When specialized grain cars began to replace boxcars was there alot involved on the grain elevator operators' part to make the changeover? Grain cars were commonplace by the late 70s, yet some elevators were still getting boxcars well into the 90s. I wonder what the advantage was in hanging on to boxcars for so long. Likely the railroads would have preferred to have all customers use grain cars. Maybe some elevators loaded both for a time?
IIRC, some of the elevators were on light rail branch lines that couldn't handle the much heavier covered hoppers, so they continued with 40ft boxcars.
That makes sense. Given that 40 ft boxcars are now a thing of the past I take it that those branch lines have been abandoned or upgraded to handle the heavier grain cars. Or are some elevators still serviced via boxcars?
Perhaps a part of the issue in switching from boxcars to covered hoppers was the level at which they were loaded.
A grain handling system built to deliver the grain through the door of a boxcar at maybe 12 feet may have required major modifications to be able to deliver to the top of a hopper at 16 feet or so (guestimate - corrections welcome).
Just a thought.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Ulrich That makes sense. Given that 40 ft boxcars are now a thing of the past I take it that those branch lines have been abandoned or upgraded to handle the heavier grain cars. Or are some elevators still serviced via boxcars?
Boxcars in grain service lasted longer in Canada, probably due in part to the Crowsnest Pass grain rates. The last regular grain shipments in boxcars of which I'm aware were to Churchill on Hudson's Bay.
Grain to a ship at Churchill? Does that still happen? How much of the year?
tree68 Perhaps a part of the issue in switching from boxcars to covered hoppers was the level at which they were loaded. A grain handling system built to deliver the grain through the door of a boxcar at maybe 12 feet may have required major modifications to be able to deliver to the top of a hopper at 16 feet or so (guestimate - corrections welcome). Just a thought.
Possibly the heavier grain cars and their need for upgraded load facilities and heavier track lead to some of the grain elevator closures we've seen over the years. Maybe instead of upgrading it made more sense to abandon light trackage served elevators in favor of trucking to elevators that already had the heavier track in place.
The Port of Churchill is currently closed to all shipping. They hope to reopen in 2023
Ulrich tree68 Perhaps a part of the issue in switching from boxcars to covered hoppers was the level at which they were loaded. A grain handling system built to deliver the grain through the door of a boxcar at maybe 12 feet may have required major modifications to be able to deliver to the top of a hopper at 16 feet or so (guestimate - corrections welcome). Just a thought. Possibly the heavier grain cars and their need for upgraded load facilities and heavier track lead to some of the grain elevator closures we've seen over the years. Maybe instead of upgrading it made more sense to abandon light trackage served elevators in favor of trucking to elevators that already had the heavier track in place.
I can't say for Canada, but in Iowa many of those elevators have closed in favor of larger facilites. Agri business has been integrated, forming large cooperatives that cover large areas. They may have non-rail served, smaller grain storage facilites, but grain there will most likely be trucked to their large rail-served elevator loadouts. Or trucked directly to some grain consummers that are relatively close by, such as ethanol facilities.
Even the farmers have changed, often getting becoming large corporations farming a lot of ground. Most take their crop to the elevator in semi-trucks. They can take grain farther, easier than farmers of a few generations back.
Also, the coming of the large, jumbo covered hoppers also brought about the unit train. The first multi car rates were for small lots, compared to today. Even to handle 25 car units, most facilites had to upgrade infrastructure. Rail to handle the cars, but also grain storage to be able to load the cars in a timely manner.
Times, they were, and still are a changin'.
Jeff
.
Churchill is only open to shipping for a few of the warmer months, though this operating season lenghtens each year as the climate warms. See past threads on the Hudson Bay Railway for details over its near abandonment and sale from Omnitrax a few years ago.
40' grain boxcars were used in western Canada until fall 1996, both due to the branchlines with 60 lb rail and the light track and subgrade on the north end of the line to Churchill. They were also the last big fleet of freight cars with plain bearings on Class I railroads.
It was eventually decided that loaded hoppers could be safely operated not only all the way to Churchill, but also on 60 lb rail with some extra safety precautions (10 mph and a track inspection after every trip). So the boxcars were no longer needed.
CN's last 60 lb branchline was the Lewvan Sub (Regina to Lampman, SK), which was abandoned in fall/winter 1998-99. This was the home of the last few six axle GMD1s, all of which received two axle trucks and larger fuel tanks by 2000.
As far as I know the last and longest line in Canada with 60 lb rail is the Alberta Prairie Railway, between Stettler and Big Valley, AB. This section has no freight customers and is normally only used for car storage and their passenger excursions.
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
timz Grain to a ship at Churchill? Does that still happen? How much of the year?
