A Classic REAL Trains 'n Traction FOTO site!

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Nice spate of domes from Lars!

I think we're going to have to add "Yogi" to the monikers carried by Al [swg]

Now, here's a finale for the Corn Belt . . . .

CGW EMD F3 #115D freight (foto credit: unknown)


Later! [tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[LoveDomes]

Yo Al

Are you saying that you CAN log on over here and post stuff but cannot do that over at the bar [?] Absolutely confused [%-)][%-)][%-)] - but then again, you guys from the left coast do have a different view of the world! [alien] <grin>

So, still with the Corn Belt I see. That just about leaves me outta the picture - so I'm going to resort to what I'm all about . . . . .

GN #1320 (from: www.trainweb.org)


GN #1321 (from: www.trainweb.org)


GN #1322 (from: www.trainweb.org)


GN #1323 (from: www.trainweb.com)


Wabash #200 (1956) (from: www.trainweb.org)


Amtrak #9560, former Wabash #200 (from: www.trainweb.org)


Amtrak #9561 former Wabash #201 (from: www.trainweb.org)


N&W #1611, former Wabash #201 (from: www.trainweb.org)



Until the next time, which probably will be Thursday!

Lars

[passengerfan]

The company just got hi-speed internet service instead of dial up so will be over on the other thread when at work instead of just at home. Just getting back to work and have a lot of catching up to do but will be back at the other thread in a day or two.Only problem with the office is that I don't have ready access to my railroad material. By Monday things should be looking more like normal again.

TTFN Al

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Nice to see ya Al 'n Lars!! [yeah] Al why so scarce at the bar these days [?]

A little something on the CGW . . . .

QUOTE: The Chicago Great Western Railway (AAR reporting mark CGW) was a Class I railroad that linked Chicago, Minneapolis, Omaha, and Kansas City. It was founded by Alpheus Beede Stickney in 1885 as a regional line between St. Paul and the Iowa state line called the Minnesota & Northwestern Railroad. Through mergers and new construction, the railroad, named Chicago Great Western after 1909, quickly became a multi-state carrier. One of the last Class I railroads to be built, it competed against several other more well-established railroads in the same territory, and developed a corporate culture of innovation and efficiency to survive.

Nicknamed the Corn Belt Route because of its operating area in the midwestern United States, the railroad was sometimes called the Lucky Strike Road, due to the similarity in design between the herald of the CGW and the logo used for Lucky Strike cigarettes.

It was merged with the Chicago and North Western Railway (CNW) in 1968, which abandoned most of the CGW's trackage.from Wikipedia.com

Later! [tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[LoveDomes]

Hiya Cap'n Tom

<argggggggggggggh> matey! Another most difficult RR to find anything on that isn't as protected as the gold in Ft. Knox! [swg] Looks like even 20 Fingers only came up with a "shorty!" (Speaking of which - how come we're not seeing much of you at the bar [?])

Caught your comments Art and hope you'll be around next week as I'll be away until mid week . . . [tup]

I haven't a thing to offer this Saturday - but thought I'd swing by B4 going over to the bar with my ENCORE contribution!


Until the next time!


Lars

[siberianmo]

G'day!

A little light reading for anyone out there interested . . . .

Chicago Great Western - Corn Belt Route (CGW)


Later! [tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[passengerfan]

CHICAGO
GREAT
WESTERN
Streamlined Head End Cars
by Al

The Chicago Great Western purchased but three lightweight streamlined cars and these three delivered in November 1946 were Baggage Cars 80 – 82. They were assigned to General Service operating in the MILL CITY LIMITED and other CGW trains until passenger service ended. In March 1965 the three Baggage Cars were sold to the Great Northern Railway and renumbered 277 – 279. They were often seen running in the westbound EMPIRE BUILDER between St. Paul and Spokane.

BAGGAGE CARS Pullman Standard November 1946 (Built for and assigned to General Service)

80 – 82

TTFN Al

[siberianmo]

ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE!

PASSENGER RR FALLEN FLAG #37

Here’s another Passenger RR Fallen Flag from Classic American Railroads:

Chicago Great Western Railway (CGW)



Headquarters: Chicago (moved to Kansas City)

Mileage in 1950: 1,458

Locomotives in 1963:

Diesel: 141

Rolling stock in 1963:

Freight cars; 4,490
Passenger cars: 33

Principal routes in 1950:

Chicago-Olewein, IA-Omaha, NE
Oelwein-Minneapolis
Oelwein-DesMoines, IA-St. Joseph, MO-Kansas City, MO
Clarion, IA-Mason City, IA-Austin, MN-Hayfield, MN
Osage, IA-Rochester, MN-Red Wing, MN
Red Wing-Mankato, MN
Simpson-Winona, MN

Passenger trains of note:

Blue Bird (Twin Cities-Rochester)
Great Western Limited (Chicago-Twin Cities)
Rochester Special (Twin Cities-Rochester)
Red Bird (Twin Cities-Rochester)
Legionnaire (Chicago-Twin Cities)
Minnesotan (Chicago-Twin Cities)
Mills Cities Limited (Kansas City-Twin Cities)
Nebraska Limited (Twin Cities-Omaha
Twin Cities Limited (Omaha-Twin Cities)


Enjoy! [tup]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]


ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE!

