Check out Norfolk Southern's website. Under "job seekers" there's a video that shows "Brian the conductor" talking about his job and what the job demands and benefits are. It is actually a pretty good video...it doesn't sugar coat it although others here could probably fill in more detail.
One of the blogs I read has a regular segment written by a BNSF conductor who I believe has been working on the railroad only a few years - he's still new-ish. Pretty fascinating first-person narrative reading!
http://www.ogdenbrotherstrains.blogspot.com/search/label/Prototype%20Railroading
I went to one of those NS Conductor Trainee/ Career Open House sessions about 2 weeks ago, and concur with the above comments. In addition, the following points were repeatedly emphasized:
They spent the 1st 2 to 2-1/2 hours with PowerPoint presentations and the "Conductor Brian" video, as well as advice and war stories from the 3 HR guys, 1 PR guy, and 2 TMs who were there. That's a lot of personnel, but they interviewed 22 people that day (I wasn't selected to be in that group) to fill about 20 openings, so maybe it was worthwhile for them. Before the interviews there was also a 'fill out a basic paper application form' session and a timed 75-minute 'assessment' test - like an SAT with reading comprehension, math/ physics, and logic problems, plus a bunch of "agree/ disagree" statements. Recommend that she go to the NS session anyway if it's not too burdensome - maybe even fill out an on-line application first, because they got expedited treatment - it's free, and she can learn something - such as clarifying/ correcting anything above that I mis-remembered.
Perhaps current Conductor zugmann will chime in here, whenever he has a free minute off from work . . . . - or one of our other regulars in the TE&Y positions.
- Paul North.
Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? Years ago when I was living in Kamloops, BC I was train watching from the CP platform. A coal train was stopped there waiting for a crew change, but the headend brakeman was no where to be found. And the train couldn't move without him. Various workers and managers began milling about in a state of agitation, and in those days (1981) there were no cell phones so no one knew if the braker was on his way or if he was not coming in at all. One manager walked past me and jokingly said that if I wanted a brakeman job that I could start right now. They finally called someone else in, but the train was delayed by a couple of hours. I would bet that the brakeman who didn't show had alot of explaining to do if he was able to keep his job at all.
Ulrich Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? ... snip
Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? ... snip
James
I live in Lexington, S.C. and was called to work 3rd trick in Charlotte Yard, about 110 miles from my home. While flying low on Interstate 77 my serpentine belt came off and I had no tools.Luckily, I was only about a mile from an exit, so I was able to get to a pay phone and call the crew caller. He put the next guy on the board on duty while I waited for my brother-in-law to assist me with my car. I DID NOT GET FIRED!!!! Even the railroad understands that s--- happens.
The Butler Ulrich: Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? ... snip When I inteviewed for a job with the C&NW, I was told, "You will be fired if you miss a call for any reason."
Ulrich: Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? ... snip
When I inteviewed for a job with the C&NW, I was told, "You will be fired if you miss a call for any reason."
Must have been a good liar.
Mechanical Department "No no that's fine shove that 20 pound set all around the yard... those shoes aren't hell and a half to change..."
The Missabe Road: Safety First
No held away until 30 hours? Unless there's a side agreement, most times held away begins after 16 hours tied up away from home. The next 8 hours is under pay at the last rate service was performed. Then 16 hours "free" before it begins again. Some places have went to continuous held away. Once you're on, you stay on until back on duty (either train or dead head). Some guys working our North Pool around the holidays last year got 30 plus hours of held away alone.
Two trainmasters who haven't spent an entire holiday at home in six years? Yeah right. Either they are very junior, trying to look indispensable or fibbing a bit. That's one of the good things about working the holidays, hardly anyone's around. And since there's usually less traffic, better trips.
I don't know about other railroads, but when it gets really, really bad weather wise they have been letting people lay off for weather. They started doing this the last few years. Not so much when "driving is not recommended" (anymore they seem to say that after a heavy frost) but for times when the authorities have closed highways and threaten to ticket anyone out. Or worse when the authorities say if you're out and go in the ditch, you're on your own until the weather clears.
Still, it's best to put across the worst case scenarios. Because, depending on locations, some or all of the above can happen at some time or another.
Jeff
PS. Paul, thinking of a career change?
After you have been accepted for employment and begin OJT, you are a probationary employee, normally for 90 days. Probationary employees can be dismissed for any reason or no reason at all, without recourse during their probationary period. You are not a union employee and not covered by any of the contract protections that come with being a union employee. The probationary period is typical in all categories of employment.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
Jeff, I may well have mangled that 30-hour bit - hence my advice to go and hear it in person, and confirm.
One of the TM's said all he had to eat on Thanksgiving was a ham sandwich, too (maybe it's uphill to the tower both ways from the parking lot ?). It's the NS Allentown Yard and eastern PA and northern NJ territory, so there might be some credibility to it anyhow.
They said you'd get some slack for extraordinary circumstances once in a while. But not for saying you couldn't get in during a snowstorm, when the TM had to drive past your place and he got in OK . . .
More like looking for a new employer, while preferably staying in the same location. But since that's where and what the 20 opportunities are - and none of it scared me off, and I like outside work - I figured I had a decent chance, but not so far. Perhaps in another position/ capacity . . .
The accident on the way to work scenario happened to me, so...
Was rear ended at an intersection by a woman on her cell phone, she tagged the rear of my Magnum in her Mercedes SKE at 60mph...the SKE didn't survive, the driver did.
Called the crew caller and was marked off as having called a "relief" which is railroad jargon for marking off after accepting a call or while on duty due to illness, emergency and several other reasons...
Look at it from this point of view, I had accepted the call for work, and while I was not technically on duty, I was on the way there within the 90 minuet call frame, so the carrier has the right to expect me to show.
Because of circumstances beyond my control, I could not report, so I too have the duty to inform the carrier of such, hence I was shown as having called a relief instead of missing a start time.
Most railroads with union contracts work it this way, but if you abuse the system, they will and do fire you for it.
As Paul and other noted, the job requires, for the most part, a willingness to show up no matter what the weather or time, and be ready for duty as soon as your rest time is up, the physical part can be grueling, but it rarely is so tough that a person in reasonable shape couldn't handle most of it...yes, you will have to pick up a 90lb knuckle every once in a while, but that's the exception, not the rule.
Riding the cars, being able to mount and dismount them, and tying hand brakes/lining switches is the normal daily duty...most of the job is mental work, trying to figure out the fastest, easiest and safest way to perform the work, plus the fatigue factor when you work in pool or extra board service.
That will be the hardest part of the whole thing, the lack of quality sleep and relaxation, plus the time away from family.
