"OUR" PLACE - SEE NEW THREAD!

[siberianmo]

Howdy Guys!

Well, we've got yet another slow day on our hands - so, it's time for 'nother

POST FROM THE PAST

This one is from Page 5, and is a Classic from Nick

QUOTE: nickinwestwales
Posted: 28 Apr 2005, 04:44:25
Joined: 16 Apr 2005

Hey,Tom-another of those cold Molsons please and as it`s payday a round for the house, as and when they straggle in!! Well it`s a day off for me(the best sort-everyone else is working) and blowing a gale out there so time to sit a while.

So,Ontario Northland,classic or not?...discuss....[takes me back to schooldays] Well ,first a disclaimer,I`ve never travelled on any of these lines,so all this is "received wisdom" picked up from the (un)official O.N. railfan site,but they caught my imagination. In part because of the manageable size of the outfit (in modelling terms) and partly the off the beaten track,frontier feel of the place.

So,the trains, The Northlander runs daily from Toronto up to Cochrane via North Bay ( C.N. trackage to N.Bay ) Normal formation seems to be G.P.38-2,A.P.U (converted "B" unit for car heating ) 2 coaches and a food service car ( coverted G.O.cars ) until fairly recently,power was any one of the last 3 F.P.7a`s dating back to `51 or 2 but retro-fitted with 2000 hp Caterpiller prime movers. Also seen on this service although not sucessful and long withdrawn ,were a number of Dutch built Werkspoor T.E.E units.

This service meets bus connections along the route serving the various `branches ` although It`s predecessor the Northland sleeper carried connecting portions and could include virtually anything. Heading north from Cochrane we have the Polar Bear Express,a summer-only tourist run up to Moosonee up in the arctic circle--this is usually a twin G.P38 lashup although Cochrane shed will happily use whats available,usually a dozen plus cars including domes,food service etc ( think these came from B.C.Rail and C.P.R . The Little Bear is the 3-times-weekly mixed to Moosonee--Beyond Cochrane you are in the tree line and the track is the only land route in or out so this is a community lifeline, The little bear runs about a dozen freight cars(lots of flats with big plant,containers etc,fuel tanks,general stores. According to season,a "canoe car" ( bulkhead flat with special racks fitted) and a "moose car" (50` box for dressed carcases) are available. so a thumbnail essay.

Thats left me thirsty so same again and i`ll just perch over here at the end of the counter, take care now, nick

POST FROM THE PAST

Enjoy!

Tom, Proprietor of "Our" Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[Anonymous]

Hello everyone. A Guiness, please. The Welsh beer was great but left a awful headache the next morning.
Russell, I remember the AFT. 2 guys my age rode with the next door neighbor to Jefferson City to see it. It was already parked so we did'nt get to see it arrive. I remember standing in line for the tour and some of the national treasures inside. What I remember most was 4449. The neighbor's name was Paul and he was a big fellow, about 6' 4" , and the drivers dwarfed him. I studied that loco intensely. Later, I bought a vinyl album(remember those?) of this engine and about wore it out. Beautiful locomotive.
I have few memories of train travel so I enjoy reading and hearing about others'. Have amassed a collection of pass. train books in the personal library to study about the way things were(and should be). I have realized, after 9 seasons of being around them, that train travel is addicting.
Hey Tom, I've noticed the jukebox is playing quite well and has some new additions. Here's another five for the jar Dave started. Some things just wear out.

[siberianmo]

G'day earlydiesels Dan

Was beginning to wonder if anyone would stop in this afternoon .... happy to see ya! [tup]
Man is it ever slow 'round here this week .......

Size comparisons can be intimidating. I remember seeing one of my ships out of the water in dry dock. The props seemed huge - then I took a walk over to an adjacent dock and looked at tanker - [wow] - dwarfed ours by a good amount. As someone coined it's all relative .......

Train travel, in my opinion, is not for getting there - it's for the experience of doing it. When we travel by train - our attitude is who cares if we keep to the schedule by the minute (what RR does in N. America anyway [?]) Enjoy the setting - the scenery and the company. That's the way it is for us ..... [tup]

Ole Juke has perked up a bit and unless those guys from the Track Gang decide to pick 'er up and bounce 'er once or twice, she should be oaky. [swg]

Appreciate the fiver for the clanger - although I can't imagine a new one is going to make all that much of a difference!

