Zardoz, I don't like the guy either but this forum isn't for that kind of comment.
I think Bush 41 was a decent, kind man. To me his crowning achievement in office was using his masterful skill in building a worldwide coalition to wrest Hussein out of Kuwait in the Gulf War.
Bush 41 was savaged by his political opposition and the media during his presidency. I think Graves disease he contracted during that time also had a strong impact on him. I think he would have won a second term had Ross Perot not entered the race with his nonsense. As a result Clinton backed in.
I'm very happy that Union Pacific is providing part of the procession to College Station, and wish I could see the train go past on its way. I remember when Bush 41 whistlestopped through our area during his campaign.
May Bush 41 rest in peace.
GrampI think he would have won a second term had Ross Perot not entered the race with his nonsense.
Agree, few people have a real clue about Perot thanks to the velvet glove treatment he got in the Media. Though to be fair, usually the media scruitinizes a candidate once they are nominated..........it's all superficial before then.
As a UP shareholder, I am proud to have Union Pacific participate in honoring President Bush and using #4141 as they are. Great plan. And in the youtube video, George sure enjoyed operating 4141. A fitting goodby.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGrDKR1kf_M&t=10s
This is a story on the funeral train from whatever is left of Newsweek.
https://www.newsweek.com/why-train-carrying-president-hw-bush-thursday-heres-why-and-more-about-his-1246291
I think it may set a new low for journalism. How on earth did the writer conclude that UP locomotive #4141 was originally a postal storage car? Such people walk among us and vote.
greyhounds This is a story on the funeral train from whatever is left of Newsweek. https://www.newsweek.com/why-train-carrying-president-hw-bush-thursday-heres-why-and-more-about-his-1246291 I think it may set a new low for journalism. How on earth did the writer conclude that UP locomotive #4141 was originally a postal storage car? Such people walk among us and vote.
As greyhounds said, the writer is absolutely ignorant when it comes to trains. One could wonder if the writer even knows the purpose of trains.
Johnny
,
Paul_D_North_Jr What did this George Bush do for - and against - the rail industry? Bush was sitting President during the 1991 UTU strike that went to a PEB on a dispute of crew consist size. I was employed as a rr client back then and was yrs away from entering the rail indudtry, thus I did not care dilly poo on how the labor issue was resolved. The award by the PEB abolished the craft of brakeman, resulting the loss of 25,000 trainman positions. Fair or not, most old head employees I have dealt with were not fans of 41
What did this George Bush do for - and against - the rail industry?
Deggesty greyhounds This is a story on the funeral train from whatever is left of Newsweek. https://www.newsweek.com/why-train-carrying-president-hw-bush-thursday-heres-why-and-more-about-his-1246291 I think it may set a new low for journalism. How on earth did the writer conclude that UP locomotive #4141 was originally a postal storage car? Such people walk among us and vote. The comments about the engine were absolutely ridiculous. The casket was to be placed in the engine? The engine was a rebuilt "postal car"? As greyhounds said, the writer is absolutely ignorant when it comes to trains. One could wonder if the writer even knows the purpose of trains.
The comments about the engine were absolutely ridiculous. The casket was to be placed in the engine? The engine was a rebuilt "postal car"?
The fact that it was a funeral train for a former president, who had been a 'friend to the industry, and was honored [as few others in that environement have been]. One thing has been pretty evident G.H.W. Bush; he was a network builder, both foreign and domesticly. He cemented friendships with his heroic letter, and note writing responses to individual's with whom their paths had crossed.
It is pretty obvious that the former president had certaily forged some strong relationships within the management of the Union Pacific, starting under the Richard(Dick) Davidson team. Just the care that has been lavished on the #4141 for over 10 years is testiment to that. He was apparently, a good family man and a patriot, who seemed to live an admirable life. No need for us to beat the guy up after he is dead. The generation that fought and died for honoralble ideals, of the WWII eara are rapidly dying off. Enjoy what they have given to the living, honor them and respect their sarifices.
I noticed a possible gaffe on Fox News this evening--the statement was made to the effect that the casket would be carried in Train 4141; now, if the UP designated the train as X4141, this was correct. I did not notice any gaffe on the NBC news.
The White House relationship with UP railroad goes back to when he was President and used them and CSX for components of his campaign train in 1992 and even before that probably. He has used UP's Executive train on a number of occasions before this including a trip out west to Nevada and Utah, trip from Houston to College Station for opening of his Presidential Library. I am operating off memory but I seem to also remember that President Reagan had a campaign train as well that Bush rode on which they used the old POTUS car the Fernidad Megellian from Florida's Gold Coast Museum? Pretty sure I saw significant UP railroad cars in that Reagan consist as well.
