"OUR" PLACE - SEE NEW THREAD!

[siberianmo]

Even though ”Our” Place is CLOSED on SUNDAY’s we do observe Sunday Photo Posting Day!!

Well, I wasn’t going to do this today – but, I found the time. Here are some Pix of my newly arrived R17 subway cars (2nd set) As with the “Red Birds” from last week, these too wound up on the Can-Am Railroad!

click to enlarge

Not again – MORE subway cars!


View beneath Union Station platforms!


R17 subway cars moving out!


R17 subway cars moving out!


R17 subway cars crossing Can-Am Gorge!


R17 subway cars at Can-Am Gorge!


R17 subway cars at Land-Between-the-Lakes


R17 subway cars at Our Place!


R17 subway cars at Our Place!


Red Birds at Mountain Depot!



Enjoy!

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]

REMINDER! Read the SUMMARY!

[Anonymous]

Hello everyone. OUR PLACE is closed but a quick note thru the slot is in order.
Tom, enjoyed the pix of your pike. I felt like a passenger who was lost trying to find which train to ride.
Barndad, I enjoy the facts you present when you post a loco picture. The mechanical and electrical stats are important to me and always curious about the airbrake schedule for each loco. Let's have some more!
Nanaimo73, I see you are a Frisco fan. I am here in the heart of Frisco country, Springfield, Mo. I would be happy to try to answer any questions about the Frisco here at the bar, should you decide to become a regular.
Trolleyboy, I suppose you are aware the "The Pocket List of Railroad Officials" is still printed about 4 times a year and includes museums and tourist railroads. It looks funny to me seeing my name in print.
Pete, probably the best CW rr book for looking at pix was reprinted within the last few years. The author is George Abdill and is simply titled Civil War Railroads. It has some text, including some first person accounts, but its strength is the wonderful photos. Gives a good feeling of the equipment and the overall conditions faced by the personnel.

[Anonymous]

I know that "Our Place" is closed today, but I happened to walk by and see Dan's message about the civil war book. So I went on E-Bay and placed a bid for one that was there. I'll know in 24 hours if I won. Thanks for the tip Dan!

[siberianmo]

Good Evenin’,

Given that we are Closed on Sunday, and the theme of the day is Sunday Photo Posting Day! I try to refrain from the “narratives.” An exception is in order:

nanaimo73 Posted: 19 Nov 2005, 21:49:12

You are welcome!

barndad Doug Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 05:22:56 and 18:02:07

Appreciate the pix – thanx for participating! [tup] Sorry, but I seriously doubt that I’ll be weathering those “Red Birds” – kinda wasted in the “underground” scene – plus that pix is absolutely GROSS! [swg]

Your Email has been answered …….

ftwNSengineer Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 08:02:36

Nice of you to participate with your pix – thanx! Sorry, ‘bout the coffee – but we are Closed on Sundays!

Given that you have been previously welcomed – no need to repeat it. [tup]

earlydiesels Dan Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 17:32:48

Nice “Inclusive Post” and good to see ya, even if it is on the day we are Closed!. Glad you liked the pike pix!

How does one go about getting a copy of that “Pocket List of Railroad Officials” [?] Thanx for addressing that inquiry. Had no clue – as the Ad I Posted was from 1956.

We open at 6 AM in the ‘morrow, hope to see y’all then.

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]

[siberianmo]

MONDAY’s INFO & SUMMARY of RECENT POSTS

We open at 6 AM (all time zones, don’t ask how we do that!

G’day! A new week has begun – but an abbreviated one for those living in the U.S. (Thanksgiving holiday). C’mon and begin the day with some freshly brewed coffee, pastries from The Mentor Village Bakery and our <light> breakfasts! [tup]

Info for the Day:

Our Sunday Photo Posting Day! was rather abysmal in that the participation was sparse. No matter – it will remain on the schedule of “things to do” ‘round here. [tup]

INDEX Mondays only!

The INDEX has been REMOVED from the daily SUMMARY. Not to worry, it follows the Monday SUMMARY. Watch for it!

SUMMARY

Name …..…………… Date/Time …..…..………. (Page#) .. Remarks

(1) barndad Doug Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 05:22:56 (168) Pix!

(2) siberianmo Tom Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 07:00:41 (168) Sunday’s Info & Summary

(3) ftwNSengineer Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 08:02:36 (168) 3rd visitPix!

(4) siberianmo Tom Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 09:29:56 (168) R17 subway cars Pix!

(5) earlydiesels Dan Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 17:32:48 (169) Inclusive Post!

(6) barndad Doug Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 18:02:07 (169)

(7) siberianmo Tom Posted: 20 Nov 2005, 18:32:02 (169) Acknowledgments, etc.

=======================================
That’s it! [tup][;)]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[siberianmo]

This feature, called the INDEX, is now separate from the daily SUMMARY and will continue to be “Mondays only.”


A helplful hint:

Generic URL: Just insert the index page in place of “106,” copy ‘n paste ‘n “go,”

http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?page=106&TOPIC_ID=35270

-or- insert the index page in the address portion of this page (at the top).


Fallen Flags (passenger ops)

106/150 SP……. 106/150 MoPac . 108/155 WP …… 109 Frisco
112 CNR ………. 112 Heralds …… 114 ACL ………… 115 SAL
116 D&RGW ….. 118 RI .………… 119 D&H ………… 120/144 PRR
122/144 NYC …. 124 UP.………… 125 AT&SF …….. 127 B&O
128 CM&StP.…. 129 CB&Q ..……. 130 Soo Line ...... 133 C&NW
134 SP&S …….. 136 GN ………… 139 B&M ..……… 140 NYNH&H; NH
141 MEC ……… 142 BAR .………. 145 NP …………. 146 L&N
147 WRR ……… 148 C&O ………. 148 KCS ……….. 151 N&W
152 Erie ..……… 152 IC ………….. 154 NPR .………. 155 SR
156 CGW ……... 157 RDG ………. 158 MON ………. 159 IT
162 LV ……….. 163 GM&O …….. 164 Extra

Passenger Train Nostalgia

110 ……… MKT Combined Fallen Flag and Ads
112 ……… CNR Ad - Super Continental Time Table
113/144 …. Passenger Train Nostalgia #1 ”Start ups” 1800s & early 1900s
117/144 …. Passenger Train Nostalgia #2 Ad - Vista-Dome sleeper obs-lounge
121 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #3 Ad - CP Hotels & Lodges
124 ………. A tale of Classic Trains BC Rail RDC trip
127 ………. B&O Ad - Strata-Dome
127 ………. B&O Ad – Diesel Electric Trains
129 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #4 Ad - CN Hotels, Ltd.
130 ………. Great Britain Nostalgia #1 Poster - East Coast Route
133 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #5 Poster - CP 1886
133 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #6 Poster - CP 1950s
134 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #7 Poster - Washington & Old Dominion Railway
134 ………. Personal RR journey CPR’s “The Canadian”
135 ………. Great Britain Nostalgia #2 London & Northwestern & Caledonian Railways
137 ………. Great Britain Nostalgia #3 London & Northwestern & Caledonian Railways
137 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #8 Ad – Great Northern
139 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #9 Ads – Great Northern
140 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #10 Ad – Union Pacific
141 ………. Nostalgia 1956 Hotel Ads
142 ………. Nostalgia Fairbanks-Morse motive power Ad
143 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #11 Ad - PRR – The Jeffersonian
145 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #12 Ad – NP
146 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #13 Ad – L&N
146 ………. Great Britain Nostalgia #4 Poster - Silver Jubilee
147 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #14 Ad – Budd & Wabash
148 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #15 Ad – C&O
149 ………. HERTZ Ad - 1956
151 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #16 Ad – Budd RDC (1950)
153 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #17 Ad – Budd RDC (1950)
153 ………. North American Steam Loco Wheel Arrangements
154 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #18 Ad – Budd RDC (1953)
155 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #19 Ad – Budd RDC (1954)
156 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #20 Ad – SP, Golden State (1951)
157 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #21 Ad – SP, Sunset limited (1951
158 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #22 Ad – SP, City of San Francisco (1951)
159 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #23 Ad – AT&SF (1950)
161 ………. Nostalgia - 9 WWII Ads ENCORE! of Veterans/Remembrance Day Commemoration
162 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #24 Ad – AT&SF (1951)
163 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #25 Ad – AT&SF (1952)
164 ………. Passenger Train Nostalgia #26 Ad – Olympian Hiawatha
166 ………. AVIS Ad – 1956
167 ………. Pocket List of RR Officials Ad – 1956