Catch ya later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Anonymous]

Hey, its me again back from picking up a few things at the nearby Publix (market). Tom let's have a good luck round for "fair weather" on me.[tup] It looks as if Tropical Storm Katrina should "land" near Ft Lauderdale, Fl, then cross the State toward Ft. Meyer, Fl., thence to the Gulf. For us, the worst case scenario is She regains strength in the Gulf and plows up Tampa Bay. Its all academic to me because I'm ready to batten down post haste.[bow]

Russell, glad you enjoyed the "trip" and Yes, I've traveled both the "Tulsan" and the "Oil Flyer" to and from K.C., MO. [tup]Yep, just a little older than you, my first "Encounter of the Third Kind" was in the West Bottoms near Wilson's Packing Plant where a 0-6-0 was shifting cars behind my Dad's offices (before 1951 flood). The whistle scared the begemins out of me. I've was "hooked" on steam from then on until today. The "high line" (elvated open girder) ran just north of this site in full view from the front windows. Lot's of steam came by and at relatively high speed.[^] Sorry, didn't have Polaroids or 35 mm then, sure wish we did.[:(] As a kid, I thought these monsters would be around forever. Near "the end," I did get some black and white pix of steam which sufficed until the colorful epoch of the Diesels began.

Rob, about the same time K.C. went all P.C.C.'s, the major Roads went all Diesel (mid 1950's). For me, it was a double "Whammy" because the old Whitt's, Brills, Birney's and steam were the "cat's posterior" in my world.[V] Know what? They still are![:D] As West Coast Dave mentioned, most of the old "bricked in" girder rail was simply paved over with asphalt with ghosts from the past "arising from the dead" on well worn streets.[swg] I still say the "light" rail you see today is but a prophecy of the near future.[2c] Hope I'm here to see it too.

Okay, some great posts happening hereabouts. Let's all "keep 'em coming." Tom, I hope the "Environmentalists" don't get wind of Boris and Leon terrorizing the wild life 'round Can-Am Gorge. On second thought..."Bring 'em on!" Happy rails all.

[siberianmo]

Hi Ya Sir Ted

They've reported that Tropical Storm Katrina is now a Category 1 Hurricane with sustained winds at 75 mph. Rode out of ferw of those storms in my day both in the radio shack - hanging on for dear life and later on up on the Bridge - wondering, how in blazes did I get this job [?] Not great fun nor are they anything to fool with. As you've indicated - make sure those hatches are battened down. More than one vessel lies on the bottom because of faulty hatch closings or just plain negligence. The Edmund Fitzgerald comes to mind ........ [tdn]

One of the drawbacks for me regarding being here so much is the tendency to think that everyone has nothing better to do than occupy their time in cyber space. That's just plain nonsense - I know it - you all know it - but somehow, the thought persists. I've got to rethink the time spent 'round here ........

Now to the subject at hand: The resurrection of passenger rail in the form of tranist (aka: light rail). Well, we know that yesterday's trolleys were really the light rail of the era - just didn't call it that. While I'm a proponent for light rail and virtually anything 'n everything that will restore passenger rail - it just ain't the same, nor will it be. The LRV's are just places to sit or stand while the vehicle moves between the urban stations. Whereas, those wonderufl passenger trains we all like to remember, were our homes on steel rails - kitchens (dining cars) - bedrooms (slumber coaches, bedroom cars, etc.) - patio rooms (observation domes) - storage rooms (baggage cars) - community centers (lounge areas) and of course the neighborhood bars (tavern cars). Tranist with their LRV's serve a purpose and provide just a wee bit of excitement to and for those of us who dearly love rail travel - but it surely ain't the same. Then again, what is [?]

Catch ya later and thanx for the Post and the round! Boris ring the bell ...... [tup]

Tonite is Fish 'n Chips Nite!!! and whatever Nick has in store for us with his Nick's Picks! [yeah]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[nickinwestwales]

