The railroads must get an extention on PTC because the technology
had NOT been fully deveolped. That's why it's such a stupid deadline!
blue streak 1 Part of the NEC corridor improvement plan figure 16 show Morris - Frankford interlocking as being improved to 160 MPH MAS which includes this curve. http://amtraknec.devcloud.acquia-sites.com/sites/default/files/2012%20Amtrak-Vision-for-the-Northeast-Corridor.pdf
Part of the NEC corridor improvement plan figure 16 show Morris - Frankford interlocking as being improved to 160 MPH MAS which includes this curve.
http://amtraknec.devcloud.acquia-sites.com/sites/default/files/2012%20Amtrak-Vision-for-the-Northeast-Corridor.pdf
There are quite a few curves with speed restrictions in that segment. The 160 doesn't mean that all those curves would be straightened, I think.
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
vsmithLatest news reported the train was traveling at 107mph before it derailed.
Heard 106, but either way, that makes it PTC preventable. Think RRs will get an implementation delay waiver now?
Have fun with your trains
It is being reported that the curve was limited to 50 mph.
The curve turns approximately 60 degrees . It is approximately 1500 feet straight line from point of entry to point of exit. No way will that curve be 160 MPH.
Norm
The first car was twisted longitudinally 180 degrees. Can't imagine what did that.
http://l1.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/2pdhHoUcQDLmGV_VKVybVw--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9ZmlsbDtoPTcwMDtpbD1wbGFuZTtweW9mZj0wO3E9NzU7dz0xMDgw/http://media.zenfs.com/en_us/News/ap_webfeeds/a0495b726aa25e15760f6a7067005c22.jpg
I read that and I do not believe that 160 MAS means that the curve itself will necessarily be 160 mph.
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
pkazmir The locomotive is sitting upright, with a chunk taken out of the right side of the nose...
The locomotive is sitting upright, with a chunk taken out of the right side of the nose...
Rgds IGN
On CNN, an NTSB person said the current speed limit there is 50 mph. Although the controller should have automatically reduced the speed (100 mph) if the engineer failed to, it did not sufficiently. Also, no inward facing cab video by union agreement. Clearly, that will change.
Here is NY Daily news gallery photo gallery of the accident. The first picture is an overview of the passenger cars.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/amtrak-train-derails-gallery-1.2220132
Excerpt from Wall Street Journal
An Amtrak train involved in a fatal crash here appears to have been traveling at more than 100 miles an hour as it entered a sharp curve where it derailed Tuesday night, killing at least seven people, according to two people with knowledge of the investigation.
https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=Excessive+Speed+Probed+in+Amtrak+Train+Crash+in+Philadelphia
Another Amtrak engineer has said to some of his acquaitances that he would bet his next paycheck that speed is the issue.
Another body discovered; death toll up to 7.
I think this is a correct consist:
Loco ACS64 number 601
Business class 81528
Coach 82776 (quiet car)
Coach 82644
Cafe 43346
Coach 82761
Coach 82797
Coach 82981
The Business class car appears to be the most heavily damaged. This is my best attempt at a description of the consist. Additional information or corrections welcome.
Tom
Wizlish,
Philly ABC affiliate has photos here:
http://6abc.com/news/photos-amtrak-train-derailment-in-port-richmond/718272/#gallery-7
Includes a photo of the loco in it's entirety, showing the opposite (left) side. (Does also show the front right damage too corner.)
Ricky W.
HO scale Proto-freelancer.
My Railroad rules:
1: It's my railroad, my rules.
2: It's for having fun and enjoyment.
3: Any objections, consult above rules.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/14/us/amtrak-train-derails-crash-philadelphia.html
The NEC Regional crash was at the same site (Frankford Jct.) as the 1943 Congressional Limited, killing 79.
I think that's just the plastic fascia around the lights. The curved plate at the bottom of the opening seems undented, and I think the lens of the visible light is unbroken, so this is probably not more than a casual shock or impact.
