A you guys talked about starting this thread, but nobody did. So I'll start it.
My experience with towers is very limited. After all we never had that many here in California and what we did have is gone now. There were a few that I would visit when in the neighborhood. Probably most frequently would be Stockton tower. Stockton tower is probably the best (traffic wise) place in northern California to see trains. All three northern California railroads, SP ATSF and WP, went through the plant.There is also the Amtrak San Joaquin trains there. Of course now the tower is gone and so is the SP-WP-ATSF replaced by UP and BNSF. Actually the first time I was there the UP had already taken over the WP but it was still the WP to me.
Another tower I would frequent was Elvas tower on the SP. Elvas is where the ex Cal P line from Oakland and the Valley line to Bakersfield & LA and the line to Roseville all come together in a big triangle. Elvas is probably the second busyest spot in northern California, Double track (or 2MT CTC) in every direction. One time the operator yelled down to my dad and I to come on up. That was right before the UP merger and the operator went on for hours about not wanting to work for the UP. He called it the Onion Pacific. Nice guy, but definately had his opinions of UP.
Hobart tower is a nother that I would drop by from time to time. But thinking about it, it wasn't the towers themselves that drew me but rather the high traffic levels that go with them. I really should have paid more attention to the towers.
So what exactly transpires in a tower? I've seen pictures of long rows of levers, that I assume are used to operate switches in a single location, thus making life a little easier for train crews.
Are the tower operators responsible for their parts of the railroad, or are they merely instruments of the dispatcher / train crews?
Why are towers such a hangout for railfans? I can't honestly ever remember seeing one in operation, let along hanging out at one for a whole day.
How do the switch mechanisms work? Are there cables running to the switches operated by the levers in the towers?
Thanks in advance for any answers.
-ChrisWest Chicago, ILChristopher May Fine Art Photography"In wisdom gathered over time I have found that every experience is a form of exploration." ~Ansel Adams
MP173 wrote:Chad:Any towers, either operating or abandoned still standing in SoCal?We are pretty lucky here in Chicago area with a number of towers. Northwest Indiana has several:Calumet - East ChicagoGrassilli - East ChicagoAlso a drawbridge tower on the J in East Chicago.Hick which is a drawbridge on the NS in E. Chicago.Wade Tower still stands in LaCrosse, Indiana.As a young railfan back in the 70's I would head to the towers for info...and usually was welcomed, as long as I didnt get in the way. Probably my best tower memory was at Tolono, Il in 1976. I struck up a great instant relationship with the IC operator and spent the entire day there. I believe his name was Kerns. Unfortunately I never got back to see him or the tower (actually a cabin) in operation.More to follow, if interested.ed
Ed, I added to my original post you might want to go back and read it. Sience I was out of state for a few years I am not sure what is left. Let me see......
Elvas in Sacramento on the SP might still be there but I am not sure.
Stockton tower was torn down around 98' or 99'. David Epling has some great Stockton tower stuff on his websight
http://cencalrails.railfan.net/stkntowr.html
interior
demolition
http://cencalrails.railfan.net/tower1.html
Hobart in Santa Fe springs is still standing though no longer in service. Cosmeticly it is in great shape. There was a feature in the UP Streamliner on it this year.
There were also a series of towers along the LA river. Metrolink took over this line and I think all the towers (5 I believe) were demolished except Dayton (I think) that was moved to the old Taylor yard and is cosmeticly restored along San Fernando road.
Colton tower is LONG gone.
College Park in San Jose was taken out of service a while back and I believe it was torn down.
Elvas
MP173 wrote:Chris: There are railroaders here that can answer the question much better than me, but as I understand it... Towers were established either to control a crossing or junction on a railroad. Also the towers were established to provide communication from dispatchers to train crews. At a crossing/junction, the towerman would line up the routings.
He/she was the traffic cop. The routings were done either using the levers, as pictured in this month's Trains issue of Calumet Tower or by pneumatic levers, sort of like a CTC machine.
In addition to being a traffic cop, the operator would also write orders to train crews. A dispatcher would issue an order which the operator either hand wrote or type on a multi copy form. These orders were then delivered to the train, either by hand, or most commonly by tying to a string and hooping the orders up. This was one of the aspects I enjoyed the most...watching the train crews reach out and "hoop" the orders.
