Some Random Classic Pics perhaps worthy of Discussion

[Miningman]

1)  

Excerpt from SEDs at Los Alamos by Benjamin Bederson

https://history.aip.org/phn/11410017.html

I entered the army through the draft in 1942, possessed of 2½ years of college (City College of New York) as a physics major. At some time in 1943 I had found myself happily back in college, at Ohio State University, taking an electrical engineering course courtesy of the Army Specialized Training Program (ASTP). This program was intended to teach technical skills to soldiers for an army that was experiencing ever-increasing demands on such skills in fighting a modern war. Just as I was completing this course in January 1944, the Army announced that it was going to abandon the ASTP because of the increasing demand for combat troops in Europe and the Pacific. Coincidentally, at that moment my commanding officer asked me if I would be interested in being interviewed for a new project, called the Manhattan Project, where my physics and engineering training, such as they were at the time, might come in handy. And, he remarked, this might get me back to my beloved Manhattan, of whose affection I had made no secret in Columbus, Ohio. Needless to say, I jumped at the opportunity, and shortly thereafter was interviewed by a visiting board of three civilians. They asked rather peculiar questions, I thought at the time, consisting mainly of elementary physics questions, for example about Newton’s laws, and about my career interests.

 

A few days later I received orders, marked Secret, along with a train ticket, to proceed to a town called Knoxville, Tennessee, to be met there by a car that would take me to another town called Oak Ridge. On the train I met several other GIs who also had received the same orders. We arrived in Oak Ridge to discover a city in the throes of heavy construction. There was orange-red mud everywhere, and a number of tall buildings with a peculiar look – if I hadn’t known better I would have sworn they were moonshine factories, and in view of their location in the hills of Tennessee, I first thought that the government was secretly manufacturing Tennessee sour mash on a huge scale – perhaps to drop huge vats of it over Europe to disable German troops. It turned out that the plants were indeed distillers, only not for whiskey but rather for the gaseous diffusion separation of U235 from U238. Of course, I didn’t discover this until later. I was assigned to the Special Engineering Detachment – the SED, and I remained in it until my discharge in January 1946.

 

Something unusual was obviously going on at Oak Ridge, since among other reasons, while we were quartered in barracks they were cleaned, and our beds made, by local young girls! No KP, latrine duty, or even drill – not a typical army experience. Instead, we were given a series of tests and interviews. After about a week I received new shipping orders, this time to report to an address in Santa Fe, New Mexico. Again I traveled by civilian train, to a town called Lamy. That was when I discovered that the Atchison, Topeka and Santa Fe railroad did not (and still doesn’t) go to Santa Fe… 

http://bederson.org/bensr/SEDs%20at%20Los%20Alamos.pdf

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODTsADmlcAk

 

2)  New Home of Facebook

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/03/nyregion/facebook-nyc-office-farley-building.html

[Flintlock76]

All those thousands of people involved, and the secret was kept right up to the end. 

Yes, they only knew about the particular piece of the puzzle they were working on, but they still kept their mouths shut about the piece.  Says a lot.  

Except for a few who didn't, but their story doesn't belong here.

Speakig of "The Gadgets," did you know if things had gone a little differently they might  have been dropped by RAF "Lancasters?"  Here's the story.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XX9ptCNpik  

[Overmod]

Flintlock76

Speakig of "The Gadgets," did you know if things had gone a little differently they might  have been dropped by RAF "Lancasters?"

That was in the era of German nuclear target priority and the use of the Thin Man plutonium gun bomb.  The part of the Lancs that made the difference was the special drop gear.  In a world where parachute retarding was not advisable, I tremble to think of the survivability of those Lancasters...

 

[Flintlock76]

Overmod

 In a world where parachute retarding was not advisable, I tremble to think of the survivability of those Lancasters...  

Well, the concept of parachute bomb fall retarding was known by that time, the Air Force making use of it during very low level bombing missions, they called them "parafrags," so parachutes could  have been applied to the A-bombs if needed, it wouldn't have been difficult.