trolleyboy ROB’s Barn

Classic Juice

116/161 Classic Juice #1 (The London & Port Stanley L&PS)
123 ….. Classic Juice #2 (The Niagara St. Chatharines Toronto Railway NS&T)
131/155 Classic Juice #3 (The Montreal & Southern Counties Railway –MS&C)
134 ….. Classic Juice #4 (The Brantford and Hamilton B&H)
142 ….. Classic Juice #5 (The Berlin & Water Street Railway - B&WSR)
146 ….. Classic Juice #6 (The Nearside Car)
148 ….. Classic Juice #7 (The Peter Witt Story)
157 ….. Classic Juice #8 (The PCC)
140 ….. Classic Juice #9 (The Nipissing Central)
162 ….. Classic Juice #10 (The Safety Car)
163 ….. Classic Juice #11 (Electricity and the big roads in Canada Part 1 CNR)

Classic CNR Steam

159 ….. Classic CNR Steam #1 (The Huntsville Subdivision)
163 ….. Classic CNR Steam #2 (The Alliston Subdivision Trains)
165 ….. Classic CNR Steam #3 (Passenger & Freight trains on the Strathroy Subdivision)


passengerfan Al’s Streamliner Corner

166 ….. Rocky Mountain Rocket of the CRI&P (Rock Island)
166 ….. Arizona Limited of the CRI&P and SP.
167 ….. Southern Belles of the KCS.


Enjoy!

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]

[Anonymous]

A happy good morning to the begining of another week.[tup] Tom, the coffee aroma is outstanding this A.M.[^] I'll grab a mug and a rasberry Danish. Pete, Dan, Doug, Rob and others have expressed some interest in the U.S. Civil War's influence on later rail development. As promised, I'll throw in my humble [2c] in a couple of installments. All of my references come from American Heritage "Civil War," narrated by Bruce Catton.

Prior to 1861, the Northern States had approximately 20,000 miles of R.R. tracks and the South around 9,000 miles. A few years before the war, the canal at Sault Sainte Marie (Michigan) had opened providing the North with unlimited quantities of iron ore from the Lake Superior ranges. This pre war period triggered the "overbuilding" of rail lines in the area and their profits were meager. After war was declared (1861), railroads in the region (and beyond) needed more and more trackage to keep up with the war demand.

Indeed east to west rail lines in the North had been established before 1861 for shipping grain and corn to the east and manufactured goods to the west. This would have a dramatic impact later as the fighting gravitated ever more westward. While the North was constructing more lines as the war progressed, the South had not (and did not) expand one mile of new lines from the first day of the war to the last. Industry in the South was hard pressed just to manufacture arms and ammunnition for the armies already in the field. Also, skilled labor was as scarce as the raw materials needed for a long, protracted conflict. Both sides were thinking the war would last only a few months, possibly a year at the most.

Being largely agricultural, the Southern States were autonomous from one another. In the North, the states were more relient upon eachother. As a result, the South was nearly void of an east-west infrastructure which would eventually play a fatal role in the ultimate collapse of the Confederacy. Ironically, there was never a shortage of food production in the old South. But, there was no means (railroads) of getting product to their armies in the quantity needed. With this very abreviated over view, one can understand better why this war would become known as "the first railroad war."

Both camps understood the necessity of rail for shipping the implements of war but the strategic value of moving masses of troops where needed, wasn't fully appreciated. The fact was never made clearer than at the Battle of Chattanooga, TN where the entire Union Army of the Cumberland was trapped in that City and under siege. I will go into more of this in the next installment. Hopefully, no one has fallen asleep to this point. Wouldn't want to make you late for work.[V]

Tom, those "Red Birds" will look great any where you put them. If they perform as well as they look, you should have "trouble free" subway operations, really neat![tup] The addition of Al's "Streamliner Corner," the "Classic CNR Steam" and Rob's "Classic Juice" has added a new dimension to the Thread. That, plus Fallen Flags and "P. T. Nostalgia" makes "Our" Place the "only bar to be!"[tup]

[passengerfan]

Good Morning Tom and the rest of the early risers. Time for Coffee and a pastry from the Mentor Bakery.

PASSENGERFAN AL'S STREAMLINER CORNER #1

GULF COAST REBEL GM&O trains 16-17 648 miles 16 hours 55 minutes each way Inaugurated October 27, 1940 between East St. Louis and Mobile Alabama.

The GULF COAST REBELS were diesel powered streamlined heavyweight trains with the GM&O shops completeing the streamlining in their own shops on nine cars and Pullman Calumet streamlining a pair of matching heavyweight sleeping cars for the trains.

CONSIST ONE

270 ALCO DL-109 2,000 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

32 Streamlined Heavyweight Baggage 30' Railway Post Office Car

63 Streamlined Heavyweight Baggage Car

243 Streamlined Heavyweight 6-Crew Dormitory 48-Revenue Seat Coach

101 Streamlined Heavyweight 6-Seat Lunch Counter 8-Seat Dining 8-Seat Lounge 24-Revenue Seat Coach

SHOW ME Streamlined Heavyweight 8-Section 1-Drawining Room 3-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

CONSIST TWO

271 ALCO DL-109 2,000 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

33 Streamlined Heavyweight Baggage 30' Railway Post Office Car

65 Streamlined Heavyweight Baggage Car

328 Streamlined Heavyweight 6-Crew Dormitory 48-Revenue Seat Coach

102 Streamlined Heavyweight 8-Seat Lunch Counter 8-Seat Dining 8-Seat Lounge 24-Revenue Seat Coach

DEEP SOUTH Streamlined Heavyweight 8-Section 1-Drawing Room 3-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

Extra Streamlined heavyweight car was a 6 Crew Dormitory 48-Revenue Seat Coach number 243

In December 1947 new lightweight streamlined coaches from the 3050-3060 series were added to the GULF COAST REBELS.

New Lightweight streamlined 4-Section 8-Roomette 1-Compartment 3-Double Bedroom Sleeping cars were delivered to the GM&O in July 1950 and at least two were assigned to the GULF COAST REBEL.
Car Names were CULVER WHITE, JUDGE MILTON BROWN, SAMUEL KING TIGRETT, and TIMOTHY B. BLACKSTONE.

