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Intermodal trains may have major problems due to Suez canal disruption.

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 7:44 AM

BaltACD
 
Murphy Siding
 
Murphy Siding 
blue streak 1

Here is a link to a back hoe trying to move sand away from the bow.  Kind of gives a new meaning of gnat and person size.

An excavator is trying to help free a ship stuck in the Suez Canal, but a photo shows how hard that'll be (msn.com) 

Seeing how the soil there is all sand, it makes sense to me that they would come in with some pumping equipment to wash out underneath the ship. 

Where do I send the bill for my consulting? Mischief

 

Undersand they had to remove between 20 & 30K cubic yards of material from under the bow.  I doubt that the banks of the canal are exclusively sand - tidal currents would keep the sand moving.

I understand the vessel was operating at about 13 Knots when the incident happened - 13 Knots and 224K tons creates a lot of momentum when it comes to impacing anything.

 

The difference between sand and rock is the size of the particles. The bigger particles just require more water power to wash them out from under a ship.

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 7:46 AM

Sara T

Now it seems ever-ything is given fine:

earlier report:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKvGKTsAoO4

Suez Canal: How to keep ships from running aground in the future | DW News

https://www.seatrade-maritime.com/casualty/suez-canal-authority-video-ever-given-salvage-operations

https://www.seatrade-maritime.com/casualty/ever-given-blocking-suez-canal-re-floated

The Ever Given, containership blocking the Suez Canal, has been re-floated, and manoeuvres are set to be undertaken to fully restore the direction of vessel.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUwWcoIlHwM

Cargo ship the Ever Given freed from the Suez Canal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNjUt7FYG2s

News Alert: Ever Given ship blocking Suez Canal successfully 'refloated' | Latest English News

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fP-e4os617c

Container ship blocking the Suez Canal partially freed | DW News

I believe we have all for-ever given her / it? our best wishes for future course.

Oh, here is some explanation of how shipping works today

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CIgHnH-1zo

latest news: full moon tide helped to free ship and now moving

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-Mo1tibl1w

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8ej5R4cvdg

 

 Sara

 

Funny side note: I followed one of the links above, that lead to another link etc. and ended up getting Rick-rolled. All I could do was chuckle. Well played.

Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.

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Posted by Euclid on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 8:14 AM

BaltACD

I wonder if the Canal authorities will formulate a rule for the future that vessels have to be shorter than the canal is wide at its narrowest point/

 

The canal shipping lane is already much narrower than the water between the banks.  One of the technical experts stated that the 200 ft. wide Ever Given, following the centerline, only has only 36 feet on each side before grounding. 

One expert suggested that for the monster ships like Ever Given, they could provide safety by connecting ocean tugboats fore and aft.  The newest classes of ocean tugs have rotating propulsion units that can move the boat in any direction with instant changes as needed.  So they could maintain various pulls to help a ship stay on course while transiting the canal. 

The ocean tugs are quite amazing in their own right.   

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Posted by Convicted One on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 10:08 AM

Erik_Mag
If the earth was a perfect sphere, 5,400 nautical miles (90 degrees of longitude at the equator) would have equaled 10,000km (90 degrees of longitude - equator to nothpole via Paris).

Am I misreading your intention there?

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 10:27 AM

BaltACD
 
tree68
 
BaltACD

I wonder if the Canal authorities will formulate a rule for the future that vessels have to be shorter than the canal is wide at its narrowest point. 

There are spots on the St Lawrence Seaway that would have trouble with that - especially with the 1,000 foot ore boats.

 

I thought the 1000 foot ore boats were 'lakers' and only navigate the Great Lakes, not the St. Lawrence Seaway.

 
The 1000-footers are confined to Lake Erie and upstream by the size of the locks on the Welland Canal.  That being said, tree's comment would easily apply to the Soo Canal as well.
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Posted by tree68 on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 11:06 AM

CSSHEGEWISCH
The 1000-footers are confined to Lake Erie and upstream by the size of the locks on the Welland Canal.  That being said, tree's comment would easily apply to the Soo Canal as well.

