Floridaflyer
I have redrawn my yard plan as you suggested, I think. Have I redrawn it correctly? Thanks,
Jack
Here is the photo, right side up.
Rich
Alton Junction
Edit: Deleted
LINK to SNSR Blog
deleted
floridaflyer Rich, have a question. would putting a blue dot between turnouts B/F and C/G separate the reversing sections into two separate sections? would require two ARs but would eliminate the two trains in one reversing section situation. Not sure how an AR reacts to another AR as a loco moves from one section to another though.
Rich, have a question. would putting a blue dot between turnouts B/F and C/G separate the reversing sections into two separate sections? would require two ARs but would eliminate the two trains in one reversing section situation. Not sure how an AR reacts to another AR as a loco moves from one section to another though.
One way to allow trains to pass each other on those two parallel tracks with only one AR1 would be to add gaps between the divergent rails on the connecting turnouts (b and f, c and g) on those two crossovers and then add gaps on the lower track 2 at the top of the diagram to completely isolate the reversing section.
That way, the upper track 2 won't even be a reversing section.
starman Rich Is it necessary to get my entire train in the reversing loop? If so, I can move the insulators on the far left and far right to accommodate the length on my longest train. Also, assume that engine A is traveling from right to left on track 1, at the very top of the track plan. At the same time, assume that engine B is traveling from left to right along the lower of the two number 2 tracks, at the top of the track plan. If engine B crosses from g to c, everything is fine; however, if engine B then crosses from d to a, engine B will be traveling in the opposite direction, on the same track, as engine A. Is this handled with the AR1 that allows and engine on track 2 to switch and travel in the opposite direction, or have I created a second reversing loop? The same question would apply when and engine B, traveling from left to right on the upper track 2, at the top of the track plan, crosses from b to f and then from h to i. Jack
Your best bet is to extend the reversing section on the left side to avoid a more complex reversing section with those crossovers on the right side.
In your two examples of engine B moving from left to right, as long as you have not extended the right side of the reversing section, you will have no problems with either of those two movements since the connecting turnouts will have matching polarities.
I followed the diagram as it is in your post, appears upsidedown. If you flip the diagram, you would still circle the divergent track at AR1. I would move the turnout at AR1 as far left as possible in order to increase the length of the reversing section. The original circle would now be the the farthest left circle in the group of four on the bottom of the diagram. the circle at the turnout to the turntable would be the same and the circle would be to the left of the turnout at"M". The reversing section is still from the divergent track at AR1 to the original far left circle ( of the original group of four). Any track that touches the reversing section ( at "M" and the turntable lead has the be isolated from reversing section. The circles at M and TT lead do that.
Edit. see Rich's post below. He flipped your plan to the correct orientation
Floridaflyer, thanks for your reply. I do have one question now and I may have others later. Are your instructions written for the layout as it is presented in my post (upside down), or did you flip it over before writing the instructions?
The short answer is no. You haven't isolated all tracks. You are making this more complicated than it needs to be. My suggestion is to move point AR1 as far to the right as possible, leaving the other end of the crossover where it is just above the letter M. Now remove all the circles except the farthest circle to the right in the upper group of circles from your plan and do the following. Put a circle at the divergent end of the relocated turnout at AR1 (assuming you use the same right hand turnout), put another circle at the turnout at the letter M, at the right hand end of the turnout this would be on the thru track. next put a circle on the divergent track leading to the turntable. You should now have 4 circles, one at AR1, one at the thru track at M, one isolating the lead to the turntable and the one that you left from the original drawing. The reversing section would be from the divergent track at AR1 to the original circle.
starman I have attached a picture of the yard that will go into the area marked yard on the previous picture of my track plan.
You do not generally want one AR section to directly join another. That should be extremely rare that this would happen anyway. There are some that have a setting for when two are back to back, if it really becomes unavoidable.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
floridaflyer Not sure how an AR reacts to another AR as a loco moves from one section to another. . . .
Interesting question!
floridaflyer Your yard track around the engine facility is a reverse loop. You enter the yard going south into the maintance area, go around the engine facility and exit the yard going north using the same entrance track. that is a reverse loop
Your yard track around the engine facility is a reverse loop. You enter the yard going south into the maintance area, go around the engine facility and exit the yard going north using the same entrance track. that is a reverse loop
I see the problem. I believe I can eliminate that reversing loop by having the track on the far left of the classification section of the yard return to the other track number two rather than where it is currently drawn.
starman Rich Thanks for your drawing and comments. This reversing loop actually seems very simple. I want to be sure I understand the reversing loop correctly. The actual reversing loop is between the two dots on the far left and two dots on the far right, as seen in your lower diagram. Is this correct? Jack
Thanks for your drawing and comments. This reversing loop actually seems very simple. I want to be sure I understand the reversing loop correctly. The actual reversing loop is between the two dots on the far left and two dots on the far right, as seen in your lower diagram. Is this correct?