The GULF COAST REBEL was discontinued in 1958.

PASSENGERFAN AL's STREAMLINER CORNER #2

The CHOCTAW ROCKET CRI&P trains 51 - 52 Between Memphis and Amarilllo nightly each direction 762 miles 9 hours 30 minutes each way. Inaugurated November 17, 1940.

Major Cities served along the route of the CHOCTAW ROCKETS were Little Rock, McAlester and Oklahoma City.

Each of the two CHOCTAW ROCKETS was initially powered by an ALCO or EMD 2,000 hp diesel passenger Cab unit. They replaced older heavyweight stream powered trains on the route.

In the new Streamlined CHOCTAW ROCKETS only the Baggage 30' Railway Post Office Cars were heavyweights. All new lightweight streamlined cars were delivered new from Pullman Standard in a stainless steel finish.

CONSIST ONE

624 ALCO DL103 2,000 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

502 Heavyweight Baggage 30' Railway Post Office Car

350 AMARILLO 68-Revenue Seat Divided Coach

622 SEMINOLE 8-Section 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

430 MEMPHIS 24-Seat Dining 16-Revenue Seat Parlor Observation

CONSIST TWO

622 ALCO DL-107 2,000 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

501 Heavyweight Baggage 30' Railway Post Office Car

351 OKLAHOMA CITY 68-Revenue Seat Divided Coach

623 WEWOKA 8-Section 5-Double Bedroom Sleeping Car

431 LITTLE ROCK 24-Seat Dining 16-Revenue Seat Parlor Observation

Replaced by RDC's in 1951 named CHOCTAW ROCKETTE see later installmant.

PASSENGERFAN AL's STREAMLINER CORNER #3

On November 17, 1940 the Illinois Central inaugurated a new Jacksonville - New Orleans train named the MISS LOU. it was named for MISSissippi and LOUisiana the two states it served. The train was a single car AC&F Railcar of a single ended type so tuning at each terminal was necessary. The seating capacity of the car was 61 and it was a racially divided car with colored section seating 24 and white section seating 37. In addition there were separate entrances and restrooms in each. The car number was 131 and departed Jackson, Miss at 6:45 AM with arrival in New Orleans at 10:45 AM. The train covered the 183 mile trip in four hours for a 45.8 mph average.
The return trip to Jackson departed New Orleans at 6:45 PM and arrived in Jackson at 10:45 PM. The train was replaced by a steam powered heavyweight train in 1942 and was returned to ACF where the car was rebuilt to a double ender and sold to the NYS&W.

PASSENGERFAN AL'S STREAMLINER CORNER #4

At the same time the IC inaugurated the MISS LOU they introduced a second AC&F Railcar train the ILLINI between Champaign and Chicago covering the 126.4 mile trip each way in 2 hours 35 minutes. The Railcar was numbered 130 and seated 70 passengers in one compartment with a pair of restrooms and a snack service was provided at passengers seats. Like the MISS LOU the ILLINI was powered by a pair of 225 hp oil engines monted beneath the car floor and each powering one truck. The ILLINI departed Champaign at 7:00 AM and arrived Chicago at at 9:35 AM with 10 scheduled stops and seven condidtional stops along the route. The train permitted passengers to spend the day in Chicago as departure from the windy city was at 6:00 PM and return to Champaign at 10:35 PM.
This train was also withdrawn in 1942 and repalced by a staem powered heavyweight with the car being returned to AC&F where it to was rebuilt to a double eneded car and sold to the NYS&W.

TTFN Al

[siberianmo]

Good Morning!

Nice start to the week, two very well thought out and interesting Posts from members of "Our" Place's Order of the Permanent Stools! Well done! [tup][tup][tup]


Theodorebear Ted Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 06:39:16

The subway cars, interestingly all referred to as "Red Bird" are on the mark insofar as my plans are concerned for the Can-Am underground. Ya takes what's available and affordable these daze - and they met both critreria. I prefer the "silver roofed" cars over the all red. The idea was to have contrasting consists, which was achieved. There was a set, now discontinued and rather difficult to locate, except on eBay - which I don't participate it - where the cars were sliver with a blue stripe. Those would have been a great addition as well. Glad you liked the pix. [tup]

Railroading and the U.S. Civil War always has been a fascinating subject. A few "grade B" movies have been made featuring trains, but none that immediately come to mind.

Having the benefit of hindsight, one just has to wonder why oh why did that first shot at Ft. Sumter have to be fired when it was [?] Looks like the Confederacy didn't fully think out all aspects of what they were getting into. The north with the industry, transportation infrastructure and population must have been a "hands down" favorite for the betting man. The south, on the other hand, always capativated my attention if only for the pride and willingness to uphold their point of view in spite of the odds.

QUOTE: On April 10, 1861, Brig. Gen. Beauregard, in command of the provisional Confederate forces at Charleston, South Carolina, demanded the surrender of the Union garrison of Fort Sumter in Charleston Harbor. Garrison commander Anderson refused. On April 12, Confederate batteries opened fire on the fort, which was unable to reply effectively. At 2:30 p.m., April 13, Major Anderson surrendered Fort Sumter, evacuating the garrison on the following day. The bombardment of Fort Sumter was the opening engagement of the American Civil War. Although there were no casualties during the bombardment, one Union artillerist was killed and three wounded (one mortally) when a cannon exploded prematurely when firing a salute during the evacuation. (from: http://www.civilwarhome.com/)

passengerfan Al Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 07:22:08

My guess is you approve of your Index placement and name! [swg]

Four in one! Now that's somethin' else, indeed. Never heard of the MISS LOU and ILLINI. All added to the next installment of Passengerfan Al's Streamline Corner [tup]

Good luck with your exam - If I recall correctly, today's the day! [tup]

Okay guyz, time to get movin' on with the day. I expect we'll have a rather trimmed down day, given the holiday week - but - I've been wrong before! [swg]

Later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[siberianmo]

G’day All!

PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #27

Here’s something to ponder with regard to our appreciation and fascination with
Classic Trains. Check this advertisement out (from The Official Guide of the Railways – 1956)



Something new for veteran travelers THROUGH SEPT. 29TH

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . NEW YORK CENTRAL RAILROAD . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

For a limited time only
AEROTRAIN CLEVELAND-CHICAGO

This much-talked about, lightweight train offers a new experience in travel – provides fast, conveniently scheduled coach service between Cleveland and Chicago . . . with many attractive New York Central features.

* Hostess service
* Seat service for light meals from a rolling buffet
* Separate bar car
* Air cooled
* Reclining contour seats

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . (Standard Time) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Train #201 – Lv. Cleveland 6:35 AM – Ar. Chicago 12:15 PM
Train #200 – Lv. Chicago 4:00 Pm – Ar. Cleveland 10:45 PM
. . . . . . . . . . . . . Also serving 12 cities in between . . . . . . . . . .


Enjoy! [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

CHECK THE MONDAY SUMMARY and INDEX PAGES FOR MORE GREAT NOSTALGIA POSTS!

[passengerfan]

Good Afternoon Tom and the rest of the gang. Time for a double CR and a round for the house.
Will do more on the MISS LOU and a follow up to the ILLINI as well at a later date
Just thought I would mention I aced my exam and got my license so now i will have some more time on my hands for awhile.