[passengerfan]

SOUTHERN
Streamlined Sleeping Cars
by Al

The Southern put together some of the finest streamlined trains to operate in the Southeastern United States. There first streamlined train was an all coach streamliner running between New York and New Orleans by way of Birmingham named the SOUTHERNER beginning March 31, 1941. This was followed by another mostly streamlined train the TENNESSEAN began service May 18, 1941 between Washington, D. C. and Memphis, Tennessee. The TENNESSEAN operated with heavyweight sleeping cars bringing up the markers of the otherwise all streamlined consist. Streamlining of the Premier All Pullman CRESCENT LIMITED would take place following WW II.
The Southern would streamline most of their trains following the war.
A lightweight streamlined NEW ROYAL PALM would operate between Cincinnati and Miami with cars originating in Detroit, Chicago, Cleveland and Buffalo. But for some reason this train would never gain the popularity of the other Southern trains.
The Southerner would receive new cars following WW II, as would the TENNESSEAN. In fact following WW II the TENNESSEAN would become a fully streamlined train when the Southern received 14 Roomette 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars in October - November 1949 from Pullman Standard. These eleven cars were assigned to the TENESSEAN with two to each consist. One car was a New York - Memphis car, another a Washington - Memphis car. The extra 14-4 cars were assigned to the NEW ROYAL PALM between Buffalo and Miami. The 14-4 cars were assigned 2200 series numbers and given VALLEY suffix names.

14 ROOMETTE 4 DOUBLE BEDROOM SLEEPING CARS Pullman Standard October - November 1949 Plan: 4153C Lot: 6814 (Built for and assigned to TENNESSEAN)

2200 CASHIER'S VALLEY

2201 HIWASSEE VALLEY

2202 JAMES RIVER VALLEY

2203 MISSISSIPPI VALLEY

2204 PAINT ROCK VALLEY

2205 PIEDMONT VALLEY

2206 ROANOKE VALLEY

2207 SHENANDOAH VALLEY

2208 SPRING VALLEY

2209 TENNESSEE VALLEY

2210 WAUHATCHIE VALLEY


The Southern equipped the new streamlined CRESCENT with three types of lightweight sleeping cars 10 Roomette 6 Double Bedroom cars were predominate in the consists with a single 1 Master Room 2 Drawing Room Buffet 21 seat Lounge car assigned to each train set. The third type lightweight streamlined sleeping car assigned to the CRESCENT was a 5 Double Bedroom Buffet 8 seat Cocktail Lounge 14 Seat Lounge Observation with high windows and raised observation lounge. The postwar Southern CRESCENT would operate as an all-Pullman train between New York and Atlanta and between Atlanta and New Orleans coaches were operated as well. The CRESCENT required four sets of equipment for daily operation. The CRESCENT was the only train in the south operating with a Master Room. It joined one other prestigious postwar train the BROADWAY LIMITED as being only one of two trains left in the United States by 1950 still operating with a Master Room. Sleeping cars operated in the CRESCENT were owned by not only the Southern but by other roads such as the L&N, PRR, WofA and A&WP and are identified as to ownership.

10 ROOMETTE 6 DOUBLE BEDROOM SLEEPING CARS Pullman Standard September - October 1949 Plan: 4140 Lot: 6814 (Built for and assigned to CRESCENT)

SOUTHERN

2002 DAN RIVER

2003 CATAWBA RIVER

2004 ENOREE RIVER

2007 OTTER RIVER

2008 PACOLET RIVER

2009 POTOMAC RIVER

2010 RAPIDAN RIVER

2011 RIVANNA RIVER

2012 SALUDA RIVER

2013 SENECA RIVER

2014 SHENANDOAH RIVER

2017 TIGER RIVER

2019 TUGALO RIVER

2020 TYE RIVER

2021 YADKIN RIVER

2022 YORK RIVER

PRR

8351 BIRCH RIVER

8352 BUSH RIVER

8353 DELAWARE RIVER

8354 MIDDLE RIVER

8355 PATAPSCO RIVER

8356 RARITAN RIVER

8357 SCHUYLKILL RIVER

8358 SUSQUEHANNA RIVER

A&WP

CHATTAHOOCHEE RIVER

L&N

3400 MOBILE RIVER

3401 PEARL RIVER

W of A

ALABAMA RIVER

1 MASTER ROOM 2 DRAWING ROOM BUFFET 21 SEAT LOUNGE CARS Pullman Standard December 1949 Plan: 4160 Lot: 6814 (Built for and assigned to CRESCENT)