Well good evening One and All and welcome to the weather-proof environs of cyber space,TED-good luck riding out the big blow,[4:-)]TOM,beer for all if you please,the weekend is close enough to taste and this side of the pond it`s also the last bank holiday of the summer season-a lively few days are in prospect [^][^] -So,to business-Fish night:- as the bountiful river Cleddau is currently throwing out fish faster than they can be caught,tonights selection will be largely local-produce based........kicking in at the lighter end of the scale,we have (for GUNNS) Penclawdd cockles & lava bread with Gower bacon, Abereiddy smokehouse mackerel pateed with Llangoffen fen cream & garden shallots,served with gooseberry & ginger sauce & wholemeal toast, a pint of Llangwm brine-cured whole shell prawns with salad bowls, Puddleduck Farm trout stuffed with field mushrooms & wild garlic and wrapped & baked served with Winterton farm baby new potatoes and a green salad, dressed Jack Sound crab with granary bread and braised leek au gratin, Bass poached in rum,lime and sweet chilli and pan-fried Sewin steaks with shallots & a mustard sauce both with baby news and James of St Davids organic carrots,brocoli,french beans & cauliflower. for the non fish lovers (like myself) we have noisettes of local-farm lamb,pan fried with reform sauce and game chips served with the vegetable platter or 12oz Welsh Black sirloin steak with grilled tomato,onion rings,mushrooms,double fried eggs and a side plate of fries tall enough to interfere with conversation..............................roll up ,roll up-get `em while they`re hot..! O.K-I`m off out to the kitchen to make sure Boris is properly tethered,gimp mask in place etc(........................sooo hungry............) and prepare tonights piscine feast,[4:-)]TOM-another for thee and me and same again for the stools if you would-It could be a long and difficult night given the recent resolution of the track gangs ongoing wages dispute-personally,I felt that deciding to pay everyone on the Can-Am staff in sterling so as to avoid U.S/Cdn $ imbalance was a stroke of genius-chat later chaps,regards to all,nick[C=:-)]

[siberianmo]

Nick the [C=:-)] Chief Chef has spoken, and [dinner] dinner is served! Man oh man, what a menu! And to think that this all began as a modest Fish 'n Chips Nite in our early days! I believe Rob was the impetus behind it back then ....... [tup]

Where does one come up with such a variety and also the expectation that one could possibly eat that much food [?]! [wow]

So it's Crown Sterling, eh [?] I don't think sooooooooo, Mate! The differential between U.S. and Canada in tems of currency - simply isn't a problem these days. So, paydays will continue to be in cold, hard cash - payble in the Rat's Patoot Room - where else [?] [swg] Nice try! [;)]

Appreciate the round for the boyz - Boris put down the doll and ring the bell! [:-,][}:)]

Thanx for stopping by .......

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[West Coast S]

Afternoon Tom and the gang, I see the clapper fund is keeping pace with the national debt [?] Round of Crown Royal if you could.

Tom, expanding on Trainut484 4449AFT recollections. The pending tour of the AFT touched off several events such as the co-event sponsored by the SP that invited the Bicentenial diesels of WP,SF & BN for a display at the Embarcadero. Haven't seen it mentioned once among the railfan community, a forgotten note to history perhaps or we were too into Disco and Pet Rocks to notice!


A few historical notes regarding a certain PA Tom alluded to that was star attraction of the 1947 ATF. At the conclsion of the tour it was was placed in storage by Alco pending a buyer. GM&O agreed to purchase the unit if Alco would upgrade it to PA1 standards. It survived until falling victim to a massive Alco purge in 1963. GM&O and Alco were aware of it's historical status and offered the unit to the Smithsonian for preservation, the offer was declined, the PA was scrapped.

Technically, calling it a PA is a misnomer, pre-PA would be a better discription, one of the first constructed, Offering it to ATF duty, garnered Alco some well needed publicity and also gave the design staff the oppertunity to throughly study reliability in real world conditions. Of note, several railroads had expressed an interest in just such a passenger unit, so, Alco had to deliver hard data to assure success of the new PA line and promote the 251 diesel over rival manfactures.

Great recollections from all, it's amazing, for all the diversity among us, that certain first encounter ties us all with a common thread.
Dave [tup]

[siberianmo]

Hi West Coast S Dave

Now that's quite a Post - once again. You've made my night 'round here, for sure. [tup][tup][tup] [yeah]

That 1947 Freedom Train pre-PA was a beautiful machine nonetheless. Alco and their PA's have always been right up there as my favorites of locos - love that look. Definitely appreciate the history provided ...... Thanx! [tup]

In toy trains, A.C. Gilbert's American Flyer had some beauties back when I was a kid. Perhaps not the detail one can find with today's products, but still fine looking in comparison with anything else marketed at the time. I suppose that's what began my fascination with S-gauge trains, although I never got into them until this year.

I concur with your assessment regarding the diversity found 'round here - really lends itself to some great conversations.