TTFN AL

[siberianmo]

Way to go Al! Wouldn't have expected anything less! [tup] [swg] Have a drink on me! Just what the world needs, more tax consultants! [swg] <grrrrrrrr>

Appreciate the round, as always, Boris wake up and ring the bell! Man oh man has it ever been sloooooooooooow. Figured as much ..... We really need some "afternoon regulars" 'round here ... sure isn't the same anymore without West Coast S Dave and those very timely submissions he used to make. Kept the place movin' just a the time of day we need it most.

Figured you'd make a comment on the NYC Aerotrain - you did SEE it, dintcha [?]

Later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[trolleyboy]

Good afternoon everyone. Tom I need an eye opener of some description this weekend of midnight shifts is starting to wear already [XX(]

Sparce but good. a classic glass is half full. I enjoyed the few opics. NS Loved the shot of the old cadilac even if it was in PC paint [sigh]. I have always liked SD7's and 9's don't no why none were built for Canada but they are a locomotives locomotive if you know what i mean.

Tom the new tube cras look good [tup] funny how they seem to sit higher than the RDC's. I might just be asleep still of perhaps they are on a raised track but good show non the less [tup]

Al Wow full consists right down to the locomotives! [bow] Great show and four at a time no less. who says monday's are boring round here ?

Doug Nice before and afters on the SW. Thanks for the info on the booklet as well. We usually grab the Canadain trackside guide but it just covers canadain rail networls and museum pieces accross this country. It is an odd feeling to see one's name in print. Good luck on your book auction.


naniamo welcome to another north of the boarder guy ! loved that old interior shot.To bad the Via 1 coaches of today aren;t that ornate. If they were people would never leave the rails.


Ted& John Great start on the Civil war stuff,the small bit I put out a couple "daze" ago is pretty much the bottom of the well for me. I'm waiting for the next insatllments, and anything elsecomming from the other sorces around here. Truly interesting stuff. as Tom said a couple of B movies on the topic is about the sum total of my knowledge of the subject.And since what i have seen has been basically all hollywierd I take that info woth the appropriate grain of salt.

I caught the last half of that CPR program as well. I should invest in the odd TV guide, then I would know when and when not to set the VCR [sigh]

I caught your joke from before just figured i would let it slide and perpetuate it. As the old saying goes when in Rome....

Tom Nice ad for the aerotrain, an interesting service to be sure. In case you were unaware ( and I'm sure you are not ) Bowser makes a nice model of it, and it has their new improved flywheel drive now so your public utility doesn't need to up the amperage to your house when you run it. Might ,make a nice addition to your Union station.

I'm not too worried about getting lost in TO next year. As long as we keep the lake to our south I'm okay [swg][:D]. Of coarse as long as we make it back to yonge street wee are good too. The Yonge subway line runs right into the bowels of Toronto Union,I can here the three chime door bells now.

Noooo Boris bwooong gwooong bwooong bwoink ! Opps looks like awk dive bombed in and rescued his perch.Wonder if that wikll leave a mark on our cloven hooved whatchacallit ?


Rob

[trolleyboy]

I'm back again Al Way to go my friend, so how much to prepare my taxes[?] [swg]

Tom I'll join al in that CR I'm feeling abit more awake now.Here's a speed chart from the CPR Pacific Region Laggan Subdivision. Time Table 83 which was in effect starting 24:01 sunday October 30th 1960 All times etc are Mountain Standard Time.

Laggan Subdivision Foot Notes and Speacial Instructions

Permanent Slow Orders/Location Permissable speeds Pass Frieght
mileage 0.0 to 5.0 (on curves ) ........................................................... 45mph..40mph
mileage 5.0 to 2.0 (on curves ) ........................................................... 50mph..45mph
mileage12.0 to 16.6 " ............................................................ 45mph..40mph
" 16.6 to 16.9 " ............................................................ 35mph..30mph
" 16.9 to 28.5 " ............................................................ 45mph..40mph
" 28.5 to 29.0 " ............................................................ 45mph..40mph
" 30.0 to 36.0 " ............................................................. 50mph..45mph
" 36.0 to 51.6 " ............................................................. 60mph..45mph
" 51.6 to 54.0 " .............................................................. 50mph..45mph
" 54.0 to 57.0 " .............................................................. 45mph..40mph
" 57.0 to 61.0 " ............................................................... 50mph..45mph
" 61.0 to 62.0 " ............................................................... 30mph..30mph
" 62.0 to 77.0 " ............................................................... 50mph..45mph
" 77.0 to 79.0 " ............................................................... 45mph..40mph
" 79.0 to 88.0 " ............................................................... 40mph..40mph
" 81.9 to 82.1 Passing Bamf station & grade crossings........ 20mph..20mph
" 88.0 to 92.3 ( on curves ) ................................................................ 50mph..45mph
" 92.3 to 94.2 " ................................................................ 45mph..40mph
" 94.2 to 104.0 " ................................................................. 50mph..45mph
" 104.0 to 112.0 " ................................................................. 60mph..45mph
" 112.0 to 121.0 " .................................................................. 40mph..40mph
" 121.0 to 122.2 " ................................................................... 30mph..30mph
" 122.0 to 125.0 " ................................................................... 30mph..20mph
" 125.0 to 136.6 " ................................................................... 25mph..20mph

Yard limits Calgary extend to yard limit sign west of Sunlta.
Yard limits Kieth extend to yard limit sigen east of Robertson
westward trains must obtain terminal clearance at Calgary and may leave sunalta without clearance.
Trains between Calgary and Sunalta,will be goverened by Terminals Timetable page 9.Times shown at Calgary are for information only.
Eastward trains holding main track for meets on westward trains at Cathedral must stop for clearance sign located 650 feet west of east switch.
The switching lead of the east end of exshaw yard must NOT be used as a meeting for passing trains.Trains MUST enter and leave the exshaw siding by use of turnout immediatly west of bridge mileage 57.0. The position of the siding switch is normal when set for switching lead.


This is taken from the Nick Morants Canada book.

Rob

[pwolfe]

Hi Tom and all.

A pint of the usual please.

Great time Saturday with Tom and Bride in Hermann.

Some really good posts, photos and links over the Weekend[tup].

BARNDAD DOUG.[#welcome] back. [wow] what a great post on the Signalman.That job wasn't for the faint of heart with the long hours, weather, snakes and the need for constant vigalance.The term Signalman has a Different meaning in the U.K. it is used for the man controlling the train movements. There are still a few of the old signalboxes around controlling semaphore signals. Can you tell me what the title of the man who worked the signals over here was [?].The department who repaired the signals etc. was known as the Signal&Telegraph.On the preserved Severn Valley Railway they have the Diamond shaped discs which were used to indicate to the S&T man there was a problem in the section controlled by that signal-box.
What a great title" Fallen Fan Railmags" were there many that went under over here[?].

TED Thanks for the Civil-War post.It is very interesting. I am looking forward to the next installment[tup]This was probably the fist time that the importance of railroads in war-time was realised. Thanks DAN for the book reference.

