Mud still sends tie-up wires via e-mail...Our office staff has associated that with Mud out in a cornfield lashed to a fencepost with barbed-wire (creates quite the visual)
mudchicken Mud still sends tie-up wires via e-mail...Our office staff has associated that with Mud out in a cornfield lashed to a fencepost with barbed-wire (creates quite the visual)
She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw
Bob,
I'm not sure where you are coming from here. I can easily understand why railroads would prohibit drinking on duty and even for a number of hours before you come on duty. In fact, I would be pretty surprised if such prohibitions did not exist.
At times in my life I've traveled around the country on Amtrak. Sometimes I've struck up conversations with off duty people working on the same train and I can recall some of those conversations were over a drink. At the time it did not occur to me that there could be a violation of railroad rules. But if rules were violated that is not a reason for the rules not to exist. There is no doubt in my mind about the rules about alcohol and, I am sure, other substances or that they are strictly enforced.
John
John WR I'm not sure where you are coming from here. I can easily understand why railroads would prohibit drinking on duty and even for a number of hours before you come on duty. In fact, I would be pretty surprised if such prohibitions did not exist.
The bottom line on alcohol is that if you get caught on a random test, that you blow a zero point zero. Ditto for the drug portion.
Presumably, your fellow crewmember(s) aren't going to want to work with you if you "smell like a brewery," unless they're all in on it. There was a time when that might well be the case. Any more, not very likely.
Metabolism times for alcohol are pretty whell known. If someone does have a drink at some point before going on duty, I'd opine that it will be far enough ahead of time that they won't have a problem passing a test.
I'm not above having an adult beverage in the evening after a long, hot day, because I know I'm not on duty until the next morning.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Rule G is Rule G -everybody knows it (Know it, Love it, Heed it!)
(and the business car fleet has really thick shades in the cars)
The first six years of my railroad experience included dealing with a fellow engineering dept. employee that had a problem with alcohol & firearms. In spite of multiple attempts to straighten this person out, liver failure at age 42 was the result after the railroad gave up and fired the person as a last resort. Life lesson.
So where does the term "tie up" come from?
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
zugmann mudchicken Mud still sends tie-up wires via e-mail...Our office staff has associated that with Mud out in a cornfield lashed to a fencepost with barbed-wire (creates quite the visual) So where does the term "tie up" come from?
Most likely from the days of horses...like Western movies, where the cowboy rides into town and 'ties up' his horse to a hitching post.
wjstix Most likely from the days of horses...like Western movies, where the cowboy rides into town and 'ties up' his horse to a hitching post.
That makes sense. Never thought of it that way.
zugmann wjstix Most likely from the days of horses...like Western movies, where the cowboy rides into town and 'ties up' his horse to a hitching post. That makes sense. Never thought of it that way.
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
Is Rule H (against use of tobacco by employees serving patrons at passenger stations or on passenger cars) still in the code of operating rules? I have the impression that this applied especially to chewing tobacco or dipping snuff--though I saw a conductor on a passenger train chewing, back in 1953.
Does anyone know what rule I was?
Johnny
Deggesty Is Rule H (against use of tobacco by employees serving patrons at passenger stations or on passenger cars) still in the code of operating rules? I have the impression that this applied especially to chewing tobacco or dipping snuff--though I saw a conductor on a passenger train chewing, back in 1953. Does anyone know what rule I was?
My 1953 B&O Rule Book (Updated to December 1964) states -
H. The use of tobacco by employees while on duty in or about passenger stations, or on passenger trains, is prohibited.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
tree68I'm not above having an adult beverage in the evening after a long, hot day, because I know I'm not on duty until the next morning.
In any job behavior that is perfectly acceptable off duty is not necessarily acceptable if it interferes with work.
John WR tree68I'm not above having an adult beverage in the evening after a long, hot day, because I know I'm not on duty until the next morning. In any job behavior that is perfectly acceptable off duty is not necessarily acceptable if it interferes with work.
My oldest rule books (CB&Q 1900 and CRI&P 1904) don't have rule I. Either it was already deleted by then or may have never existed. They may have just skipped using I for a rule designation since in some printing fonts a J can be close to an I.
Jeff
zugmann- New, retro avatar? Joan Jett?
Semper VaporoThere is the story of one engine that was parked in a roundhouse and left overnight (no night crew) with the engine still hot. The throttle leaked and pressure built up in the cylinders until the engine rolled forward to the back wall which stopped the engine. Pressure continued to build until the wheels broke traction and spun wildly. The blast of exhaust up the stack blew the roof off the back of the roundhouse.
I remember this story -- and with a little care I can probably find the source.
Google 'Night Walkers' for more information on how this happened -- it obviously is not just a 'leaking throttle'. What would happen was that the engine would cool down at a different rate from the throttle LINKAGE which would push it ever-so-gently open. If you didn't have the valves with proper lap and the valve gear wasn't blocked in mid (to keep steam from getting into either end of a cylinder in the first place)... well, it would move. Usually not as extreme as in the story, which probably involved the valve gear dropping over time.
If you ever wondered why there was a reversing lever in an outside throttle rod, about in the middle -- that is how they fixed the nightwalking issue. The lever reverses the effect of differential expansion in half the rod... so the net movement is zero.
