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Third Avenue Lightweight Streetcars

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, January 17, 2021 5:17 AM

Conduit car as intended as built on Third AvenueL

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, January 14, 2021 1:34 PM

Two on the "T" on Amsterdam Avenue

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, January 4, 2021 10:44 PM

Conduit cars equipped with poles (1947) on the 161st-163rd St. Crosstown, probably on West 155th Street Manhattan just west of 8th Avenue, the Polo Grounds, and the McdCoombs Dam Bridkge to The Bronx, where 186 is headed, with the end point the destination sign shows as Hunts Point.  127 will get as far as Amsterdam Avenue.

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, January 2, 2021 12:31 PM

Midland Mike:  All the lines dikscussed in my posting were built as competitors.  For a short time, all streetcar lines were leased to the Metropolitan Railway, but reverted to the originsal owners shofrtly after that company entered receivership.

Unification in Manhattan between surface and rapid transit took place well after bus conversion and even after end of the South Ferry - Chatham Square part of the Third Avbenue Elevated.

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Posted by rcdrye on Saturday, January 2, 2021 7:08 AM

The Third Avenue line converted to cable in two sections, north of 6th on Dec 4, 1893 and to the Post Office on February 11, 1894. According to Hilton's "Cable Car in America" it required 4350 tons of iron yokes and 46000 barrels of cement.  The cable installation was barely complete before TARS started converting other lines to conduit electric operation.  The Third Avenue line was converted in 1899. Among cable lines Third Avenue was considered number two in traffic density, after Chicago's  State Street line.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Friday, January 1, 2021 11:16 PM

I presume they were built as competitors.  Did they eventually under the same management ?

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, December 31, 2020 10:42 PM

Correct.  First came the horsecar streetcar, Manhattan's second, after the NY & Harlem on 4th Avenue and lower Park Avenue, ,then came the steam-operated elevated, then conversion of the horsecar line to cable. then cable to conduit electrification, then conversion of the steam elevated line to electricity, then rebuilding of the elevated with a continuous center track, then conversion of the streetcar to bus with tracks above 59th Street kept in service several months for use of the 65th Street shops for Queensboro Bridge cars and K and 125 X put-ins and pull-outs, then abandonment and removal of the elevated.

rc can more easily provide the exact dates.

Note correction to a previous post and insertion of the missing photo.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Wednesday, December 30, 2020 9:41 PM

daveklepper

Third Avenue and E. 86th Street, 124 on the line for which it was built:

 

I presume that is the 3rd Avenue El above the trolley tracks.  Which came first, and were they competitors, at least initally?

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, December 30, 2020 2:02 PM

And this previously "unknown location" is on Burnside Avenue west of Webster Avenue.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, December 30, 2020 1:53 PM

Third Avenue and E. 86th Street, 124 on the line for which it was built:

Former conduit car 127 on Tremont Avenue Line on Burnside Avenue approaching  University Avenue:

 

Former conduit car replacing convertabils on the 167th Si. Crosstown approaching the Washington Bridge to West 181st Street, Manhattan:

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, December 24, 2020 3:24 PM

Correct, and usually called the 207th Street Bridge.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Wednesday, December 23, 2020 10:49 PM

daveklepper

 ...ex-Third Avnue Manhattan conduit car 104 entering The Bronx on the 207th Street Fordham Road Crosstown:

 

 

 

 

What bridge is the trolley crossing?  I assume it is over the Harlem River.

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, December 23, 2020 10:30 PM

Formr 59th Street Manhattan conduit car 628 at a Bronx location to be determined, and ex-Third Avnue Manhattan conduit car 104 entering The Bronx on the 207th Street Fordham Road Crosstown:

 

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, November 24, 2020 7:49 PM

AT Third Avenue and 65th Street:

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, November 13, 2020 5:19 AM

Also, on this thread, one of my previously posted photos shows 199 turning the corner possibly just moments after the screen-shot photo, so unless other information is available, I'll assume a missing photo  has been returned to me.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, November 13, 2020 5:14 AM

Yes, the two local track are n the first level, and the bi-directtional, signalled, south in AM, north in PM, express track above.

Its platforms are directly over the local tracks.

This was typical of Manhattan elevated express stations, often called "hump stations."

125th St., 3rd Ave., was an exception, in that north of the station, the express track continued on an upper level to the upper level of the 4-track double-level bridge over the Harlem River.

See the thread on Remembering the Third Avenue Elevated.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Thursday, November 12, 2020 9:59 PM

[

daveklepper

 

There is something very unusual about this photo.  125th & 3rd is the south end of the "K," as it is for the replacement M100 bus today.  Usually, a "K" would turn the corner, change ends, use the spring-loaded trailing crossover, and return to 125th Street for the  run to Marble Hill, Broadway and W. 225th Street.  So why is somebody boarding the car?  Does he plan to ride north although boarding at a southbound car-stop?  Or is about to be told by the operator not to board?  Or is the car a pull-out, headed for the 3rd Avenue & 65th Street Carhouse?  

