Four derailments in one day, 4-22-03

[Anonymous]

Why are there so many derailments. Can't the railroads maintain their tracks? Even main lines?

In Europe they don't have so many derailments. It is almost a daily occurance in America!

[Anonymous]

Hey you got to be first at something. Derailments are a fact of life in the railroad business. The goal is to have none but more important is to safe derailment that do not cause a disaster. There are many things that can go wrong and sometimes do. Most of the time it is do to human error, could be the conductor not paying attention or the engineer going to fast or mechanical and track departments. I'm am not putting blame on anyone but everybody at the railroad has a part to play in the safe operation of the railroad. Weather can be a factor to and it is hard to controll that. As for Europe, they do have derailments. But do you expect the media to cover it here? Most of the derailments I've seen on the news have been over played. Most of the mishaps I've seen was the result of somebody trying to do a move without thinking ahead.

[edblysard]

Guess he didnt see where the two trains in Turkey ran into each other head on, or the Indian railroads weekly disaster. Considering the millions of miles traveled, and the millions of tons of goods moved, along with Amtrak, american railroads are safer than most. You stand a better chance of being struck by lightning that being hurt by a train in america.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[cabforward]

sorry, ed, michael has you there.. he said europe, you named countries in asia.. but if you have some data from r.rs. operating between england and poland, that's o.k..

[dknelson]

before the advent of this and other websites you hardly learned of routine derailments unless you were an avid collector of ICC accident reports.
The number is probably lower now then ever -- it is our knowledge that has increased.
As for Europe -- I suspect they have their share but many of their passenger trains are fixed-consist and they don't switch as many freight cars as we do here so the chances for derailments are perhaps lower. I suspect most derailments here are due to switching mistakes
Dave Nelson

[BRAKIE]

Lets see 4 train wrecks in 24 hours..Hmmm.How many trucks wrecked in that 24 hours? How long has it been since the last derailment?

[edblysard]

Yes, true, I goofed.
But switchers in england still have re-rail frogs slung under their side, as do most switchers. My point was that, unless passengers are involved, it never makes the American press. And the number of derailments here, and in Europe, Aisa and elsewhere is about the same.
Europe, with its dedicated passenger lines, which have a higher maintainance schedule than freight lines, dosnt report to the FRA. On the other hand, every railroad in America does, so the numbers would seem greater. And, from personel experience, I can assure you that every time a car gets on the ground, it isnt always reported. A block of wood or a wedge can work wonders. I have even used a old joint bar or two.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[RudyRockvilleMD]

I don't have any comparative figures on derailments US vs Europe, but I am sure they have their share. In fact, a freight derailment on the Eurostar's Folkstone - London line several years ago delayed us on a trip from Brussels to London because the Eurostar had to be rerouted over a line that didn't have the power capacity to handle the Eurostar train.

In October 2002 a Great Northeastern Railway London to Leeds express train derailed while traveling over 100 mph, and killing 4 people, a few miles north of London. This derailment set off quite a firestorm of criticism of Railtrack because they knew the rails in the derailment area were faulty, but they did not limit the speed on the line until the defective rails could be replaced. A week after the high-speed derailment occurred a train derailed while it was standing still in the Stafford England station.

[Anonymous]

Exactly, I like how you think.....
Ken

[edblysard]

Didnt know the SP laid rail in England...

[mudchicken]

Ed, you are an optimist! (SP comment)

I think the response(s) to the original post pretty well hits the nail on the head with the fact that the general public "just don't understand" and even fewer would understand the FRA "reportable derailment rule". You don't want derailments, you deal with them as best your budget will allow and you make d-a-m-n sure you don't repeat the process....

Had several "Joe Publics" come up to me near a yard in Southern California and complain bitterly about the derail signs next to a cluster of derails protecting a triple main track from the yard switching lead. (1) They could not understand what a derail was and how it could ever be a safety device (thank god gravity works!) and (2) They thought each of those signs was a monument to a past derailment (the type that the yellow press and the mis-information media types play up big on the evening news). (3) They insisted this was grossly unsafe and a threat to their communities and the railroad had better not plant another of those "derailment" signs near their neighborhood. After a half hour of futily trying to explain what a safety device is and what a derail is used for, the "Joe Publics" walked off, no more the wiser. When they were out of earshot, the trainmaster I was with and I couldn't keep from laughing hysterically at what we just experienced.

-mudchicken

[Anonymous]

Pardon me Sir, but what is a derail, how does it work? I do not work for the railroad so can you please explain?
Joe Public

[cabforward]

i'm not in rr-ing, either, but have seen them and watched crews use them..
better get something to drink, this could take a while.. there are 2 kinds of derails.. there is the kind which fits over the rail as a hood on a car.. it is usually yellow to attract attention.. it is always locked, and can be opened by a crewman with a switchkey, or remote control from a control tower.. derails do exactly what the word says, they de-rail, or remove, the unit of rail eqpt. from its position on the track.. the rail section with a derail is always a subordinate connection to another track which connects it.. de-rails are often found not far from a switch, turn-out, spurhead, or whatever you want to call it.. the reason for this is to enforce safety for train movements on the track which is superior to the de-rail track..

derails are designed (but not perfected) to be too big an obstacle for wheels to pass over without coming off the rails and 'wrecking ' the car, engine, etc. this may cause damage and (partial) loss of a shipment to a receiver, but it is far more important to preserve the safety and property of the trains and crews which are using the line adjacent to the derail.. why cars and engines move when they shouldn't is for another time..

