According to another source, Subtropolis has a total square footage of 55 million sq ft, of which only 14 million sq ft are being marketed as business space available for lease.
Of that 14 million, 6 million sq ft are presently occupied, a 42% (+/-) occupancy rate. Not really a stellar performer.
Perhaps the low overall occupancy ratio (6 of 55 million sq ft) provides a cushion to their air quality issues?
FWIW, I've been in cautious disbelief over how well lit the pictured areas have been in their leasing info. I just found the following image that appears to be more typical of what I would expect to be the case:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Subtropolis_02.JPG
MiningmanThank you. Always and ever steam!
Subtropolis might make an interesting use of a steam "tank" engine?
Thanks, aerogratio.
I was told, in 1960, that mushrooms were grown in it. I ventured into one day, but did not have a flashlight with me so I did not go very far.
Dynamite certainly was not used, for Alfred Nobel did not perfect it until 1867.
An aside--for a time, Amtrak, in its information about the route from New York to Florida, stated that Union officers used dynamite to dig the cave under Petersburg that became the "Crater." Amtrak's writer was not up on military procedure or the history of dynamite. That information was not in later editions of the information.
Johnny
Deggesty As to caves, there was, sixty years ago, a cave near Walhalla, S.C. It was the start of a railroad tunnel that was not completed. Clemson University was using it to cultivate mushrooms.
As to caves, there was, sixty years ago, a cave near Walhalla, S.C. It was the start of a railroad tunnel that was not completed. Clemson University was using it to cultivate mushrooms.
Sliding OT: Some old coal mines in PA are used for that purpose. We have a local farmer who ships hay there for the bedding for the mushrooms...
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
I've been to this facility or one like it, years and years ago. My employer at the time was making and installing metal shelving and catwalk that mounted between lines of shelving, to a government agency which was fitting out their space for paper document storage. In the room where the installer was working, the lights were on for about 100 yards from the wall we entered through, and I don't know how far it went beyond that. The "room" was at least 200 feet wide, and all of this was full or would be full of row after row of metal shelving 20 or 30 feet high (can't remember if there was one or two levels of catwalk above the floor). We were shipping them an 18-wheeler or two per week of shelving parts and catwalk panels, and the installers were keeping up with deliveries. That is the most shelving I have ever seen in one place in my life. It was very impressive.
Bleu cheese!! Amazing!
https://www.roadsideamerica.com/tip/1178
Semper Vaporo --- Thank you. Always and ever steam!
I have been there because a clients disaster recovery site was there. Many cars and trucks drive into that place. It has a very powerful dual but seperate ventilation system. The interior areas have their own HVAC and air exchange system that runs basically like any regular office. Exterior where the cars and trucks drive and park there is a constant breeze throughout the complex so the fumes from truck or car exhaust do not linger. It is better ventilated then most outdoor multilevel parking garages. Clearences are pretty tight on some of the roads inside the structure..
As for the rail service, you will have to ask someone that lives there but its my belief that the large KC railroads have contracted out most of their switching in city limits to Kansas City Terminal Railway. I stay in KC a lot and have yet to see a UP or BNSF switcher run by KC Union Station. It is always Kansas City Terminal Railway doing the switching. Now it might just be on the section of track I am observing but I kind of suspect it is across the city.
rvos1979 the customer I went to with paper products was quite a ways back in,
Thanks for sharing your first hand experience.
Is there any way you could make a reasonable guestimate what proportion is currently occupied vs vacant? a third? half? three quarters? etc.
I've been in that particular cave, it's very interesting. Called customer before entering to be sure I can get into the dock (space is very tight, and the rock is unforgiving to a trailer). One of those places where you can't have too many vehicles in the same place because you can't physically fit otherwise. Don't remember much about the ventilation, but the customer I went to with paper products was quite a ways back in, and gas vehicles were allowed in, the workers drove their own vehicles in. The front part has very few straight roads, as I got further back, it became more regular. There are similar caves in other parts of Missouri, Carthage and Springfield are two others that come to mind, those two are actually cold storage facilities if I remember correctly........
Randy Vos
"Ever have one of those days where you couldn't hit the ground with your hat??" - Waylon Jennings
"May the Lord take a liking to you and blow you up, real good" - SCTV
MP173The vehicles shown in the photograph are at an upfitter
Definitely true MP173. The point I was hoping people would gather ....look at the treads on the tires. Definitely driven into the upfitters occupied location.
No skids or gurneys were injured in the making of that photograph.
For the heck of it, I superimposed the site plan for the entire Subtropolis site onto a Kansas City map, just to get an idea how far back into the catacombs their lease offerings stretch.
I'd post it here, but don't want to risk running afoul of the intellectual property police, ....but I will say that their penetration is substantial. Well north of Parvin Rd.
One of the spaces they are offering to lease is a 200,000 sq ft space boasting 18 dock-high loading doors, and this space is as deep into the catacombs as any they show on their drawings.
1. I doubt those 18 docks will be served exclusively by electric tow motors
2. Contemplating the advertised 17' ceiling height, that space alone is 3.4 million cubic feet of volume. You'd need a 60,000 cfm fan just to accomplish one complete air change per hour.
3. That's just one 200K sqft space, a fly on the elephant
Again repeating myself, I'd love to see their ventilation strategy.
