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I need a drink!! Is your local trackside bar open?

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Posted by tree68 on Sunday, July 19, 2020 3:23 PM

blue streak 1
Legal question .  Person "A: leaves a high out break state.  "A" arrives at state with registring and self reporting but does not report or isolate.  Later "A" is proven to have been a carrier or even infected.  "A" exposes "B" who dies.  Can "A" be prosecuted for say voluntary manslaughter ? 

Nobody seems to want to prosecute a couple of governors who put infected people in nursing homes, so I doubt it.  

That's not to say it couldn't happen.

We're dealing with a situation here where a group of young folks got together for an outing on the river on the Fourth.  Eight "cases" were reported, although no one is saying if that was eight people who actually got sick, or one that got sick and the rest are considered such.  

It also hasn't come out just exactly where the "Typhoid Mary" came into this story.   The county has had just over 120 cases since day one, and now suddenly there are eight at once?  

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Posted by alphas on Sunday, July 19, 2020 1:09 AM

Maybe if it can be proven he/she knew they were infected and deliberately set out to spread it.    Its similar to people knowing they have AIDS and withholding that info from their sexual partners.    The next question is could they be charged with involuntary manslaughter or criminal negligence if they can't be charged with voluntary manslaughter?      There are grounds for a civil lawsuit even if no criminal charges can be made.   Of course, if the perpetrator has no assets then its unlikely to occur (unless its to collect against any future assets).    

The trial lawyers will want to go after bigger targets in civil cases regarding COVID--States and municipalities, companies, school districts, transit agencies, nursing homes, hospitals, doctors, etc.     Eventually, you'll be seeing the same type of lawyer adds on TV for COVID as you see for other diseases and various medical events.   

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Saturday, July 18, 2020 10:39 PM

LLegal question .  Person "A: leaves a high out break state.  "A" arrives at state with registring and self reporting but does not report or isolate.  Later "A" is proven to have been a carrier or even infected.  "A" exposes "B" who dies.  Can "A" be prosecuted for say voluntary manslaughter ? 

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Posted by tree68 on Saturday, July 18, 2020 2:32 PM

Flintlock76
However, fly into New Jersey and this  is what's waiting for you, depending on where you're coming from.

Same thing in NY.  You're supposed to report yourself and self quarantine for 14 days no matter how you arrive.  I would suspect that a vast number of folks arriving via private transportation will ignore the directive.  That won't be a problem unless they manage to spawn an "outbreak."  

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Posted by Flintlock76 on Saturday, July 18, 2020 11:51 AM

CSSHEGEWISCH
Airliners are interstate commerce and come under Federal jurisdiction and come under non-existent Federal guidelines.

Makes sense.  And of course no one in either political party is going to seriously suggest shutting down or curtailing airline operations while this dilemma is in progress.

However, fly into New Jersey and this  is what's waiting for you, depending on where you're coming from.

https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2020/07/people-who-fly-into-nj-will-be-asked-to-fill-out-survey-amid-out-of-state-quarantine-advisory.html  

Whether this is an interference with interstate commerce is something the lawyers will have to figure out. 

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Posted by tree68 on Saturday, July 18, 2020 11:15 AM

CSSHEGEWISCH
Simple, the establishments mentioned arre governed by statutes and guidelines of the state in which they are located. 

This is the hammer the states will use to enforce their "directives."  Governor's decrees don't generally have the force of law, but if they threaten to pull your license to whatever, you have no choice but to comply.  

Were it not for that hammer, many businesses would likely tell the states where to shove it.

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Posted by CSSHEGEWISCH on Saturday, July 18, 2020 10:03 AM

Simple, the establishments mentioned arre governed by statutes and guidelines of the state in which they are located.  Airliners are interstate commerce and come under Federal jurisdiction and come under non-existent Federal guidelines.

The daily commute is part of everyday life but I get two rides a day out of it. Paul
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Posted by Flintlock76 on Friday, July 17, 2020 9:34 PM

Lets see here, restaurants only allowed 50% capacity, if that much.  Some places outdoor dining only, some take-out only.  Bars?  Who knows? Seems to change all the time.

But you can still be sealed in an airliner with as many people as they can cram in the thing and be launched to all parts of the country, and who knows how many "Typhoid Marys" might be on board?    

Can someone explain that to me?  Hmm

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Posted by Enzoamps on Friday, July 17, 2020 8:16 PM

I used to travel the USA and I always checked the blue laws when I arrived.  It was 40 years ago, but in Connecticut, I found beer for takeout stopped at 8PM, but bars could stay open until 1AM.  Apparently if you wanted a drink in the evening, they'd prefer you were out driving about rather than sitting at home.

