daveklepperI do not know of any other group than Jews who had both special trains to the camps and also were forced to enter the gas chambers.
You say "don't read my posts if you consider them offensive" I have to ask you, (personally) would you be inclined to be similarly charitable if someone came on here and started posting rhetoric specific to Israel's acts of "man's inhumanity to man", or would you go back on some bent insisting that your "survival" is a stake, and you there fore have no choice but to argue?
Like I said earlier, your take on what should be considered "reasonable" appears to be very one sided.
We don't come on here posting about the massacres at (example) Sabra and Shatila as a gesture of cooperation, trying to be considerate of the feelings of others who might be offended by those truths. That you seem to feel no reason to reciprocate, is troubling.
Let me flip the logic. If you feel like you are being attacked every time you bring up sensitive topics, then perhaps you should stop bringing up sensitive topics?
Damage control.
At 88 years old, my memory is not perfect. And if I'm accused of definining myself as a victim by pointing that out that is in the accuser's head, not in mine. I find I did reply as best as I could, with the knowledge I had at the time, to the specific question of whether other than Jews were transported by train from Wurzburg, and the answer that I forgot I gave was:
Good question. Not in as mass movements. Gypsies were to be exterminated, but we do not have the records for special trains that we have for Jews, and they did not have a "Wannsee Conference" that planned the "Final Solution." Communists were to be exterminated, but they were mostly just arrested and shot.
In general, non-Jewish, non-German Europeans were to be slaves to Germans but not erased completely. But Wansea planned for all Jews to be either killed outright or worked-to-death in slave-labor camps.
In some slave labor camps Jews were joined by others who were slaves but not earmarked for death unless they had shown opposition to Nazi rule before being put in the camps.
Gypsies = Romanie
I do not know of any other group than Jews who had both special trains to the camps and also were forced to enter the gas chambers.
T did some more research and found it may have been possible that some other people were attached to the Jewish transports from Berlin-Grunewald. But I am not certain. And not from Wurzburg.
And I wiill write the Lions Club. Thanks.
The other readers, not specifically the one who posted the nonsense. I suggest a good English-Hebrew dictionary may be better than Wikapedia for Hebrew language instruction. "Yeshiva" is not only used for Jewish religious academies, but also for many kinds of meetings. I come back to the Yeshiva from an Israeli Acoustical Society meeting and from enjoying a pair of train rides, and another student will ask me in Hebrew: Aipho hayyitah hayeshivah? Where was the meeting held?
More nonsense. Again, you too. Please don't read my posts. You cannot contibute something positive so you make an accuation.
I await some positive or critical reponse for my suggestion for railroad-related memorial to the blacks who had to leave Ocoee in 1920.
daveklepper Since I live at the Yeshiva, it takes a very specific effort to avoid using the word, which simply means "s place to sit." That is my answer to your question. I surely would be a victim. I choose not to be a victim.
Since I live at the Yeshiva, it takes a very specific effort to avoid using the word, which simply means "s place to sit." That is my answer to your question.
I surely would be a victim. I choose not to be a victim.
1. Wrong. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeshiva
2. You've been playing the victim ever since this thread started.
daveklepperIs there a railroad station? What is its current use?
The ACL station burned in 1928. There is no indication it was rebuilt.
The Tavares & Gulf (SCL) depot is being used by the Lions Club.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Above statement has been proved wrong already, and I do not intend to simply repeat what your two false accusations were and apparently still are. If they truly still remain true for you in your mind, then please don'r read my postings.
Now for something constructive in "connecting the dots."
Florida readers: What is the town or small city of Ocoee like today? Is there a black community? Is the white community fairly open-minded?
Is there a railroad station? What is its current use?
Would it make sense to have a memorial to those who had to leave in 1920?
Are there Florida readers who might like to work to help this occur?
The name of the Ocoee City Manager is Richard Frank, and the website for the city is www.ocoee.org
Florida readers who wish to comment on whether this a good idea or not are very welcome to do so.
