When a signal goes out

[Anonymous]

Quoth jeaton: "Speaking of which-Do TM's set ABS signals to red for testing crews? If so, is there a "test" switch in a locked signal box or is "another" method employed."

Yes, TMs and RFEs do these dastardly deeds. In some locations there is a plug in locked signal cases that can be pulled to set the signals red. In other locations, other methods can be used (I've used some of them, and for obvious reasons I'm not saying what they are). In TC territory, the dispatcher can be instructed to hold a controlled signal in stop position to see if the crew makes the proper stop and communicates with the dispatcher. The dispatcher will just say, "I can't give you that signal" and then tell the train what he wants it to do.

Supervisors are required to make a certain number of tests. Usually they don't like being out there any more than the crews like for them to be.

Don't tell me about the TMs that have it in for crew members; I've heard it all before. Before you can convince me about them, you've got to convince me that all crews are always innocent and always follow the letter of the rule.

Don't waste your time trying.

Old Timer

[jeaton]

Speaking of which-Do TM's set ABS signals to red for testing crews? If so, is there a "test" switch in a locked signal box or is "another" method employed.

Jay

[Anonymous]

Many railroads had "burnout protection" in ABS territory. If a signal light was burned out, it draws no amperage, and was wired so that under that condition the signal in advance displayed a yellow (approach) indication.

On one such railroad, a Trainmaster figured he could put a milk can over the green indication on a signal, thus making it dark. But the train got a clear signal on the last one in advance, and came busting around the corner to find a dark one. After it came to light what had caused the engineer to make an emergency stop, the TM was shown the error of his ways . . .

And, no, it wasn't me.

Old Timer

[ValleyX]

Is X a symbol for being dark? If so, signal has to be taken at its most restrictive indication, which being an absolute signal, would be STOP.

[csxengineer98]

what do you mean..how would i react..... need a bit more info on how this seniro is building up...but if i was to come into an absolute signal...on a clear....and i have a red or a dark signal...you come to a controlled stop if you can see the track head of you is clear...if i cant see..or i can see that it isnt....ONE BIG HOLE COMEING UP....and maybe ABANDON SHIP depending on speed..and distance to impact...
csx engineer

[JoeKoh]

ok I saw the following on csx tracks.these are absolute sinals too
x r
r r
track 2 track 1
facing west

facing east
r r
x r
r track 2
track 1
these signals are at fc tower on the willard sub defiance oh.
how would you react?
stay safe
joe

[csxengineer98]

always take the signal for the most restirctive indication that it can display... should you come around the bend and see a dark signal....or a signal bulb burned out that shows a more restrictive indication than you should be getting at that location in relation to the signal you came in on....emergancy is not to be used unless you cant see the track to be clear headed of you.... if you can see...you use good train handeling to bring the train into compliance..and you run at that speed... untill you pass the next signal...
csx engineer

[Anonymous]

You don't necessarily have to go into emergency.

If the signal can be seen from a good distance and it is seen to be burnt out, then the engineer can bring the train to retricted speed under control.

Here in the CROR, if it is an intermediate with an "R" plate, then the most retrictive signal that can be given is a restricting, which allows the train to proceed at a speed not greater than 15 MPH prepared to stop short of an improperly lined switch, broken rail, equipment left on track, or an opposing movement. There is no requirement to stop and proceed.

The train then has to call up the RTC and notify them of the burnt out signal.

If the signal does not have an "R" plate, and all lights are burnt out (two or three aspect signal) - (very unlikely) then the most retrictive signal that could be displayed would be a stop, then the train has to call up the RTC and ask for a 564, which gives the train permission to pass the stop signal.

However if there is only one aspect burnt out on a 2 or 3 aspect signal, then as long as the bottom aspect is not yellow (which would be a restricting signal), then the train may proceed at the most restrictive possibility for that signal.

(If it was yellow over a burned out than the most restrictive would be a clear to stop.)

However, if at any point the signal appears to be damaged, than the train cannot pass that signal, as it's indication cannot be trusted, so again a 564 would have to be issued by the RTC, signal imperfectly displayed.

That's up here in Canada for the Canadian Railways, CROR.

[Junctionfan]

During the blackout, I believe all the trains went into emergency and reported to dispatch for futher instructions. The line were all CTC so if there isn't anything happening and on a really busy line where there are a lot of passing sidings, I guess that would be the safest choice.

[FThunder11]

I've noticed that about 5-10 minutes before a train gets to a signal( at least in Trinidad, Colorado) the signal comes on, what happens if the train is originally given a clear signal, and when the train gets to the signal, the green light is burned out? Does the train have to stop, ask for permission and then proceede?