The only other airplane capable of carrying A-bombs would have been the Convair B-32 "Dominator," originally contracted as a back-up for Boeing's B-29, "just in case," but development was agonizingly slow, the B-32's not making it to the Pacific until mid-summer of 1945.  I won't tell the whole story of the B-32, anyone curious can look it up easily.  Suffice to say all B-32's produced (there weren't many) were dropped from Air Force inventory by the end of 1945.  Obviously the Air Force didn't think much of it.  

The Lancs probably could have pulled off the atomic missions, losing that five tons of dead weight would have certainly given them an immediate gain in airspeed, and the bombs would have still had that 45 second interval from drop to detonation, maybe much longer if they put drag chutes on them.

But it's all speculation anyway, since the scenario never happened.  

[pennytrains]

The soviets did drop them by parachute.  Or at least, they did with this one:

75 years ago the term "Hibakusha" was invented.

[Overmod]

Flintlock76

... parachutes could  have been applied to the A-bombs if needed, it wouldn't have been difficult.

Perhaps I should have worded that a bit more strongly: parachute retardation was clearly an option, and a technically much-preferred one for obvious reasons, but was specifically rejected for the early A-bomb drops.  This is not a matter of speculation.

As I recall, the stated military reasoning was that a retarded drop would provide more time for them enemy' to shoot at the device to disable it (or fire any salvage fuzing early) if they recognized it, but (in my opinion much more importantly) in the event of nondetonation the drop would lovingly convey to the Japanese a near-intact copy of $4B of applied secret research.  They certainly had physicists who would know more or less exactly what it was, and how to reverse-engineer most of its details.

It has been my opinion since reading about the Lancasters in the Groves book that parachute retardation would have been needed for that aircraft's survival, and that rejection of that aircraft type would have functionally followed regardless of any 'American carrier for American bomb' chauvinism actually involved.

 

[Flintlock76]

Well, it's all speculation anyway.  It certainly makes a lot more sense as far as a "what if?" scenario than say, "USS Constitution vs. HMS Victory, who would win?" or "What if General Lee had an atomic bomb at Gettysburg?"  

And considering the B-29 had its development problems the Air Force was going to have to use something.  As it was the the B-29's "bugs" were sufficiently worked out, although if Air Force historian Col. Walter Boyne is to be believed, and I don't see why not, when all was  said and done the Air Force never loved the B-29 the way they loved the B-17.  

A few more things...

The "Tsar Bomba."  I wonder how many shots of Stoly those Soviet bomber crewmen needed to settle down after THAT mission?  

And Hiroshima's "Shadow People."  In a way, they were the lucky ones.  They never knew what hit them.

[Miningman]

With the end a few years away, the Rock Island, always struggling, gave it a good go with a new look. A household name and a sprawling system it was always the underdog and a railfan favourite.

This certainly gave a good impression and at least pointed to a new and hopeful future.

Never really cared too much for this scheme, always found it a bit garish but it was the times and perhaps in scenes such as this it gave a good impression.

 

[daveklepper]

I liked it and still do.

But then I also liked the McGinnis New Haven scheme and still do.

But thls variation even better:

[Flintlock76]

I saw one of those sky blue "Rock" boxcars pass through Richmond about two years ago, it looked like it had a skin disease but was still recognizable.  Quite a shock to see it though!  

And it seemed the New Haven just couldn't settle on a paint scheme once diesels and modern electrics came along, but the thing is they ALL looked good!  

[Overmod]

Flintlock76

but the thing is they ALL looked good!

Are you sure you want to say ALL?

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4d/New_Haven_Railroad_Daniel_Webster.JPG/800px-New_Haven_Railroad_Daniel_Webster.JPG

[pennytrains]

Well...that one is certainly questionable. 

[Miningman]

Yeah it even toured here through Southern Ontario on the CASO but we showed it the door pronto.

 

[SD70Dude]

I quite like the McGinnis colours, even though I despise the man.

We still have lots of these in revenue service, Illinois Central and/or Grand Trunk Western must have bought a big portion of Rock Island's grain car fleet after the final bankruptcy.  The (very faded) logos and lettering are still readable on many of them.

[Flintlock76]

Overmod

Are you sure you want to say ALL?

Uh, yeah, I see what you mean.  I wasn't aware the "Daniel Webster" even existed.  Well, it's a wasted day if you don't learn something new.  Man, that thing's really ugly!  