Exactly - Ships on the Welland Canal and the Long Sault locks on the St Lawrence are limited to 766' - that's the length of the locks.  Even with that, there are places where such ships could get wedged sideways. 

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Posted by Sara T on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 12:03 PM

Murphy: >> I followed one of the links above, that lead to another link etc. and ended up getting Rick-rolled.<<

Since you didn't note which link it was you may simply keep chuckling. Otherwise I would have repaired what seemed to go wrong. But I always check the links I put and if it works with me, it's seems not the link that is to blame when you try to follow it.

SARA

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 12:42 PM

Sara T

Murphy: >> I followed one of the links above, that lead to another link etc. and ended up getting Rick-rolled.<<

Since you didn't note which link it was you may simply keep chuckling. Otherwise I would have repaired what seemed to go wrong. But I always check the links I put and if it works with me, it's seems not the link that is to blame when you try to follow it.

SARA

 

It wasn't a link you provided. I probably followed one of your links that lead to other links that sent me down a rabbit hole that ended with Rick.

Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.

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Posted by Backshop on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 1:13 PM

tree68

 

 
CSSHEGEWISCH
The 1000-footers are confined to Lake Erie and upstream by the size of the locks on the Welland Canal.  That being said, tree's comment would easily apply to the Soo Canal as well.

 

Exactly - Ships on the Welland Canal and the Long Sault locks on the St Lawrence are limited to 766' - that's the length of the locks.  Even with that, there are places where such ships could get wedged sideways. 

 

That's also why all 13 thousand-footers are American owned.  There's not much commerce on Lake Ontario on the American side.  It all goes from Superior to either Michigan (Chicago area) or Erie.  

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Posted by Sara T on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 1:15 PM

Murphy:

Sorry, I don't know Rick, but I tell him when I see him that you will kick his .. his what he has at the backside .. when you see him.

Last he was reported on board of the Ever Given, but since he was wanted for posssibly having something to do with the grounding I'm not sure if he's still on board. 

Sara

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Posted by Erik_Mag on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 10:38 PM

Convicted One

 

 
Erik_Mag
If the earth was a perfect sphere, 5,400 nautical miles (90 degrees of longitude at the equator) would have equaled 10,000km (90 degrees of longitude - equator to nothpole via Paris).

 

Am I misreading your intention there?

 

Oops.... Corrected in original post.

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Posted by Paul of Covington on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 11:27 PM

Erik_Mag

 

 
Convicted One

 

 
Erik_Mag
If the earth was a perfect sphere, 5,400 nautical miles (90 degrees of longitude at the equator) would have equaled 10,000km (90 degrees of longitude - equator to nothpole via Paris).

 

Am I misreading your intention there?

 

 

 

Oops.... Corrected in original post.

 

   Now I'm confused.  Did you correct the right "longitude"?

_____________ 

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Posted by Overmod on Tuesday, March 30, 2021 11:59 PM

90 degrees of longitude = ¼ of the way around the earth at the equator

90 degrees of latitude = ¼ of the way around the earth, from equator to pole.  (A quarter of the great circle through the poles and the datum point in Paris is the supposed original basis of metric distance measure as Erik hinted.)

Oblateness of the spheroid is considerable, though, as might be expected for continental masses moving at supersonic speed.

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Posted by Convicted One on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 12:02 AM

Paul of Covington
   Now I'm confused.  Did you correct the right "longitude"?

LOL, it's a matter of comparing miles of longitude along a line of latitude, compared to miles of latitude along a line of longitude.  It would actually be a line of longitude passing from the equator to the pole, via Paris.

Not that I claim to be an expert. It took me 62 years to figure out how to determine local longitude with a lensatic compass and a wristwatch.    Dunce

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 1:09 AM

Convicted One
LOL, it's a matter of comparing miles of longitude along a line of latitude, compared to miles of latitude along a line of longitude.

