Quentin
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QUOTE: Originally posted by sammythebull As a UTU member based by what Gunn has said on record this yr concerning Amtrak labor, I have to say his ousting is a step in the correct direction. In a May hearing on Capitol Hill, Gunn clearly stated that he wanted to change all labor contracts, cut wages, slash benefits, cut asst condr off trains, expand runs w/only one engr in the cab, slash rr retirement for new hires, out source work currently done by Amtrk paid workers, open routes to scab non union operators and cancel the Federal Employee Liability Act and working conditions free from the Railway Labor Act. UTU has gone on record stating Gunn is the worse head of Amtrk they have ever dealt with. Gunn is the first to directly attact its dedicated work force. I want to see Amtrk suceed but changes are going to have to be made in how things are done. Messing w/a skilled and dedicated work force is not one of them. Now if we can get Mineta unemployed and out on the street, then that would be a five star slam dunk.
-Don (Random stuff, mostly about trains - what else? http://blerfblog.blogspot.com/)
QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS QUOTE: Originally posted by TRAINMANTOM AS FAR AS THE AMTRAK BOARD AND THE BU***EAM GO " SEND IN THE CLOWNS ,DONT BOTHER THEIR HERE" Please don't shout Sondheim. It's a soft song. Chris Denver, CO
QUOTE: Originally posted by TRAINMANTOM AS FAR AS THE AMTRAK BOARD AND THE BU***EAM GO " SEND IN THE CLOWNS ,DONT BOTHER THEIR HERE"
Have fun with your trains
QUOTE: Originally posted by jhhtrainsplanes QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar ...I don't mind my tax dollars going to Amtrak....even though I don't get to ride it that much....Better still, I'd like to see it improved and I don't mind paying for that either if it's being done by someone we have trust and confidence with...Such as Mr. Gunn...There are plenty of happenings in this country that are tax supported that an individual may not be directly getting the benefits from. I have ridden Amtrak and look forward to the time when I can again. I have never ridden any train in the Northwest Corridor, yet my tax dollars go to fund those trains. If Amtrak is shut down ALL of Amtrak should be shut down. This cut it up and piece it out is nonsense. If this country can fund trains in Iraq, why can't we fund them here? If you have not emailed your congress people please do so. There are several links on (about) page 3 to help you.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar ...I don't mind my tax dollars going to Amtrak....even though I don't get to ride it that much....Better still, I'd like to see it improved and I don't mind paying for that either if it's being done by someone we have trust and confidence with...Such as Mr. Gunn...There are plenty of happenings in this country that are tax supported that an individual may not be directly getting the benefits from.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Junctionfan Well said Another thing that irritates me about politicians is their rhetoric and lack of intelligent decision making processes that are need to run things. Most of thease politicians falls into at least the whimp or moron category. No wonder why nothing works right-they are the reason. Perhaps thease folk should submit a resume with references to see if they are trully up to job because for so far in both of our countries, I am not particularly impressed with the majority of politicians.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Junctionfan The firing of Gunn is just the a simple political exercise of stupidity. Thease guys don't care about what they do, they simply want to be re-elected or become something higher. What's my point?-thease guys are s&*t-heads because anybody else would normally take pride in their work or move on. Why would Amtrak board of directors try to ruin Amtrak when that means they would be out of a job-something stinks here. Are thease guys awesome or what? "Let's spend alot of our time pretending we give a crap about Amtrak and then try to shut it down"........this is the impression they are giving me. You can understand why people have little patience with politics because really, it doesn't work. Mean time, Mineta- the Secretary of Worthless Transportation, continues to pretend he is worth his weight in gold. More like the worth of dirt if you ask me.