MIKE Is the Vermont Central Stephenson Bridge still in use[?]. The first Tubular bridge he designed and erected was at Conwy in North Wales which is still used today. There was a larger version built over the Menai Strait which separates the Welsh coast with the Isle of Anglesey. There was a fire in the bridge box in the early 70s the bridge was re- built with out the boxes and the main road was added on a deck above the railway, although the railway is now single-track, it was originally doubled in two tubes.

Thanks for the Streamlined Corner AL great info [tup].And WELL done on the exam[wow][yeah]. The single railcar trains must have been a success, they surely were heavily overcrowed before being re-placed by the steam- hauled cars[?].

TOM do you think I resemble the guy standing outside the left hand doors of our place[?], although there is no cycle leaning against the wall.(This was my usual mode of transport back home).
Great pics of the CAN-AM really liked the cars reflection in the lake[yeah][tup].
In the Nostalgia I guess the Aero Train is like the one preserved at St Louis . I have wondered what they rode like.
PETE.
P.S You was right about the cabbage[:I][:-^]

[Anonymous]

Good afternoon everyone. I think just a draught of Piels today Tom. Tomorrow will be a hectic one for me with 3 appointments at Bay Pines V.A. Med. Cen. Its probaby best to go ahead with the last installment on the Civil War tack now. But first, I'd like to compliment Al for his usual excellent treatment of the great streamiliners. G.M. & O. and I.C., now that is a "double header" if ever there was one.[tup]

As mentioned in the last memo, the Battle for Chattanooga was truely a landmark in the strategic use of railways. As that "see saw" battle developed Union Gen. Rosecrans was able to threaten the supply line of Gen. Bragg's army by a pincer movement to cut the Western Atlantic mainline from Atlanta, GA. This forced Bragg to abandon Chattanooga to secure his "life line." Gen Rosecrans, however did not reoccupy the City and soon found himslef under a heavy counter attack from Bragg with reinforcements that had arived by rail from Atlanta. Now, in a defensive position back in Chattanooga, Rosecrans was under siege for weeks in a hopeless postiion for a "break out." When Washington finally understood the catastrophy at hand, Gen. U.S. Grant was dispatched to save the Army of the Cumberland. Grant sent two Corps of another Union command by rail to try to "flank" Braggs army. They made this troop movement with astonishing speed; from the banks of the Rappahannock River to Bridgeport, AL., two full Corps (horses, artillary, stores and all) arrived in just 8 days and non too soon. The North was able to open a supply route to the trapped army before they literally were starved into surrendering en masse. This supply route became known as "the cracker line" and soon, with reinforcements, the North made their "break out." There were ensuing blunders made on both sides but Bragg eventually was in full retreat to Atlanta. This battle was particularly crtical because it effectively ended the threat of the Confederacy's advance toward the West.

I think we can all appreciate the enormous contribution the early railroads made in the 1860s during that terrible conflagration. From the U.S. Civil War onwards, railroads would would be "key" in any future military planning. Even to this day, heavy military ordinance relies on two steel rails over most of the world. Along with serving the implements of war, the railroads also brought back the wounded and untold numbers of possibly fatal medical delays were averted through the effeciency of the crews and management of the nation's railways.

Well, its starvation time from 6:00 P.M. tonight through 1:40 P.M. tomorrow.[V] First the blood, then the CT SCAN, followed immeadiatly by Plastic Surgery Lab. So, I'll be "among the missing" until Wednesday. Okay Boris, hit "the rounds on me" bell and I'm outta here. Gadfrey, he put a donut on my head![:O][alien]

[trolleyboy]

Ahternoon Pete. I don't know about the uS but they are calle dsignal main tainers on the CN / CP and their assosiated US roads.

Neat info on the bridges. Too bad the Victoria Bridge was torn down in the 50's.It was used by car traffic Grand trunk and later CN trains. It also cared caternery for the GT/CN owned Montreal and southern Counties interurbans to run on. It's big claim to fame besides it's ornateness was how narrow it was. The MS&C cars were built narrow speacifically to fir accross the bridge. Which ws raized in 1956 for the building of the St Lawrence Seaway.

Note to chef Nick No cabbage for the thanksgiving dinner on thursday.LOL

Ted Loved installment number two.Show the practcality of railways for defence purposes. Hoope all goes well tomorrow for you. I'll be sure that Boris whips up a rip roaring batch of prune smoothies and danish for your return on Wed.He says that he misses you already. Even his battle scarred buddy seems a bit sad atb the prospect of you being absent a couple of daze. BTW you have mail.


Rob

[wanswheel]

Good evening Tom and OUR PLACE guys

This will be brief because I doubt if I'll be able to post it. The mechanix of posting has been giving me grief. You have no idea how much of my beautifully composed laborious (Hey, that could be a nod to Boris) typing has been lost to the etherial ethics of ether.

Ted good luck at the VA tomorrow and I salute your great posts on Civil War
Congrats to Al and re Gulf Coast Rebel, a little pic, halfway down on the right: http://www.jelsma.com/prints_new.html
Thanks Rob for answering Pete's question about the bridge over troubled waters (Simon said to get silly) because I had no idea about the current's of the St. Lawrence.
Doug nice shot of a good old Davenport, which I'm partial to because the
word Davenport is on my birth certificate. So it's not just a place to Cry and Pee,
for crip's sake, that's good to know.

Mike

[siberianmo]

G’day!

What a sloooooooooooow day, but all of a sudden some activity! So, on to the acknowledgments!

trolleyboy Rob Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 15:50:44, 16:38:12 and 16:50:56

Where in Hades have ya been! <Geesh> How in the world are we supposed to carry one when the “Inner Circle” completely bails out on me[?] <Geesh II> Fine, fine – blame it on work, [yeah] right! Seems to me that excuse is well worn thin these daze! [swg]

Nice Inclusive Post! as always. [tup]

I do think it’s an optical contusion [?] regarding the height of those R17 subway cars compared to the RDC’s. The tracks are all at the same level. Okay, okay – I’ll get out my micrometer! [swg]

Lost in TO[?] Not as long as moi is aboard – a skilled, trained and certified Navigator of the U.S. Coastal Protective Service (aka: U.S. Coast Guard). I “found’ Europe from Boston, I can surely find TO’s Union Station should our “host of hosts” become disoriented! [swg]

Those R17 subways cars are on the same level tracks as all the other consists within the Union Station platform area. Must be an “optical contusion” of sorts! <huh?> Okay, okay, I’ll go fetch my micrometer just to make sure that the heights are the same or lower than the RDC’s. [swg]

I’ve refrained from the “formal’ welcome aboard for your fellow countryman on Vancouver Island. Just waitin’ to see whether he’ll come back willing and able to participate along the lines we all have come to enjoy. I wonder ……..

No go with the Aerotrain on the Can-Am. Wrong period of time for a “fit.” You may recall that no passenger trains operate on my layout unless I’ve ridden ‘em in real life. That’s the criteria. The exception to the rule lies with those “commemorative runs” for consists like the “oriignal’ CP “The Canadian,” and the like. Those trains “reside” in my display cases and are pulled out just for special runs. KInda like my VIA Rail EMD E8 A/A “smoothsides” consist presently at Union Station – just love that one! [yeah]

Nice works for the “Laggan Subdivision.” [tup][tup]

Regarding the U.S. Thanksgiving dinner – it is traditional to have turkey and dressing. Since we haven’t heard from our Chief Chef [C=:-)] Nick lately, the burden is on you to put the menu together. And absolutely NO cabbage! <yuck>

pwolfe Pete Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 16:40:57

Way too few pix on Sunday, but glad you enjoyed what was there. We really need to reinvigorate this idea, or come up with something else. Getting’ a bit “old” being in the boat, rowin’ by myself insofar as regulars are concerned that is.