There were no "accusations"
As far as I know, from what I've read, only Jews from this specific station.
I would think that from Berlin-Grunewald, most probably others as well. Not only Romanny, political prisoners, Communists, others that were both important and out-of-favor with Nazis.
That was a legitimate question, and I must apologize for not answering earlier.
The accusations confused me.
No one was bothered by the constant reminder of Father Frank Browne's religion and profession.
Does that answer you? Again, if the word bothers you, you should not read my posts.
If I had to stop and think to truly edit-out all references to my life and location, I surely would be a victim. I choose not to be a victim.
charlie hebdo I'm not going to say much on this kertuffle other than reiterate my agreement with the remark that you seem to have a strong need to proclaim to all in almost every post something about Israel. We all live in different places but unless it is germane to the topic, you won't see others saying they are in their office or college or church hall or temple or mosque or public library or rec center to use that computer. I don't know why you feel such a personal(ity) need, but it really is not necessary to do so on here.
I'm not going to say much on this kertuffle other than reiterate my agreement with the remark that you seem to have a strong need to proclaim to all in almost every post something about Israel. We all live in different places but unless it is germane to the topic, you won't see others saying they are in their office or college or church hall or temple or mosque or public library or rec center to use that computer. I don't know why you feel such a personal(ity) need, but it really is not necessary to do so on here.
+1
Backshop daveklepper Here are some possible reasons: (!) You hold "Replacement Theology Views." (2) You resent someone living in Israel having an opportunity to present information that you cannot present. (3) You accept Georgeown University's view of the "Semitic Family Quarrel" and feel those holding different views should be silenced. There may be other reasons. 4. Most of my professional life was helping churches with acoustics problems. I would not have been able to do so if I had evengelized for Judaism, and I do not do so now, and not on this Website. Those who accuse me of his are lying, plain and simple. On this website and outside my Yeshiva in general, I am religion-neutral, and everybody who knows me knows that. 1. None of those reasons apply. 2. You're so immersed in your religion that you don't even see it. Almost every time you post (not just this thread), you mention your Yeshiva. I don't see anyone else on these forums continually posting "On the way home from my Roman Catholic mass last Sunday, I went trainwatching". Even Father Al, who I believe is a Lutheran(?) priest, never mentions his religious affiliation (that's why I'm not sure what denomination he is) unless he says in passing that he had railfanned an area for several years because he was assigned in that area. I don't care what religion you are, I just don't need to be continually reminded of it, as it isn't germane to the forum.
daveklepper Here are some possible reasons: (!) You hold "Replacement Theology Views." (2) You resent someone living in Israel having an opportunity to present information that you cannot present. (3) You accept Georgeown University's view of the "Semitic Family Quarrel" and feel those holding different views should be silenced. There may be other reasons. 4. Most of my professional life was helping churches with acoustics problems. I would not have been able to do so if I had evengelized for Judaism, and I do not do so now, and not on this Website. Those who accuse me of his are lying, plain and simple. On this website and outside my Yeshiva in general, I am religion-neutral, and everybody who knows me knows that.
Here are some possible reasons: (!) You hold "Replacement Theology Views." (2) You resent someone living in Israel having an opportunity to present information that you cannot present. (3) You accept Georgeown University's view of the "Semitic Family Quarrel" and feel those holding different views should be silenced. There may be other reasons.
4. Most of my professional life was helping churches with acoustics problems. I would not have been able to do so if I had evengelized for Judaism, and I do not do so now, and not on this Website. Those who accuse me of his are lying, plain and simple. On this website and outside my Yeshiva in general, I am religion-neutral, and everybody who knows me knows that.