RME
I've read that steam engines with power reverse, at least some classes on the Pennsy, would allow the valve gear to drop to full forward as the air leaked out of the power reverse cylinder. This occured as the air pumps would have the steam cut off when the engine was bedded down for the night. If the throttle leaked, the results were obvious! Fortunately, there was a snifter valve (I think that's the right spelling) on the side of the cylinder that could be opened to allow sneaky steam to escape harmlessly. This was the round thingy near the inlet port to the valve chamber.
Jeff, I wish I could find my copy of the 1943 Southern Operating Rules; I hoped that I would find it while packing books for my move (I did find some other books and such), but it has not come to light; I have a vague memory that Rule I was in it. Now, if I can find certain books that should have been in boxes labeled to indicate what is in them.... It's exciting, determining what will fit into a much smaller living space after living in a house for thirty-eight and a half years.
Murphy Siding zugmann- New, retro avatar? Joan Jett?
Not quite, but there is a resemblance, I'll admit.
There's a logic to what I display, but that is not really important.
Johnny, killing a little time and looking through my rule book collection, I did find a couple with a Rule I.
One is the Kansas City Terminal rules from 1971. There rule I reads, "No employee will engage in other employment without permission from proper office, or be allowed to do any work for himself or for others in working hours, nor in the shops of the Company, except with the permission of the department in which he is employed."
Another is the first and second editions of the General Code of Operating rules, before they went to a new numbering system and junked the traditional rule numbers. Their rule I reads, "Employes must exercise care to prevent injury to themselves or others. They must be alert and attentive at all times when performing their duties and plan their work to avoid injury."
I glanced at a few others, different railroads and eras, and the ones I checked didn't have a rule I. Generally, the rule books read about the same and the numbering is similar. There are differences, as shown by the two examples above, so sometimes it's hard to generalize about what rule is what number or how it reads. Another example is Rule H, usually about tobacco use but in the KCT 1971 rules it is used for reporting for and devoting one's self to duty. The KCT book also is one that uses the entire alphabet, A to Z for the general rules section.
Now for some more vernacular. On another thread I mentioned "chain gang" for pool service. I had mentioned that I was working the chain gang, but as of yesterday I'm back on the extra board. Not by choice. I didn't get "bumped," that is displaced by someone with more seniority. Instead, my turn and two others were "cut." When assignments to a board or pool are abolished, the board is said to be cut. I was "cut off" the board.
"Cut in" and "Cut out" are also used instead of saying turning something on or off. Before entering cab signal territory, we cut in the cab signals. When leaving cab signal territory, we cut them out.
Tallow pot-fireman
Brains-conductor
Bindlestiff- hobo or bum riding the rails, the knapsack he carried was called a bindle
Sidedoor Pullman-boxcar
Rule G- saw it talked about and had to add about a Frisco brakeman who violated it all the time. The crew who worked with him on third trick would dump him in an empty boxcar to sleep it off. I guess they didn't want to work with him, too dangerous. But one night, he was caught asleep by the Yardmaster and that was it, he was fired on the spot.
Lots of good ones on here, some I know, some I forgot and some I never knew.
On the ground-when a freight car or engine ran off the tracks in the Yards.
Dad would come home and say "they put another one on the ground today" and we'd go back to work with him to see it and how they got it back on tracks.
Thanks, Jeff, for your research into Rule I.
As to GCOR's I, the 1950 Rock Island (also the authority on several other roads, including B-RI, T&P, MP, GH&H), has Rule L: " Constant presence of mind to insure safety to themselves and others is the primary duty of all employees and they must exercise care to avoid injury to themselves and others. They must observe the condition of equipment and the tools which they use in performing their duties and when found defective will, if practicable, put them in safe condition, reporting defects to the proper authority. They must inform themselves as to the location of structures or obstructions where clearances are close. When employees are on or near tracks, they must expect the movement of trains, engines or cars at any time, on any track, in either direction."
In the Rock Island book, Rule Q is similar in effect to KCT's I H, though quite different in wording: "Employees must report at the appointed time, devote themselves exclusively to their duties, must not absent themselves, nor exchange duties with or substitute others in their place without proper authority...."
Apparently in 1950 there was already the problem of employees using narcotics, since "The use of intoxicants or narcotics is prohibited. Possession of intoxicants or narcotics while on duty is prohibited."
As to "getting on the ground," I have always understood that this can occur anywhere on the property--out on the road as well as in a yard.
We had "Dummy Masts" but no doll posts
Caboose = Van = Buggy = Crummy (and many of them were!)
I may have missed it but did any one mention:
All referred to essentiall the same thing (too complex to explain here).
And I don't think I saw anyone call conductors "brains" or the caboose a "brain wagon".
ChuckAllen, TX
D&HRetiree We had "Dummy Masts" but no doll posts Caboose = Van = Buggy = Crummy (and many of them were!)
They still "tie down" trains. Crews still "tie up". I've heard it said on the old Wheeling, they didn't tie up, they "docked'. Don't have any idea how a nautical-sounding term came to be used.
Also, instead of being in the siding, I believe it was common on the NKP to consider yourself "in the pass". I've been told that wasn't a common phrase on other roads. Of course, "going in the hole", was also a known phrase and I'm not talking about the Rathole on the CNO&TP. Which reminds me, I don't think railroaders call it the Rathole, at least, not anymore
As noted in another thread: auxiliary tenders.
Water bottles.
A-tanks.
Gins.
Insert more as needed...
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