Oh well, even Babe Ruth didn't hit a home run every time at bat.

[Overmod]

SD70Dude

I quite like the McGinnis colors, even though I despise the man.

Then you will like the fact that you don't even have to acknowledge that the 'McGinnis' with reference to the paint scheme refers to his wife, who set the thing up (note that it is 'colors' because the business is American).  The 'official' name is the Matter scheme, for the then-famous designer who did the work.

As I have noted before, he went through an AWFUL lot of duds before arriving at the rather delightful elements in the final designs (which play around with the colors depending on locomotive type).  See the YouTube video, but keep aspirin and Dramamine near.

https://vimeo.com/57203024

I am not as certain that I like his version for B&M nearly as much...

[jeffhergert]

SD70Dude

I quite like the McGinnis colours, even though I despise the man.

We still have lots of these in revenue service, Illinois Central and/or Grand Trunk Western must have bought a big portion of Rock Island's grain car fleet after the final bankruptcy.  The (very faded) logos and lettering are still readable on many of them.

 

Many of them went to the CNW and to the SSW.  Of those, most now have been sold off to other owners.  The last ones arrived on the RI in '78/79.  Time is ticking away for them.

Jeff

[SD70Dude]

jeffhergert

Time is ticking away for them.

Jeff

Yes indeed, besides the 40 and 50 year age limitations CN now has a total of 2500 new high-capacity grain cars either in service or on order (all from National Steel Car in Hamilton, ON).  A number of prominent grain shippers out here have also acquired their own fleets over the past few years. 

The ex-Rock Island cars are only a small minority of the soon to be retired fleet, there are still hundreds if not thousands of cylindrical four bay hoppers still in service out here, these being the former Canadian Wheat Board and Provincial government fleets, nicknamed 'Trudeau Hoppers' after the Prime Minister who bought them.  They have been a everyday sight across the Canadian prairies for decades, having replaced the previously ubiquitous 40' boxcar in grain service. 

And yes, despite being modern compared to F-units or steam this iconic Canadian car design is very worthy of preservation.  That's all I can say for now. 

 

[Miningman]

Alberta.... boring!

[SD70Dude]

I was hoping you would find that one, I'd probably get banned again for posting it.

If anyone asks, they are all painted like that (we're very open-minded up here)

[Miningman]

Without the winter.  Still quite nice.

 

[Jones1945]

Miningman

Alberta.... boring!

 

Now, this is really boring:

 

[Miningman]

Indeed! Good one.

[Overmod]

I regret to say it took me a while to figure it out. 

[Miningman]

Over on Trains some folks were discussing the blandness of Amtrak decor versus the fabulous themes in passenger cars post WWII.

For a while though Amtrak gave it a go, perhaps influenced by all the equipment they inherited and tradition. 

And also in other ways.

[Overmod]

One of the things I did was a proposal for Amtrak dining cars in the great age of purple in Amtrak and AutoTrain decor.  This had tables with the appearance of inlaid marquetry and 'bar finish' clear epoxy for durability, and 'nonwoven' tablecloths and napkins that could be washed but just as easily 'recycled' if badly stained ... or stolen for souvenirs.  After eating hours the tables folded down against the walls and the car became a disco with a full light show and sound system built into the channels in the overhead.

Hokey perhaps but it would have been fun, especially with the car attendants in hot pants...

 

[Miningman]

Certainly far better and classier than WAP! 

[Flintlock76]

Miningman

Alberta.... boring!

 

Mamma mia!  

As a rule I have no use for "tagging" but after seeing that I'll have to rethink things a bit.

It couldn't have come out of the car shop like that, could it?

[daveklepper]

Wish to second the throughts expressed by others about the Danial Webster paint scheme being an exception ot oterwise good designs.

[GeoffS]

My son and I were just out Thursday afternoon train watching along NS north of Duncannon PA @ about MP 125. Did not even turn into our spot when a train comes along of covered hoppers. Gray hopper after gray hopper goes by but near the end another strange color is seen. On this poor faded car it said ROUTE ROCK. I was so shocked to see it I did not get the new owners markings! But, they are still out there!

GEOFF