Sound the alarm, Boris Crown Royal for the house on Dave! [wow]

Leon the Night Man has sauntered in, wearing his spiffy Jump Boots of course. Time for me to check out ...... [zzz]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[pwolfe]

HI Tom and all
A pint of the regular and a round please for the wonderful conversations over the last couple of days I am slowly learning about American railroads[tup].
One of the things I wish I could recall better is a visit my Dad took me to at a early age to the Rugby Locomotive Test Plant where we met someone who allowed inside to see a loco on test. The loco was on rollers with the driving wheels a blur but the engine not moving an inch.Dad said the noise was tremendous but I just stood there fascinated.
Many years later an old driver worked in the same factory as I and he used to recall turns at the test plant ,he said it was a good job for a driver, although noisy, but for a stoker it was a hard shift with the rollers loaded to simulate the cars and the engine being flat out, there was often two stokers he said. Was there a plant like in the U.S.
Anyway Tom can I have the roast lamb and another pint please and I will try to call in again soon. [yeah]

[siberianmo]

Hey Pete

Just caught your Post before checking out ..... Happy you made it in. By the by, that supply of Welsh brew that Nick sent, finally made it. We've got some in the back with the remainder sitting in our reefer car over at the CP siding, just 'round the bend.

You've hit it just right with the stuff going on here. Can't remember more meaningful and continuous discussions going on since we began on April 12th. Just browsing through the Posts of the past three days - rather few that they've been - for the most part, there''s some quality offerings in them. A shame that a few of our regulars are missing out on this ......

A locomotive on test - now that must have been something to witness. No protection for the ears in those days, eh [?] While I'm not at all familiar with such locations, my bet is that we've got a guy or two who will provide some amplifying info on U.S. sites ....

The gals are just about ready to serve your meal and your pint is right in front of you. Enjoy! [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[trolleyboy]

Evening Tom, I'll have a CR and the lamb as well. Haven't had a good piece of lamb since I don't know when[tup]Pwolf I don't know about the US but EMD has a test track in London Ontario at the locomotive plant,they had stationary load testers as well,not sure if they are still there or not,next time I'm in London i'll check. Ted definatly batten the hatches you don't want to end up in Kansas by antway other than by train[:p][;)][:0] I concur though the Whitt's had much more personality than the PCC but at least the PCC's were still streetcars. I think that you will see more cities opting for light rail of some description IMHO it makes eceonomic sence espeacially with oil prices as they are. I know of at least three Canadian cities ( mid size ) seriously looking at their options. Do you ride the TECO line when you get the chance?I'm wondering how do the phoney Birney's run? If they work out well maybe more cities will opt for the "new old " Whitt clones anyone?Anyway a late night yeaterday and an early day tomorrow means Rob's fading fast[|)] Nite all [zzz][zzz]

[trolleyboy]

Oh forgot a couple of things. Tom Loved the dallas url good stuff [tup] hope everyone caught the url a page or so back and ckecked it out. Tom & Dave Though I wasn't around for it, looking at the 1967 confederation train for Canada's hundreth makes you wonder. The CN/CP sponsored train was a passionate purple and white concoction. First and only time I've ever seen maple leaves done up in purple. This train was loud compared to even the ACL's purple and silver[:O] Well folks this time I'm off to bed for sure. Leon send a round out to the remanders of the house for me, thanks [tup] Rob

[Gunns]

Even Tom and all,
Nick yer manking me hungry,
I'll have what you said <especially the Trout> and some Coffee. at work here,

As for the AFT, when the 76 western version came through, I went about 30 miles West of Phoenix, and chased in in to town. The police had all the stop light blocked for us in the small towns and we were allowed to blast through town at 75 mph to keep up with the train.

Pwolf locomotive testing out here for the Santa Fe was to get a Dynamoniter car and then to pull a train over Raton Pass <3.5% grade>
Well Im Changing Batteries tonight <3000.00 ea 2.5 vdc 100000 amps> so ring the bell, at least some one can get a drink.
Gunns

[Anonymous]

Happy Friday to all who must fight the concrete treadmill M-F. A few of us have been "down that road" and, believe me, the gold at the "end of the rainbow" is worth every swear word, grid-lock and toll booth along the way. As the old British expression has it: "Keep your pecker up!"[:D] However, you may wi***o take a closer look at your retirement plans if they happen to include Florida.[:-^] Tom, stay where you are, I'll help meself to the Bakery's fre***oasted Bagels and a Thermos of hot Joe. The "Thermos" is for a hasty departure just in case, don't ya know.[;)]