1. None of those reasons apply.
2. You're so immersed in your religion that you don't even see it. Almost every time you post (not just this thread), you mention your Yeshiva. I don't see anyone else on these forums continually posting "On the way home from my Roman Catholic mass last Sunday, I went trainwatching". Even Father Al, who I believe is a Lutheran(?) priest, never mentions his religious affiliation (that's why I'm not sure what denomination he is) unless he says in passing that he had railfanned an area for several years because he was assigned in that area. I don't care what religion you are, I just don't need to be continually reminded of it, as it isn't germane to the forum.
My life is at the Yeshiva. I write my railfqn stuff at the Yeshiva. The computer I use to upgrade pictures is at the Yeshiva. You use the words home, car, office, etc often when you descrive what is going on in your life. Instead of all those I have fhe Yeshiva. It's my real home.
If the word Yeshiva, no matter how many times I use it, bothers you, that tells me somethng about you, and I simply do not want you to post on a thread that I wite. Any thread. But esecially one where I start to describe what some Germans did to memorialze a segment of their population that they truly wish they had not lost.
On this, I think Charlie will agree, and I welcome his comment.
Please, don't read my posts. I don't need your attacks.
You play the victim well.
And the only religious view promoted by excerpts from my book than I hoped ansered your specific questions regarding Empathy is:
Tolerance.
Not any particular relgion or belief system.
I had intended to find an excuse the post the following, which I consider important information that should be widely read, excerpted from the Orlando Sentinal:
1. On this thread, you cannot find one senence from me either promoting or explaining Judaism as a religion, other than the one explaination about what Dieter's Thesis concerned. And I certainly will avoid even going that far in the future.
2. I do answer your quessions politely. But accusing me of lacking empathy or promoting Judaism are not quesitions but both accusations and lies.
3. On the Classical Trains Forum, Journey of Destiny Thread: The original poster, Miningman, and I explored in detail Father Frank Browne's life, and in doing so certainly put Roman Catholisism in a very good light, because Father Frank Browne was a very fine person (and obviously a railfan with a paricular love for steam). Neither of us intended to promote the Catholic Church or its religion, and nobody accused us of doing so. But someone who is an Orthodox Jew is fair came to the four people who "agree." (And perhaps Charlile has changed his mind.) Here are some possible reasons: (!) You hold "Replacement Theology Views." (2) You resent someone living in Israel having an opportunity to present information that you cannot present. (3) You accept Georgeown University's view of the "Semitic Family Quarrel" and feel those holding different views should be silenced. There may be other reasons.
5. Nobody forces you to read my postings. If you don't like them, please don't read them. I started this thread and hereby ask you not to post on it in the future, so ohers who appreciate my contributions can continue to read them and post their informative contribuiions. Thank you.
I've been to Dachau in 1978. The most depressing place I've ever been. It's just in a suburb of Munich and I suppose that when it was in operation it was a lot less developed in the area around it. There was a fairly busy road that was just alongside it. The Arbeit Macht Frei gate was there but in an abandoned and overgrown area- people entered the site on a side opposite from that. The tour guide said that it was for political prisoners and so forth but was not really an extermination camp such as there were in Poland but there was a gas chamber and the ovens as I described in another post. The barracks are gone and there is a replica of one built after the war and the adminstration buildings are there. I did not see any rail tracks.
What a cheerful subject this entire thread is and how angry it seems to make some people.
Just to stay on topic, both Buchenwald and Dora were served by railway sidings, Dachau not, but it was the first and many of its prisoners and dead were socialists and communists, i.e., the only real opposition to the NS prior to and after the emergency decree. Railwaymen, particularly in the Wedding district of Berlin, were fierce enemies of the Gestapo, so much so that even late in the war, they didn't raid houses there at night for fear of being executed.
I guess that I'll make it +3. When Convicted One, Charlie Hebdo, 243129 and I agree on something, a religious place of punishment just dropped below 32*F.
