Amtrak Coffee whats your Op?

[Paul of Covington]

   With coffee, I'm kinda like Larry.   I love the smell of coffee roasting, coffee being ground, coffee brewing, but oddly, I don't like coffee.

[Anonymous]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iP6IUqrFHjw

 

 

[NKP guy]

It turns out that there are a zillion ways to "make coffee." but when it comes to my most memorable cups, I think the coffee we enjoyed aboard the Great Lakes ore boat I worked on in 1967 takes the prize.  Delicious.  Or was it that it just felt so welcome and good? Does anyone else remember those white heavy ceramic mugs that used to be ubiquitous? 

I've also had a cup of warm cocoa waiting in my roomette when I boarded the Three Rivers at Akron at an early hour on a cold morning; a very nice Attendant touch. indeed.

[Semper Vaporo]

tree68

Semper Vaporo

Personally, I HATE even the SMELL of coffee.

Curiously, I like the smell of freshly ground coffee - a favorite part of shopping with Mom back in the day was when she ground up the coffee at the A&P.

On the other hand, I can't stand the TASTE of the stuff - I don't even like it if someone gives me hot water for tea from a container that has held coffee.

I will admit that twice I have had a cup of coffee and really did enjoy them.  Both were similar situations, but I will only relate the first one (in 1965) because it sure changed my attitude on life.

I was waiting for a bus on 16th St. outside of Methodist Hospital in Indianapolis, Indiana, across the street from a small diner (that looked like it might have been a repurposed street car).  It was COLD, WINDY and SNOWING so hard I could not see very far down the street.

I was in misery!

A young fellow came up to me and asked, "Has the bus come yet?"  I was shivering so hard I didn't attempt to speak, I just shook my head, "No", but my thoughts were that this kid was probably the stupidest person alive... "Would I be standing here in this weather if the bus had come yet?"

He then said, "I'm going over to the diner, hold the bus for me!"  And he ran across the street.

Now I had an even lower opinion of this stupid creep!

"If he thinks I will hold the bus for him so he can wait in the warmth of the diner he has another think coming!"

About a minute later I caught a glimpse of what I figured was the bus as it rounded the corner about 2 blocks away.

I gave the young creep no further thought.

That is, until he suddenly thrust a cup of coffee at me and said, "Here, I didn't know if you took your coffee with cream or sugar so I just put a little sugar in it."

The gesture stunned me, but the warmth of that cup in my hands kept me from saying I can't stand even the smell of coffee!

As I held the cup with both hands and put my face over it to absorb what heat I could get from the steam (while I held my breath!), I felt so small and petty that I wanted to crawl under the cup.  I did taste the coffee and the heat going down my throat was WONDERFUL.  I don't remember the flavour, just the warmth.

Nicest thing a "creep" has ever done for me.  Never saw him again.

 

 

[Euclid]

Overmod

Euclid

You heat the basket with hot water before putting in the coffee.

Actually, you heat the basket with hot water, then add the coffee and heat again with hot water -- enough to moisten and warm up the grounds.  By the time you insert the basket and start the brewing, the 'bloom' will have happened.  And everything will have been preheated (but not too hot) so no premature quench of the aromatics...

... and I think it is the aromatics that make the 'early' coffee so fragrant.

Keep in mind that you will have to play with the grind of the coffee -- make it too fine and your first cups are going to resemble espresso because they'll leach too fast; too coarse and you'll have a watery cup that resembles in look and taste the water drained from a hot-water heating system.

When you say you heat again with hot water, do you mean to pour hot water onto the grounds in the basket before starting the coffee maker?  I don’t do that.  I might try that to see what happens.   As you suggest, this is a fussy process to get just the right result.  It can easily end up too strong or too weak.   I have noticed that I can hear how strong it is when I pour it into the cup.  

All I have concluded is that to get 1½ cups of baby coffee, I need to brew a batch size of 6 cups.  It won’t work with less than a 6 cup batch.  It also does not necessarily work to make more than 1½ cups of baby coffee by increasing the batch to more than 6 cups, although that probably depends on the coffee maker.  There is quite a choreography of events that has to take place to hit the bull’s-eye.  Generally, this revolves around the rate of water introduction into the coffee, and how long that it continues to flow through the grounds.    