Nick [C=:-)], what a tour de force last night's "Picks" turned out to be.[^] How you manage delicate French cuisine with the artistry of a Maestro's baton, then turn to rolling pin, meat hammer and battle mace for provencial Welch fare confounds me.[tup] Sure beats Breakfast Burritos, eh Gunns? But Nick maybe the greatest mystery is how your goods budget at "Our" Place manages to stay "in the black?"[tup] [tup]

Rob, Tom and ***, although the varnish and hand burnished brass of yore may be forever history; vinyl, glass and epoxy on rails is still preferable to gas lines, CO exhaust and fender benders along life's journey![8D] Imagine the raise in your net income without insurance, fuel, maintenance, et al. at the end of the month.[:D] We could all afford our "dream layout" with a "classic roster" thrown in to boot.[^] We won't even mention eliminating the "stress" factor![:O]

I'm putting all personal travel plans "on hold" 'till this storm season is over (November).[V] I am far and away more fearful of looters, vultures, scam artists and FEMA bureaucrats than any damage nature could do. So, its back to the 1:87 and 1:29 variety for this C.E.O.! Okay, if I missed any "heavy" train talk this Post; its nothing personal. Just remind me and I'll "get to it."[:I] Happy rails to you's. I'll try to get back a.s.a.p.!

[Anonymous]

Ah yes, Rob, my apologies! Yes, when I go to South Tampa (Ybor City), I make a point of riding TECO'S Birney Clones. The cars run very well and are too comfortable. The location and routing is strictly with tourist's dollars in mind. New Orleans carefully avoided the French Quarter. Tampa's Ybor City is their Latin Quarter and they fully exploited that as a tourist venue. The St Charles line in N.O. supports local needs while the Rivefront line is more commercial. Hey Tom, thanks again for the Summaries, I caught my ommision easily. See ya later.

[siberianmo]

Mornin’ Guys!

I see we’ve had some activity since my departure …. So let’s get to the responses:

Hi Rob

Hmmmmmmmm, when is FISH ‘n Chips Nite NOT FISH Nite[?] When Nick offers up a menu fit for Kings (and Queens!) [swg] Lamb! That’s two of ya on a nite that YOU helped orchestrate way back when ……… HOWEVER , the lamb is a good choice! [tup]

Appreciate the comments. My presumption is you are referring to the Age of Steam Museum in Dallas web site at:

http://www.dallasrailwaymuseum.com/collection.html

The 1967 Confederation Train Purple People Eater (my name!) may be viewed at:

http://expo67.ncf.ca/confederation_train_1967.html
===========================================
Gunns Kevin

Glad someone ‘round here is eating the fish! A bit too late to throw ‘em back, wouldn’t you agree [?]

I’ve been at a crossing or two where you could feel the rumble and listen to the roar as a fast moving train moved through. Don’t know about 75 mph – bet that was an experience.

Good info on the Dynamometer cars. I’d like to know more ‘bout ‘em. Always wondered when I’ve seen ‘em on the right-of-way ‘round here. Seen a couple with U.S. Department of Transportation livery too. Now there’s a job! [swg]
==========================================
Ted

Keep your pecker up! Now there’s an expression that requires a bit of elaboration. A couple of the guys spewed forth their OJ on that one! [swg]

Nick certainly did it up Royal last night, eh [?] You obviously are appreciative of fine foods, something it appears our Chief Chef [C=:-)] is no stranger to and with. [tup][tup]

I follow your thinking regarding light rail. Reducing it to simplicity perhaps has merit – but there will never be a replacement for what we once had. When I ride the St. Louis MetroLink the joy factor just isn’t there. It’s a way to get somewhere for many. For me – I have to drive over 20 miles just to get to a station – then ride it for the sake of riding – then back to the parking lot for trip home. Anyway, I concur wholeheartedly regarding lines of gas guzzling machines sitting at idle or moving at crawl speed in comparison to our electric powered LRV’s ….. but methinks we’re mixing apples with walnuts here. Passenger trains – especially of the Classic kind just cannot be matched in conversation with LRV’s.

(Note the difference between ours and LA – MetroLink vs Metrolink – I got into a flap some years ago with an authority figure who didn’t know or care about the difference in the appearance of the acronym. My point was, if you’re going to come across as the end-all-of-knowledge regarding light rail, at least take the time to get the reference correct! He was beside himself, whereas I remained stoic – suppressing many urges.)