2350 CRESCENT CITY

2351 CRESCENT HARBOR

2352 CRESCENT MOON

2353 CRESCENT SHORES

5 DOUBLE BEDROOM BUFFET 8 SEAT COCKTAIL LOUNGE 14 SEAT RAISED LOUNGE OBSERVATIONS Pullman Standard February - March 1950 Plan: 4162 Lot: 6814 (Built for and assigned to CRESCENT)

SOUTHERN

2300 ROYAL ARCH

L&N

3300 ROYAL CANAL

3301 ROYAL STREET

W of A

ROYAL PALACE

The remaining 10-6 sleeping cars delivered to the Southern, CNOT&P and FEC were for the NEW ROYAL PALM. The other sleeping cars for the NEW ROYAL PALM were four 5 Double Bedroom Buffet 8 Seat Cocktail Lounge 14 Seat Lounge Observations. These were owned one each by the Southern, CNOT&P, NYC and FEC. The other sleeping cars assigned to the seasonal NEW ROYAL PALM were prewar 13 Double Bedroom COUNTY series sleeping cars belonging to the NYC and IMPERIAL series 4 Compartment 4 Double Bedroom 2 Drawing Room Sleeping cars also NYC. The 10-6 sleeping cars assigned to the NEW ROYAL PALM follow:

10 ROOMETTE 6 DOUBLE BEDROOM SLEEPING CARS Pullman Standard September - October 1949 Plan: 4140 Lot: 6814 (Built for and assigned to NEW ROYAL PALM)

Southern

2000 ALAPAHA RIVER

2001 ALTAMAHA RIVER

2005 FLINT RIVER

2006 OCMULGEE RIVER

2015 RAPPAHANNOCK RIVER

2016 ST. JOHNS RIVER

2018 TOMBIGBEE RIVER

2023 WARRIOR RIVER

CNOT&P

3400 EMORY RIVER

3401 FRENCH BROAD RIVER

3402 COOSA RIVER

3403 HOLSTON RIVER

3404 ETOWAH RIVER

FEC

ARGENTINA

BRAZIL

CHILE

GUATEMALA

VENEZUELA

The four Sleeper Lounge Observations built for the NEW ROYAL PALM were as follows:

5 DOUBLE BEDROOM BUFFET 8 SEAT COCKTAIL LOUNGE 14 SEAT RAISED LOUNGE OBSERVATIONS Pullman Standard February - March 1950 Plan: 4162 Lot: 6814 (Built for and assigned to NEW ROYAL PALM)

Southern

2301 ROYAL COURT

CNOT&P

3499 ROYAL PALM

NYC

ROYAL CREST

FEC

AZALEA

In November 1950 the Southern renamed 2300 ROYAL ARCH to 2300 LUTHER CALVIN NORRIS.
In September 1958 Pullman rebuilt 2300 LUTHER CALVIN NORRIS and 2301 ROYAL COURT into straight eleven Double Bedroom Sleeping cars for assignment to the CRESCENT between New York and Atlanta. Pullman rebuilt A third car belonging to Southern subsidiary CNOT&P 3499 ROYAL PALM in October 1958 to an eleven double bedroom sleeping car. This car was then assigned to run with the other two in CRESCENT service.
Although other Southern trains were assigned 10-6 Sleeping cars few of these trains became fully streamlined. One of the exceptions was the streamlined all coach SOUTHERNER that was assigned a 10-6 operating between New York and Birmingham in both directions.
Another 10-6 operated in the heavyweight BIRMINGHAM SPECIAL between New York and Birmingham.
The PEACH QUEEN carried one 10-6 between New York and Winston/Salem another between New York and Raleigh/Durham.
The AIKEN-AUGUSTA SPECIAL and ASHEVILLE SPECIAL forwarded a 10-6 Sleeping car between New York and Asheville.

TTFN AL

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Nice to see Lars 'n Art aboard today! [tup]

Not that much out there regarding the Rock Island (CRIP) so anything in the form of Pix is a real treat! [tup]

Now to the "theme" at hand - liked that Pix from you Lars! [tup] Don't believe I've see that one before . . .