If she can handle those, she can handle the rest.
23 17 46 11
That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. "..
I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it..
I've been railroading for just a tad under 10 years and for the most part I still enjoy my job. This job isn't back breaking physically demanding work. What it is, is simply following directions that are laid out in these thick rule books we have. I say that because it's not railroading anymore, it's rules compliance.
My schedule is rough on family life. I spend my holidays and weekends in a hotel or on a train, and weather conditions dont matter. Buy a good rain suit. It's 10 degrees hotter than hell on these rocks in the summer, and bone chilling cold in the winter.
Marking off excessively is a no no and could get you fired. We have a 90 minute call, and the carrier expects us to be there on time. They are understanding at times, things happen. Cars break down, tires get flat, maybe you have personal things going on at home.
Rules. Rules are what you will follow to the T or look for employment somewhere else. Not going by the rules will also get you killed, ever hear about blood rules? Rules written in blood? Well that's the gospel truth. Dont take short cuts, it's not worth it. The railroad is the only job I've ever seen where we have to have run off insurance in case some weed weasel decides we didn't make that move just right, now we're out of service for 30 days(if we're lucky). And it's only going to get worse with conductors going to certification Jan. 1st. Personal fines will be issued for rule violations as well as desertification.
Railroaders complain and gripe, but we earn that right. Hell you would too if you had to put up with the BS we do daily. But overall I still enjoy it, I wouldn't be here if I didn't.
Ulrich That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it..
Only if you dont know how to switch LOL. One is not harder than the other, one just requires a little more thinking and a little more walking.
Georgia Railroader Ulrich: That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it.. Only if you dont know how to switch LOL. One is not harder than the other, one just requires a little more thinking and a little more walking.
Ulrich: That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it..
Easier to stay awake when your walking around.
coborn35 Georgia Railroader: Ulrich: That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it.. Only if you dont know how to switch LOL. One is not harder than the other, one just requires a little more thinking and a little more walking. Easier to stay awake when your walking around.
Georgia Railroader: Ulrich: That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it.. Only if you dont know how to switch LOL. One is not harder than the other, one just requires a little more thinking and a little more walking.
Yes it is!
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It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
I have been railroading since 11/30/98. Although the 'new' has long since worn off, considering the culture and workplace environment every yr continues to degrade, its still a good--not great--job which can pay a chunk of change for doing so little labor work. This is the reason we are all here to start with. Anyone out there can get hired by a rr. We have a student condr in a class currently doing their 90 days of pre mark up training and this dude is 63 yrs of age! Another item to keep in mind is about three months ago, a new union agreement went in effect of which now new condrs no longer are covered by the union until I think its 60 days after marking up. This changed from after eight wks in student training. Be careful. Anything goes wrong, one can most likely be toast.
Ulrich [snipped] I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it..
BaltACD After you have been accepted for employment and begin OJT, you are a probationary employee, normally for 90 days. Probationary employees can be dismissed for any reason or no reason at all, without recourse during their probationary period. You are not a union employee and not covered by any of the contract protections that come with being a union employee. The probationary period is typical in all categories of employment.
I am conductor/switchman for a RailAmerica shortline...
The duties of a conductor vary depending on what type of operation you're working in. I, for example, wear several hats over the course of the day. I handle the switching duties, radio communication, customer relations, paperwork, and anything else that goes with getting my job over the road. Most class 1 conductors will not switch a train after they are out of training. They step on a built train, handle the radio work, walk their train if there is a problem and step off and the next crew change point.
I have seen had heard several female conductors on the class 1's we work with. I have only seen 1 female come through our railroad. She had a baby and has not returned since.
I think working for a shortline is better for a person with a family or who doesn't want to travel or sit for extended periods of time. I think the class 1's are for people who want the big money and are not tied down to much at their home terminal.
Once you hold a job or are in a pool your life gets better. While you're on the extra board you can kiss your life goodbye.
Tell her to go for it!
Well it is definitely not as hard as it was when I hired out for NS in 1996. For one conductors have more time off and longer rest periods now as opposed to then. Definitely the hardest part of a railroaders job is the lifestyle. A young conductor can pretty much forget having a social life. Once you qualify you will be on the extraboard with no seniority. You could get called for pretty much anything from road jobs to locals or yard jobs at anytime of the night or day on any day of the week. You could work for six days straight before getting 48 hours rest or you might go for four days without getting out. It is definitely not a 9 to 5 Mon - Fri job so if that is what you are looking for then a railroad life is definitely not for you.
I was a conductor for 3 and a half years and then I went to engineer's school. Depending on what territory you hire out in it may be that short or could be a lot longer. On NS every conductor hired after 1985 has to go to engineer's school when it is their time to go and if you don't pass then you will no longer be employed. While I enjoyed being a conductor I for one couldn't wait to go since I love trains! Plus now I don't have to deal with the weather conditions that a conductor does.
Speaking of that I would say that the hardest part about being a conductor would be hanging on to the ladder on the side of a boxcar on a mile long shove move at 2:30 am on a Sunday morning when it is 35 degrees and raining. Yes I did that! Keep in mind I had to hold on with one hand because I had to hold my radio mike in the other giving the engineer instructions over the radio. If you can do that then you can handle anything as a conductor.
As far as duties are concerned a conductor has to have good arm and good back strength. If you are switching cars, you will have to bend air hoses back to couple them together. One girl I trained couldn't do it. I told her I might have to do this one hundred times a night working in the yard. You also have to line switches which sometimes can be hard if they haven't been lubricated in a while. While not very often you may have to change out a knuckle which weighs about 50 lbs. Definitely not fun and you will get dirty! Make sure you have really good boots. Ballast will eat thru cheap boots in no time because you will do a lot of walking especially when you are performing a brake test. Trains can get up to 2 miles in length. A conductor does have to keep up with all of the paperwork. This includes: hazmat information, train consists (wheel reports), dispatcher bulletins, work orders and track authority sheets. You will also be required to keep a bag or grip as we say with all of your necessary items such as rule books, timetables, hazmat books, radio, gloves, lantern, safety glasses, ear plugs...etc. You can be on duty up to 12 hours and there are no drive thru places to get something to eat when you are in the middle of nowhere so you'll need to pack a big lunch. You will more than likely spend a lot of time waiting in a siding or being held out of the yard so it can get kind of boring at times. You are not allowed to use your phone and definitely cannot text while the train is in operation. The FRA could personally fine you up to $17,000 if they catch you. I turn my phone off and store it away before I board the engine.