QUOTE: Originally posted by TRAINMANTOM AS FAR AS THE AMTRAK BOARD AND THE BU***EAM GO " SEND IN THE CLOWNS ,DONT BOTHER THRIR HERE"
-ChrisWest Chicago, ILChristopher May Fine Art Photography"In wisdom gathered over time I have found that every experience is a form of exploration." ~Ansel Adams
QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd Now we're to the point of debate! I think the issue isn't whether a majority of Americans consider using it, it's whether a majority of Americans want it around. The majority of Americans don't use Medicaid, but the majority think it should exist - even though it is a huge cost. Every poll I've ever seen says the answer is "yes" - the gov't should keep funding or expand funding for Amtrak. "Being worthy or taxpayer dollars " is a value judgement. Does it really matter if we want it as kinetic art or useful transportation?
QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd Only if you can convince Congress it's for the common good. Providing for the common good is a constitutional mandate. That's kind of my point. Is Amtrak really serving the common good? If the vast majority of intercity travelers never even consider Amtrak as a travel option, let alone actually riding it, is it worthy of taxpayer dollars? If yes, then we need to fund it the way it should be. If no, then let it die.
QUOTE: Originally posted by oltmannd Only if you can convince Congress it's for the common good. Providing for the common good is a constitutional mandate.
QUOTE: Originally posted by CG9602 Here's one thing to think about for those who want to privatize or shut down rail service: How aboput privatizing every last inch of the Interstate Highway System, and having the new owners charge what the market will bear? We expect Amtrak to turn a profit, how about expecting the same of the Interstates? Oh, and while you're at it, privatize all metropolitan airports, and the entire U.S. air traffic control system. If you can't afford to by stock ownership in a particular airport, have a rule that your airline can't serve that city. How many airlines would stay in business if they had to build airports completely from the ground up? I say, if we are going to privatize intercity and interstate rail service, let's privatize the Interstate Highways, make them all toll roads, as well as my suggestions regarding airports. /sarcasm/ Oh wait - that might force us all to recognise our contradictions! Heaven forbid, we can't have that! /sarcasm/
QUOTE: Originally posted by jhhtrainsplanes F Y I Do you remember the article in Trains a while back about Mineta wanting to end Amtrak? In his speeches he gave false information about Amtrak. Mr. Mineta KNOWS the truth. He sits on the Amtrak Board. YES, he is a board member. I thought board members were suspose to do what is right for the company or organization they oversee. It appears that even though Mineta knows the truth he continues to spread untruth. Dear Sir: Unfortunately, reports are that Mineta, soon to be one of just two people (Laney) the other, left on the board, has apparently never attended an Amtrak board meeting in his 52 months on the board. Now, that is having your finger on the pulse of an agency you are supposedly overseeing! Mineta and the whole Amtrak board should be unseated, immediately. A new board should be appointed but not by the president. Mr. Gunn should be rehired, IMMEDIATELY. I have never distrusted an administration more than the current one. This firing is nothing BUT politics.
QUOTE: Originally posted by up829 QUOTE: Originally posted by CG9602 Here's one thing to think about for those who want to privatize or shut down rail service: How aboput privatizing every last inch of the Interstate Highway System, and having the new owners charge what the market will bear? We expect Amtrak to turn a profit, how about expecting the same of the Interstates? Oh, and while you're at it, privatize all metropolitan airports, and the entire U.S. air traffic control system. If you can't afford to by stock ownership in a particular airport, have a rule that your airline can't serve that city. How many airlines would stay in business if they had to build airports completely from the ground up? I say, if we are going to privatize intercity and interstate rail service, let's privatize the Interstate Highways, make them all toll roads, as well as my suggestions regarding airports. /sarcasm/ Oh wait - that might force us all to recognise our contradictions! Heaven forbid, we can't have that! /sarcasm/ What makes you think there aren't plans to do just that? Private highways have been proposed in Texas and tollways exist in many other states. Even the non-combat units of the military are being outsourced to private contractors. Maybe the Feds have a plan to sell the Mississippi River to BNSF.[:D][:D][:D]
QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS QUOTE: Originally posted by CG9602 You missed my point completely. If we expect profitability from one form of transport, we should expect profitability from all of them. When was the last time the Interstate Highway System showed a profit? When was the last time O'Hare showed a profit? When was the last time the Army Corps of Engineers showed a profit? If not, then why are these not expected to show profits while Amtrak is? The taxpayer subsidizes them all. If the "profitability" test should be required for one of the forms of transport, then let's apply it to all of them. Where were the investors during the 1950s up to the present day regarding private limited access expressways? If it isn't required for one - regardless of if it is used by the vast majority of people - then it shouldn't be required for any of them. So should I, and a small minorty of other folks decide to start using horses, should I be subsidised? Should I write my congressmen and tell them that if no other form of transport should be required to turn a profit, then I plan on getting a horse, and expect an equine reimbursement from the government? Chris Denver, CO
QUOTE: Originally posted by CG9602 You missed my point completely. If we expect profitability from one form of transport, we should expect profitability from all of them. When was the last time the Interstate Highway System showed a profit? When was the last time O'Hare showed a profit? When was the last time the Army Corps of Engineers showed a profit? If not, then why are these not expected to show profits while Amtrak is? The taxpayer subsidizes them all. If the "profitability" test should be required for one of the forms of transport, then let's apply it to all of them. Where were the investors during the 1950s up to the present day regarding private limited access expressways? If it isn't required for one - regardless of if it is used by the vast majority of people - then it shouldn't be required for any of them.
QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS QUOTE: Originally posted by CG9602 Here's one thing to think about for those who want to privatize or shut down rail service: How aboput privatizing every last inch of the Interstate Highway System, and having the new owners charge what the market will bear? We expect Amtrak to turn a profit, how about expecting the same of the Interstates? Oh, and while you're at it, privatize all metropolitan airports, and the entire U.S. air traffic control system. If you can't afford to by stock ownership in a particular airport, have a rule that your airline can't serve that city. How many airlines would stay in business if they had to build airports completely from the ground up? I say, if we are going to privatize intercity and interstate rail service, let's privatize the Interstate Highways, make them all toll roads, as well as my suggestions regarding airports. /sarcasm/ Oh wait - that might force us all to recognise our contradictions! Heaven forbid, we can't have that! /sarcasm/ It's kind of interesting that when railroads were just catching on in this country that most major long distance roads were privately owned toll roads, and that airline travel didn't exist. Railroads and Water Travel (especially canals) were heavily subsidied by both the Federal and State governments, as they were the main ways to travel at that time. Kind of like autos and airplanes today. Majority rules. Sorry.
"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo Possum "We have met the anemone... and he is Russ." Bucky Katt "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future." Niels Bohr, Nobel laureate in physics
QUOTE: Originally posted by jarubel Ok, I conclude that....uhmmm....George Bush is even a worse President than Andrew Johnson was? (Johnson is widely regarded as one of our worst Presidents.)
QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS QUOTE: Originally posted by dave e The board members that voted to Fire Mr. Gunn have all been appointed by Bush. Draw your own conclusions. OK. Andrew Johnson was Abraham Lincoln's Vice-President. Draw your own conclusions. Chris Denver, CO
QUOTE: Originally posted by dave e The board members that voted to Fire Mr. Gunn have all been appointed by Bush. Draw your own conclusions.
QUOTE: Originally posted by jarubel Just found a little more information on that hearing using Google news search. Apparently Rep. Oberstar of Minnesota is seeking a hearing next week in which Gunn would testify. Sen. Schumer of New York and other democrats say the removal may have been illegal. I doubt there is much chance that Gunn could be reinstated, or is there?
QUOTE: Originally posted by swknox Just remember Mr. Bush is the puppettier controling all the strings.... I think the democrates are going to kick the republicans butt in a year in the next round of voting.
QUOTE: Originally posted by jhhtrainsplanes [Once Amtrak is gone there will be NO more national passenger rail service. The American people MUST band together now to keep any national passener rail service or we will have none. If Amtrak is killed that will just be more money for Halliburton contracts. [:(!] No wonder the pres and vice are pushing for Amtrak to be killed.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar ...Oh so true....Once it stops, it {the system and what it takes to run it will be gone forever}....Then the opposition will be satisfied. And who knows where they will spend the money then....