Southern on the move, Harrisonburg, VA (1947)


Later! [tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[artpeterson]

Hi Lars -

Good eye - that shot of the La Mirada on the cover of "VR" was also taken by Barney Stone at the same time. Wild to see things like the C&O 500 and 501 along with brand-new UP F7 sets and the ACF-Talgo "Train X" consist in his slides of the fair.

Art

[LoveDomes]

G'day Cap'n Tom

Love the Southern - great railroad! [tup] [tup] [tup]

Saw that beauty in the Smithsonian a few times. The consist that went with it was an awesome display of fine looking passenger cars! [yeah]

Here's one to enjoy! [tup]

Southern EMD E8 #6908 (photo: Martin O'Toole)




Hey Art! - I know all about being a day late and a dollar short 'round these threads! [swg] I'm sure Tom is only interested in meaningful participation, both here and at his bar! Good work, as usual. [tup]

Found this from a magzine cover . . . .

Rock Island's La Mirda observation as the tail car of the Golden Rocket



Until the next time!

Lars

[artpeterson]

Hi all -

Well, reading the forum from work means I'm almost never in synch with your themes of the day! So, pardon me for deviating, but I thought you'd enjoy this shot of RI "La Mirada" at the RR Fair on July 30, 1948. The original was taken by Barney Stone.

Have a great weekend!

Art

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Of course, a discussion about the Southern wouldn't be complete without:


Southern #1401 at the Smithsonian



Enjoy! [tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Now we KNOW there's a ton of info available on the Southern - much of it on these Pages!

So, here's an installment that was first Posted over at the bar . . . .

Now arriving on track #1 …..
Railroads from Yesteryear! Number Ten

Southern Railway (SOU)



Used with permission from: Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Formatting differences made necessary due to Forums requirements. Some heralds from other sources.

Locale: U.S. Southern states

Reporting marks: SOU

Dates of operation: 1894 – 1982

Track gauge: 4 ft 8½ in (1435 mm) (standard gauge)

Headquarters: Washington, D.C.

The Southern Railway (AAR reporting mark SOU) was the product of nearly 150 predecessor lines that were combined, reorganized and recombined beginning in the 1830s, formally becoming the Southern Railway in 1894. It was combined with the Norfolk and Western Railway to form the Norfolk Southern Railway in 1982.

History


1921 map

The nine-mile South Carolina Canal and Rail Road, Southern's earliest predecessor line and one of the first railroads in the United States, was chartered in December 1827 and ran the nation's first regularly scheduled steam powered passenger train – the wood-burning Best Friend of Charleston – out of Charleston, South Carolina, on December 25, 1830. (The Baltimore and Ohio Railroad ran regular passenger service earlier that year.) By 1833, its 136-mile line to Hamburg, SC, was the longest in the world.

As railroad fever struck other Southern states, networks gradually spread across the South and even across the Allegheny Mountains. Charleston, South Carolina and Memphis, TN, were linked by 1857, although rail expansion halted with the start of the Civil War. The York River Railroad, which operated from the Pamunkey River at West Point, Virginia to Richmond, Virginia, was a major focus of George McClellan's 1862 Peninsular Campaign, which culminated in the Seven Days Battles and devastated the tiny rail link. The Richmond and Danville Railroad was the Confederacy's last link to Richmond, and transported Jefferson Davis and his cabinet to Danville, Virginia just before the fall of Richmond in April 1865.

Known as the "first railroad war," the Civil War left the South's railroads and economy devastated. Most of the railroads, however, were repaired, reorganized and operated again. In the area along the Ohio River and Mississippi River, construction of new railroads continued throughout Reconstruction.

Southern Railway, as it came into existence in 1894, was a combination of the Richmond and Danville system and the East Tennessee, Virginia and Georgia Railroad. The company owned two-thirds of the 4,400 miles of line it operated, and the rest was held through leases, operating agreements and stock ownership. Southern also controlled the Alabama Great Southern and the Georgia Southern and Florida, which operated separately, and it had an interest in the Central of Georgia.

Southern's first president, Samuel Spencer, drew more lines into Southern's core system. During his 12-year term, the railway built new shops at Knoxville, TN, and Atlanta, GA and purchased more equipment. He moved the company's service away from an agricultural dependence on tobacco and cotton and centered its efforts on diversifying traffic and industrial development. Sadly, Spencer was killed in train wreck in 1906.

By the time the line from Meridian, Mississippi, to New Orleans, LA was acquired in 1916 under Southern's president Fairfax Harrison, the railroad had attained the 8,000-mile, 13-state system that marked its territorial limits for almost half a century.

The Central of Georgia became part of the system in 1963, and the former Norfolk Southern Railway was acquired in 1974.