Well, a little more specific than that (because we don't use east and west poles); while any line of longitude is a great circle in our hypothetical sphere, the only line of latitude that works is the equator.

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Posted by Convicted One on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 9:18 AM

Overmod
the only line of latitude that works is the equator.

Which was part of Erik's original specification.  Yes

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Posted by mudchicken on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 10:12 AM
Mudchicken Nothing is worth taking the risk of losing a life over. Come home tonight in the same condition that you left home this morning in. Safety begins with ME.... cinscocom-west
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Posted by BaltACD on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 11:30 AM

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 11:37 AM

For those who don't use LinkedIn (a kind of professional social-networking system): the clip is a couple of wiener dogs in safety vests, shown digging in the sand with the 'stuck' ship's bow in the background, then happily receiving treats as we see the 'liberated' Ever Given gliding past in the background.

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 11:37 AM

For those who don't use LinkedIn (a kind of professional social-networking system): the clip is a couple of wiener dogs in safety vests, shown digging in the sand with the 'stuck' ship's bow in the background, then happily receiving treats as we see the 'liberated' Ever Given gliding past in the background.

Sorry if this was a 'spoiler' for anyone...

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 11:38 AM

For those who don't use LinkedIn (a kind of professional social-networking system): the clip is a couple of wiener dogs in safety vests, shown digging in the sand with the 'stuck' ship's bow in the background, then happily receiving treats as we see the 'liberated' Ever Given gliding past in the background.

Sorry if this was a 'spoiler' for anyone... Whistling

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Posted by Convicted One on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 12:16 PM

Overmod
For those who don't use LinkedIn

 

Thanks, Overmod...I was kind of having the same reaction Balt was having.

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Posted by Convicted One on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 12:20 PM

So, if  delays caused due to this whole fiasco are expected to drive up consumer prices, where do I sign up for the class action suit to recover my losses?   Opportunity seems tailor-made for one of those late night TV commercials,

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 12:24 PM

And just which court would have jurisdiction??  The canal is in Egypt, the ship is Japanese-owned (I think) and we never heard which flag the ship flew under.

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Posted by BaltACD on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 12:36 PM

CSSHEGEWISCH
And just which court would have jurisdiction??  The canal is in Egypt, the ship is Japanese-owned (I think) and we never heard which flag the ship flew under.

Operating under a Panama flag, I understand; with a Indian crew.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by Semper Vaporo on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 12:43 PM

Convicted One

So, if  delays caused due to this whole fiasco are expected to drive up consumer prices, where do I sign up for the class action suit to recover my losses?   Opportunity seems tailor-made for one of those late night TV commercials,

But if you sue and win, the damages paid to you will just raise the prices of the goods that are transported and YOU and I will have to pay those higher prices.

Should I then sue you to recover the losses I incur because of the settlement you got?

Semper Vaporo

Pkgs.

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Posted by Overmod on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 12:47 PM

Semper Vaporo
Should I then sue you to recover the losses I incur because of the settlement you got?

Why not?  That's just a subset of the economics phenomenon "rational expectations" that is one of the principal invisible hands that drive inflation...

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Posted by Convicted One on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 1:09 PM

Semper Vaporo
Should I then sue you to recover the losses I incur because of the settlement you got?

Not if my exit strategy pays off. The key is to sue, win, set up the payoff as part of a trust based in South Dakota, and then file personal bankruptcy. And hopefully die before you can

untangle South Dakota trust protections. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Time 

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Posted by Semper Vaporo on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 1:49 PM

Convicted One
Semper Vaporo
Should I then sue you to recover the losses I incur because of the settlement you got?

You may have to hurry with that; I have both feet in the grave and I am just trying to decide which way I want to face when I lie down.

 

Semper Vaporo

Pkgs.

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Posted by Convicted One on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 1:55 PM

Perhaps I'll just settle for placing a flaming bag of organic fertilizer on the front porches of the major stockholders.  I don't suppose you want a share of that, too? Mischief 

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