With all of that being said I still couldn't think of anything I'd rather be doing. Yes the railroad has been hard on my wife and kids and they have had to endure a lot. I've missed ball games and parties and a lot of their lives while they've been young. But it also has been rewarding. My wife now appreciates it more now that I have seniority and my kids are more understanding now. While railroaders can complain about the job it pays the bills and if it is in your blood like mine then you look forward to that 2:30 am call for NS 212 at 4:30 am.
The best advice I could give anyone when looking for a career is to decide what type of job you would enjoy going to everyday and keep trying for it until you get it. It took me three times before NS hired me and I had shortline experience.
Good Luck!
Tim
NS Locomotive Engineer
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jimhandsome I am conductor/switchman for a RailAmerica shortline... The duties of a conductor vary depending on what type of operation you're working in. I, for example, wear several hats over the course of the day. I handle the switching duties, radio communication, customer relations, paperwork, and anything else that goes with getting my job over the road. Most class 1 conductors will not switch a train after they are out of training. They step on a built train, handle the radio work, walk their train if there is a problem and step off and the next crew change point. I have seen had heard several female conductors on the class 1's we work with. I have only seen 1 female come through our railroad. She had a baby and has not returned since. I think working for a shortline is better for a person with a family or who doesn't want to travel or sit for extended periods of time. I think the class 1's are for people who want the big money and are not tied down to much at their home terminal. Once you hold a job or are in a pool your life gets better. While you're on the extra board you can kiss your life goodbye. Tell her to go for it!
Im not sure why you think that, but it couldnt be farther from the truth!
coborn35 jimhandsome: I am conductor/switchman for a RailAmerica shortline... The duties of a conductor vary depending on what type of operation you're working in. I, for example, wear several hats over the course of the day. I handle the switching duties, radio communication, customer relations, paperwork, and anything else that goes with getting my job over the road. Most class 1 conductors will not switch a train after they are out of training. They step on a built train, handle the radio work, walk their train if there is a problem and step off and the next crew change point. I have seen had heard several female conductors on the class 1's we work with. I have only seen 1 female come through our railroad. She had a baby and has not returned since. I think working for a shortline is better for a person with a family or who doesn't want to travel or sit for extended periods of time. I think the class 1's are for people who want the big money and are not tied down to much at their home terminal. Once you hold a job or are in a pool your life gets better. While you're on the extra board you can kiss your life goodbye. Tell her to go for it! Im not sure why you think that, but it couldnt be farther from the truth!
jimhandsome: I am conductor/switchman for a RailAmerica shortline... The duties of a conductor vary depending on what type of operation you're working in. I, for example, wear several hats over the course of the day. I handle the switching duties, radio communication, customer relations, paperwork, and anything else that goes with getting my job over the road. Most class 1 conductors will not switch a train after they are out of training. They step on a built train, handle the radio work, walk their train if there is a problem and step off and the next crew change point. I have seen had heard several female conductors on the class 1's we work with. I have only seen 1 female come through our railroad. She had a baby and has not returned since. I think working for a shortline is better for a person with a family or who doesn't want to travel or sit for extended periods of time. I think the class 1's are for people who want the big money and are not tied down to much at their home terminal. Once you hold a job or are in a pool your life gets better. While you're on the extra board you can kiss your life goodbye. Tell her to go for it!
It depends on where and the kind of assignment you're working. At some terminals the road conductors don't do a lot of ground work unless something goes wrong. Even the "working" road (thru) trains may only mean doubling up or over at the beginning or end of the run. Possibly kicking out a bad order after the train is built.
Other places the road trains may do more intermediate, even local freight type work. Don't forget the yards where class 1 trains originate, terminate and do intermediate work usually have switch engines (and locals) manned by class 1 train/yardmen, some long out of training.
On my territory, many road trains have line of road pick ups and/or set offs - which are performed by the road conductor as nearly all yard assignments are Remote Control crews that under our rules must be in the clear with a crewed train in their working limits. Most all crews originate a train at one end of their run or terminate the train at the other end of their run; all yard moves are performed by the road crew. The local freights all do their own switching on line of road. We have a number of purpose line of road road switchers that handle stone and trash, originating at train, dropping it at a customer - picking up a train from the customer and taking it back to origin - needless to say these crews do all their own work. There are several premium assignments where the trains have priority and little if any line of road work - needless to say these are populated by the small numbers on the seniority roster.
On my carrier and territory - the Conductor's job is far from a get on and ride job.
Thank you and everyone else for the great input! The NS job fair is two days away and my daughter says she it up to it. It'll be her first real job interview, but down or up, she says she can't score a goal unless she takes a shot (she's a want-to-be hockey player.)
Again, eveyone THANK YOU for sharing tails from the cab (would say Cabin Car?)
I have seen women working MOW. Granted that is not an easy task nor were they assigned 'light duty' such as being a flagman. Some of them can work alongside men and handle the task with ease.
I prefer photographing MOW to standing at a crossing waiting for a train.Those folks deserve recognition. The MOW folks are those who keep the railroad running seem to be among those least appreciated and least recognized. Their work is indeed 'back breaking', and I've photographed some small men and women doing things I thought they couldn't.
Norm
Despite their importance, from a operations perspective the are viewed as 'Maintenance in the Way'.
Norm48327 I have seen women working MOW. Granted that is not an easy task nor were they assigned 'light duty' such as being a flagman. Some of them can work alongside men and handle the task with ease. I prefer photographing MOW to standing at a crossing waiting for a train.Those folks deserve recognition. The MOW folks are those who keep the railroad running seem to be among those least appreciated and least recognized. Their work is indeed 'back breaking', and I've photographed some small men and women doing things I thought they couldn't.
Coborn35 is right. I'm a class 1 railroader and do a ton of switching. I ride mainline freights too, and guess what, we also do work on those. Class 1's are for people who want big money and aren't tied down to much at their home terminal? Nope you're way off. I do make big money though.
Let's get one fact straight about railroad employment - any job - any position
It's about making money!
BaltACD Let's get one fact straight about railroad employment - any job - any position It's about making money!
Correct Sir. Money is the motivator out here.
Georgia Railroader snipped] My schedule is rough on family life. I spend my holidays and weekends in a hotel or on a train . . .
Paul_D_North_Jr Georgia Railroader: snipped] My schedule is rough on family life. I spend my holidays and weekends in a hotel or on a train . . . After some of the past few holidays spent with various relatives of the extended familes, that starts to seem like an attractive aspect of the job . . . - Paul North.
Georgia Railroader: snipped] My schedule is rough on family life. I spend my holidays and weekends in a hotel or on a train . . .
