One huge factor that nobody has mentioned yet is the relatively limited flight time of such vehicles.
The current best on the market consumer quadcopter is only good for 20 minutes.
While this is OK for track inspection under limited circumstances (10 minutes out and 10 minutes back at 30 MPH equals five miles), it's hardly suitable for chasing a train for 8 hours.
Never mind the requirement to have the drone in sight at all times, I would envision an employee going to one of several set locations known to need such inspection, uploading the planned route to the quad copter (it would have to be capable of autonomous flight based on GPS), then launching it and waiting for it's return. If the quad copter is capable of transmitting video for the entire trip, then the employee simply watches on his computer screen. If not, when the drone returns, he downloads the video and observes it then.
Larger autonomous flight vehicles exist - at a larger price.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Norm48327 The FAA has not yet finalized rules for operating drones and are notorious for taking their time.
The FAA has not yet finalized rules for operating drones and are notorious for taking their time.
Rgds IGN
zugmann Euclid I have a feeling that every sort of business is going to be buying drones and trying to figure out why they need them. It is just too gee whizz to resist. Everybody is going to need a drone to keep up with their competition. Until somebody brings an airplane down with a drone (not a matter of if but a matter of when, I'm afraid). Then that will be the end of the drone experiment, except for very limited uses.
Euclid I have a feeling that every sort of business is going to be buying drones and trying to figure out why they need them. It is just too gee whizz to resist. Everybody is going to need a drone to keep up with their competition.
Until somebody brings an airplane down with a drone (not a matter of if but a matter of when, I'm afraid). Then that will be the end of the drone experiment, except for very limited uses.
Also remember the drone that landed at the White House.
According to news reports the operator(who had been drinking at the time) was flying it inside his apartment when it got away from him.
Thx IGN
Primary railroad drone uses are by the engineering dept and emergency response. Bridge inspection, ability to look under a bridge without a "snooper" lift. Drones could also survey track before/during/after flooding conditions. Drones can survey an incident scene where there is suspected hazmat releases or there is restricted access.
If I was going to fly one in conjunction with a train I would do it behind the train in high fire risk areas by about 15-20 minutes with an infrared camera looking for hot spots.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
dehusmanIf I was going to fly one in conjunction with a train I would do it behind the train in high fire risk areas by about 15-20 minutes with an infrared camera looking for hot spots.
And this could be done from fixed locations as well.
zugmann Knowing Amazon, they probably have 737s on their site. With free Prime shipping, too.
Knowing Amazon, they probably have 737s on their site. With free Prime shipping, too.
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
tree68 One huge factor that nobody has mentioned yet is the relatively limited flight time of such vehicles. The current best on the market consumer quadcopter is only good for 20 minutes.
Murphy Siding zugmann Knowing Amazon, they probably have 737s on their site. With free Prime shipping, too. And in the future, they'll ship them to your door with a drone.
And in the future, they'll ship them to your door with a drone.
That'd be one awesome drone.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.
Murphy Siding tree68 One huge factor that nobody has mentioned yet is the relatively limited flight time of such vehicles. The current best on the market consumer quadcopter is only good for 20 minutes. Ya gotta think outside the boxes- air to air refueling. The airforce has been doing it since maybe the late 40's. If we can imagine drones flying above trains and dodging airplanes, surely we can imagine them refueling in flight.
Ya gotta think outside the boxes- air to air refueling. The airforce has been doing it since maybe the late 40's. If we can imagine drones flying above trains and dodging airplanes, surely we can imagine them refueling in flight.
I was thinking of putting little heli-ports on the locomotives. The drones can come back and re-fuel or re-charge every 20 minutes.
_____________
"A stranger's just a friend you ain't met yet." --- Dave Gardner
Paul of CovingtonThe current best on the market consumer quadcopter is only good for 20 minutes.
This is not a hobby store quadcopter.
This is an octocopter and weighs in at 55 pounds. Certainly it can carry more battery at that weight.
ROAR
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
I'm waiting for the drones that can touch down on a high-tension power line and charge up in 3 seconds...or fry to a crisp.
jcburns I'm waiting for the drones that can touch down on a high-tension power line and charge up in 3 seconds...or fry to a crisp.
Be more fun to watch the latter.
Norm
BroadwayLionThis is not a hobby store quadcopter. This is an octocopter and weighs in at 55 pounds. Certainly it can carry more battery at that weight.
No doubt - but probably still not enough to follow a mainline freight for several hundred miles at 60-70 MPH.
zugmann Euclid You can bet that every single bit of state, local, and federal government will find a need to be flying drones around. Day will turn to night just like during the great locust plagues. Perhaps, but I think it is more of a fad at this point. It'll pass.
Euclid You can bet that every single bit of state, local, and federal government will find a need to be flying drones around. Day will turn to night just like during the great locust plagues.
Perhaps, but I think it is more of a fad at this point. It'll pass.
Just like the automobile was going to be a fad. Then when it seemed too be catching on, cities were trying to ban them, but it was like trying to stop drinking with prohibition.
People will want their own drone!
Ken G Price My N-Scale Layout
Digitrax Super Empire Builder Radio System. South Valley Texas Railroad. SVTRR
N-Scale out west. 1996-1998 or so! UP, SP, Missouri Pacific, C&NW.