Notable features


1895 map

Southern and its predecessors were responsible for many firsts in the industry. Its predecessor, the South Carolina Canal and Rail Road, was the first to carry passengers, U.S. troops and mail on steam-powered trains, and it was the first to operate at night. In 1953, Southern Railway became the first major railroad in the United States to convert totally to diesel-powered locomotives, ending its rich history in the golden age of steam.

Every diesel locomotive Southern owned had to be ordered with a high hood and pointed long hood forward, this was meant for crew safety in case of accidents with vehicles and from the first GP7 to the last GP50, they came with this option until the tradition stopped with the SD50.

From dieselization and shop and yard modernization, to computers and the development of special cars and the unit coal train, Southern often was on the cutting edge of change, earning the company its catch phrase, "The Railway System that Gives a Green Light to Innovations".

Merger into Norfolk Southern

In response to the creation of CSX in 1980, the Southern Railway merged with Norfolk and Western Railway to form the Norfolk Southern Railway, further consolidating railroads in the eastern half of the United States.

Roads owned by the Southern Railway

• Alabama Great Southern Railroad (AGS)
• Central of Georgia Railway (CofG)
• Cincinnati New Orleans and Texas Pacific Railway (CNO&TP)
• Georgia and Florida Railway (G&F)
• Georgia Northern Railway (GANO) — acquired in 1967
• Georgia Southern and Florida Railway (GS&F)
• Knoxville and Charleston Railroad
• Tennessee, Alabama and Georgia Railway (TA&G)

Major Railroad Yards on the Southern Railway

• Chattanooga, Tennessee – DeButts Yard (formerly Citico Yard)
• Atlanta, Georgia – Inman Yard
• Linwood, North Carolina – Spencer Yard
• Birmingham, Alabama – Norris Yard
• Knoxville, Tennessee – Sevier Yard
• Macon, Georgia – Brosnan Yard
• Sheffield, Alabama – Sheffield Yard

Company officers

Presidents of the Southern Railway:

• Samuel Spencer (1894–1906)
• William Finley (1906–1913)
• Fairfax Harrison (1913–1937)
• Earnest E. Norris (1937–1951)
• Harry A. DeButts (1951–1962)
• D. William Brosnan (1962–1967)
• W. Graham Claytor Jr. (1967–1977)
• L. Stanley Crane (1977–1980)
• Harold H. Hall (1980–1982)

References

• Norfolk Southern Railway. Retrieved February 22, 2005.


Used with permission from: Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Formatting differences made necessary due to Forums requirements. Some heralds from other sources.

***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** ***** *****

Enjoy!

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]

[siberianmo]

ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE!

PASSENGER RR FALLEN FLAG #36

Here’s another Passenger RR Fallen Flag from Classic American Railroads:

Southern (SOU)



Headquarters: Washington, DC

Mileage in 1950: 6,300

Locomotives in 1963:

Diesel: 644

Rolling stock in 1963:

Freight cars: 40,038
Passenger cars: 587

Principal (not all) routes in 1950:

Washington, DC-Charlotte, NC-Atlanta, GA-Birmingham, AL-New Orleans, LA
Cincinnati, OH-Chattanooga, TN-Birmingham
Danville, KY-St. Louis, MO
Chattanooga-Memphis, TN
Chattanooga-Morristown-Knoxville-Bristol, TN
Chattanooga-Atlanta-Valdosta, FL-Jacksonville, FL
Valdosta-Palatka, FL
Salisbury-Asheville, NC-Morristown, TN
Asheville-Spartanburg-Charleston, SC
Charlotte-Jacksonville
Danville-West Point, VA
Greensboro, NC-Norfolk, VA
Rome, GA-Mobile, AL

Passenger trains of note (not all) :

Aiken-Augusta Special (Washington-Salisbury-Augusta)
Asheville Special (Washington-Greensboro-Asheville)
Birmingham Special (Washington-Lynchburg-Bristol-Knoxvillle-Chattanooga-Birmingham
Carolina Special (Cincinnati-Knoxville-Asheville-Greensboro & Charleston)
Crescent (New York-Washington-Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans))
Florida Sunbeam (Cincinnati-Atlanta-Florida points)
Kansas City-Florida Special (Kansas City-Birmingham-Atlanta-Brunswick & Florida points)
Peach Queen (Washington-Atlanta)
Pelican (New York-Lynchburg-Bristol-Knoxville-Chattanooga-Birmingham-New Orleans)
Piedmont Limited (Washington-Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans)
Ponce de Leon (Cincinnati-Atlanta-Jacksonville)
Queen & Crescent (Cincinnati-Chattanooga-Birmingham-New Orleans)
Royal Palm (Cincinnati-Chattanooga-Jacksonville)
Skyland Special (Asheville-Jacksonville)
Southerner (Washington-Atlanta-Birmingham-New Orleans)
Sunnyland (Memphis-Birmingham-Atlanta)
Tennessean (Washington-Lynchburg-Bristol-Knoxville-Chattanooga-Memphis)
Washington-Atlanta-New Orleans Express (Washington-Atlanta-Montgomery-New Orleans)