I think it works better to have the coffee stored in the refrigerator due to the way it makes it sort of clumpy, but the refrigerator also makes the coffee cold, so the pre-warming process is more critical.  You mention that pre-heating can quench the aromatics.  Some people who use pause and brew without considering any preheating, will put their baby coffee in the microwave and give it a shot of heat before drinking it.  I have found that just ten seconds in the microwave makes the coffee a little warmer, but completely destroys the flavor.

I also think this requires Folgers Black Silk coffee, which happens to be a dark roast.   It may not be the best, but it is the best I can find at a reasonable price.   In any case, I think it requires a dark roast, but they can vary a lot.     

[tree68]

Semper Vaporo

Personally, I HATE even the SMELL of coffee.

Curiously, I like the smell of freshly ground coffee - a favorite part of shopping with Mom back in the day was when she ground up the coffee at the A&P.

On the other hand, I can't stand the TASTE of the stuff - I don't even like it if someone gives me hot water for tea from a container that has held coffee.

[Overmod]

Euclid

You heat the basket with hot water before putting in the coffee.

Actually, you heat the basket with hot water, then add the coffee and heat again with hot water -- enough to moisten and warm up the grounds.  By the time you insert the basket and start the brewing, the 'bloom' will have happened.  And everything will have been preheated (but not too hot) so no premature quench of the aromatics...

... and I think it is the aromatics that make the 'early' coffee so fragrant.

Keep in mind that you will have to play with the grind of the coffee -- make it too fine and your first cups are going to resemble espresso because they'll leach too fast; too coarse and you'll have a watery cup that resembles in look and taste the water drained from a hot-water heating system.

(One other little note: I've been told the magic hot water temperature is about 182 degrees F, and this has as little 'spread' as the magic temperature for mashed potatoes (between 161 and 165 degrees presoak).  So be careful that your brewer, whatever it is, does not just boil the water up and over the basket...)

[Semper Vaporo]

I worked with a fellow that when he came into the office in the morning would grab his never washed coffee cup, dump out the cigarette butts that he had put out in the cup the previous afternoon, put in 2 "HEAPING" spoonsful of instant coffee into the cup, then go to the office coffee pot and fill the cup with that fresh brewed coffee.  Once back as his desk he would drop 2 "No-Doze" tables in the cup, stir it a couple of times and gulp it down.  He would often repeat the process (without the No-Doze) a couple of hours later for the morning break.

 

Still, he yawned a lot in the afternoon.

 

 

[caldreamer]

Uncle Bernie knows real coffee.  that is the stufff I spoke of in my original reply..  Makes Turkish coffee taste like water with a drop of brown colring.

   Ira

  

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

Euclid's method makes a lot of sense to me.  I refuse to drink most teas because they start with merely hot water - not boiling - and then whatever heat the water had is lost/ dissipated in warming the porcelain teapot and cup or mug.  Most of the time I'll pre-heat the thermos or cup or mug with boiling water, then add the coffee (or make the tea).   

For some fun, do a search for "Navy coffee".  Three aspects seem to be in common:

1. Use lots of coffee - like 1-1/2 to 2 times as much as "normal". 
2. Pour some/ most of the brewed coffee back over the grounds for a "2nd pass". 
3. A "pinch" of salt.

Here are some of the better webpages I found: 

http://www.seabeecook.com/cookery/recipes/navy_coffee.htm 

http://www.seabeecook.com/cookery/recipes/usn_coffee1.htm 

http://theurbanpossum.blogspot.com/2004/11/navy-coffee.html 

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090522220455AAtupVD 

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-91446.html 

http://blogs.militarytimes.com/broadside/2013/08/20/the-perfect-cup-of-coffee/ 

As it happens, my daughter - who's a coffee connoisseur - will be traveling on Amtrak from SF to LA on 4 different trains (3 interim layovers of 2 days each) at the end of May.  I'm sure I'll get a review of Amtrak's 'java' at the end of it all.

- Paul North. 

[blownout cylinder]

There is a coffee that is called Death Wish coffee...supposed to have 200% more caffeine in one cup....now...imagine that as a triple espresso....