That sentiment has been expressed by a few of my fellow rails before.
I worked for the Union pacific for a year and that was more than enough for me. I went in around 2002. Started as a switchman, then conductor, and finally a hostler. The pay sucked. The 6 weeks of training was minimum wage! I was making around $14.00 a hour under the union contract after training. I had no benefits of any kind for the first year and the union dues were $100.00 a month.
After 3 months there was only 3 people left from the original 16 new hires. Another month and there was just two of us. Everyone else had long quit with the majority of them leaving the first month.
If you are on call then your personal life is over. Not only is it over but you can't go anywhere where it takes 2 hours or more to get back to the rail yard. You have to be there in 2 hours or less if they call you up. You will be working every shift during the week and all hours of the day and night.
Despite the awful hours, walking on hard rock all day long, standing in the rain and snow at 3AM, and all the other problems. The one thing I could not stand the most the constant complaining and moaning and groaning from the Engineers and the others who worked there. They would complain about everything from the chairs, computers, lockers, weather. locomotives, track, signals, radios, and anything and everything for 8 straight hours. Then if they were not complaining about that it was about the Union contract or the pay they were making. Never in my life have I heard such a bunch of whiners.
Few people find railroad life ideal anymore. I was also told by my trainer that over half the people who retire from the railroad die with in the first 6 months. That is pretty amazing.
I love trains and spend a lot of time riding them. But I can honestly say working for the railroad was the most unpleasant job I have ever had and would never go back to that life again. I know of few companies that require someone to be on call 24 hours, working in all weather conditions, and working around equipment where one slip could end your life. If they do require all these things they are paying you big bucks.
Thomas 9011 I worked for the Union pacific for a year and that was more than enough for me. I went in around 2002. Started as a switchman, then conductor, and finally a hostler. The pay sucked. The 6 weeks of training was minimum wage! I was making around $14.00 a hour under the union contract after training. I had no benefits of any kind for the first year and the union dues were $100.00 a month. After 3 months there was only 3 people left from the original 16 new hires. Another month and there was just two of us. Everyone else had long quit with the majority of them leaving the first month. If you are on call then your personal life is over. Not only is it over but you can't go anywhere where it takes 2 hours or more to get back to the rail yard. You have to be there in 2 hours or less if they call you up. You will be working every shift during the week and all hours of the day and night. Despite the awful hours, walking on hard rock all day long, standing in the rain and snow at 3AM, and all the other problems. The one thing I could not stand the most the constant complaining and moaning and groaning from the Engineers and the others who worked there. They would complain about everything from the chairs, computers, lockers, weather. locomotives, track, signals, radios, and anything and everything for 8 straight hours. Then if they were not complaining about that it was about the Union contract or the pay they were making. Never in my life have I heard such a bunch of whiners. Few people find railroad life ideal anymore. I was also told by my trainer that over half the people who retire from the railroad die with in the first 6 months. That is pretty amazing. I love trains and spend a lot of time riding them. But I can honestly say working for the railroad was the most unpleasant job I have ever had and would never go back to that life again. I know of few companies that require someone to be on call 24 hours, working in all weather conditions, and working around equipment where one slip could end your life. If they do require all these things they are paying you big bucks.
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Was probably even tougher before cell phones. I knew an engineer back in 1980...he literally could not leave the house because the railroad might call him in to work. So he did alot of reading while he was waiting...just about every wall in his house had a bookshelf, and he had become a learned authority on a number of subjects as a result.
After some of the past few holidays spent with various relatives of the extended familes, that starts to seem like an attractive aspect of the job . . .
LMAO!! So true
Wow you spent a whole year on the RR and complain about those who have a right to complain Blah. Well at least you realized this lifestyle wasn't for you and moved on. The RR is a little different once you're standing on this side of the tracks isn't it?
Hi all
I did not see a post about current pay. What are those in training paid? What are some typical rates for a new conductor and an engineer with say five - ten years on the job? How does over time work, if you are on the job for the full 12 hours, is four of it overtime? What is the typical annual salary for a class I road conductor or engineer. Are there health and vacation benefits?
rrbrewer Hi all I did not see a post about current pay. What are those in training paid? What are some typical rates for a new conductor and an engineer with say five - ten years on the job? How does over time work, if you are on the job for the full 12 hours, is four of it overtime? What is the typical annual salary for a class I road conductor or engineer. Are there health and vacation benefits?
Depends on your working agreements. One size does not fit all. Speaking from experience our locals which are based on 100 mile days make overtime after 8hrs. Our mainline trains get it after 12 and a half hours due to higher mileage(190 miles). Depending on how long you've been out here we make anywhere from $185 -$350 a day on locals before OT. Mainline $275-$400+ one way. If we deadhead back home or when we catch the next train out multiply that number X two, plus whatever meals and detention time we make. Detention time is $155 -$275 roughly , for 8 hrs. The higher the mileage, the more you make per trip, but OT wont kick in until much later. Lower mileage jobs pay less but you will get OT sooner, usually after 8 hrs.
Training pay again depends on which RR you work for. NS pays $1200 every two weeks while training. You are not entitled to OT or any other claims. You do get paid meals and gas mileage when they apply.
Engineers get a weekend differential when they go out of town on the weekend. Also when called for a job at an outlying point we get a deadhead plus gas mileage. I have made around $500 a day working these types of jobs, OT and mileage add up, plus getting penalty claims for various things but that's another story.
One week of vacation after your first year(you do have to have X number of days worked in order to qualify) Two weeks after two years, and after 25 years you get 5 weeks which is the max. Benefits are far better than most places of employment, again it depends on who you work for.
We have conductors at 80% who are knocking down $70K a year, and engineers who are making six figures.
One can see why the railroads can afford to be selective about who they hire. If you can work, those pay rates are great. Starting out might be tough and at low pay, but that's true of every job.. I think the key to success in any line of work is to stick it out and hang around long enough so that you eventually reap the benefits. Too many people quit and jump around from job to job and career to career and never manage to get past the initial rough 5 years.
Ulrich One can see why the railroads can afford to be selective about who they hire. If you can work, those pay rates are great. Starting out might be tough and at low pay, but that's true of every job.. I think the key to success in any line of work is to stick it out and hang around long enough so that you eventually reap the benefits. Too many people quit and jump around from job to job and career to career and never manage to get past the initial rough 5 years.
This is true, the first few years can be bad, and some people who spent 4 years and thousands of dollars for college are unemployed while I'm working and all I did was graduate high school. I wont say the RR is the best a person can do with only a HS education but it certainly has been good to me. I'm here to stay.