Convicted One Flintlock76 OK, now you've got two. But, why is there one poster who adamantly insists upon forcefeeding his religion and attendant social dogma to the forum, despite TOS prohibitions? Your distraction of trying to excuse one failing by introducing another, while admirably compassionate, really (IMO) only encourages future repetition. Lets be realistic, the TOS requirement is not intended to punish anyone, It exists exactly because such topics are sensitive in nature to multiple people for varying and disparate reasons. Their discussion invariably declines into just the type of cat fights that we have here now, The best way to avoid these confrontations is to not bring up such topics to begin with. I wish everybody could accept this. The prevailing attitude that seems to feed these conflicts appears to be one in which party A continually posts subject matter known by all to be prone to contention, yet the subject is only considered "contentious" after any "party B" dare disagree with them. Seems a little one sided to me.
Flintlock76 OK, now you've got two.
But, why is there one poster who adamantly insists upon forcefeeding his religion and attendant social dogma to the forum, despite TOS prohibitions?
Your distraction of trying to excuse one failing by introducing another, while admirably compassionate, really (IMO) only encourages future repetition.
Lets be realistic, the TOS requirement is not intended to punish anyone, It exists exactly because such topics are sensitive in nature to multiple people for varying and disparate reasons. Their discussion invariably declines into just the type of cat fights that we have here now,
The best way to avoid these confrontations is to not bring up such topics to begin with. I wish everybody could accept this.
The prevailing attitude that seems to feed these conflicts appears to be one in which party A continually posts subject matter known by all to be prone to contention, yet the subject is only considered "contentious" after any "party B" dare disagree with them.
Seems a little one sided to me.
+2
daveklepper In answering your specific question, by
You did NOT answer my specific question.
daveklepperExamination of this thread indicates you have used it only for attacks on me and just possibly on Jews in general.
Asking a question and making an observation on your topic are personal attacks?
I take umbrage at your inference that I am attacking Jews in general. Point out where I attack you and Jews in general or STFU.
1. Use of railways for the Holocaust is a railway matter and not a reigous matter.
2. The`Wurzburg Railrtoad Station memorial was funded and organized by Germans, not by any religious group, and it is a railroad matter, not a religoius matter.
3. I will continue to post the news of any similar railroad-related memorial for any religious, ethnic, national, or racial group regardless of any criticism.
4. The history of the word ribbit is a language matter, and in explaining its history I did noi discuss religion beyond expressing the purpose of my student's thesis. But I'll avoid going into religious matters even that far in the future. .
Flintlock76OK, now you've got two.
1. In answering your specific question, by joining the Interracial Youth Conferencd of Greater New York as a teenager and discussing ways to overcome, get round, negate the effects of discrimination with my fellow teenages of all different colors represented in Greater New York's population. Already posted about this affiliation. Apperently, you did not bother to read it.
2. By continiuing my efforts with cash contibutions to such organizasions as the Southern Poverty Law Center and the NAACP during the period when my income permitted such contributions.
3. By voting in USA elections for people that I felt would enforce measures against discrimination. I violated this rule only once in my life because I truly believed there was an even greater danger, and I still believe I made this once-only decision correctly and it probably need never be repeated.
4. Personal relations with others of different color, ethnicity, and/or religion
Examination of this thread indicates you have used it only for attacks on me and just possibly on Jews in general. In no case have I found you making a contribution to knowledge, railwise or anything else. on this thread. I posted this thread and hereby ask you to desist, so others can continue to post useful information and read it.
I can also point out that, given my past postings of music experiences in Christian churches, usually in connection with some travel report, of course if I had known of a station memorial to some persecution of another ethnic grouip, it would have been mentioned along with Grunewald, a different station memorial.
But it would have had to have been a railroad station memorial.
Again, please desist from further personal attacks.
daveklepperI don't need to prove my empathy for you. Other readers can read about what I have done with my life and conclude I've demonstrated a whale of a lot more empathy that you have in your life.
I AM SPEAKING ONLY OF THIS THREAD and what you posted.
What do you base this statement on? " I've demonstrated a whale of a lot more empathy that you have in your life."
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