I suppose that character on the porch COULD be you. Hadn’t quite thought of any of ‘em that way, but why not![?] [swg]

Cabbage is “predictable,” Mate! [swg] By the by, there’s an Email response sent your way …

Theodorebear Ted Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 16:45:58

Nice fini***o the Civil War piece and the relevance to railroads. [utp][tup]

I know all about fasting the night before – do it every 3 months whether I need it or not, so to speak. Good luck with the “procedures”! We’ll be here upon your return ……

wanswheel Mike Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 18:27:43

Hang in there, Mike – practice DOES make perfect! Look – you can always DELETE your post. Just check out the options available to you in the upper right hand corner of your Post. Should show “Delete – Edit – Quote” – but you must be signed in to see these options. Once you make a Post and determine that it is not up to whatever you wanted it to be – you can Delete and start over – or Edit it. I’d recommend COPYING it BEFORE deleting – that way you can “paste” it back to the “message block,” then correct or add, etc. Just takes practice … you’ll get there.

We all appreciate your participation! [tup]


Catch y’all later!

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]

[trolleyboy]

Good evening again gents. Tom I think that it was an optical delusion I'm sure, don't worry about the micromiter,you aren't one of those modellers that has one are you [?][:O]

The aerotrain might make a nice museum piece[swg] for the old canam cupboards. Just a thought. Also I'm glad toknow that I won't need to bring a compass next year [swg]

BTW the Monday index looks quite nice very full bodied,nice to know that we have that much information at our collective fingertips.[tup]

If the good chef is unavailable thursday, the lovely ladies from KW have decided that they would love to help. Since they are friends and known to us here they are waving their usual extravigant catering fees. ( Yes they are licensed caterers as well as arm wrestling champs,makes wringing the birds neck easier don't you think [:O][XX(] They do insist on only the freshest of ingrediants. After the greta cabbage incident during oktoberfest they will NOT be serving cabbagr rolls or any sort of ***. Full menue to follow.

Turkey ( wild as shot by the boyz )
Duck ( roasted and peking for those wishing an oriental flavour )
Ham ( likley aa full pig roast knowing the ladies ham is a usual thanks giving extra )
Mashed potatoes
Salad
Yams & squash
and of coarse pumkin and apple pies as desert
Oh and Boris say's that he and Tex are making their tex/mex K ration casarol.

The last to be avoided at all costs !


Mike Glad you liked the bit on the bridge,for my part your posts are comming in fine,does take a bit of getting use to,but keep at her we aren't going anywhere. [tup]


Well I'm off for now have another coat of paint to out on a third avenue arched roof car kit.Then to some detail work on it,and mating an old bachman drive. Gotta do it when I'm in the mood.

TTFN Rob

[siberianmo]

Yo Rob! Looks like we're just about to close up and I hate to do this to ya - but - Tweeeeeeeeeet, Tweeeeeeeeet! Rules violation! Rules violation! Rule #2 - failure to order a drink! Boris ring it loud 'n clear - trolleyboy Rob is springin' for the house! [yeah][wow][swg]

One of those nights again - woke up just a couple of minutes ago thinkin' that I had a full night's sleep! <Geesh!> Saw the lights still on, with Leon the Night Man behnd the bar. Gimme one of those Southern Comfort's on the rocks - ahhhhhh, nice! That'll put the ole body back to rest. [zzz]

Nice menu for Thanksgiving - I'm sure the customers will love it. What time is [dinner] to be served [?] I gave the gals the day off, so you may have to come up with some "help" in addition to the "lovelies" you brought in from Deutchsland. [swg]


Looks like RailImages is still down ........

Okay, Mate - thanx for stoppin' in - time to close up!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[siberianmo]

TUESDAY’s INFO & SUMMARY of RECENT POSTS

We open at 6 AM (all time zones, don’t ask how we do that!

Good Morning! Coffee’s fresh and hot; pastries from The Mentor Village Bakery are delicious and the <light> breakfasts are waitin’ to be prepared! So, whaddyawaitinfor [?]

Info for the Day:

(1) Wednesday is “Pike Perspectives Day!”
(2) Thursday is U.S. Thanksgiving – “special menu” in effect.
(3) Friday is “Stean ‘n Fries Nite!”
(4) Saturday is “ENCORE! Day,” where we repeat some memorable Posts.
(5) Sunday we are CLOSED and it’s Sunday Photo Posting Day!

SUMMARY

Name …..…………… Date/Time …..…..………. (Page#) .. Remarks

(1) siberianmo Tom Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 00:45:07 (169) Monday’s Info & Summary

(2) siberianmo Tom Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 00:53:50 (169) Monday INDEX

(3) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 06:39:16 (169) U.S. Civiil War, etc.

(4) passengerfan Al Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 07:22:08 (169) #1 thru #4 Streamliner info

(5) siberianmo Tom Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 08:30:41 (169) Acknowledgments, etc.

(6) siberianmo Tom Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 13:42:34 (169) NOSTALGIA #27 – Ad – NYC Aerotrain

(7) passengerfan Al Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 15:26:02 (169)

(8) siberianmo Tom Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 15:46:57 (169) reply to passengerfan

(9) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 15:50:44 (169) Inclusive Post!

(10) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 16:38:12 (169) Laggan Subdivision Foot Notes and Special Instructions

(11) pwolfe Pete Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 16:40:57 (169) Inclusive Post!

(12) pwolfe Pete Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 16:40:57 (169) Inclusive Post!

(13) Theodorebear Ted Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 16:45:58 (169) Inclusive Post!

(14) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 16:50:46 (169)

(15) wanswheel Mike Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 18:27:43 (169)

(16) siberianmo Tom Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 18:40:52 (169) Acknowledgments, etc.

(17) wanswheel Mike Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 18:43:09 (169) Nice URL

(18) trolleyboy Rob Posted: 21 Nov 2005, 22:25:54 (169) Thanksgiving, etc.

(19) siberianmo Tom Posted: 22 Nov 2005, 01:06:14 (169) reply to trolleyboy, etc.

=======================================
That’s it! [tup][;)]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]
Proprietor of “Our” Place, an adult eating & drinking establishment!

[siberianmo]

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ENCORE! ENCORE! . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

First appearing on page 108: Here’s another Fallen Flag for the gang from Classic American Railroads:

Western Pacific (WP)

Headquarters: San Francisco, CA

Route mileage in 1950: 1,137

Locomotives in 1963: Diesel - 174

Rolling stock in 1950: Freight cars – 5,532; Passenger cars – 29

Principal routes in 1950 (not including subsidies):

Oakland-Stockton-Sacramento, CA-Salt Lake City, UT
Keddie-Bieber, CA
Reno Junction-Reno, NV
Niles-San Jose, CA

Passenger trains of note:

California Zephyr (Chicago-Oakland)
Exposition Flyer (Chicago – Oakland)
Feather River Express (Oakland-Portola, CA)
Royal Gorge (Oakland-St. Louis, MO)
Scenic Limited (Oakland-St. Louis)
Zephyrette (Oakland-Salt Lake City) [RDC’s!]