Glad you appreciate the SUMMARIES – from the limited feedback I’ve received, they appear to be more friendly than the redundant narratives ……

Stay safe 'n dry!
========================================

Catch ya later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[siberianmo]

FRIDAY’s NEWS & SUMMARY of RECENT POSTS

We made it – FRIDAY is here! [yeah] Why not start the day off with us by drawing a hot cuppa Joe from the urn(s) – regular or unleaded – pull out a pastry or two from the case of The Mentor Village Bakery’s finest and perhaps order a [light] breakfast. Can’t think of a better place to be ……..

News of the Day:

COMMENTARY Once again I want to thank those of you who have taken the time to keep things interesting ‘round here. The talk has been terrific when it comes to our subject – Classic Trains.

For those who have been away from us and take the time to read these SUMMARIES, you’ve really missed out on some great stuff these past several days. Check ‘em out! [tup]

Tonight is Pizza Nite and Steak 'n fries as well. The gals will be workin' and the place should be hoppin' ....... [tup]

SUMMARY

Name - Date/Time - (Page#) - Remarks

(1) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 07:22:14 (86) Thursday’s News & Summary

(2) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 08:25:26 (86)

(3) wrwatkins *** Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 08:55:03 (86)

(4) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 09:21:24 (86) reply to Theodorebear

(5) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 09:31:46 (86) reply to wrwatkins

(6) Trainnut484 Russell Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 10:18:24 (86)

(7) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 11:08:39 (86)

(8) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 11:20:08 (86) reply to Trainnut484

(9) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 11:25:53 (86) reply to trolleyboy

(10) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 14:22:27 (86) POST FROM THE PAST

(11) earlydiesels Dan Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 14:36:35 (86)

(12) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 15:35:59 (86) reply to earlydiesels

(13) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 16:27:06 (86)

(14) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 17:09:08 (86) reply to Theodorebear

(15) nickinwestwales Nick Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 18:43:07 (86)

(16) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 20:03:05 (86) reply to nickinwestwales

(17) West Coast S Dave Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 20:12:51 (86)

(18) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 21:48:40 (86) reply to West Coast S

(19) pwolfe Pete Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 21:53:54 (86)

(20) siberianmo Tom Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 22:04:37 (86) reply to pwolfe

(21) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 22:49:50 (87)

(22) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 22:56:25 (87)

(23) Gunns Kevin Posted: 25 Aug 2005, 23:23:15 (87)

(24) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 26 Aug 2005, 06:12:14 (87)

(25) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 26 Aug 2005, 06:46:02 (87)

(26) siberianmo Tom Posted: 26 Aug 2005, 08:07:11 (87) reply to trolleyboy – Gunns – Theodorebear

=======================================
That’s it! [tup][;)]
Tom (Siberianmo) [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[Gunns]

Morning all,
coffee please,
Just a quick link,
http://www.drgw.net/trips/index.html?tr=SWS2
this is a trip report about the SFS and the Grand Canyon RR. The GCRR is probably the closest to a classic RR, one of our club members is a machinist there, He commutes out to Albuqurque every month or so to help out.

Later
Gunns

[siberianmo]

Mornin' Gunns Kevin

Ya got me there .... didn't follow your Post very well. Huh [?]

Regarding Classics I'm sure that Kalmbach may have a different definition than what we use 'round here. I wouldn't begin to try and define it - no thanx! [swg]

To my way of thinking, the Classics for ME are those that remain uppermost in my memory, plus those of today that are heading that way.

Catch ya later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[Gunns]

Hi again Tom,
I edited the post, I think I missed a link.... fixed now.
Warm milk with baleys Irish Cream in it <g>.
time for sleep
Gunns

[West Coast S]

Morning Tom and the gang...Hmm, what have we in the mentor's bakery? Happy Thursday for those of us with Saturday duty.

I'd like to contribute to a few recent post, specifficaly those from Trolleyboy regarding electric railway marine operations. The Pacific Electric maintained controlling interest in the White Comet Lines, who's two intercoastal steamers YALE and HARVARD provided overnite connections to San Franciso during the twenties to mid thirties. PE provided parlor car service from downtown to a special boarding dock, the only time PE offered parlor car service. The effects of the depression and the disapearance of the HARVARD during a severe storm, with no survivors forced White Comet into recievership. Ownership of the YALE was assumed by the Catalina Steamship Company and she continued the intercoastal runs until her transfer to the Navy in 1940.

Catalina Steamship Company assumed all debt incurred by White Comet with the help of PE resources. PE was heavily promoting Santa Catalina Island as a relaxing way to spend the summer. When the public took notice, PE instituited the famous Catalina Specials to handle the influx, that as late as 1950 was the chosen means by more then one hundered thousand passengers since the inception of the service. PE built a dedicated line to the Catalina Docks to expidite a smooth transfer from shore to ship, these Catalina Specials were the longest and heaviest trains operated on the system and the only ones that offered checked baggage, the existing infastructure and facalities on Anaheim Street where unable to cope with these trains.