[Euclid]

Pause and serve function is intended to allow people to get coffee before the brew is finished because they can’t wait that long.  But actually, it can also be used to get much higher quality coffee.  I have a recipe and method for making what I call, “Baby Coffee.”   You make a 6 cup pot of coffee on the strong side, using Folgers “Black Silk” in a garden variety drip maker. 

You heat the basket with hot water before putting in the coffee.  Then after filling with water, you heat the carafe with hot water before starting the brew.  After it makes 1½ cups, pour it all into a big cup.  That is the best cup of coffee possible without going to South America.

The pre-heating part is critical because the hot plate does not have much time to add heat when you take out coffee so early in the brew.  I am not sure of the exact science, but coffee is especially good in the early part of the extraction phase.  The ratio is very finicky, and hard to hit the perfect “sweet spot.” 

Also, the remaining 4½ cups in the brew will be just fine, so nothing is lost in the process of making Baby Coffee if you can use the whole 6 cups.  And it is the first cup that matters most anyway.       

[zugmann]

desertdog

There's a reason they've nicknamed Starbucks "char bucks."

FWIW, I've found the best coffees at Whole Foods.

John Timm

I'm partial to Rogers Family Coffee, myself.  Especially their San Fransisco Rainforest Blend.   I'm not a huge coffee drinker, but that stuff is pretty good, IMO.

[Mookie]

NorthWest

schlimm

Undoubtedly another of your questionable and/or illegal activities.

Or maybe not. Amtrak trains aren't noted for always having the best arrival and departure times. An example is the eastbound California Zephyr, stopping at Lincoln, Nebraska, at 3:26 AM.

That sounds about right.  They have always had a schedule pretty close to that for EB and around 1am for WB.  That way you get to see the Rockies or Chicago in the morning.  It is also very quiet here, so we don't disturb your sleep.  Unless you live here.

[erikem]

tree68

I wasn't able to attend his retirement, but I did contribute a gag gift (I hope someone played it up well) consisting of one of his old coffee cups in which was a glob of coffee colored with a spoon handle sticking out - the inference being that his coffee was so strong that it stuck to the spoon.

Sometimes I refer to coffee like that as needing to be cut off with a pair of scissors...

My great uncle Bernie had a couple of sayings about coffee. One was that the coffee wasn't any good unless you could float a horseshoe in it. If you use a spoon to stir the coffee and nothing is left of the spoon afterwards, you've got a good cup.

A former co-worker told about an NMR lab he was working in that ran some analyses of a pot of coffee as it sat on a burner for a few hours. After seeing the results, he'd never drink from a pot that had been sitting on the burner for more than an hour.

My experience with Amtrak coffee is that it isn't much worse than most K-cup coffee.

- Erik

[Semper Vaporo]

tree68

{Snip}

My son's former father-in-law visited them once and his daughter took him for coffee at Starbucks (well, the drive-thru).  Apparently getting a "plain" cup o' joe there is a challenge, but they finally managed.  He took one sip, said "burned," and dumped it out the window...

 

That is why they offer such a variety of "flavours" and adulterants... so you cannot detect that the "COFFEE" is lousy.

 

Personally, I HATE even the SMELL of coffee.  Can't hardly stand to walk down the coffee aisle at the grocery, it stinks so bad.

 

[tree68]

I worked in an office headed by a real "old school" guy - always the first to arrive in the morning, and making the coffee in one of those 20 cup or so "drip" coffee makers.  I don't drink coffee, so I can only go by the reports that he made at a tad strong so he could get a drinkable cup off the pot sooner than when it was actually done brewing.

"Tad" may be too mild of a word, from what I understand.  

I wasn't able to attend his retirement, but I did contribute a gag gift (I hope someone played it up well) consisting of one of his old coffee cups in which was a glob of coffee colored with a spoon handle sticking out - the inference being that his coffee was so strong that it stuck to the spoon.

Sometimes I refer to coffee like that as needing to be cut off with a pair of scissors...

I read sometime back that they still haven't been able to determine all the chemicals in coffee... 

My son's former father-in-law visited them once and his daughter took him for coffee at Starbucks (well, the drive-thru).  Apparently getting a "plain" cup o' joe there is a challenge, but they finally managed.  He took one sip, said "burned," and dumped it out the window...