Of note:
PRR handled SR trains east of Washington.
N&W handled SR trains via Bristol between Lynchburg and Bristol.
A&WP handled SR trains to and from New Orleans via Montgomery.
WRofA and L&N handled SR trains to and from New Orleans via Montgomery west of Atlanta.
Frisco handled SR trains between Memphis and Birmingham, west of Birmingham (The Kansas City-Florida Special).
Frisco handled SR trains handled the Sunnyland Memphis-Birmingham route.
SAL handled SR train The Florida Sunbeam south of Jacksonville.


Enjoy! [tup]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]

ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE!

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Lars - chill, man - chill! [swg] No sweat about not having anything to provide regarding some of these rather obscure RRs from the past. They surely weren't back then - but material IS difficult to come by these days. Not worth the worry - just being Posted for the interest.

Now, domes is where it's at! I just don't care for excursion and tourist trains per se. I'm a "real railroad passenger fan" so to speak. Now having said that, I'm also a "veteran" of many, many VIA Rail Canada trips where the overwhelming number of passengers were in fact - tourists. Same for our recently concluded Alaskan rail adventure - virtually all tourist. However - and this is a big however - we were in the "real" cars - not those being towed along and owned by cruise ship operators. No thanx.

I like these new double deck domes - whether they are called Ultra Domes or something else. Having traveled them I can say they surpass any rail experience I've ever had -and that says A LOT for me! I'd love to see VIA Rail use them on their cross Canada trains and get into a serious replacement program for their aging fleet whereby the single and double level domes become the "norm."

Now Amtrak is a totally different matter. I dare say we'll NEVER see these cars on Amtrak nor will we see replacements for the Superliner equipment. Stuff is simply breaking down, with the fleet dwindling so rapidly that talk of laying up a long distance train or two isn't really conjecture - at least that's what I'm hearing and reading - and NOT from Forum sources.

America's passenger rail system just plain ISN'T - but it could be. Using modern equipment is only one step in the right direction. We need a commitment from the Congress to put into place a RELIABLE, SAFE and MODERN system - one that moves people efficiently from place to place, free from the entanglements of bureaucratic BS and political gobbledygook. WIll it happen [?] Nope - not in two lifetimes, is my guess - and I'm 68.

Okay, that's it - and all begun because you Posted those Domes! [swg]

Later! [tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[LoveDomes]

Hiya Cap'n Tom

I'm not even going to try to dig up anything on the Erie - good grief! These are getting more difficult as the numbers rise! [swg]

So, here's my contribution for the day - DOMES - as the name implies, I love 'em . . .

Colorado Railcar Ultra Dome - Rocky Mountaineer



Colorado Railcar Ultra Dome - Holland America cruise lines



Alaska Railroad double deck dome by Colorado Railcar


Until the next time!


Lars

[passengerfan]

ERIE
Streamlined Sleeping Cars
by Al

The Erie owned a total of thirteen lightweight streamlined sleeping cars all built by Pullman Standard. There were three different types of sleeping cars purchased by the Erie. First to arrive on the Erie were four AMERICAN series 6 Section 6 Roomette 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars from Pullman Standard. These were part of a large order for these cars that went to Union Pacific, Chicago & North Western, Southern Pacific, Santa Fe, Rock Island, Missouri Pacific and Illinois Central. The four cars received in June 1942 were assigned to the ERIE LIMITED between New York and Chicago.

6 SECTION 6 ROOMETTE 4 DOUBLE BEDROOM SLEEPING CARS Pullman Standard June 1942 Plan: 4099 Lot: 6669 (Built for and assigned to ERIE LIMITED & LAKE CITIES)

AMERICAN LIBERTY

AMERICAN LIFE

AMERICAN UNITY

AMERICAN WAY

It would be 1949 before additional lightweight streamlined sleeping cars would join the Erie. In May-June 1949 Pullman Standard delivered seven 10-6 sleeping cars named for persons who had influenced the Erie. These cars were assigned to the ERIE LIMITED, LAKE CITIES and ATLANTIC EXPRESS.

10 ROOMETTE 6 DOUBLE BEDROOM SLEEPING CARS Pullman Standard May - June 1949 Plan: 4129A Lot: 6797 (Built for and assigned to ERIE LIMITED, LAKE CITIES and ATLANTIC EXPRESS)

BENJAMIN LODER

CHARLES MINOT

DANIEL CRAIG McCALLUM

ELEAZAR LORD

JAMES GORE KING

MARVIN KENT

WILLIAM REYNOLDS

After the delivery of the 10-6 sleeping cars the sleeping car assignments on the Erie were as follows.