QUOTE: Originally posted by TomDiehl Unfortunately, once the infrastructure is dismantled, and the agreements with the freight railroads is allowed to lapse, it may be very difficult, if not impossible, to reassemble Amtrak and it's agreements. Remember, the railroads only agreed to the useage by Amtrak in exchange for taking the passenger trains off their hands (and balance sheets). And such specialized shops facilities aren't just sitting around to subcontract the work, waiting for that day to come.
QUOTE: Originally posted by bbrant QUOTE: Originally posted by miniwyo Alright, First of all, What does Bush have to do with this guy getting fired? From what I have read, it sounds like the Board incharge of Amtrak did it. My opinion - it's more angry liberal democrats venting their own frustrations. To them, Bush always has been and always will be evil. Whether it's Amtrak or those darn evil companies that turn a profit, they like to point their fingers. Blaming Bush for Gunns firing is no exception. Brian
QUOTE: Originally posted by miniwyo Alright, First of all, What does Bush have to do with this guy getting fired? From what I have read, it sounds like the Board incharge of Amtrak did it.
QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS At the risk of getting everybody in the forum upset with me... If it's part of "The Plan" to fire Gunn and kill Amtrak, I say let it die. The coming energy crisis will force the issue when the time is right, and we'll see passenger trains on the tracks again. Perhaps at that time, it will be better received, and a man of Gunn's talents at the helm could truly bring the dream that we all have for passenger rail travel to fruition. Stepping off the [soapbox] and putting on the asbestos suit!
QUOTE: Originally posted by AntonioFP45 Brain, It could be, however you have to realize that President Bush himself wants to eliminate Amtrak's subsidies, so Bush will be blamed. That's a given.
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QUOTE: Originally posted by gfjwilmde Although i didn't like Mr. Gunn because of his stance he took with us(unionized labor), some of us fear there are going to be harder times ahead. At least he(Mr. Gunn) was someone with a railroading background. Not like these 'other' pinheads that couldn't tell a train from a plane if one ran them down. Mr. Laney is as worthless as they come(along with Mr. Mineta and the rest of the board of directors). Animal manure has more of a purpose than anyone of them. These idiots are a waste of dna and space. GLENN A R E A L RAILROADER!!!!! A R E A L AMTRAKER!!!!! A T R U E L Y A N G R Y AND E M B A R R A S S E D AMERICAN!!!!!!!!!!
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QUOTE: Originally posted by jeaton Chris- Your arguements have merit, but it is interesting that surveys suggest that 70% of the American public thinks that rail passenger service is a good thing to have. True, they don't vote the subject with their pocket books (buying tickets), but the preference to have the service is clear. Why? I don't know. Maybe the general public just feels that the nation with the world's leading economy should have top quality highways, airports AND railroad trains. As for me, Friday I am going to Washington, DC on Amtrak. Not only is it cheaper than driving and flying, but at certain times enroute I'll be able to step off the train for a quick smoke. Try doing that when flying. Jay
QUOTE: Originally posted by CopCarSS Would I miss Amtrak? Of course I would. Do I think that Gunn had a lot going for Amtrak? Yes I did. Do I think that there's a place for rail travel in America? Yes I do. Do I realize that I live in a land where the majority rules (and in this case it's a huge majority)? Yup. If it's part of "The Plan" to fire Gunn and kill Amtrak, I say let it die. The coming energy crisis will force the issue when the time is right, and we'll see passenger trains on the tracks again. Perhaps at that time, it will be better received, and a man of Gunn's talents at the helm could truly bring the dream that we all have for passenger rail travel to fruition.
QUOTE: Originally posted by SteamerFan Ah now maybe Amtrak will evolve instead of just meeting the status quo.
QUOTE: Originally posted by trainboyH16-44 But why?!!