another derail appears similar to a turn-out.. it is a switchstand which turns 1 rail inward to the middle of the track.. this device turns only 1 rail, for simplicity's sake.. when the rail is turned inward, a car moving into the device will turn as if to follow a path to a sidetrack.. instead, the car runs out of rail, and bumps along the roadbed a few yards and, with luck, stops standing up.. re-railing crews can be dispatched to restore the car(s) to the track.. the point is to interrupt the car's ability to threaten other trains or people by 'wrecking' it.. usually, such derails happen at slow speeds, and no damage or injury are involved..

both derails can be operated by crewmen or by tower controllers.. manual derails may show their status on control boards.. i dont know if notices are still posted nowadays, but in the '50s & '60s, the turn-out that led to a sidetrack with a derail would carry a notice on its mast, 'attend to derail'.. if the sidetrack had the derail that looked like a turn-out switch, the turn-out that led to the derail and the derail device itself had notices, 'attend to derailing switch'.. that meant not only open the derail to enter the area, but close it when leaving..
derails are removable, but the cover-over probably takes less time than the 'switch-like' derail to relocate..

just like any other property offense against a r.r., it is a felony to tamper with a derail device.. if it directly jeopardizes or harms the safety of a crew or a train being pulled, it is a federal crime (trainwrecking).. and anyone over 12 should do some hard time for conviction of such a violation, but that's just me..

[edblysard]

What, you mean you have a device to intentionaly derail a railcar? So it cant roll out on to a main line and hit a inbound train head on? Why dont you just have some one down there to play catcher?
And you know, if you keep planting those de-railment signs, property values in that neighborhood are going to go down.
No, really, I have had the same joes come up to me, and demand we quit blowing the horn after dark, because it disturbed them when they were trying to relax and watch TV.
I wasted some time trying to explain the end result of not blowing the horn, stupid me, I didnt realize they were deaf from all that horn blowing, because they didnt hear a thing I said.
Got a little POed with the obtuse folks, asked them why, if they didnt like trains, would they buy a house less than 100 feet from a railroad crossing? Cant print the answer I got, the admin. guys wont let it post. Needless to say, our engineers have found a real nice, loud tune to play for them on our Nathan five chime. Accompanied by bells no less!( they just thought it was loud)
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Anonymous]

Since the State of Texas is bigger than most European nations, I would think that a nation our size would have more derailments. Also, I would venture that US railroads haul more tonnage in a day than most European railroads haul in a month.

[wabash1]

ED is this all the people come up with is why derail cars and blow the horn at night.. i guess we are more in touch with discomfort here. i have had people come to me ask why wont the railroad shut down during morning and evning rush hour so they dont haft to try and beat us at crossing going to work. the place i am talking is track speed 50 for frt and 60 for intermodel trains. it takes 45 sec to clear the crossing when we go thru. but we are to stop running trains there til after rush hour.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the info. It makes sence now. I have seen something different. At the local cement plant they use a switch and about 100 ft. of track. When rail cars are at the plant they have the switch set so if one gets away it routes it into a big pile of sand. (Does not damage the car or derail it.) One time a contractor who did not know any better took the sand thinking it would not be missed. They had fun getting the cars out of the swomp at the end of the track.
TIM A

[edblysard]

And imagine how POed they would be if you quit pulling those freight cars out of their plant, or the tanks out of the refinery? Had a Shell employee scream at me that we always block her on her way to work, (she was sitting at the crossing entering her plant) so I asked her if she would like me to shove them back in and leave. She yelled"**** yes" So I stopped the movement, started the shove back, then walked over, and asked her who her boss was, she got a little irate, demanded to know why I needed that info, so I told her I would be sure to let him or her know that she demanded we get out of her way, and thats why the refinery didnt get pulled that night. I told he if Shell didnt mind the last shifts production not leaving the plant, then neither did I. Shoved just clear of the crossing, cut the motor off, took out my cell, and acted like I was calling someone. This lady jumped out of her car, and actually apologized, asked me if it wasnt to much trouble, would we "hook back up? I dont mind waiting" My engineer thought I was nuts, untill I told him what was up.
Man, you block them for a whole 45 seconds?
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[edblysard]

Do you mean the nation, as in America, or the nation, as in just us Texans?
Ed

[Anonymous]

You're right Ed,

It is unfair of me to include the other 49 states. Ain't Texas Great!!! Be safe and have a Lone Star day.

[edblysard]

Wonder if the rest of them will ever figure it out. There's Texas, and then the rest of them. We just let those other 49 states use the name.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[wabash1]

I am not going to get into the texas debat. I been to texas many times . i didnt stay enough said

[edblysard]

Been to Japan, Russia, Germany, France, Great Britian, Canada, Mexico, and most of the Pacific Rim. Still came home to Texas. Nuff said.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[Anonymous]

Well, there's no place like home.

Wherever home is..

[csxns]

Right on J nothing their for me.

[wallywalkabout]

Ed, you forgot to mention Colorado. We all know, here in CO, how much you'all like our state! Ever been to Lake City? At any given time, license plates from Tex out number Col about 10-1. Have a good day! Wally

[edblysard]

No, but had a co-worker from the State Attorney Generals Office go to your state on vacation, came back, quit, packed up and moved, in less than a week. Swears she will never leave, she lives within sight of Boulder.
Gotta get one kid outta the house, by then I will have enough time in at the railroad for 3 weeks vacation, plan on Colorado, New Mexico, and Southren Calfornia, not necessarly in any order.
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[edblysard]

Who knows, maybe Dorthy was right, except I cant visualize a pair of red ruby work boots...
Stay Frosty,
Ed

[foamer4000]

Their just is not enough room in the rest of them for a Texas sized ego.

Quote" The world has no shortage of IDIOTS"

David

[edblysard]

Ohhh...someone is touchy. Maybe he needs to stay away from caffeinated drinks?
Uneasy lies the head that wears a crown.
Stay Frosty,
Ego,
Opps, I meant Ed