[caldreamer]

Was that "Warm Glowing Feeling" that you had from the plutonium that was mixed in to Gladeau coffee to give it a a little flavor ??

[Overmod]

Gladieux, wasn't it, out of Toledo, Ohio?  IIRC Marriott bought 'em in the mid-'80s.

[desertdog]

Euclid

Actually, I think the worst coffee is weak coffee.  The bad reputation of strong coffee is mostly due to bad quality coffee made strong enough to tell that it is bad.  Maybe that is why people make weak coffee. 

Coffee these days has all dropped in quality.  Most name brand grocery store coffee is pathetic.  Coffee shop coffee is burned in the roasting to give an illusion of richness that many people fall for.  McDonalds shifted over to that coffee hoax.  I doubt many people have ever tasted really good coffee.  It is almost unrecognizable as what we call coffee.

Coffee from the highest quality Arabica beans has a very complex flavor that can seem almost chocolaty at times.  It can be made very strong, and still be silky smooth.  It can sort of take your breath away as if it contained alcohol.  I have no idea of where to buy this type of coffee.   

There's a reason they've nicknamed Starbucks "char bucks."

FWIW, I've found the best coffees at Whole Foods.

John Timm

[ACY Tom]

Many, many years ago I occasionally travelled between Chicago and the Cleveland/Akron area. I preferred riding the train, but sometimes the schedule dictated that I had to ride "the Dog". One regular stop for the bus was a rest stop near Toledo on the Ohio Turnpike. It was run by an outfit called (I'll probably misspell this) "Gladieau". The very first time I ever tried their coffee, I realized I had finally found the worst coffee on the planet. Or, if it wasn't the worst on the planet, it was certainly the worst in the Western Hemisphere. After that experience, I ALWAYS bought a cup of coffee when I chanced to visit that rest stop, simply because I wanted to see whether they were maintaining the tradition. Gladieau never disappointed me. Of course, I could never stomach more than about 1/4 cup of the stuff. The rest always went into the washroom sink. But it always gave me a warm, glowy feeling (is glowy a word?) to know that some traditions endured. Can anybody tell me if Gladieau is still in business, or if the rest stop still serves that stuff?

[NorthWest]

schlimm

Undoubtedly another of your questionable and/or illegal activities.

Or maybe not. Amtrak trains aren't noted for always having the best arrival and departure times. An example is the eastbound California Zephyr, stopping at Lincoln, Nebraska, at 3:26 AM.

[Euclid]

Actually, I think the worst coffee is weak coffee.  The bad reputation of strong coffee is mostly due to bad quality coffee made strong enough to tell that it is bad.  Maybe that is why people make weak coffee. 

Coffee these days has all dropped in quality.  Most name brand grocery store coffee is pathetic.  Coffee shop coffee is burned in the roasting to give an illusion of richness that many people fall for.  McDonalds shifted over to that coffee hoax.  I doubt many people have ever tasted really good coffee.  It is almost unrecognizable as what we call coffee.

Coffee from the highest quality Arabica beans has a very complex flavor that can seem almost chocolaty at times.  It can be made very strong, and still be silky smooth.  It can sort of take your breath away as if it contained alcohol.  I have no idea of where to buy this type of coffee.   

[caldreamer]

Obviously you guys have never had Army coffee.  so strong it it used to protect Abrahms tanks from incoming shell fire.  Talk about strong and bad tasting coffee, but I lived on it for years.

[schlimm]

Polish Falcon

Well I am either getting on or off the train at those wee hours and sometimes both

Undoubtedly another of your questionable and/or illegal activities.

[Deggesty]

Mr. Parnell must have a stranglehold on the powers that be at the hospital. Or, do the people who drink it regularly have a strange taste for coffee?

[blownout cylinder]

You might want to try Parnell's coffee...straight  outa the coffee machine at the hospital here....bad stuff it was. Tasted like someone mixed in woodchips with a dose of dinosaur poop...gads it was awful!!!

[Mookie]

I bet with that "fortitude" you add, you probably don't know whether you are coming or going.

[Polish Falcon]

Well I am either getting on or off the train at those wee hours and sometimes both

[jrbernier]

  'Railroad' coffee is traditionally strong to keep night shift workers awake!  Now, at 2 AM you are looking for coffee?  Most passengers are trying to sleep....

Jim