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Classic Railroad Quiz (at least 50 years old).

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Posted by rcdrye on Friday, August 25, 2023 6:55 AM

This particular beast has been elusive, to say the least.  there are plenty of examples of jackshaft drive for electrics and industrial diesels, including several by Baldwin-affiliated Whitcomb.  The only above-the-frame design I've found do far is a New Haven experimental that could be a cousin to the DD1.

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Posted by Overmod on Friday, August 25, 2023 10:56 AM

The actual jackshaft on this one was ahead of and slightly above the drivers.  The engine was higher than that.  I subsequently came across a thread on 'some other forum' that actually had a cab-off view of the mechanicals.

This is all well before the United States entry into WWI.

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Posted by rcdrye on Friday, August 25, 2023 11:14 AM

Was it one of the bizarre diesel-pneumatic ones that started on compressed air with steam like cylinders before clutching up the transverse shaft that drove the jackshafts? 

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Posted by Overmod on Friday, August 25, 2023 3:02 PM

I don't think so.  What I see is a fairly substantial engine mounted squarely over the driver wheelbase, with the jackshaft far out in front.  My guess barring a little better research is that the thing uses some kind of clutch in a mechanical driveline.

I don't see evidence of how that big engine is started.  I'd suspect it would be like the very early V-8 GE gas-electric cars, which used something that is its own potential quiz question.

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, September 3, 2023 8:09 AM

Does anyone still have an interest in this?

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Posted by Overmod on Sunday, September 10, 2023 4:41 PM

I'll leave it open a little while longer, but in the meantime:

Where could you find a system switching freight cars across a road grade crossing using third-rail standard MU equipment?

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, September 11, 2023 9:00 AM

The third rail did not, of-course, continie across the road.  There were several locations  like this on the Chicago Aurora and  Elgine, but I do not recall the exact lolcations.

There may also have some on the Sacramento Northern.

And one on the Long Island Railroad on the Long each branch.  Saw a DD-1 do the chore.

The electric locomotives on all three railroads were mu-equipped, or did you mean MU passenger cars providing the power?

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, September 11, 2023 6:53 PM

Multiple MU passenger cars, I presumed in a set long enough to span the gap at the grade crossing.  At least 2 cars in the picture I saw when I was young.

I am pretty sure there was an adapter coupler to be able to move the freight cars.

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Posted by daveklepper on Tuesday, September 12, 2023 5:28 AM

That rules out the LIRR, which only used locomotives.  If a DD1 was not available, an H6 or H9 consxolidation certainly was.

Possibly the CA&E did this on occasion.  The Chicago Rapid Transit did have a freightp-line gradep-crossing (ex  Milwaukee), but I believe this had overhead wire.   The Sacramento Northern also had freight motors, but may have done this on occasion.  Ditto the Lackawana and Wyoming Valley (One freight motor). The Wilksbarre and Hazelton?

But with the Laurel line having just one freight motor, logically they could passenger equipment when uit was serviced,  But they alsdo use witre on freight sidings.

Is it one of the mentioned operations?

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Posted by rcdrye on Tuesday, September 12, 2023 7:03 AM

CRT would have had coupler problems, as would CA&E.

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, September 12, 2023 11:37 AM

The answer is far more obvious than anything mentioned so far.

Standard steel MU passenger cars, only equipped to operate on third rail.

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Posted by daveklepper on Thursday, September 14, 2023 8:44 AM

Freight delivered nominally by the BMT's South Brooklyn Railroad to a costumer wanting delivery (or pick-up) at the Canarsy Station, with rhe road crossing the last on the subway system at East 105th St. Station.  Not a usual freight origine or destination, freight at Canarsy may have been a  one-time occasion, and the South Brooklyn always used whatever was handy, not just its own equipment.  The MUs were probably standard steels, the usual three-car "B" unit, with cabs  only at each end, and door-control only in the middle car.

And  you did  state that an adapter coupler was  used, not at all unusual for South Brooklyn.

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Posted by Overmod on Thursday, September 14, 2023 9:10 AM

That's it, as amended.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, September 15, 2023 5:01 AM

The reason is that you are correct.  It is East 10o5th Street, and my memory had taken a glitch.  Do you have further informatyion on when and who was the customer and what kind of freight?

Name every railroad whose tracks the Montrealer-Washingtonian used.  For exanmple, don't leave out Washington Union Terminal.

 

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Posted by rcdrye on Friday, September 15, 2023 6:59 AM

Canadian National Railways (Montreal - East Alburgh VT)

Central Vermont Railway (East Alburgh VT - Windsor VT) White River Jct-Windsor operated by Boston & Maine.