Lending out the Executive train is not unusual for Union Pacific. They have a business relationship with the Perot's as well and Margot Perot has used their Executive train out of Dallas Union Station for one of her charities for fund raising. I am sure that relationship probably either started via joint interest in the charity or the Perot Family did some land deals with UP railroad since the Perot's own a lot of Texas real estate.
Each time the UP uses their executive train for a purpose other than business they may or may not get a tax write off, which depends on the use. Then there is the publicity of having their brand name in the public view. Business Lear Jets operate in the same way and are loaned to politicians and sometimes TV preachers as well for lobbying or for the tax benefits.
As far as the World War II generation dying off. Vince Sparanza is still alive at the age of 94 (or there abouts) and has attended several 101st Airborne reunions. He was a machine gunner at the Battle of Bastongne in World War II and has a lot of decorations. The man is walking history and loves to sing the paratrooper song "Blood on the Risers"......which is awesome even though it has one or two verses that get kind of gory (heh-heh). More than one YouTube video out there with him in it. Battle of the Bulge and the sieze of Bastogne is a milestone in WWII history.
video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4eBy1Y4Cdk
Outside cab view of Funeral Train rolling (Houston & Texas Central RR?):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYqM6Xm2BSU
Deggesty I noticed a possible gaffe on Fox News this evening--the statement was made to the effect that the casket would be carried in Train 4141; now, if the UP designated the train as X4141, this was correct. I did not notice any gaffe on the NBC news.
Jeff
From my phone because my laptop won't log in for some reason.
54light15 Zardoz, I don't like the guy either but this forum isn't for that kind of comment.
I try not to.
jeffhergertFrom my phone because my laptop won't log in for some reason.
Seems to be a bit of that going around...
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Zardoz, I see your point. I used to live in New York and in the 1980s and 1990s, it was like he was one of New York City's mayors, you did not have a day where he was not in the papers along with the police commissioner, the cardinal, Al Sharpton, George Steinbrenner and of course, the mayor.
54light15Al Sharpton,
Russell
54light15 Zardoz, I see your point. I used to live in New York and in the 1980s and 1990s, it was like he was one of New York City's mayors, you did not have a day where he was not in the papers along with the police commissioner, the cardinal, Al Sharpton, George Steinbrenner and of course, the mayor.
Not to change the subject at all, but I lived in the New York area (Northern New Jersey) in the 80's as well, and what 54light' says is true.
It was also common knowledge back then that if Trump said he was going to build something, it got built. If he said he was going to do something, it got done.
Just sayin', and that's all I'm sayin' on that subject.
Tthanks, Jeff. I should have known that in such an instance not only the engine number, but also the owner of the engine has to be specified.
If an engine is running light, is that specified?--I think of the five CSX engines I saw running light and headed west I saw in Iowa a few years ago.
Firelock76It was also common knowledge back then that if Trump said he was going to build something, it got built. If he said he was going to do something, it got done.
You know why that was. Mob involved in Concrete pouring. Some of the other building trades like steel fitters are heavily union and under the table payments help with their building site priorities. Trump had no moral qualms about doing business with any of them with their methods. Not making a moral judgement myself but few people outside of New York and even some that lived in New York were oblivious to these facts. Also, Trump could call in favors from such groups because of his long standing relationships creating issues for a competing building under construction. Then he would jump on the press and degrade the competitor builder as "stupid" or "incompetent". Big reason why he is respected in New York but generally not liked.
If you read his book "Art of the Deal"......which is printed with large font and....well nevermind. Anyways, he details some acts of deception he used in there to obtain building financing. Including one notorious example now of hiring a grading and digging company to just move earth around a lot and then Trump floated rumors that time was running out for investors to get into his great deal of a building (when he had almost no financing). The deception worked but is that really something he should be doing? I have my own reservations.
The one item I do like about Trumps approach to constructing buildings and that is his approach to only using high quality materials and proven construction techniques so much so that his buildings sell for a premium because they are constructed in such a manner and they have a reputation for low maintence costs and durability. So he got that part right at least.
I am sure business schools across the country are having a field day with various Trump examples from the past. His past books are entertaining reading but in many examples he is skirting the law or right on the edge of breaking it. I do think he pays his fair share in taxes though just because his Corporate structure on paper is such a mess.....I think it would take an Army of accountants to figure out how to use his Corporate Structure fully to take advantage of the tax code. I don't think he employs an army of Accountants.
George Bush was a politician and only a long ago businessman. Trump is a first time politician and has always been a businessman. So there is a difference there and you can't really compare the two based on their backgrounds. A more apt comparison would be between Ross Perot and Donald Trump.
No argument with anything you've said. New York is a world all it's own. Everyone else's rules just don't apply. It is what it is.