If you can stick it out the pay will be really good. One person from our group did stick it out and he as been with the UP for over 9 years. He said he was making around $68,000 a year.
One thing to remember and something that is extremely important when working for the railroads. They have their own retirement which is recognized by the Federal government. What that means is when you start working for the railroad your Social security money stops going to the government. If you quit under 5 years of working for the railroad all that money you paid to the railroad goes to them and you don't get it back and it is not transfered into your Social security fund. So be careful. You have the chance to loose 5 years of Social security money which you never get back.
Thomas 9011 If you can stick it out the pay will be really good. One person from our group did stick it out and he as been with the UP for over 9 years. He said he was making around $68,000 a year. One thing to remember and something that is extremely important when working for the railroads. They have their own retirement which is recognized by the Federal government. What that means is when you start working for the railroad your Social security money stops going to the government. If you quit under 5 years of working for the railroad all that money you paid to the railroad goes to them and you don't get it back and it is not transfered into your Social security fund. So be careful. You have the chance to loose 5 years of Social security money which you never get back.
Money paid in by employees who do not have 10 years railroad employment does not "go to the railroads", rather it remains in the funds. That is exactly the same way SSI works.
Because the total employee/employer payment to Railroad Retirement is greater than SSI, the retirament benefits from Railroad Retirement are also greater.
"We have met the enemy and he is us." Pogo Possum "We have met the anemone... and he is Russ." Bucky Katt "Prediction is very difficult, especially if it's about the future." Niels Bohr, Nobel laureate in physics
Further and clarification:
Tier 1 Railroad Retirement payments in and benefits are the same as Social Security. Currently employees pay 4.2% and employers pay 6.2% percent of employee annual earnings up $110,100. Unless Congress and the Administration extends the 2% reduction of employee SSI/RRB withholding, the employee rate will return to 6.2% on March 1, 2012.
The Tier 2 payment is 3.9% for employees and 12.1% for employers up to annual employee earnings of $81,900. The Tier 2 funds go to the National Railroad Retirement Investment Trust, an independent non-profit entity established by Federal Law. In many respects, Tier 2 functions the same as many state and municipal retirement plans, with the trust making prudent investment in a variety of debt (bond) and equity (stock) securities.
Dear Georgia Railroader
I'm from Houston, TX and am writing an online article about railroad jobs. I would like to have the input of someone who actually works on the railroad for those who may be considering entering this field. I know that RR life is often pretty strenuous and unpredictable, but I was attracted to your comment that "for the most part I still enjoy my job".
I would like to include some positive comments in my article about working for the railroad and was wondering if you would be interested in contributing a comment/personal remarks. If so, once I have completed the article, I would send it to you for your review before publishing it.
Thank you for giving this your consideration.
Respectfully,
Debbie McCabe
debbiehoustontex@aol.com
debbiehoustontex Dear Georgia Railroader I'm from Houston, TX and am writing an online article about railroad jobs. I would like to have the input of someone who actually works on the railroad for those who may be considering entering this field. I know that RR life is often pretty strenuous and unpredictable, but I was attracted to your comment that "for the most part I still enjoy my job". I would like to include some positive comments in my article about working for the railroad and was wondering if you would be interested in contributing a comment/personal remarks. If so, once I have completed the article, I would send it to you for your review before publishing it. Thank you for giving this your consideration. Respectfully, Debbie McCabe debbiehoustontex@aol.com
Hhhmmm, possibly, maybe. Who are you with?
Railroading for new conductors in my opinion is complicated. If you are unfamiliar with railroad life it can be a big adjustment. While working the railroad can be interesting, rewarding, and challenging, it can really mess up your personal life. It will take a long time to gain seniority thus those jobs that have weekends off will be out of your reach. You will get stuck working the jobs that most people do not what to work. You will be working from the extra board being on call 24/7. It will be very hard to plan for dates, or future events. Despite this there is a potential to make a lot of money!
On CSX you spend 7 weeks at the REDI Center (Railroad Education and Development Institution) in Atlanta, GA. In which they teach you the basics of railroading, along with company values. Then you spend 3 months in the division in which you will work learning all the jobs on every subdivision, along with learning the territory. I will say it is a lot of information to retain in 3 months! Honestly once a new hire "marks up" is when they really learn the most. While you are training the different jobs you get matched with many different people, and not all of them are good teachers, some of them look down upon cubs or new hires. There are people that will let a new hire do anything they feel comfortable with. For the three months you are on probation, so don't get hurt or screw up!! Then after that you will be a certified conductor you mark up most likely on an extra board. Sadly you have to were a yellow hat for 1 year :( which I hated when I went through it because it was like a big target). Then after 6 months if you are working from a yard extra board you will more than likely go through RCO (Remote Control Operator) training. Which lasts about five weeks. You will start out at 75 percent pay, with a five percent increase every year until you get to 100 percent. Your medical insurance starts at six months, and dental and vision starts at 1 year. You will get 1 week vacation, your first year. There is a possibility that you could be furloughed. I was for 1 year in 2007. If you can gut out all the flim flam, in the end it is rewarding.
7 weeks in the classroom and 3 months to learn the actual job.
Wow.
Ive worked for UP as a conductor/engineer for six years now. I can tell you being in train and engine service on a railroad is not a job or even a career, its a life style. If she is used to having set days off, working during the day, being home for the holidays, being around for important milestones like birthdays, anniversary's, etc. forget it. Some days Ill get home and be dead tired, but the lawn needs mowed, groceries to buy or whatever the case might be, and by the time all of those things have been accomplished, the phone is ringing and its the railroad calling you to make another 250 mile run all night and then be at the away from home terminal for only god knows how long. The work really isn't tough, your being paid mostly for all the inconveniences you experience. If your working in a yard or on a road local you'll get a little dirty from climbing up and down equipment all day long and of course your hot in the summer, cold in the winter. Railroads have a knack for calling out difficult jobs and moves in the middle of the night and at the worst time. You can expect to be spotting a unit train at a grain elevator in the middle of the night while its pouring rain, etc. Again, your being paid for inconvenience. Some things have changed since the days of cabooses and brakemen but not much, the Conductor is still responsible for the safe movement of the train and its freight, and the basic hand signals are still the same along with your basic radio communications, car counts, etc. The Conductor handles mostly all the paperwork anymore, clerks are going the way of the dodo bird. If something goes wrong the conductor will be the one trekking through 3 ft. of snow to find the problem (air hose, hot wheel or axle, dragging equipment). Expect furloughs, even if the human resources person who interviews you says that they are really busy and needs lots of people I can assure you there's a good chance their lying or greatly exaggerating. Railroads have been burned in the past for not having enough people when business picks up so they hire loads of people at one time and then lay them off expecting them to come back when they need them. UP and NS are known for this. I think the hardest part of the job is sleep management, if you have the option to work in a yard you may have an easier time knowing when to sleep but being on the road, especially an extra board where you can be called at anytime makes it difficult. Again, its not a job, but more or less a lifestyle. Ive seen several people that have had regular jobs along with a wife and family, and they're world gets turned so upside down that they end up divorced and quitting I was not married when I started on the railroad so all my wife knows is the railroad life which really helps. Of course you can always do other things on the railroad, a large majority of railroad jobs have set shifts, days off, and promote more of a normal life unlike being a conductor or engineer. I wish your daughter the best of luck.