Boston and Maine (White River Jct VT -Springfield MA).  Southbound trains operate via CV, northbound via B&M between Brattleboro VT and East Northfield MA.

Boston & Albany (NYC) Springfield Union Station

New Haven (Springfield MA - Bronx NY)

New York Connecting RR (Bronx -Queens via Hell Gate Bridge)

Pennsylvania RR (Queens NY - Ivy City DC)

Washington Terminal Company (DC)

For some periods the train operated Montreal -St Johns QC on CN, connecting with the CV St. Hyacinthe Sub for the remainder of the route.  

B&M's portion was made up of a patchwork of owned and leased lines.  Between Windsor VT and Bellows Falls VT the line was owned by the Sullivan RR (Except for the ends, the entire railroad was in Sullivan County NH).  The portion between Bellows Falls and East Northfield was owned by the Vermont & Massachusetts RR.  Both of those companies remained in existence under B&M control until the entire Conn River Line was acquired by Central Vermont on 1987.

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Posted by daveklepper on Friday, September 15, 2023 7:17 AM

Thanks. Great.  You did include the B&A-NYC and NYConnecting that many would have left out.  And, as usual, I learned something new from your answer.  Look forward to your question.

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Posted by Overmod on Friday, September 22, 2023 3:51 PM

rcdrye, don't forget you're up on this thread, too

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Posted by rcdrye on Friday, September 22, 2023 4:37 PM

In the covered wagon era, carbody modifications were rare, except for side panels.  One railroad did something to an F3 that no other railroad tried. Although the result was not easy to pick up in a photo, it was easily found with a measuring tape.

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Posted by daveklepper on Saturday, September 23, 2023 9:53 PM

Did not the Boston & Maine relocate  the drawbar and coupler further from the centewr for better operation around curves?

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Posted by FRRYKid on Sunday, September 24, 2023 2:43 AM

rcdrye

In the covered wagon era, carbody modifications were rare, except for side panels.  One railroad did something to an F3 that no other railroad tried. Although the result was not easy to pick up in a photo, it was easily found with a measuring tape.

 

Don't know if this qualifies but in 1948, the NP rebuilt the side panels on their F3s as there were problems with the air filters. That changed the early passenger scheme (aka Butterknife) to extend around the front porthole. This then became the Phase II standard.

"The only stupid question is the unasked question."
Brain waves can power an electric train. RealFact #832 from Snapple.
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Posted by rcdrye on Sunday, September 24, 2023 4:53 PM

The modification I'm looking for was only done once, to one unit of a former EMD demonstrator.  From the front and an angle it looks like a normal F3, from the side not so much. This unit and another ex-demonstrator (from the same set) were the only F3s this railroad owned. 

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Monday, September 25, 2023 10:01 AM

The road in question is TP&W, and the unit in question was an F3B that had a cab attached to one end.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by rcdrye on Monday, September 25, 2023 1:14 PM

Yep.  TP&W got half of EMD F3 four unit demonstrator set 291.  TP&W numbered their two units 100A and 100B, the 100B (291B1) was renumbered to 101 when it got a cab  with a nose that was slightly shorter than standard.

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, October 1, 2023 8:59 AM

Waiting for CSS&SB's question.

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Posted by Overmod on Saturday, October 21, 2023 7:50 PM

Bump

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Posted by daveklepper on Sunday, October 22, 2023 1:10 AM

The PRR 11000-Volt-25Hz electrification extended over another railroad, one independent of the PRR, not like the Long Island.

Which railroad?  Where?  Why?  All traffic under the wire, both electric diesel and/or steam.

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Posted by Backshop on Sunday, October 22, 2023 7:16 PM

Wahington Terminal. So that PRR trains could enter Washington Union Station. PRR, B&O, RF&P, Southern.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, October 23, 2023 1:03 AM

Washington Terminal was not an independent railroad.  It was partly owned by PRR. Close, however.

The railroad was a Class I.  The electrification no longer exist, but the reason for it may exist, but with much reduced importance and traffic, although traffic that was once under wire remains strong.

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Posted by Overmod on Monday, October 23, 2023 4:30 AM

This has to be Pot (Potomac) Yard -- familiar to me as the south end and interchange point of the high-speed container train I developed for Conrail.

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Posted by daveklepper on Monday, October 23, 2023 10:39 AM

Yes, Patomic Yard was included, and now name the ralroad the PRR Used to reach it and the nature oif the traffic.

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