The Grain Board had an agreement that some quota of grain went thru Churchill. Once that was cancelled, the grain went to more cost efficient routes/ports.
There are no small elevators shipping out by rail here in west central Indiana. In my area we have gone from an elevator with a loading track or two in every small town and sometimes in between to having one to three large facilities per county with multiple tracks for loading out 50 or more cars at a time. These are owned by large corporations (Cargill, ADM, and Tate & Lyle in this area) with a few large independants here and there. When I started farming in the 70's we had a "large" truck-a tandem that could haul 550 bushels and there were still many small trucks being used and also tractors hauling wagons. Now a tandem is a little truck and almost all the hauling is done with semi's. In the 60's and 70's there were still a few small elevators loading boxcars but by the mid 70's it was all hopper cars. Fertilizer went the same way, when I started working the local ferilizer dealer in the 60's we received boxcars of fertilizer that were slowly unloaded by opening a door and letting it run into the bucket of a loader until it got low enough to scoop out from the inside. We also got semi loads of bagged fertilizer(not on pallets) that had to be unloaded by hand. By 1972 all fertilizer came in by hopper car and bags were rapidly becoming obsolete.
Sorry this is so long, many memories involved here.
RKFarmsThere are no small elevators shipping out by rail here in west central Indiana. In my area we have gone from an elevator with a loading track or two in every small town and sometimes in between to having one to three large facilities per county with multiple tracks for loading out 50 or more cars at a time. These are owned by large corporations (Cargill, ADM, and Tate & Lyle in this area) with a few large independants here and there. When I started farming in the 70's we had a "large" truck-a tandem that could haul 550 bushels and there were still many small trucks being used and also tractors hauling wagons. Now a tandem is a little truck and almost all the hauling is done with semi's. In the 60's and 70's there were still a few small elevators loading boxcars but by the mid 70's it was all hopper cars. Fertilizer went the same way, when I started working the local ferilizer dealer in the 60's we received boxcars of fertilizer that were slowly unloaded by opening a door and letting it run into the bucket of a loader until it got low enough to scoop out from the inside. We also got semi loads of bagged fertilizer(not on pallets) that had to be unloaded by hand. By 1972 all fertilizer came in by hopper car and bags were rapidly becoming obsolete. Sorry this is so long, many memories involved here.
Carriers don't want to serve one and two car customers, especially in agricultural products - fertilizers and grown grains. Business has been pushed for the benefit of Unit Trains. Unit trains of between 65 & 130 cars (able to handle 100 net tons per car) - to obtain the unit train rates the trains are required to be loaded and unloaded within 24 hours. To handle that much grain requires large facilities to both load it and unload it - the traditional County Elevator that may have handled 5 or 10 cars a day can't handle Unit Trains.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
BaltACD Carriers don't want to serve one and two car customers, especially in agricultural products - fertilizers and grown grains. Business has been pushed for the benefit of Unit Trains. Unit trains of between 65 & 130 cars (able to handle 100 net tons per car) - to obtain the unit train rates the trains are required to be loaded and unloaded within 24 hours. To handle that much grain requires large facilities to both load it and unload it - the traditional County Elevator that may have handled 5 or 10 cars a day can't handle Unit Trains.
It's not that railroads don't want to serve smaller ag customers, it's that unit trains are so much more efficient that they a better deal for both the railroad and the customer. Elevators that can't do unit trains usually can't compete in a very price-sensitive market, unless they can truck the grain to a nearby unit train facility.
BUT... that is true only for the big row crops (corn, wheat, soybeans, canola, etc.). For other crops, the railroads still do a TON of business in 1 - 10 car shipments. The General Mills plant across from my office (where they make the country's Cheerios) isn't unit-train capable and receives a vast supply of gluten-free oats* every day. There's a mustard mill on the other side of the yard a few miles away that gets inbound product off the CP in cuts of maybe 5 cars or so at a time**. Pulses are almost never shipped by unit train. And a hefty percentage of all the cars going over the hump at Northtown are grain hoppers carrying I-don't-know-what to I-don't-know-where. Even some of those unit-train-qualified elevators get manifest service as well.
Dan
*Oats are naturally gluten-free when grown, but keeping them gluten-free all the way to the breakfast table requires some extra effort in the supply chain.
**This place is also served by BNSF, literally on the other side of the building. As recently as 2015, inbound came in on the CP side and a portion of the outbound product would leave on the BNSF. I'm not completely sure whether they still use BNSF, but I saw CP switching them last month. The BNSF and CP tracks where in very close proximity but didn't connect at all. When BNSF and CP needed a better connection for trackage rights trains in 2015, the tracks leading toward this facility got upgraded and reconfigured to make a connection, and now handle almost every eastbound CP train in the Cities except for intermodal.
Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.