QUOTE: Originally posted by jarubel QUOTE: Originally posted by ConrailJim I corrected my post after I thought about it, jarubel. How does that work, though? For $14.99, how does your message get to the person, and when does it get there? Jim QUOTE: Originally posted by jarubel QUOTE: Originally posted by ConrailJim Letters get the most attention. However, all mail to Congress in Washington gets screened for anthrax, etc. They state a delay of at least 2 weeks, but it really runs about 6 weeks until they get your letter. FAX it to them. Jim I think if someone spent $14.99 to send me a telegram instead of 37 cents to send a letter it would carry a hell of a lot more weight. http://www.westernunion.com/info/osTelegram.asp?country=US Heres a link to frequently asked questions at the Western Union website regarding sending a telegram. http://www.westernunion.com/info/faqTelegram.asp Apparently they don't have Western Union messengers anymore and all delivery is contracted out to couriers or some other form of delivery service. I delivered a few myself when I was a driver for a taxi company, but that was almost 15 years ago.
QUOTE: Originally posted by ConrailJim I corrected my post after I thought about it, jarubel. How does that work, though? For $14.99, how does your message get to the person, and when does it get there? Jim QUOTE: Originally posted by jarubel QUOTE: Originally posted by ConrailJim Letters get the most attention. However, all mail to Congress in Washington gets screened for anthrax, etc. They state a delay of at least 2 weeks, but it really runs about 6 weeks until they get your letter. FAX it to them. Jim I think if someone spent $14.99 to send me a telegram instead of 37 cents to send a letter it would carry a hell of a lot more weight. http://www.westernunion.com/info/osTelegram.asp?country=US
QUOTE: Originally posted by jarubel QUOTE: Originally posted by ConrailJim Letters get the most attention. However, all mail to Congress in Washington gets screened for anthrax, etc. They state a delay of at least 2 weeks, but it really runs about 6 weeks until they get your letter. FAX it to them. Jim I think if someone spent $14.99 to send me a telegram instead of 37 cents to send a letter it would carry a hell of a lot more weight. http://www.westernunion.com/info/osTelegram.asp?country=US
QUOTE: Originally posted by ConrailJim Letters get the most attention. However, all mail to Congress in Washington gets screened for anthrax, etc. They state a delay of at least 2 weeks, but it really runs about 6 weeks until they get your letter. FAX it to them. Jim
QUOTE: Originally posted by TomDiehl On CNN, their report ended with the statement that his firing might be politically motivated. YA THINK???? A real "DUH" moment in newscasting.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar ....Ok Jim, I just emailed my two Senators....Come on all you supporters of rail passenger service in our great country...get on the horn to your Rep. or Senators...
QUOTE: Originally posted by bbrant Who will be named to replace David Gunn?
QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar ...Your so right...they just fired one of those...re: "leader with vision and experience"....They will have to search high and low to find a dedicated and knowledgeable person on the subject at hand....I doubt if anyone will want to take it on...That is one that will not be a puppet of this administration.....What a sad bunch of crap this notice is today...Coundn't hardly believe what I was seeing as I saw the bulletin coming across the TV screen this morning.... I agree with Jim above....Scream loud and clear to all the congresspeople you can think of....They all should hear it and the facts....!!
Pump
QUOTE: Originally posted by JOdom QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar ...Mr. Gunn has seemingly been working on all operations of Amrtak to make changes and get rid of waste where possible and run the system as only a railroader knows how to do so....From what I've learned of his ability, knowledge and perserverance of the job at hand....I suppose he was "too good" in shaping a system with the resources he had to make it work...that the word finally went out from somewhere within this administration to "get him out of there" before it gets more difficult to shut the system down....What a shame.... I believe you hit the nail squarely on the head. At least from my perspective (admittedly limited knowledge), I thought Mr. Gunn was the best thing to happen to Amtrak since Mr. Claytor.
QUOTE: Originally posted by Modelcar ...Mr. Gunn has seemingly been working on all operations of Amrtak to make changes and get rid of waste where possible and run the system as only a railroader knows how to do so....From what I've learned of his ability, knowledge and perserverance of the job at hand....I suppose he was "too good" in shaping a system with the resources he had to make it work...that the word finally went out from somewhere within this administration to "get him out of there" before it gets more difficult to shut the system down....What a shame....
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