The Catalina Specials were some of the last revenue runs on the PE, only ending upon abandoment of the Long Beach Line in 1960.

PE was also involved in the throughbred horse trade, during horse racing season PE handled hundreds of horse cars, interchanged from the three steam roads, these roads did not have a physical rail connection within the Santa Anita Race track, PE did. These were known as racetrack specials, during racing season every available box motor was put into service to cope with the demands. When a box motor was unvailable, Leased SP power was subsutuited, thus Moguls, Consolidations and diesel power graced the overhead wires. All steam and diesel power leased to PE service were outfitted with overhead trolley poles to activate signals and grade crossing protection.

In the final decade, PE became dependent on leased SP power for freight duty as the unreliable and no longer economical to repair ancient box motors were retired and scrapped. PE envisioned the future as a dieselized freight feeder and carrier with all passenger operations abandoned or sold off and the overhead wires and supporting electrical facalities retired and scrapped. PE had cause to embrace such a bold change, during these years they ranked seventh in the nation in freight revenue generated and fourth in California.

It was not to be, reality would imprint a far different ending for the PE.

Dave [tup]

[siberianmo]

G'day Gunns Kevin

Now, that's better! Thanx - makes more sense now. I read the Trip Report and man oh man, it was not only full of interesting stuff, I learned about yet another chance at a rail experience. Don't know when I'll ever return to that part of the world - but if and when, I'll surely check into the SFS! [tup]

Tom

[siberianmo]

Hello Dave

You are fast becoming the 2nd Oracle at "Our" Place! [tup] Good stuff, once again. You're on a roll .........

Duty on Saturday [?] Well at least it's only one day - I recall many a duty weekend, and those made for loooooooooong nights. Ugh.

I'm learning more 'n more about left coast rail and feel somewhat remiss in that while I was assigned out thataway I didn't pursue any of it. Not that I really could - for the things I was pursuing were hardly on rails! [swg] Anyway, it would be interesting to know where in the U.S. or Canada that there are rail and ship connections. I recall seeing lots of that kind of stuff in New York Harbor - but it was all the movement of freight cars on barges. But to integrate passenger rail with shipboard travel, then back to rail - well, that's something else indeed.

Interesting. Thanx! [tup][tup][tup]

By the by, check out that URL on the SFS that Gunns Kevin Posted .... I think you'll find it of interest.

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[West Coast S]

Hello again Tom and the gang... Great URL by Gunns, too many trains and not enough time!

On the subject of testing equiptment during the steam era, this is one example i'm familar with:

Pennsy maintained a test lab, complete with rollers, load testers, etc. and a chemical, fuel/water analysis lab within the Altoona Shops, N&W is known to have compiled the initial performance data for the A,J,Ys due to leasing test time from the Pennsy. N&W was never comfortable with the controlled enviorment concept favored by the Pennsy. N&W would return to Roanoke, which was also equipped with additional research assets specific to the N&W needs, and expand the test results by placing each locomotive in revenue service under monitored conditions for a specified period of time before releasing to general service.

Tom... The Florida East Coast constructed the Key West extension to capture the steamship trade to Cuba. The entire line was destroyed by a Hurricane in 1932, and was never rebuilt. Reconstruction of the ill concieved line was explored during WWII, but FEC wanted no part of responsibilty for post war operation and maintaince of the cursed route.

Dave[tup]

[siberianmo]

G'day Dave

My son sometimes oversteps the bounds and gets a bit snarky when it comes to my travels on trains to hither and yon, rather than spending the time visiting where they reside. In response, I usually say something like we lived together long enough - it's now my time to do what I want! [swg] Translated: I could spend my remaining days aboard the passenger trains of yesteryear. The closest I can find to suit my needs are in Canada - that's fine with me. Wonder if my retirement check will sustain my high hopes [?] Nah. My bride will just have to get 'nother job! [swg]

I'm always put into somewhat of a funk when I think of the attendant industries that went by the wayside once our railroads turned that proverbial corner. With the advent of diesel - lots of things changed, but never as much as when the passenger roads left us. Lots and lots of ramifications there. Pity.