Here in Michigan we closed all bars and restaurants and most stores.  Then they relaxed it a step and bars could sell takeout only, and restaurants as well, takeout only.  Curbside signs popped up everywhere.  I live next to a brewery, they cut a hole in one door and set up a to go counter.

And later they opened up bars and restaurants for dine in, but only 50% capacity and seats separated - like every third bar stool.  And immediately we had a student bar in East Lansing - Harpers - where the kids crammed in and bunched up in lines, and by the next day the virus spread.  SO far we have 186 people with COVID from that one incident.

They have since tightened up a little, but restaurants are still open for dine in, with the restriction.  I was just at a Texas Roadhouse this evening.  We have to wear masks.  The diners have removed all the stuff that sits on the tables, like ketchup and salt shakers.  Some limit menus.  Others replaced the plastic coated menus with menu printed on paper place mat - disposable.  Some will wipe salt shakers and bring you one, others serve up the little paper packets of salt.

No buffet places at all, and no place in the area that makes sushi is open for dine in.  To go only.

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Posted by tree68 on Friday, July 17, 2020 5:46 PM

adkrr64

Maybe someone will add a nice bowl of chilled India Pale Ale soup to their food menu.

The problem is, the business owners are looking for guidance.  If the Gov figures out that they're selling a bag of chips or the like as the "food," something is sure to come down that says they have to have the food prepared on site - and not all bars have kitchens, or the permits to operate one.

LarryWhistling
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Posted by highball6868 on Friday, July 17, 2020 4:00 PM

Found this great little place in Vermont-https://www.windsorstationvt.com/our-menu/

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Posted by adkrr64 on Friday, July 17, 2020 11:56 AM

Maybe someone will add a nice bowl of chilled India Pale Ale soup to their food menu.

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Posted by tree68 on Friday, July 17, 2020 7:24 AM

If you're in NYS, you have to order food now, too...  Governor's orders.  Snack sized chips are flying off the shelves...

LarryWhistling
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Posted by PennsyBoomer on Friday, July 17, 2020 12:24 AM

BaltACD

 Speaking of "crazy quilts" ... I used to carry a wallet size card delineating the various states and their motorcycle helmet laws (you can ride from Pennsylvania to California, exclusive, on I-80, without one, except for nanny Nebraska). Now one needs a state "quilt" for gun laws and face diaper laws. Balkanization at its best. 

charlie hebdo
Five package  stores in Bristol,  TN that sell alcoholic beverages. King University and a Bible college. 

 

Alcohol laws among the various governmental areas across the USA have created at crazy quilt of regulations that is worthy of the Mad Hatter at his maddest!

I would venture that the imposition of Prohibition on the country created the near universal disrespect for the law as people wanted their 'adult beverages' without regard to any laws to the contrary.

 

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Posted by SFbrkmn on Tuesday, April 7, 2020 4:09 PM

Right now, we all could use a drink

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Posted by guetem1 on Tuesday, April 7, 2020 3:17 PM

there is a BBQ joint/bar near the UP Davidson yard (nee Centennial, nee, Lancaster) called the railhead that does a fair business (or did....)

 

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Posted by alphas on Monday, April 6, 2020 2:04 PM

BaltACD
Alcohol laws among the various governmental areas across the USA have created at crazy quilt of regulations that is worthy of the Mad Hatter at his maddest! I would venture that the imposition of Prohibition on the country created the near universal disrespect for the law as people wanted their 'adult beverages' without regard to any laws to the contrary.

 

States have always determined their own alcohol laws since the repeal of prohibition which is why where you can buy various forms of alcohol varies so much.   The current legal age of 21 for all states is because the Feds used the power of the purse to push the states who were less than 21 to conform.    

There was not "near universal disregard" for prohibition in the US.   The majority of the people either supported it or didn't care one way or another which was why it got passed in the first place.     Support for it did drop over the years it existed, particularly in the urban areas, but not anywhere to to the extent "near universal disregard" implies.    Opposition to it was not enough to bring the democrats to power until 1932 when the Great Depression dominated all other issues. 

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Posted by alphas on Monday, April 6, 2020 1:23 PM

[quote user="BaltACD"]

 Prohibition was the 'Stimulus Package' that organized crime needed to gain 'market share' in providing product to the multitudes that did not agree with the 'official policy' that was enacted into law by the government.

 

That's a good summation of what happen during prohibition.    What I was saying  was that organized crime was already a problem before prohibition.    Its safe to say that if prohibition hadn't been passed, organized crime would still have been with us and their involvement in drugs would have occurred earlier than it did.    It wasn't until it looked like prohibition might go away that drugs got much attention from organized crime who started looking for ways to replace their lost income from booze.