wyldmanr8cer [snipped] . . . The work really isn't tough, your being paid mostly for all the inconveniences you experience. . . . Again, your being paid for inconvenience. . . .
Thomas 9011 Few people find railroad life ideal anymore. I was also told by my trainer that over half the people who retire from the railroad die with in the first 6 months. That is pretty amazing.
I won't disagree with your comments about whiners but I take complete issue with the above comment. Being a retired railroader myself, I know that isn't remotely true. Of course, there are those it has happened to, I've known a few but I've also known a few who kept working despite being sick, only retiring when they were too sick to continue. I think this comment is "pants on fire" false.
I agree with Valley X. Trainers will tell you anything.
Another thing I didn't agree with was whoever said that when weather conditions have the highways shut down and state police and the like are ordering everyone off the highways, railroaders are exempt. I will say that it never happened to me personally but I do know of two cases where the employee was told that they were to go straight home, they (law enforcement) didn't care who they worked for, they were going to drive any farther on the highway.
Both individuals went home and called the railroad and that was that, nothing was ever said.
Ulrich:How does this thread compare to the challenges of hiring and retaining good people in your industry? I would think there are a number of similarities.
One of my trucking customer's biggest challenges seems to be driver turnover.
Ed
MP173 The differance in OTR and RR is one thing PAY and in RR you will get to see your family for more than 34 hours in a week normally. That and your time off is NOT spent in a 6 foot box attached to your Work area where your still attached to the load you are carrying and your Bosses at anytime can and WILL beep you via a Qualcom device saying GET MOVING the SECOND that your 10 hour break is over. That is the NORMAL day of a OTR Driver.
Plus an OTR driver has to deal with if the truck is messed up the company REFUSES to repair it he gets placed OOS the FINE IS AGAINST HIM NOT THE COMPANY. He is the one that gets hammered on his CVSA scale his MVR his Service record yet he was the one that Tried to get it FIXED and the COMPANY SAID NO.
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Out of all the replies here I only saw one that mentioned the choice every railroader must make. You either choose money or lifestyle. If money is most important to you, then choose to work the road. If lifestyle is most important, then choose to work the yard. I choose to work the yard. I have a fixed schedule and 2 days off a week. It took 14 years but I finally work Monday to Friday, but I earn less pay than a road engineer.
I tell all new hires. You pay your dues in the first five years. No life. No choice. After five years you will begin to get some choice and with that a better quality of life.
With any type of work, if you put in an honest day's work, you will be treated with respect and the trainmasters won't bother you. As with managers in any company, they know who is dependable and who is not, and the trainmasters have a large rule book they can use to make your life miserable.
It's a lifestyle and most people wash out. My class had eight green vests and now we are two. Our current class of green vests started at twenty and now they are at nine. This is not a career for everybody.
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zugmann My first couple of years were more fun in this industry and I could see career possibilities. Now it's just a plain old boring, unfulfilling job.
My first couple of years were more fun in this industry and I could see career possibilities. Now it's just a plain old boring, unfulfilling job.
Zug, is it the job? Or the company you work for? Not that the grass may be any greener on the other side of the fence. Plenty of crab grass everywhere you go.
I love railroading, but don't always love the railroad.
Hang in there brother.
"Is it the people, or the organization* ?" (as my high school history teacher used to ask us - *though he used the word "institution" instead, but that might have another implication here . . .
Bid a Yardmaster or Train Dispatcher's job when they are advertised....whole different perspective than T&E - of course if the NS makes those positions available to T&E. CSX does.
zugmann Unfortunately not every terminal treats the honest guys with respect. Some seem to bully them more because they can get away with it. My first couple of years were more fun in this industry and I could see career possibilities. Now it's just a plain old boring, unfulfilling job.
Unfortunately not every terminal treats the honest guys with respect. Some seem to bully them more because they can get away with it.
Every terminal will be different as far as training and work schedules. I spent 6 weeks in Atlanta at REDI, then almost 6 months training before marking up. My terminal has a lot of locals, and 3 yard jobs. With mainframe access at home, and by getting to know your territory, you can get a good feel for when you will get called to work. Sometimes you get surprised, but generally, I know if I am going to turn on my rest, or if it going to be a while. I can see who is ahead of me, who has taken a day off etc, etc. Its not as bad as it sounds. The extra boards here are guaranteed, a new hire will make over $900.00 a week minimum, assuming no days off board. I have been here a year, and love it. Sure, rainy nights suck, 0200 calls suck, sitting home next out on a Saturday night sucks(thank god for Netflix), but overall I have no regrets.
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jeffhergert I love railroading, but don't always love the railroad. Jeff
I think you nailed it.
I worked for Seaboard Coast Line out of Miami for 2 years and Waycross for 6 months back in the mid '70s and I really loved it! the best job in the world (until I found an even better job!). from what I have heard and read in the past few years, and in this thread, it seems that what is gone now is the camaraderie of your crew (4 to 5 men on a local or road switch crew) working together. a stuck switch, or a knuckle changeout? you always had someone to give you a hand. a drawback to railroading back then is NO cell phones. I only worked the extra board (I loved the diversity of working something different every time) and when you are near the top of the list, you HAD to stay home to wait for the phone to ring. working out of Miami, of course we had no worries about working in freezing conditions. I can't imagine how railroading would be in Winter conditions! also, the idea of 'training' for the job is laughable. there was no training at all. you learned only what your fellow crewmen told you while you were on your 'student' trips. after a week or so, you marked up and you were expected to know everything!
cudjoebob I worked for Seaboard Coast Line out of Miami for 2 years and Waycross for 6 months back in the mid '70s and I really loved it! the best job in the world (until I found an even better job!). from what I have heard and read in the past few years, and in this thread, it seems that what is gone now is the camaraderie of your crew (4 to 5 men on a local or road switch crew) working together. a stuck switch, or a knuckle changeout? you always had someone to give you a hand. a drawback to railroading back then is NO cell phones. I only worked the extra board (I loved the diversity of working something different every time) and when you are near the top of the list, you HAD to stay home to wait for the phone to ring. working out of Miami, of course we had no worries about working in freezing conditions. I can't imagine how railroading would be in Winter conditions! also, the idea of 'training' for the job is laughable. there was no training at all. you learned only what your fellow crewmen told you while you were on your 'student' trips. after a week or so, you marked up and you were expected to know everything!
