon

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Posted by Nationwidelines on Tuesday, May 26, 2020 6:04 PM

JonEddy,

That is the 1936 only whistling tender for the Hudson.  It requires special 4 rail track to make the whistle work.

Lionel sued for patent infringement, so the whistling tender/coaches appeared only in 1936.  In 1937 Flyer brought out the whistling billboard.

NWL

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Posted by JonEddy on Tuesday, May 26, 2020 6:47 PM

Really, I remember reading about the whistle in the thread a while back. I thought that was only on the 9900 Zephyr's. Can this tender run on the three rail system without hurting anything? Anyone know how to test the whistle to make sure it works?

Nationwidelines

JonEddy,

That is the 1936 only whistling tender for the Hudson.  It requires special 4 rail track to make the whistle work.

Lionel sued for patent infringement, so the whistling tender/coaches appeared only in 1936.  In 1937 Flyer brought out the whistling billboard.

NWL

 

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Posted by Nationwidelines on Wednesday, May 27, 2020 5:26 PM

To test the whistle, just use power wires from your transformer and connect one to the split fork power pickup on the tender and the other to one of the wheels on the tender.

It should run fine on 3 rail track, but not sure about going through switches.

 

NWL

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