There is one positive result that is usually overlooked about the US attempt at prohibition.   Diseases and deaths associated with alcoholism dropped quite a bit  during its time, extending into the 1930's.     They didn't rise back to their pre-prohibition levels until the 1940's.

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Posted by Semper Vaporo on Monday, April 6, 2020 12:49 PM

I have often wondered, if there were a U.S. Constitutional Amendment prohibiting the consumption of PEAS, would there be a "cartel" formed to supply them?  Would there be secret clubs formed where you had to know the password to get in, so you could have a bowl of pea soup?  Would butter knives have to be redesigned so peas would not rest on them?

Semper Vaporo

Pkgs.

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Posted by York1 on Monday, April 6, 2020 9:00 AM

At my college, the official policy was no alcohol on campus.

We found there was a big difference in how this was enforced between the men's and women's dorms.

If a girl brought alcohol into the dorm, someone always reported her and she was punished.

If a boy brought alcohol into the dorm, chances are that it was shared with everyone, and the RA was even invited to the party.  I don't recall a single boy punished for alcohol.

York1 John       

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Posted by BaltACD on Monday, April 6, 2020 6:56 AM

alphas
 
NKP guy
One of my profs at KSU remarked, "This country never had an organized crime problem until Prohibition was passed." 

Cute saying but not true.    Organized crime existed and was an urban problem prior to prohibition.   Protection, prostitution, and gambling was its main focus before prohibition, but it was also involved in smuggling.    Then it got much more involved with drugs and organized labor in the '30's.  

Prohibition was the 'Stimulus Package' that organized crime needed to gain 'market share' in providing product to the multitudes that did not agree with the 'official policy' that was enacted into law by the government.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by alphas on Sunday, April 5, 2020 11:54 PM

NKP guy
One of my profs at KSU remarked, "This country never had an organized crime problem until Prohibition was passed."

Cute saying but not true.    Organized crime existed and was an urban problem prior to prohibition.   Protection, prostitution, and gambling was its main focus before prohibition, but it was also involved in smuggling.    Then it got much more involved with drugs and organized labor in the '30's.  

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Posted by BaltACD on Sunday, April 5, 2020 11:04 PM

Deggesty
When I was at King, gambling and the use of alcoholic bevrages were forbidden. I rather doubt that that has been changed (it is sometime since I have read the students' handbook).

Official policy and reality are often very different.

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Posted by Electroliner 1935 on Sunday, April 5, 2020 9:26 PM

When I was in college, I worked on the auditorium handling lighting and film projection jobs. The head stage man was a former Pullman conductor. School was officially "dry" but he keep the booze in his locker. I watched him fill a class tumber (estimate that it was at least 12 oz of clear liquid) with either gin or vodka and drink it straight. No noticable effect on how he acted. Often wondered how his liver was. He would share it with some of the coeds. Often wonder what happened to him as he was still there when I graduated. 

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Posted by Deggesty on Sunday, April 5, 2020 3:00 PM

When I was at King, gambling and the use of alcoholic bevrages were forbidden. I rather doubt that that has been changed (it is sometime since I have read the students' handbook).

Johnny

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Posted by zugmann on Sunday, April 5, 2020 2:11 PM

NKP guy
   As for Pennsylvania's Beer Stores and other states with silly liquor laws from a bygone era that somehow persist:  follow the money.  It's lobbyists who keep these laws in place. 

Also has a smattering of help from the religious sector (remnant of the blue laws). 

There are still "dry townships" in the Keystone state, last I checked. Although they were dwindling. 

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any

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Posted by NKP guy on Sunday, April 5, 2020 1:06 PM

BaltACD
would venture that the imposition of Prohibition on the country created the near universal disrespect for the law as people wanted their 'adult beverages' without regard to any laws to the contrary.

   One of my profs at KSU remarked, "This country never had an organized crime problem until Prohibition was passed."  

   As for Pennsylvania's Beer Stores and other states with silly liquor laws from a bygone era that somehow persist:  follow the money.  It's lobbyists who keep these laws in place. 

 

                                                    * * * * * 

   Also:  Cleveland used to have a great little diner for truckers on St. Clair Avenue in the trucking-company district.  It's name?  The Fifth Wheel, of course.

 

 

 

 

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Posted by BaltACD on Sunday, April 5, 2020 11:12 AM

York1

Balt, Off-topic, but how are you feeling?

Vertical, breathing and above room temperature, eating vegitation not feeding it.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by 54light15 on Sunday, April 5, 2020 11:02 AM

A real trackside bar is Gene McCarthy's Old First Ward Brewing Company on the south side of Buffalo, N.Y. Directly across the street is a small active train yard that serves the grain elevators nearby. McCarthy's is a cool old Irish bar with excellent food and they make their own beer which is excellent as well. I stop in whenever I'm travelling through Buffalo. 

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