Ah, the good old days. I got started in transportation in the mid 1980s, and it was very much the same as you describe it. No formal training...you just picked it up as you went. I remember my first time at the wheel of a tractor trailer... no licence beyond a class 5, and my training consisted of someone shouting "be careful when cornering". But we survived. Nowadays a course and a license is required for everything..even for a forklift. That's probably a good thing though.
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The difference between then & now is what you mentioned about 'crew'. With 4 or 5 men on a crew back then, the newbie didn't NEED to know much of anything beyond being able to follow simple direct instruction from the crew's Conductor. Today, when the newbie makes his first day on his own - HE IS THE CONDUCTOR in most all cases. While with a 2 man crew the Conductor doesn't supervise anyone, he also doesn't get the help of a old head in pointing out obvious mistakes he is setting himself up for.
Back then, entry level jobs in the industry were just that entry level jobs where one had the opportunity to learn the job before being placed in a responsible position. Now at all levels, all 'entry level' jobs are to positions that have real responsibility. The Conductor, especially in Local Freight and/or Road Switcher and Yard service has the responsibility for mapping out the moves required to get the job done and in many cases in Yard service the Conductor is also a RCO (remote control operator) operating the locomotive from the ground to do the job.
It is a culture shock to, in short order, go from an non-railroad individual off the street to having to be a productive Conductor. This form of 'forced feeding' is being used in virtually all Contract (Union covered employees) positions, from trackman, carman, signalman, Train Dispatcher and all the other crafts required to operate a railroad. The on call nature of being hired to the Extra Board just adds to the culture shock for most people.
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zugmann Even conductors now have to be "certified". Certifications are like those reward cards from the stores: multiple and mostly useless.
Even conductors now have to be "certified".
Certifications are like those reward cards from the stores: multiple and mostly useless.
I need a bigger wallet to carry all of my certifications...but then again...when was the last time someone asked me if I was certified to handle a propane tank. Can't remember the last time anyone asked me for my first aid certification either... All those cards should at least be good for a free coffee somewhere..
We have a small group who went into TE&Y service in the early 1990s. There was an engineer shortage at the time. They finished their conductor's training on a Friday and started firing (engineer's training) the following Monday.
Most of them, but I don't think all, were transfers from other departments (clerical, MOW, etc) within the railroad. Now I think you have to have at least a year in train service before entering engine service.
That is what it is supposed to be; however, when the numbers don't add up vs. retirements and those getting 1 year of Conductor service - shorter times happen.
jeffhergert Now I think you have to have at least a year in train service before entering engine service. Jeff
Now I think you have to have at least a year in train service before entering engine service.
Quite often team work today means people are out there working by themselves, and that seems to be the way it is on the railroad as well. That's usually ok, but can present serious problems when things go wrong and there's no help immediately available. We've had a couple of cases over the years where someone has died on the job and we didn't find out about it until a day or more later.
They warned us that would happen . . . It happens not just to those employed in Train, Engine & Yard service by an actual railroad, but in the associated service businesses, too - in my case, it was a trackwork contractor - too many days from 4 or 5 AM to 7 to 9 PM plus Sat. in the office, and sometimes SUndays. too.
I can relate to that...not so much these days but earlier on in my career. I still prefer working really early in the mornings...not sure why that it is.. just do.
Greetings fellas! I am new to the RR industry & trying to get a conductor job at UP or NS.
This is a really old thread but there's a lot of good stuff so BUMP! I have some Qs regarding these hold overs. And here I thought FURLOUGHS were the big thing to fret about.
When you're held over, they can hold you for 16 hours out of your home terminal after you're shift, before you start getting paid. Until they can find a way for you to deadhome back "home"? So if they hold you 28 hours, you dead head back several hours+. It's now been 2 full days since you worked your 12, and sat for 28. Then deadheaded back. Then what- you work another 12? How often is this happening for extra board guys?
Is it still accurate that UP is famous for shoring up on guys for when it's busy and furloughing them for a year & thinking they'll come back to work at that time?
I had read that a guy made it to engineer in 1.5 years. I was wondering if that's still attainable in the current industry status?
I researched that RR workers are only permitted to work 167 hours per month. That's less than 2 single hours of overtime/month. In all my previous fields, everybody who's anybody knows the way to making real money is in overtime. I was very disappointed in thinking I could make oil field money in the RR industry. It's not even on the same planet or even the same solar system of that type of money. It cut me deep because I know RR not only bust their asses but work in the same type of weather as the oilfields.
Thanks to any RR guys that can answer some of my Qs.
Also guys one more Q... You guys mentioned there are different areas- shortline, working the yard, local(?), and the road gigs where you're in and out of hotels.
It's my understanding that as extra board I will have no say in what I do or what I want to do. If I desired to work the road, never in my home...I would need seniority to do this? It seems like this would be undesirable for many guys with families. A rediculous question- many promient companies pay per diem. What is the per diem rate for each day outside my home terminal?
Perhaps I've had some outrageous expectations for this field in terms of compensation. I was hoping for 75-85 hours a week. $1,000 bucks doesn't cut the mustard. That might be real f'n money to a 21 year old with a very small nut but i have big nuts and I have to provide for them. I would find it desireable to just work every day. I don't have a problem with working, I want to make money. I don't want to be furloughed.
I have worked with guys that didn't even have a "home". They had chicks at our home city but they paid no rent anywhere. We stayed at so many hotels that we were all "super diamond elite" so for the 4-8 days a year we were "home" they just got hotels for free on their rewards. However, I realise this lifestyle wouldn't be possible for the RR as they do not let you work every single day of the week or for a full calendar month. And with room sharing no one is going to be getting a years worth of room points, that's a huge lost perk. It's a bummer they can't cover a room for each of the 4 or 5 man crew. I would never have been able to work with a guy 358 days a year for 10-12 hours/day & then shared a room at night, my God!