Apples and oranges. A car is practical conveyence. A drone is nothing more than an expensive toy for the majority of people. Add in a few extra FAA regs some day, and nobody but a handful of hobbyist is going to want to bother.
zugmann Apples and oranges. A car is practical conveyence. A drone is nothing more than an expensive toy for the majority of people. Add in a few extra FAA regs some day, and nobody but a handful of hobbyist is going to want to bother.
I'm pretty pro-drone in large scale applications, but the thing is sooooooo faddish. Most "drones" are simply RC helicopters with a trendy name slapped on it. If you're flying it, it's not a drone!
In the aviation sense, when I hear the term "drone" I usually think of an unmanned target aircraft or reconnaissance aircraft flown by remote control from a considerable distance away. I definitely do not think of the overgrown toys that are currently being called drones.
It seems to me that the requirement the drone remain within sight of the operator severely limits its use. Perhaps wreck inspection in a suspected hazardous enviroment might occur or the inspection of structural members of a bridge, but these are unusual circumstances.
To use a non-railroad example -- these things are being promoted as a tool to inspect growing crops. However, in my part of the country, fields of 30 or 40 acres are very common. A drone in the middle of that field perhaps is within my line of sight, but it may not be within my range of vision. A rail line, being long and narrow, suffers much more from that same limitation.
Railroads have used them for bridge inspections.
One thing people seem to be misunderstanding. The labor contrat wasn't saying that a conductor ON A TRAIN would be flying a drone, its said the CRAFT that would be flying drones would be a conductor (as opposed to an engineer or a maintenence employee). The conductors were carving out who does the work.
Euclid Regarding drones being a fad, gadgets sell like hotcakes, and drones fit right into that market. But I am surprised that a railroad company would jump on that bandwagon.
While the fad thing will eventually pass (thousands of "consumer" UAVs will be collecting dust in closets before too long), I think the industry will mature, and legitimate uses will be found - many of which have already been mentioned.
Looking specifically at railroad uses - the original concept of doing cursory inspections of trouble spots could be a real timesaver. No longer would a track inspector need to get track and time for a patrol. Just launch the UAV and run it from a safe location off the tracks. If problems are found, then it's time to set on and take a first hand look.
As has also been mentioned, this isn't a job for my Parrot AR.Drone 2.0. "Industrial quality" devices will be used, possibly even with satellite communications. Parameters can be set into the GPS to keep them out of trouble (ie, aircraft conflicts). There would be little need to fly them over 50 feet or so anyhow, barring "hard" obstructions.
I'm not at all surprised that BNSF (or any other railroad) would look to using UAV's. We know that management is always looking for a way to save a buck. This is just one possibility.
Two words (more or less): CB Radio. 10-4 good buddy, see ya on the flip-flop
Murphy Siding Two words (more or less): CB Radio. 10-4 good buddy, see ya on the flip-flop.
Two words (more or less): CB Radio. 10-4 good buddy, see ya on the flip-flop.
True.
One must remember, though, that many folks who used CB for business or official purposes in the early days eventually migrated to commercial LMR radio, including the "itinerant" channels, and now even trunked radio for some businesses. FRS and GMRS are also now in play for users who may have used CB in the past.
I haven't been on CB in years, but I think it's still a going concern. Just not like it was in it's heyday.
Euclid Has BNSF actually started using drones? The whole plan sounds a little farfetched to me. The references that I have seen are always wrapped up in a lot of explanation about union contracts with the drone just mentioned in passing. Regarding drones being a fad, gadgets sell like hotcakes, and drones fit right into that market. But I am surprised that a railroad company would jump on that bandwagon.
I am certain that they have. Not so much as a practicle work device, but more of a show-and-tell to the unions. "See, Look what we got! You wanna join in the fun?"
It is just like a push for operatorless trains, or trains with just a "rider" in the cab rather than an engineer and conductor. They *have* demonstrated this technology in a subtle way to their employees. On one run, my friend the conductor (and his engineer) were told not to touch the horn valve, and that the train would sound the horns automatically via GPS.
And the horns sounded with out any intervention.
Demonstration complet, now back to our regularly scheduled programing.
The engineers were offered the job of handling trains by remote control in the yards and at certain industries, they turned the offer down flat. Apparently they did not want to get out of their warm cabs and ditz about with heavy appliences, levers and switches.
The Conductor's Union accepted the responsibility, what the heck, they gotta go out there anyway, they may as well run the locomotive. No big deal.
BNSF is always out there looking for savings.
tree68 Murphy Siding Two words (more or less): CB Radio. 10-4 good buddy, see ya on the flip-flop. True. One must remember, though, that many folks who used CB for business or official purposes in the early days eventually migrated to commercial LMR radio, including the "itinerant" channels, and now even trunked radio for some businesses. FRS and GMRS are also now in play for users who may have used CB in the past. I haven't been on CB in years, but I think it's still a going concern. Just not like it was in it's heyday.
Murphy SidingI'm sure there are still HAM radio operators out there,
Yep - I just became one. You're right, it's not a huge group, but there's more than you might think.
Murphy Siding Two words (more or less): CB Radio. 10-4 good buddy, see ya on the flip-flop
She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw
Mookie Murphy Siding Two words (more or less): CB Radio. 10-4 good buddy, see ya on the flip-flop Bassett Hound here. Don't have ears any more, but traveled w/a trucker and that was our "smart phone".
Bassett Hound here. Don't have ears any more, but traveled w/a trucker and that was our "smart phone".
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