ERIE LIMITED #1

New York - Chicago
10-6

Salamanca - Chicago
6-6-4

Akron - Chicago
10-6

ERIE LIMITED #2

Chicago - New York
10-6

Chicago - Salamanca
6-6-4

LAKE CITIES #5

New York - Chicago
10-6

New York - Cleveland 6-6-4

LAKE CITIES # 6

Chicago - New York
10-6

Cleveland - New York
6-6-4

ATLANTIC EXPRESS #8

Chicago - Akron
10-6

The Erie purchased two 10-5 Sleeping cars from Pullman Standard that were delivered in June 1954 that were nearly identical to the 10-5 sleeping cars purchased by the Canadian National about the same time. The two Erie 10-5 Sleeping cars were assigned to service between Chicago and Youngstown overnight in each direction. The eastbound car traveled in the ATLANTIC EXPRESS and the westbound car traveled in the ERIE LIMITED.

10 ROOMETTE 6 DOUBLE BEDROOM SLEEPING CARS Pullman Standard June 1954 Plan: 4186B Lot: 6946 (Built for and assigned to Chicago - Youngstown service in ERIE LIMITED and ATLANTIC EXPRESS)

PRIDE OF YOUNGSTOWN

SPIRIT OF YOUNGSTOWN

The Erie merged with the Delaware Lackawanna and Western in October 1960 creating the Erie - Lackawanna.

TTFN Al

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Hmmmm, no responses! Well, here's something to enjoy . . . .

Erie GP-7 #1210 (foto credit: unknown)


Later!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[siberianmo]

ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE!

PASSENGER RR FALLEN FLAG #35

Here’s another Passenger RR Fallen Flag from Classic American Railroads:

Erie Railroad



Headquarters: Cleveland, OH

Mileage in 1950: 2,341

Locomotives in 1960:

Diesel: 695

Rolling stock in 1960:

Freight cars: 20,372
Passenger cars: 519

Principal routes in 1950:

Jersey City-Paterson, NJ-Middletown-Hornell, NY-Youngstown, OH-Chicago (Hammond-Chicago via rights on the Chicago & Western Indiana)
Marion-Dayton-Cincinnati, OH (Dayton-Cincinnati via rights on the B&0)
Hamilton, OH-Indianapolis, IN (rights on the B&O)
Leavittsburg-Cleveland, OH
Pymatuning, PA-Leavittsburg, OH
Hornell-Buffalo-Niagara Falls, NY
Salamanca-Dunkirk, NY
Corning (Painted Post)-Attica, NY
Avon-Rochester, NY
River Junction-Cuba Junction, NY
Carrolton, NY-Eleanora Jct., NY (Brockway-Eleanora Jct. via B&O rights)
Corning, NY-Newberry, Jct., PA
Lanesboro-Wilkes Barre & Scranton, PA
Lackawaxen-Avoca, PA
Newburgh Jct.-Campbell Hall-Graham, NY
Maybrook-Pine Island, NY
Croxton (Jersey City)-Nyack, NY
Piermont-Suffern, NY
NY&NJ Jct.,-Ridgewood Jct.
Paterson (Newark Jct.)-Newark, NJ
Croxton-Midvale, NJ

Passenger trains of note:

Erie Limited (Jersey City-Chicago & Buffalo)
Lake Cities (Jersey City-Cleveland & Buffalo; later extended to Chicago)
Pacific Express (Jersey City-Chicago)
Atlantic Express (Chicago-Jersey City)
Midlander (Jersey City-Chicago)
Southern Tier Express (Buffalo-Hornell-Jersey City)
Mountain Express (Jersey City-Hornell)
Tuxedo (Jersey City-Port Jervis)


Enjoy! [tup]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]

ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE! ENCORE!

[passengerfan]

Good Afternoon Gents. T
Art the C&O route you were inquiring about was Ashland to Elkhorn City a distance of 134 miles between November 1960 and July 1963.. Train numberrs were 36 and 49.

WABASH
Streamlined sleeping Cars
By Al

The Wabash owned a total of twelve lightweight streamlined sleeping cars. Ten were 12 Roomette 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars with four painted UP streamliner colors, they were assigned to the CITY OF ST. LOUIS between St. Louis and Los Angeles and carried WESTERN prefix names. These WESTERN prefix cars were delivered in February 1950 by American Car & Foundry along with six BLUE prefix names cars of the same type painted in Blue and White for service in Wabash overnight trains between Chicago and St. Louis and St. Louis and Detroit trains. Two BLUE prefix cars were assigned one per consist to the overnight Detroit - St. Louis trains and two per consist were assigned to the overnight Chicago - St. Louis trains.