Enjoy! [tup]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]

[passengerfan]

Good Morning Tom and the rest of the Gang. Time for Coffee and a pastry from the Mentor Bakery.

PASSENGERFAN AL'S STREAMLINER CORNER #5

CITY OF LAS VEGAS UP trains 115-116 Inaugurated December 18, 1956 using a leased Aerotrain set. between Los Angeles and Las Vegas round trip daily 335 miles each way 6 hours 45 minutes eastbound 6 hours 55 minutes westbound.

In one of the early operational assignments for one of the GM AEROTRAIN consists the Union Pacific leased one of the trains for a one year test between Los Angeles and Las Vegas round trip daily.
To say the train was well received is to kind for it was an utter failure that drove many passengers to their cars for the traip from Southern California to Las Vegas. In fact UP terminated the lease two months early and returned the train to GM mostly due to its noisy rough riding characteristics.
The UP named the train the CITY OF LAS VEGAS but it was better known by its passengers as the CRAP SHOOTER'S SPECIAL. In CITY OF LAS VEGAS service one of the articulated cars was removed, this was done so the train would be able to climb Cajon Pass unassisted but this was never the case, in fact a helper was required twice eastbound and westbound for the underpowered train in mountain service. The CITY OF LAS VEGAS provided coach revenue seating for 276 passengers in comfort soimilar to that of a Greyhound Bus which the articulated coach bodies were widened version of. In the center of the train two cars were converted to Buffet and Lounge cars with the one becoming a lounge their was a bar and 28 seat lounge. The other converted cars was known as the "Chuck Wagon" Buffet car. This car allowed passengers to serve themselves from the buffet and return to ones seat to eat.
The 1,200 hp Aerotrain powere unit was very underpowered for moutainous operations.
The CITY OF LAS VEGAS Aerotrain was discontinued on September 14, 1957 replaced by a full size conventional streamlined CITY OF LAS VEGAS beginning Septemebr 15, 1957. The cars had no numbers but I have taken a little license to show the consist.

1001 GM Aerotrain 1,200 HP Diesel Passenger Cab Unit

1001A Articulated 40-Revenue Seat Coach
1001B Articulated 40-Revenue Seat Coach
1001C Articulated 40-Revenue Seat Coach
1001D Articulated Bar 28-Seat Lounge Car
1001E Articulated "Chuck Wagon" Buffet Car
1001F Articulated 40-Revenue Seat Coach
1001G Articulated 40-Revenue Seat Coach
1001H Articulated 40-Revenue Seat Coach
1991I Articulated 36-Revenue Seat Coach Observation

TTFN AL

[siberianmo]

G'day!

Thanx, Al for the Streamliner Corner #5 ... Crap Shooter's Special, has a nice "ring" to it! [tup][tup]] No small wonder it wasn't well received given the times and place. The mid-50s in California - cars were "in" and the nation was "in love" with 'em.

P.S. You gotta start readin' the Posts - some questions have been "pending" answers ... [swg] Can'tg all be "one way." [tup]

Okay, guys - I'll be here - but will most probably not Post again for a few hours ....

Later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

[passengerfan]

Good Morning Tom and the rest of the gang. Close enough time for a CR and a round for the house.

PASSENGER FAN AL'S STREAMLINER CORNER # 6

LAND O'CORN Illinois Central trains 13-14 inaugurated August 28, 1941 between Waterloo, Iowa and Chicago round trip daily. 275.1 miles each way 550.2 miles round trip 5 hours 40 minutes each way. The two car motorailer train averaged 50 MPH including 14 stops enroute.

The Illinois Central inaugurated a two car Motorailer train built by American Car and Foundry on August 28, 1941 named the LAND O'CORN. The two car streamliner was single ended having a control cab at one end of the lead car 140 only. There were two oil engines mounted beneath the floor of the 140 and and a single oil engin was mounted beneath the floor of the 141the trailing car. The second car 141 was equipped with a diaphragm at each end with the intended purpose of adding a third motorailer unit if traffic warranted.The third car was never built due to the outbreak of WW II in December 1941.
After a grade crossing accident with a semi-truck on February 18,1942 at Plato Center, Illinois that left the engineer dead and 25 passengers injured the Illinois Central withdrew the LAND O'CORN, ILLINI and MISS LOU from service replacing all three motorailer trains with conventional steam powered heavyweight trains. The four motorailers were returned to American Car and Foundry who rebuilt them to double ended cars and sold them to the NYS&W.

CONSIST

140 Control Cab 70-Revenue Seat Coach Motorailer

141 Trailer 39-Revenue Seat Coach 8-Seat Dinette 8-Seat Lunch Counter Motorailer

Will add the postwar streamlined ILLINI, MISS LOU, and LAND O'CORN another day.

Hope this answered some of the questions on the IC Motorailers.

PASSENGERFAN AL'S STREAMLINER CORNER # 7

The D&RGW introduced two mini-streamliners on Novembver 17, 1941 for overnight operation between Denver and Salt Lake City named the PROSPECTORS. The trains numbered 7-8 covered the 570 miles in 14 hours 30 minutes each way. The two car stainless steel streamliners were diesel electrics with Hercules diesels mounted beneath the floor of each car serving generators that supplied power to the truck mounted traction motors. The Hercules diesels would probably have not caused any problems on any other railroad but the high altitudes and numerous 2.2 % grades played havoc with the two trains. The Roots blowers were not of large enough capacity to to supply the necessary air for equal compression to all cylinders at high altitudes. The two car mini-streamliners lasted in service from November 17, 1941 until July 4, 1942 when they were withdrawn from service and replaced with conventional steam powered heavyweight trains. At that time they were stored behind the Rio Grande shops in Denver and eventually returned to Budd where they were quietly scrapped.
Budd would eventually find success with a similar idea the Budd RDC following WW II.
The two consists were numbered M-1 and M-2.

M-1 CONSIST

JOHN EVANS Cab Baggage Compartment 44-Revenue Seat Coach

DAVID MOFFAT 8-Section 2-Cabinets Buffet 8-Seat Dining 4- Seat Lounge Observation

M-2 CONSIST

BRIGHAM YOUNG Cab Baggage Compartment 44-Revenue Seat Coach

HEBER C. KIMBALL 8-Section 2-Cabinets 8-Seat Dining 4-Seat Lounge Observation

TTFN AL

[siberianmo]

G’day All!

PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #28

Here’s something to ponder with regard to our appreciation and fascination with
Classic Trains. Check this advertisement out (from The Official Guide of the Railways – 1956)



Extra service at no extra fare!

Route your passengers on the Central’s newest train

OHIO XPLORER CLEVELAND-CINCINNATI

Built for the Central by Pullman-Standard, the beautiful, lightweight all-coach Xplorer brings a new look to American railroading. Travelers will appreciate being introduced to this train and its convenient schedule.

*Hostess service
*Seat service for light meals from a rolling buffet
*Air cooled
*Reclining contour seats
*Separate bar-lounge car

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . (Standard Time) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Train #421 – Lv. Cleveland 6:45 AM – Ar. Cincinnati 12:15 PM
Train #422 – Lv. Cincinnati 1:45 PM – Ar Cleveland 7:15 PM
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Also serving 8 cities in between . . . . . . . . . .

. . . . . NEW YORK CENTRAL RAILROAD . . . . .