I presume that the actual collision-safety plate 'cab' structure is behind the nose and fascia, and is also undamaged. Someone with Photoshop might be able to process the dark image to see if there's any detail; I've never seen a picture of an ACS-64 with the fascia uninstalled but the underlying structure complete -- I'm sure somebody has one, or has a diagram or drawing showing the crash-resistant structure in the ends.
Is there a good picture of the 'other end' of the motor, or of the sides? I'm still trying to figure out how this could happen without overspeed.
BaltACD blue streak 1 Something that needs investigation. Several ear witness reports stated that the train's engineer made a series of short horn blasts very shortly before the accident. This will be an important clue if true. Could have been engineer saw something. Found it interesting that motor (# 601 ) was not damaged enough that the headlight was still operating. I don't know if Amtrak engines are video equipped - many freight engines these days (all new ones being delivered) have forward facing videos that record on a 72 hour loop.
blue streak 1 Something that needs investigation. Several ear witness reports stated that the train's engineer made a series of short horn blasts very shortly before the accident. This will be an important clue if true. Could have been engineer saw something. Found it interesting that motor (# 601 ) was not damaged enough that the headlight was still operating.
Something that needs investigation. Several ear witness reports stated that the train's engineer made a series of short horn blasts very shortly before the accident. This will be an important clue if true. Could have been engineer saw something.
Found it interesting that motor (# 601 ) was not damaged enough that the headlight was still operating.
I don't know if Amtrak engines are video equipped - many freight engines these days (all new ones being delivered) have forward facing videos that record on a 72 hour loop.
Also read report that SEPTA train only 3 minutes ahead had it's windshield broken by a projectile of some sort.
http://www.philly.com/philly/news/20150514_SEPTA_train_hit_by_projectile_before_Amtrak_crash.html
NorthWest Nope, ACS-64 was in the lead. The utterly mangled (first in consist) car hit the catenary pole broadside, taking down the pole. Hopefully it was empty, as they sometimes are with low passenger loads.
Nope, ACS-64 was in the lead. The utterly mangled (first in consist) car hit the catenary pole broadside, taking down the pole. Hopefully it was empty, as they sometimes are with low passenger loads.
Some of the passenger quotes led me to think that the first car was the quiet car.
vsmithDoes anyone know if the engine was in push mode with a cab car in the lead? It looks like one of the passenger car derailed and then hit something nasty, that's why its so mangled. I was wondering if that might have been the lead cab car. Real mess and a tragedy.
No cab car on Wash to NYP trains. Only on Keystone service trains. 601 was leading
BroadwayLion Report seen by LION suggests PTC in effect westbound, not yet eastbound. ROAR
Report seen by LION suggests PTC in effect westbound, not yet eastbound.
ROAR
Amtrak has there ACESES system which is sort-of PTC. It has two parts. The first is just regular-old PRR style cab signal with a second layer of aspects from a second carrier frequency. This has been in place for years on the whole corridor. The second part is civil speed and enforced stop stuff. That uses transponders and dead reckoning (and some data radio stuff) to enforce civil speeds, work zones and stop signals. As of last fall, this was only in place east of New Haven.
I don't know how it could be in place in only one direction on NEC south tracks that are signalled in both directions.
Randy Stahl These cars have ECP brakes ?
These cars have ECP brakes ?
They had EP braking when built but it was removed... but that's not really what you're getting at...
This was a new AMTK unit, it should have had a forward view.
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
seppburgh2CNN has had the 'experts' out discussing the rail conditon. The 'experts' have has point the discussion towards the poor conditon of the track due to the many trains and a few tank trains. The expert blamed the poor rails on the "decline of the rail industry" and that no steel mill is interested in making 'heavy rail.'
CNN does not *have* experts, they have third rate highschool dropouts as "reporters" who have agendas rather than facts.
Don't bother me with facts, I have an agenda to fill!
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.