Towers were great places to visit. (note the past tense, today I doubt if one could walk in). In a tower one would get the pulse of the railroad. You could listen to conversations with crews, towermen and operators. Remember, the radio communication was not available between dispatchers and train crews, so they had to use towermen. Towers such as Porter (Porter, In) were busy places. In the late 70's the Conrail Buffalo - Chicago line ran thru Porter with the old NYC line branching off to Detroit ( primarily Amtrak). The C&O line to Grand Rapids also branched off of the Conrail main. There was (and still is) a Conrail line that branched off to go to the IHB. A few years prior, there was an EJE line that joined. It was much line a tree with branches. Busy place. If you stayed in the tower...you stayed out of the way of the towerman and kept quiet, unless he turned to you and spoke. The last time I entered a tower was in 1998 ... Lennox Tower at Mitchell, Il. near East St. Louis. The looks I got from the towerman and other men told me that I was not welcomed. I left very quickly. Perhaps the shirt and tie I had on made them think I was a UP spy. ed
Ed and Hugh,
Thanks for the info. Another question I had: If the tower is at a junction or crossing between two different railroads, how is responsibility for construction, maintenance, operations of the tower, etc delegated? Does one RR take care of the above and the other pay for the services? Or do both share the costs of construction and maintenance, and each help staff the tower? Or is there a third party not directly affiliated with the RR's that receives money from both RR's to provide the service?
CopCarSS wrote: Ed and Hugh, Thanks for the info. Another question I had: If the tower is at a junction or crossing between two different railroads, how is responsibility for construction, maintenance, operations of the tower, etc delegated? Does one RR take care of the above and the other pay for the services? Or do both share the costs of construction and maintenance, and each help staff the tower? Or is there a third party not directly affiliated with the RR's that receives money from both RR's to provide the service?
Sorry I didn't get to your questions but it looks like it's been covered. I just had a FCC official show up for a suprise inspection, The first time I've had that happen in 20 years in the biz.
Anyway, I think when a railroad has to cross another it's the railroad that wants to cross that has to pay for the installation, maintainance and operation of the plant. But I know there are exceptions.
Chris, I know you're familiar with the tower in West Chicago; it's still in operation. The operator of that tower controls the signals for the UP-EJ&E crossing there, as well as the switches for the connecting track off EJ&E, and the crossovers just to the west of the diamonds on UP, as well as the lead into the yard. He's in touch with the dispatchers of both railroads, because they don't have control of the interlocking--he does. They can just tell him what they have coming, and where it wants to go.
The tower is owned and maintained by the EJ&E, and the operator is an EJ&E employee. The day-shift operator there was a veteran named George. UP renamed the tower Washington Street (CNW had called it JB, among other names). So very often you'd hear the dispatcher calling out "Hello, George, Washington".
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
Brian (IA) http://blhanel.rrpicturearchives.net.
blhanel wrote:One thing I'm fuzzy on- are the Armstrong levers in any given tower used exclusively to control turnouts, or are there other applications, such as signalling, or derails, or ??? If an interlocking doesn't have any associated turnouts, does that mean the tower doesn't need any Armstrong levers?
Armstrong levers were used to control switches, derails, and semephores by direct mechanical connection before these items were motorized. After motorization, the levers were sometimes left in place to act merely as electric switches for the motors.
Wait, let me understand: you moved the lever(in the tower) and the correponding turnout, switch, etc. ... located 100, 200, 300, 400 yards away and outside the tower, moved as well? Were they linked mechanically or were they moved by electrical means?
Huh?
doghouse wrote: Wait, let me understand: you moved the lever(in the tower) and the correponding turnout, switch, etc. ... located 100, 200, 300, 400 yards away and outside the tower, moved as well? Were they linked mechanically or were they moved by electrical means? Huh?
Yes, There would be rods in pipes that mechanicaly linked the lever with the switch (or derail or whatever). I believe that's why they were called 'Armstrong' because those long rods took a lot of strength to move.
chad thomas wrote: doghouse wrote: Wait, let me understand: you moved the lever(in the tower) and the correponding turnout, switch, etc. ... located 100, 200, 300, 400 yards away and outside the tower, moved as well? Were they linked mechanically or were they moved by electrical means? Huh? Yes, There would be rods in pipes that mechanicaly linked the lever with the switch (or derail or whatever). I believe that's why they were called 'Armstrong' because those long rods took a lot of strength to move.
How did the 90 degree turns work? If rods in a pipe, I take it there was lots of grease used?
Actually, Chad, the pipes were hollow--the "armstrong" levers moved the pipes themselves the distance necessary to throw the switch, line the signal, clear the derail, or whatever. If you can find any remnants of such a system left anywhere, you'll note that the "supports" were actually rollers for this pipe. And, yes, it could be strung out there for a mighty long distance, with interesting connections to get it under a track, and stuff like that.
Interlockings that didn't have switches would still need levers (and pipes connected to them) for the signals that were interlocked.
The operator had to know his stuff, to throw the levers in the proper sequence--the "interlocking" would prevent you from doing it in any wrong way, but I believe the proper sequence of levers to throw for a given lineup would be posted somewhere in the tower, where it could be read by the operator while at work.
Yes, it does take a lot of rollers and 90 degree bell cranks (lubricated with plenty of grease) to get the movement from lever to switch.
We've still got a fair amount of mechanical signalling in the UK - there's some pictures of a couple of large UK signalboxes (= interlocking tower) here http://www.signalbox.org/gallery/lm/severnbridgejcn.htm and http://www.signalbox.org/gallery/lm/edgeleyjcn1.htm (this one has a mechanical interlocking frame but all switches and signals are power operated). The white levers are spares (generally made redundant following rationalisations of the track layout), the ones with short handles operate power switches and signals - they are shortened to remind the operator that they don't need as much force to pull them !