Edit we posted at the same time an now I am confused as I did not fit it into your previous track plan. If a train enters the yard going down the page, through any of the tracks under the word Maintenance and exits on a separate track that doesn't merge with the entering track, there is no reversing loop. But maybe I am lost between track plans
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
starman I am using a Digitrax system. Now, exactly where would I install insulators and where would I connect AR1's. I assume I would use AR1's. Also, I would like to run rather long trains and more than one train on the same track at a time. How will reversing loops affect my operation?
I am using a Digitrax system. Now, exactly where would I install insulators and where would I connect AR1's. I assume I would use AR1's. Also, I would like to run rather long trains and more than one train on the same track at a time. How will reversing loops affect my operation?
You added a bit of a complication in your latest drawing with those two passing sidings, one above and one below those two crossovers. I placed dots where the gaps need to be cut in order to isolate the entire reversing section, as shown in the upper portion of the diagram.
If that configuration is not longer than your longest train, then expand the reversing section by extending the gaps to the left. But when you do that, you also need to add gaps to the divergent side of the turnouts on the left side of the passing sidings, as shown in the lower portion of the diagram.
Make sure you wire the two mainlines the same way. Any and all feeders inside the reversing section should be wired to the output side of the AR1.
If you are running multiple trains, you have to be careful about more than one train entering and or exiting the reversing section simultaneously. When the AR1 automatically flips the polarities to avoid a short, the train that set off the AR1 can pass through the reversing section unhindered, but a second train might encounter a mismatched polarity and cause the AR1 to flip polarities which then adversely affects the first train.
So, the proper protocol would be to halt the second train outside of the reversing section until the first train has cleared the reversing section. That said, it may be possible to have two trains on separate tracks passing each other simultaneously in the reversing section. It all depends on where the trains are located at a given time and what action has been taken by the AR1. For that reason, it may be best to follow that halting protocol that I just mentioned.
If installed properly, the ARs will be completely transparent to the users and should give many years of trouble-free service.
Regarding cost (from your earlier post), auto-reversers cost about $25 or so for a basic unit. A little more, depending on whether any advanced features are wanted. Not a whole lot in the scheme of things, and actually a bargin for the amount of work they do.
Robert
I have drawn my track plan to scale using AnyRail, at least the best I could do. It is pretty close to scale. Using flickr.com the only picture sizes I could come up with were postage stamp size or what you see below. At least the picture below can be clearly seen.
Please note that track 1 and track 2 or both loops. My yard is a little more complicated to draw and I will include that in a separate picture, probably tomorrow.
Some of my curves look tight, but I can run an articulated steam engine over them. I was limited in AnyRail, as far as I could determine, as to the exact size curves that were available to me.
I have labeled what I think are the important turnouts using the same scheme that Henry used. I hope I got it all right. Please note that b-f and g-c could be moved anywhere along the top of the track plan as I have laid out this plan, but not fastened anything down.
Please ask if you have any questions. I won't be offended. This is the first layout I have ever built. The overall my idea is to have N&W trains, from the 1950's to 1960's, travel from the coal mines in western Virginia (along the bottom of the plan), through the Pieidmont area (along the right side of the plan, through the South Norfolk yard (along the top of the plan - I grew up in South Norfolk about a block from the yard), and finally through Norfolk and into the Lamberts Point yard (in the center of the room).
Again, sorry for the large size of the picture, but it was that or postage stamp size! Perhaps someone else can tell me how to send a more appropriate size image.
I appreciate all comments and help.
floridaflyer I think he also has one in the lower right of the plan. But without a larger picture it is hard to tell. Maybe yes maybe no
I think he also has one in the lower right of the plan. But without a larger picture it is hard to tell. Maybe yes maybe no
floridaflyer In a quick look at your new plan it appears that the yard is a reversing loop. Bigger picture would help though.
In a quick look at your new plan it appears that the yard is a reversing loop. Bigger picture would help though.
I am guessing that he wants to also enter the yard from the left side coming down on the blue colored track, but it is not clear from his question.
Especially with DCC, there's no real reason to avoid reverse loops and such, because it can be easily handled automatically, no extra toggles or whatnot you might need with DC. As an operator, you just need to make sure the turnouts are lined properly and drive the train, nothing to flip or adjust. If it makes sense in the track plan for there to be a connection that happens to cross polarity, just do it, and install an auto reverser.