Enjoy! [tup]

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

CHECK THE MONDAY SUMMARY and INDEX PAGES FOR MORE GREAT NOSTALGIA POSTS!

[trolleyboy]

Good afternoon everyone. tom I'll grab a CR while I digest all of Al's passenger train info.My but that'a alot of stuff [tup] . The "Crap shooters speacial " seems fine and appropriate to me but that's with 5 decades of hindsite,times were a tad more civilized then I suppose. Oh well time marches on.

Tom I thought I had ordered a drink last nigth , but on rechecking the post i hadn't. [oops] I'm sure that the CPR section gang enjoyed the round however.

To answer your question's, dinner will likley be served around sixish ( allows the CN and CP track gangs to make it in )Also the girls can indeed have the day off ( don't think the bath tub pool could stand the strain of the time and a half for them [xx(] ) Helga and Hilda are bringing their friends and family to help,known locally as" Wagner's coven". Best to keep Boris locked up we know what almost happened over halloween [:-^][:O]

Bit of a slow day again but the encores are a good thought since they weren't needed on saturday.Always nice for the refresh helps keep things in focus. I'll be back with my two cents in a moment or so.the only keeper I'll post this week don't want to give you a full time secretaries job afterall. [swg]


Rob

[trolleyboy]

Okay so up next in continuation of today's classic passenger train scheme of things....


Classic CNR Steam #4 Passenger and Mixed Trains to Niagara Falls


These are the passenger and mixed trains that called on Niagara Falls Ontario in the mid to late 50's. As layed out by Ian Wilson's Steam to The Niagara Frontier.


Number 86

Hamilton to Niagara Falls section of number 83. Modified schedule on sunday's.
Cars off number 83 in Hamilton formed consist of train 86. Engine came off of number 95 from Niagara Falls. Usually a stream lined 6400 or a 6200 class northern.

Number 87 and 84

Fastnight mail train Toronto to Niagara Falls . Did not officially handle passengers: not listed in the public timetable.Most express to Hamilton came in on 87, by the caar load. About 90% , if not all express to Niagara Falls came in on 84. Circa december 1957, carried storage car of box baggage or refridgerator type for Hamilton and Hamilton transfer mail, set off in Hamilton and returned on No. 108. circa may 17 1956 at least one (each) Toronto-St Catharines and Toronto-Niagara Falls express reefers, carried mail in authorized space in baggage car between Hamilton and Niagara Falls. At Merriton , the switcher removed at least one express car from 84 and set it behind the station for unloading and transfer to NS&T Red Onion. The consist of train 84 at Niagara falls wa used to make up numbers 95 and 91. Usually powered by a Bullet Nosed betty until mid 1954. After which older mountains or 6400 class streamilined mountain or older Northerns became the norm. Engine would return on afternoon local 91-92

Number 89-90

Toronto to Niagara Falls leg of over night Maple Leaf CN-LV train to New York city. Normal consist was a LV baggage/smoker two LV pullman cars ( for Philadelphia and New York),CN coaches and parlour cars to Niagara Falls,and LV coach to New York.carried mail in authorized space in baggage car between Toronto and Suspension bridge . Normal power was any variety of Northern or Mountain, with the occastional Hudson. Engine returned to Toronto next morning on 93-94

Number 91-92

Daily afternoon local passenger train,Niagara falls to Toronto. Normal power was a bullet nose betty ( mountain type 6060 series ) , occastionally a northern.Return movement for engine on night train 87/187 - 84/184. Cirac may 17 1956 carried Hamilton/ Toronto express reefer. Did not carry mail,except in baggage during Christmas season.

Number 93-94

Niagara Falls to Toronto leg of overnight Maple Leaf from New York city.Engine was off train 89-90. RPO worked between Toronto and Niagara Falls on 83-86 & 93-94. Discharged mail on the fly at Beamsville. Normal consist out of Niagara Falls was RPO LV baggage/smoker , two LV sleepers(pullmans) , CN coaches and parlour car from Niagara Falls and LV coach.Extra express cars on some days. Power was off of 89-90.


Number 95

Niagara Falls to Hamilton section of number 6. Carried mail in authorized space in baggage car between Niagara Falls and Hamilton. normallt powered by a Pacific assigned to Niagara Falls ( until april or may 1956 )After that time ,powered by engine off train 102.

Number 101-102

Daily passenger train, Toronto to Niagara Falls. Heavy with head end cars. Carried RPO ( not on Sundays ) . Also carried mail in authorized space in baggage car between Toronto and suspension bridge. discharged mail on the fly at Grimsby Beach and Vineland. Circa may 17 1956,carried Toronto - Hamilton express reefer. Consist included parlour car amd Montreal sleeper ( pff number 17 at Toronto ); this equiment returned on train 107-108. normal power was bullet nosed betty untill mid 1955,then streamlined northern ( 6400's ). Engine returned to Toronto on 107/108

Mixed Train 218

Originally Stratford- Fort Erie mixed trains aperating as M218-M219,engine making two-day round trip out from Stratford. Express cars were lifted by M218 at places such as Caledonia,Dunnville,St Thomas. On most days , there was a CN reefer behind the tender on arrival at Fort Erie. On the trip home M219 lifted an express reefer of fish at Dunnville,which was handed to M238 at Caledonia for furtherance to New york city via train 90 from Hamilton. On the trip home M219 luifted express casr at Brantford. Effective april 27 1958 , trains operated between Stratford and Brantford as M218/M219 while former London-Fort Erie way freights 510/511 were modified to run between London and Brantford as 510/511 and between Brantford and Fort Erie as M220/M217.Until early 1957.regular power was a light pacific assigned to Stratford, after which Stratford assigned Mikado's took over. From april 1958 onward,Stratford assigned Mikados handled trains between Stratford and Brantford and Mimico assigned Northerns handled trains between London and Fort Erie.Steam last used on this train in april 1959.

Fort Erie Race Trains

Passenger extras Toronto to Fort Erie and return during the racing season ( spring and summer ). Consist made up of buffer ( non passenegr carriing car ), parlour car and sufficient best available coaches. No stops on Oakville subdivision west of sunnyside. Stopped briefly at Welland in both directions.Returned immediatly following last race. any suitable passenger power was used including Northerns mountains hudsons or heavy pacifics.

Picnic Trains

Anual picnic trains for big industries in the Hamilton area, went to Crystal Beach. Passengers were dropped at the beach,then engine went to Fort Erie to turn. Picnoc trains used commuter coaches laying over. again any suitable passenger power was used.

Enjoy Rob

[pwolfe]

Hi Tom and all.
A pint of the usual and a ham sub please.

Thanks ROB for the info on the Laggan sub and the Stephenson Bridge.Is there any photos of it[?]. Next year is the 200th anniversary of the birth of another great Victorian engineer Isambard Kingdom Brunel. I am reading a article about him and will try to add some more later.The Thanksgiving dinner menu looks wonderful.[tup]

MIKE Great link showing the paintings.[tup] The one showing Green Bay depot is especially good as I was up there in May the depot is now a Brew-pub and restaurant but the building looks the same.

Thanks AL for the Aero Train info. I wonder if they ever thought about installing a more powerful engine in the Power-cars.[?]

Another good Nostalgia TOM[tup].
Off to get a haircut now.[V] Hope to call in later PETE>