Let me make a personal confession here, confession is good for the soul after all.
I spent most of the 90's with a full-blown case of Bill Clinton Derangement Syndrome. You know what? It was a waste of my time and energy. I feel like a fool now. So, from now on anyone who gets into the White House, Republican or Democrat, male or female, is only going to get my best wishes and hopes for the best. I've got more important things to do, like learning about this fascinating railroad world. I'll leave the Derangement Syndromes to the chattering classes, chattering is all they're good for. It dawned on me a while ago that for the chattering classes it's all about the game anyway, not what you do with the win.
You know why Mr. Trump won in 2016? My opinion? Because he ran like a businessman and not like a politician. He saw the underserved market and went after it. It worked. I could see it, I wonder why the so-called experts can't. Maybe they're not as expert as they think they are.
Enough.
Applause! Chapeau mousiur Firelock, chapeau. ( my hat to you sir)
Mercy buckets, Miningman! Mercy buckets? That's GI French. I am a military historian by avocation, after all!
Merci beaucoup, for everone else.
Firelock76You know why Mr. Trump won in 2016? My opinion? Because he ran like a businessman and not like a politician.
Yup and I think he opened the door wider for other citizens to run because before him we were getting to a kind of a standard that non-politicians were not qualified for the job....when in fact via the Constitution the job is open to any citizen with no limitations on past occupation. Now we just have to break the artificial barrier that only wealthy people can run for President.
I think President Trump won in no small part to the fact that the democrats ran one of the worst campaigns in memory plus the media giving unlimited air time to then candidate Trump. But lets get away from that...
Watching some of that footage from onboard the 4141 and it's a Celestial miracle they didn't run anyone over. Man, some people were clueless. Esp the officer at Magnolia standing near the tie butts (appearing at least) to be taking a selfie with his back to the train. Sigh.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.
CMStPnP Now we just have to break the artificial barrier that only wealthy people can run for President.
Now we just have to break the artificial barrier that only wealthy people can run for President.
zugmannWatching some of that footage from onboard the 4141 and it's a Celestial miracle they didn't run anyone over. Man, some people were clueless.
LOL! Hey I live in Texas, that whole thing was Classic Texas, it's rainy, foggy and dreary outside soooo...........lets all wear very dark clothes and stand as close as we can to the railroad tracks!!!! lol.
It's a shame. People don't learn.
As gruesome as it sounds maybe the media shouldn't have surpressed that video of the poor woman who was drop-kicked by UP 844 out in Cheyenne several months back. On picture's worth a thousand words.
But no, in deference to her family they obviously couldn't do that.
What I couldn't understand was the people whooping it up as the train went past. Uh folks, Mr. Bush has passed on, he can't hear you no matter how loud you yell.
Then again, I'm old enough to remember the respectful silence people maintained when Bobby Kennedy's funeral train passed crowds. Different time I suppose.
CSSHEGEWISCHAnd some of his quotes during the campaign suggested that his wealth meant that he couldn't be bought.
Yeah that is spin though. Everyone has their price regardless of what is in the bank. It would be more accurate to say "most can't meet my price" but saying that would be a lot worse than not saying anything at all. So the spin goes in the ears and keeps folks more comfortable.
It is just like the quote: "I could never kill anyone". If it was really true and that instinct was so controllable, we would have world peace and the Nazis would have been better known for putting flowers in the end of rifle barrels.
Trump election:
Fact: Mr. Trump won because of the Electoral College, not because he got more votes from the American people than his opponent. Not very democratic, I think. And if I may use an analogy, many forum contributors wouldn't think much of placing a person without any experience of any sort in the railroad industry in charge of UP or BNSF, etc., would they? How would that likely turn out? So much for running a country "as a businessman."
Bush funeral train:
Just as touching, in its own way, as the funeral services. I knew UP would rise to the occasion. What a great-looking train they assembled, and looking as if it had just emerged from the paint shop with a good wax job. UP really is a railroad with a great corporate memory and tradition.
As far as the people along the tracks, that touched me, because those were my fellow-countrymen, out to see a historic event and to pay their respects. And they were there by the thousands! With flags and signs! I'm pretty sure Bush would have loved seeing them.
As for their demeanor, Yes, they were not silent or very quiet. But consider the circumstances. Bobby Kennedy had been assassinated and FDR had died in office unexpectedly, while G.H.W. Bush had lived a long and full life. I think that affected the public response and celebratory atmosphere.
Besides, at least to this Ohioan, these were Texans, for goodness' sake, a people not known for their British-like reserve and stiff upper lip. They were welcoming home, in their unique way, a fellow Texan who had done them proud.
Last thought:
Don't you just wonder at Mr. Trump's inner thoughts on the Bush funeral?
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