Tony
I grew up near Hopkins, MN and spent a lot of time during the 1960s visiting Milwaukee Road Tower E-14 where the Milwaukee crossed the M&StL just west of Hopkins. At that time, the tower had 24 armstrong levers that controlled electric signals and semephores. The levers were color coded for their function, plus they had cast iron number plates on them. On the wall, there were glass jars that looked like the glass on electric meters. Inside the jars, were metal models of semephore blades that changed position, matching the indication of the actual signals outside. One of the levers still manually controlled a mainline switch. Many were painted gray and were out of service, having been left over from earlier days when the trackage was more complicated.
That lever bank had a lot of mechanism besides the just the levers. It was called an interlocking plant. With all those big, shiny levers and other moving parts, it was about as impressive as a steam locomotive. I have always felt that those big, straight mechanical, armstrong interlockings of the earlier 1900s, with hundreds of feet of control rods, bell cranks, roller footings, and mechanical semephores were some of the most audacious examples of railroad engineering; ranking right up there with track pans.
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
PRR clung to towers longer then most. In fact, most PRR towers lasted into the Conrail era and then quickly disappeared. There are a few left on Amtrak's NEC, I believe the towers at Paoli, Overbrook, and Zoo are still manned.
My office, at CSX's Eastside yard, in Philadelphia - RG Tower - was manned until the early 90s. The operator's desk was next to the yardmasters desk. With the exception of the operation Schuylkill River Drawbridge, all movements are controlled by the AV Dispatcher in Jacksonville, FL. Even though the operator is long gone, tradition dies hard, and the office and yard are still refered to as RG Tower and RG Yard. Most people look at you funny when you call it Eastside.
Nick
Take a Ride on the Reading with the: Reading Company Technical & Historical Society http://www.readingrailroad.org/
I do not think I have ever seen an interlocking tower in person. The only railroad related tower I have been to is a yard tower (for the yardmaster). I did get invited up to one once.
"No soup for you!" - Yev Kassem (from Seinfeld)
My vote for the most interesting "tower" operation I've ever seen is Chicago's Brighton Park Crossing, where two north/south NS lines and a CSX line are crossed by a CN line (former C&A, etc.) to Joliet. NS, CSX and CN are the current owners -- the lines have great history with other long-gone railroads including but not exclusive to NYC and PRR. Others that crossed have long since been abandoned and the rails salvaged.
Here's what Bill Gustason's excellent website "Chicago Rail Junctions" has to say:
"What makes Brighton so interesting is its mode of operation. Despite all the trackage, it is not an interlocking plant. It is run by a "switchtender" who occupies the cabin between the CSX and Panhandle tracks. All trains approaching the junction must stop; they are allowed to proceed only when signalled by the switchtender, who uses manually operated semaphores to convey his messages. Going to Brighton is like going back to the 1940's--one of the few places where semaphores actuated by rods can still be found."
Here's one of Bill's photos:
and here's the link:
http://www.dhke.com/CRJ/brighton.html
Click on the link for a highly-detailed description including a map of the crossing and directions on how to get there. It is the only place in Chicago where semaphores are still in operation, but BEWARE! -- the security around the crossing is extremely tight and intolerant these days and the security agents will sooner have you arrested by the Chicago Police than give you a warning. The controversial video that appeared in a thread here about six months ago where a railroad officer allegedly challenged two railfans (who supposedly kept the videocam running) originated at Brighton Crossing. You can get a good look if you ride the CTA's Orange Line train, as it runs on elevated track right next to the crossing.
Also, go to Bill's homepage and explore all of the junctions and crossings in Northeast Illinois and Northwest Indiana:
http://www.dhke.com/CRJ/
Poppa Z
We had a tower here on Vancouver Island at Ladysmith which was on the cover of the September 1978 Railfan and Railroad. It had an armstrong lever that controlled a stop sign mounted on a post outside to stop traffic on the road crossing at the diamond.
nbrodar wrote: PRR clung to towers longer then most. In fact, most PRR towers lasted into the Conrail era and then quickly disappeared. There are a few left on Amtrak's NEC, I believe the towers at Paoli, Overbrook, and Zoo are still manned. My office, at CSX's Eastside yard, in Philadelphia - RG Tower - was manned until the early 90s. The operator's desk was next to the yardmasters desk. With the exception of the operation Schuylkill River Drawbridge, all movements are controlled by the AV Dispatcher in Jacksonville, FL. Even though the operator is long gone, tradition dies hard, and the office and yard are still refered to as RG Tower and RG Yard. Most people look at you funny when you call it Eastside. Nick
There's a preserved tower at Bowie, MD on the NEC, unless something has happened to it since 1997. I'm pretty sure it was originally somewhere else and was moved to the site. Don't even know that it was originally a PRR tower, but believe it was.
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