12 ROOMETTE 4 DOUBLE BEDROOM SLEEPING CARS American Car & Foundry February 1950 Plan: 9004 Lot: 3074 (Built for and assigned to Wabash overnight trains and CITY OF ST. LOUIS)
Waba***rains

BLUE BOY

BLUE CLOUD

BLUE GAZELLE

BLUE HORIZON

BLUE KNIGHT

BLUE SKIES

CITY OF ST. LOUIS

WESTERN LAKE

WESTERN SCENE

WESTERN SUNSET

WESTERN VIEW

In August 1951 ownership of Wabash WESTERN SCENE was transferred to the Union Pacific.
Three 6 Section 6 Roomette 4 Double Bedroom Sleeping cars were delivered to the Wabash between November 1955 and February 1956 for assignment to the CITY OF ST. LOUIS pool of cars. These cars were assigned NATIONAL prefix names and the Bedrooms were located mid-car between the trucks, Sections were located at one end and Roomettes at the other end.

6 SECTION 6 ROOMETTE 4 DOUBLE BEDROOM SLEEPING CARS Pullman Standard November 1955 - February 1956 Plan: 4197 Lot: 6957 (Built for and assigned to CITY OF ST. LOUIS)

NATIONAL COLORS

NATIONAL HOMES

NATIONAL UNITY

TTFN Al

[siberianmo]

Hi Art

Here's a different version of those C&O RDC-4s . . . .

C&O RDC-4s #9080-9081 (courtesy: www.trainweb.org - foto credit: S.J. Cook)



Enjoy! [tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[artpeterson]

Hi Tom -

Glad you liked the RDC shot. Willis had a good eye for a nice shot, and I'm glad that his path and that of the C&O train crossed! I note an error in what I typed about the "Pere Marquette" shot. The year should be 1971, not 1969. Sorry!

Art

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Good to see ya, Lars and thanx for the "theme" Pix!! [tup]

Nice stuff from Art and no doubt the RDC Pix "did it" for me! [yeah] Many thanx! [tup]

Now to the "issue" at hand .... RDCs hauling cars. The answer may be found on page 62 of "RDC The Budd Rail Diesel Car," by Donald Duke and Edmond Keilty.

They say, "About the only task an RDC could not do was haul a non-powered trailer car. During a trial test, the Chicago & Eastern Illinois tried just such an experiment. The result; the fluid in the Allison torgque converters immediately heated up to the danger point. The car's design was such that it could pull nothing other than itself. It was an unrealistic request to ask that much from a vehicle that heats and cools itself, stops like a motor bus, and costs about the price of a lounge car. Despite this fact, there were still several roads that did pull trailers, at least for a period of time. Among these lines were the Minneapolis & St. Louis, the Rock Island, the Chesapeake & Ohio, the Southern Pacific, and the Long Island."

Long live the RDC! [tup] [tup] [tup]

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

[artpeterson]

Hi Lars -

True enough about RDCs and hauling any cars. In fact in Ed Kielty's book on the RDCs there was a black & white of this same C&O operation, with the caption noting that the Budd warranty had been voided, or words to that effect.

Art

[LoveDomes]

Hiya Cap'n Tom

I see Art has returned with some great pix! I know you'll love the RDCs on page 62! They weren't designed to pull, were they [?] I recall reading several points of view on that and then YOUR clarification taken from a reliable source - the manufacturer. Interersting shot for sure! [tup]

Here's my meager contribution to the "theme" over here - the Wabash . . . .


Wabash #200 (1956) (from: www.trainweb.org)



Until the next time!


Lars

[artpeterson]

Last C&O image deviates from the "classic" theme and is definitely not a passenger train, but I hope you enjoy it anyways.

Three nearly-new (built the previous month) GP15Ts head a freight on the ex-RI line at Tinley Park on November 6, 1982. Trailing the locos are dead L&N locos/slugs headed for Silvis.

Art

[artpeterson]

A touch more C&O coverage. E8 1469 on the "Pere Marquette" (Chgo-Grand Rapids) under the Northwestern Station trainshed on April 18, 1969. Three of us rode the train to Michigan City that day, returning via South Shore Line.

Cheers!

Art

[artpeterson]

As usual, I'm a day or two out of phase with the theme of the day, but I hope you'll enjoy this shot, nonetheless.

The two ex-M&StL RDC4s, working as C&O 9080-9081, were photographed in October 1962 by Willis McCaleb. I know these cars worked a run within KY, but don't know the exact location. If anyone has an idea, I'd welcome that info!

Art