 

Are there 2 levels of elevated track in the photo?

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, November 12, 2020 8:35 AM

Changing ends at the Foot of Main Street, fan-trip or regular "7" car to Mt. Vernon, while a long-distance New York Central train speeds through the Yonkers Station without stopping. 

The following photo was sent me as taken as a screenshot.  Does anyone know who was the photographer?  Just possibly may have been myself, and a previous posting has another identical "K" car at the same location, 125th St. and 3d Av.

There is something very unusual about this photo.  125th & 3rd is the south end of the "K," as it is for the replacement M100 bus today.  Usually, a "K" would turn the corner, change ends, use the spring-loaded trailing crossover, and return to 125th Street for the  run to Marble Hill, Broadway and W. 225th Street.  So why is somebody boarding the car?  Does he plan to ride north although boarding at a southbound car-stop?  Or is about to be told by the operator not to board?  Or is the car a pull-out, headed for the 3rd Avenue & 65th Street Carhouse?  

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, November 9, 2020 8:22 AM

And returning to Manhattan, we saw 180 at Park Row City Hall in an earlier posting von this thread.  Here it is adjacent to the main shop and carhouse at 65th Street, with the Elevated's 67th Street Station in the background:

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, November 9, 2020 8:13 AM

The northern terminal:

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, November 3, 2020 7:18 PM

Jack May corrected me in that The Bowery and Park Row had four tracks.

The line that came closest to being an interurban in the Third Avenue system  was the New Rochelle (at the NYNH&H Sta.) - Subway (E. 241st St. and White Pl. Rd-Av.) line which connected The Bronx, Mt. Vernon, Pelham, and New Rochelle.  But this was all paved in-street track.   The Yonkers "5" line, Neperhan Avenue, was wholey within Yonkers, but, after TARS' two East River bridge lines quit, had the only revenue track of the system not in pavement.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, November 3, 2020 7:28 AM

  8/31/85    125th & 8th to 186th and Amsterdam
12/01/86    125th St from river to river
12/05/93    3rd Ave from 130th to 6th
  2/11/94    3rd Ave line from 6th to Park Row

Note that at 125th and Third, the north-south cables were located below the original east-west ones.

End of cable operation (the following day electric operation began):

  9/10/99    125th Street from river to river and Amsterdam
10/22/99    3rd Ave from 130th to 65th
11/18/99    3rd Ave line from 65th to Park Row (65th to 6th electric and 6th to Park Row horse starting 11/19, 6th to Park Row electric from 11/24

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, October 30, 2020 7:05 AM

Park Row - City Hall. March 1947:

Third and Amsterdam Avenue Line, but before December 1935 tracks at this location shared with 4th and Madisob line, the successor to the World's original street railwaטץ

 

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, September 7, 2020 10:42 PM

194 near the 125th Street Fort Lee Ferry and then after the last day od Bronx Streetcars (now with trolley pole) in the Bronx West Farms carhouse.  It lasted a few more years in Yonkers:

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, August 29, 2020 4:45 PM

More at the east end of the Washington Bridge:

 

 

 

 

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Posted by daveklepper on Wednesday, August 26, 2020 2:04 AM

Showing the transformation of some of the newest Third Avenue cars from conduit Manhattan cars to pole The Bronx cars, 640 is an example:

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, August 25, 2020 5:43 AM

Jack May, The Bronx expert, told me the concrete structure is not what I thought it was, this confirmed by a resident Transit Authoritiy expert, and that the location is Bascobal Place on Ogden Avenue, a short distance south of the east end of Washington Bridge, and thus 384 is on the "O" Ogden Avenue, the route that crossed the Harlem River twice, running from 155th Street and Amsterdam Avenue to 181st Street and Broadway via Ogden Avenue in The Bronx..

But here is ex-Manhattan 141 on 138th Street in The Bronx:

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, August 24, 2020 6:58 AM

 

  

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, August 24, 2020 1:44 AM

Most of the 1936-1937, first mostly-new-material and regenrative-braling, home-built Third Avenue lightweights in the 301-400 series were assigned to Yonkers and Subway - New Rochelle service.  Exceptions were 397-400, equipped for conduit and assisting 101-200 on Manhattan routes, 101-200 similar, but built by splicing two single-truck cars together.  Also five others, including 374 pictured, were assigned to The Bronx's Ogdan Avenue Line because of its steep grade.  When Ogden Avenue went bus, they were to replace 229th St. - Mt. Vernon convertable cars. 

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, August 18, 2020 1:18 AM

Two ex-Manhattan, conduit, Third and Amsterdam Avenue cars, now with poles for operation in The Bronx, at the 161st  street Bronx Concourse underpass in late 1947:

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