I've seen the FEC Key West extension remains once or twice in my travels down thataway. I knew about the hurricane's destruction of it, but never knew what the reason was for running a railroad of that magnitude into Key West. Now I know - thanx!

Regarding your duty Saturday - hope you have a challenger or two thrown your way, if for no other reason than to pass the time quickly! [tup] By the by, when are you off to your new assignment [?]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[passengerfan]

Good evening Tom . Guess I'll have my usual CR and a round for the house.
Another West Coast Railroad owned steamship operation was the Great Northern Pacific operating two fast deluxe ships for their day the SS Great Northern and SS Northern Pacific between San Francisco and the mouth of the Columbia River where passengers boarded an SP&S train for Portland and connecting trains for Seattle and beyond. This was James J. Hills route to San Francisco since who could never get direct trackage to the city by the bay. The ships were able to compete with SP passenger trains of the day and fares were comparable.
The Canadian Pacific was even more into ships at one time operating the beautiful White Empress Liners to Japan, The Phillipines and Hong Kong prior to WW II from Vancouver. From Vancouver passengers could board the trains for Montreal or even beyond to Halifax by way of St. John, N. B. and then a ride on another CPR owned Coastal Steamship a Princess Liner where a connection was made with the CP owned Dominion Atlantic to Halifax or Yarmouth.
The CPR also operated Empress liners from Montreal and Quebec City Trans Atlantic so vast was the Canadian Pacific transportation system.
But in order to compete with close rival Great Northern CPR operated Coastal Steamships on several routes from Vancouver and Victoria. The Princess Liners provided service from Downtown Vancouver to Nanaimo on Vancouver Island numerous times daily. In direct competition with the GN they operated the Triangle route between Vancouver, Victoria and Seattle twice daily at one time. In the day runs following WW II they operated the SS Princess Marguerite and Princess Patricia licensed for 1,500 day passengers each. The overnights which I only had the opportunity to ride once were the SS Princess Joan and Princess Elizabeth. The Night boats disappeared in the late 1950's and other princesses lasted into the 1970's. The CPR also offered service to Alaska from Vancouver as well. Along with Hotels and later the Airline the CPR was indeed a complete transportation company.
Well must run for now.

[West Coast S]

Tom... Saturday duty can be pretty dull around here. Command reversed the decision to release me for a new assignment, so the next available oppertunity to apply will be mid next year. So for now, business as usual.

I agree with the extinction of the attending aspects associated with diesel and the passenger train. I think the following puts it in presepective.

Dieselization permited longer faster, heavier trains, run more frequently, thus requiring new means to keep apart. Farewell to the train order station, written orders the telegraph and the manual block control. farewell to the jobs they created and the communities they supported.


Farewell to the coal docks, water towers and roundhouses and turntables and all else associated with steam railroading , your day is done, replaced by the diesel that only requires a few tracks for servicing.

Farewell to the thousands of shopworkers, hostlers and millions more behind the scene who gave their all to keep the railroads running in time of peace and war.

Farewell to shops with legendary names such as Altoona, Roanoke, Cheyenne and a thousand more, farewell to the communities that once depended on you.

Farewell to the American passenger train , even the vaunted diesel could not save you from the technology of improved air and highway alternatives and changes in public preferances.

Farewell to the Pullman Porter, your time is done, you have served with honor for over a hundred years by catering to millions of travellers, farewell to the Pullman Company, your daring, innovative approach to rail travel helped bind a restless nation. Now, your time has come as well. You too have served with honor in time of war and peace.

Farewell to way of life, never to return and yet not so distant as to be completely forgotten.

Dave [tup]

[siberianmo]

G'day passengerfan Al

Seems like awhile since you've been in - probably not - but it just seems so. Crown it is - Boris ring the bell! [yeah]

From the relative little that I know regarding the real transporation companies of old, Canadian Pacific had to be the world's largest and leader in that area. They surely had a well integrated system - trains, planes, ships and hotels. They did it right and often.

Change is inevitable and wil always be a dynamic we either accept or give in to. It's just that simple, I guess. Doesn't mean we have to like the changes, though .......

Enjoy the evening and thanx for the Post and informative stuff. [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[siberianmo]

G'day Dave

Sorry to learn about the nix of your transfer. I recall how happy you were when you thought it was a Go.

I have to ask - WHERE did all of that wonderful analogy come from [?] If it is original stuff - you need to copyright it. If it is from other sources, please share them with us. Really introspective and really covers all the bases. Well done!

Thanx! That's a Post worth saving - which I will do.

Tom[4:-)][oX)]