Miningman It's more like a ' tunnel' ... large surface openings on either end and obviously serious exhaust ventilation. The vehicles also could be all Diesel engined. You simply cannot run gasoline engines in any enclosed space.
It's more like a ' tunnel' ... large surface openings on either end and obviously serious exhaust ventilation. The vehicles also could be all Diesel engined. You simply cannot run gasoline engines in any enclosed space.
If you go to 6:30--6:50; 11:47--12:15; 21:50-22:30; you will see some sedans and small suv's that I doubt have diesel engines and at other locations in the video, auto pass the truck. It looks like workers are parking their personal cars which the companies allow and the ventilation handles. A spill and or fire may be a problem.
Well... I, for one, understood what you meant. But thanks for clarifying it for the others.
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
Picture a railway yard with a ladder track with 4 parallel tracks each ending with a bumper post/stop.
The 4 individual parallel tracks would be called an 'Ore Drive'. So ore drive 1, ore drive 2....and so on. At the end of the track at the bumper post would be the drawpoint. The drawpoint contains 'muck', which is broken ore or rock by blasting or other mechanical means.
Scooptrams are low clearance front end loaders with buckets ranging from 2cu/yds to 14cu/yds. They move down the ore drive to the drawpoints, dig in, and back out with a bucket full of muck ( blasted and broken ore). Basically the stope would be the entire area of mining operations.
So 4 scooptrams, mucking out 4 drawpoints. It is a ballet because they have to do it in such a fashion as to not interfere with each other when they reach the 'ladder track'. ( At some point the ore would then be dumped into an ore pass, which goes to the bottom level of the Mine in what is known as the loading pocket... from there it is hoisted to surface in a skip).
So picture 4 locomotives removing cars one a time from each of the 4 tracks and building a solid train somewhere else without interfering with each other. A ballet!
Murphy Siding Miningman ...a ballet of 4 scooptrams mucking out multiple drawpoints in a stope.
Miningman ...a ballet of 4 scooptrams mucking out multiple drawpoints in a stope.
Ok thanks MP173
The vehicles shown in the photograph are at an upfitter.
New vans, pickups, etc are brought from OEM manufacturer (GM, Chrysler, Ford, etc) and are "upfitted" for final delivery to the end user with interior racking and graphics.
Ed
Miningmana ballet of 4 scooptrams mucking out multiple drawpoints in a stope.
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
MiningmanDude-- Onky Diesel engines allowed to operate underground.
Then how do you explain all the automobiles that are shown in the video. Somebody did not get the memo?
Dude-- Onky Diesel engines allowed to operate underground. Scoop trams, ore trucks, long hole drills, personnel carriers, geologists, survey crews, shift bosses and mine captains all zipping around drifts, x-cuts and ramps in Diesel powered Kubota's. Gasoline powered anything is 100% banned at all times, by Law and common sense.
Mine Ventilation is serious business and an entire department within engineering, with specialists and technologists working in Mine Ventilation only. There are special doors that seal off a Mine into sections and Diesel equipment is limited in numbers at any time.
You log in on a large panel sign and log out when you leave. Sometimes you cannot proceed down a ramp or enter an area until a piece of equipment comes out. So you wait in front of the doors, kind of akin to waiting in a siding.
2,000, 3,000 or 7,500 feet down any gasoline engine will result in carbon monoxide death.
Ventilation in a Mine is very robust and Diesel fumes are carried away fairly quickly, although I have seen the air blue with exhaust from a ballet of 4 scooptrams mucking out multiple drawpoints in a stope.
Ventilation is exceptional in an Uranium mine, with multiples of redundancy and each working area separately exhausted, it is not passed on down the line and then out.
If you get lost underground and get confused a good rule of thumb is to lick your finger and hold it up and feel the way the 'wind' is blowing and follow that... it will get you to the shaft where you can call for the cage.
mudchickenGo in there with a gas engined anything and you won't come out. (plus you will spook any miner in the hood)
Forces one to think:
Just looking at the total cubic volume, and assuming a minimum of 4 air changes per hour....plus I'm sure there must be some form of redundancy required.
Miningman can elaborate or correct me on this, but it is my understanding that diesels are preferred for underground operations because they do not produce a lot of carbon monoxide, unlike gasoline engines.
Propane or natural gas engines produce even less CO, but then you have the added risk of a gas explosion from a fuel leak.
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
Go in there with a gas engined anything and you won't come out.
(plus you will spook any miner in the hood)
Retired TunnelRat
I'd love to see their ventilation system. With a big diesel belching exhaust deep into one of their caverns, you'd think OSHA would have some "air change" requirements to be reconned with.
JoeBlowHow far do the rail spurs go into the tunnels?
The graphics in their leasing brochure leave a lot to be desired, but if you look at the following partial site plan, I believe the dotted lines depict rail sidings.
Noteworthy, most of the blocks of space depicted on this sketch are not among the portions currently being offered as available. Either that's because they are already occupied (if so, then good for them), or because they have not yet been made into marketable areas (utilities, lights etc)
JoeBlowFinally, who switches the industrial park nex door?
Assuming I've hit the mark at N 39.1635 W 94.47694, and assuming the mapping service that I use is accurate, it appears to be BNSF
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