Once again, any feedback appreciated
My 20 yr old stepson caught wind of hiring classes going on near home. Although not too serious of it, more curious, I basically talked him out of even thinking of applying. Like I told him of his grandfathe,r who retired from SF 30 over 30 yrs ago after doing the gig for 43 yrs, he did not want his two sons following dad into the industry back in the 70s. History repeats itself. Many retored or and current railroaders are telling their family members the same.
Held away kicks in after 16 hours. You're under pay for 8 hours, then go back off for another 16, then back on pay for 8 hours. Until you go back on duty, either working or deadheading home. Usually you won't get into a second held away. Some places have continuous held away. Once you start, you stay on it until you go back on duty. When in the motel, the railroad pays for the room. Where I work we get $6.00 for the first 12 hours for meals. After 12 hours a second $6.00.
Seniority will determine where and what assignments you will be able to hold. Most seniority districts cover more than one home terminal. Expect at first to hold an extra board. There can be different kinds of extra boards, some only cover yard jobs, others road jobs. Some cover both, depending on the terminal. Almost all trainmen's assignments on class one's have a guarantee now. The rate will vary depending on assignment and railroad. (I've heard UP's rate is better than NS's rate for guarantee.) They don't like paying guarantee so they try to keep boards where you make more working. The monthly hourly limit is 276 hours, not 167. It's unlikely anyone will hit that number.
On the class one's, expect to be furloughed. Regionals and short lines are probably more stable, but they too could furlough if they lose a major customer. Some of the smaller ones are better than others pay/working conditions wise. Still, I'd look at them first for the better stability.
I hear that it can be pretty rough for an Amtrak conductor while qualifying.
SFbrkmnThere is no time limit on becoming an engineer at least w/BNSF. Newton, KS just had its closing for an engr class starting in August. The lower half bidders came from a condr class that just marked up in June. In April, these guys were learning ground service. In about 60 days, engrs will be teaching these same greenhorns on running an eng.
We've had the understanding that the FRA would no longer permit anyone with less than a year's time on the ground become engineers. Something that came out of a wreck some years ago, the kind that made big headlines nation wide. As I recall, the engineer only had a few months of ground experience before becoming an engineer and hadn't been set up very long and the conductor had only been on the job a few months.
Since we haven't had an engineer's class for 6 or 7 years, I don't know how they would handle engine service training. From talking to the new hires, conductor's training isn't the same as when I hired out. (Hint-It isn't better now compared to then. At least the on-the-job part.)
My understanding at CSX before I retired one had to have at least one year working as a Conductor and have a clean record to get 'promoted' to Engineer's School. (Those without a clean records were handled in their own path.) I also understood that if one failed during Engineer's School one was terminated. There was to be no one that held a Conductor Only status after one's turn at being an Engineer came to pass. You either made it through Engineer Training and ultimately got your FRA Engineers Card or you were history.
Pre existing Conductors were 'Grandfathered' if their seniority was before some date - I am thinking 1987 but that may be mistaken.
BaltACD My understanding at CSX before I retired one had to have at least one year working as a Conductor and have a clean record to get 'promoted' to Engineer's School. (Those without a clean records were handled in their own path.) I also understood that if one failed during Engineer's School one was terminated. There was to be no one that held a Conductor Only status after one's turn at being an Engineer came to pass. You either made it through Engineer Training and ultimately got your FRA Engineers Card or you were history. Pre existing Conductors were 'Grandfathered' if their seniority was before some date - I am thinking 1987 but that may be mistaken.
It was the 1985 agreement that said everyone hired after that date could be forced to go into engine service. It's usually filled by seniority bid, you must not be under any discipline/probation, but if there are no bidders they can start forcing people. Like any other vacancy with no bidders, they start at the bottom of the active roster and work up.
(I believe it was the 1972 agreement that first gave those in train service priority in consideration to go into engine service. I think until the 1985 agreement, they could still hire "off the street" for engine service, without first having a trainmen's seniority date. I knew some former RI engineers that left in 1978-79 before the RI shutdown and hired out on the CNW. They only had a CNW engineer's seniority date, no trainman's date.)
Once started on the road to becoming an engineer, you must pass. If you fail, you are out. You can't go back to being a trainmen only. Those pre-1985 conductors can't be forced to engine service. Since I've hired out, I don't recall them needing to force anyone into engine service, or anyone failing it and being terminated.
The numbers of pre-1985 conductors are dwindling where I work. Once they are all gone, they may decide to send everyone through engineer's training. Once everyone is qualified for both crafts, whether you work today as an engineer and tomorrow as a conductor will come down to seniority and preference. A lot of my coworkers think this will eventually happen. I think it's a ways off, but some short lines do that already.
With the ebb and flow of business it is not that uncommon to have qualified Engineers that have been cut off the Engineers Board and are back working as Conductors.
BaltACD With the ebb and flow of business it is not that uncommon to have qualified Engineers that have been cut off the Engineers Board and are back working as Conductors.
During the worst of the downturn 8 or 9 years ago, the furlough list contained a few conductors who had qualified as engineers. We still have a few conductors who have qualifed as engineers, but have never touched a throttle as an engineer.
For us, it used to be that if an engineer at his/her home terminal (our district has about 5 terminals that qualify as such) couldn't hold any of the engineer boards, they could set themselves back to conductor. That would allow engineers with less "whiskers" keep working in their home terminal and everyone was happy. Almost everyone. A young conductor who was bumped off a premium assignment as a result of an engineer setting back, complained. It was found that this practice, which had been going on a long time, was contrary to some older contract provision. So now, an engineer has to exhaust the ability to work as an engineer, chasing his/her seniority over the entire district before being able to set back. Of course, this usually means the youngest are forced to take jobs up to a couple hundred miles away from home. And because it's viewed as a seniority move, there is no company lodging offered. (At least some hotels, will give the corporate rate even though the company isn't paying for the room. We've had a couple guys quit (a few more thinking about it) the railroad and industry entirely, over this seniority chasing. It's a reason others say they wish they hadn't gone into engine service. They've been trying to negotiate home zones with the seniority district, but so far nothings happened.
As for the trainmen, they don't have to chase their seniority. If they can't hold their home or close to home, they can choose to accept being furloughed or going to a reserve/training board (when such board is active) that works two days a week.
And I might add - no two local labor contracts have all the same provisions in what is required to continue to maintain and/or exercise seniority. What Jeff has just mentioned is the way things work where he is - the way they work at another location or on another railrod can be entirely different. All these different contract provisions were negotiated by the local work force in the craft to protect THEIR interests at the time the agreement was negotiated with NO KNOWLEDGE of how things would work out 5 years, 10 years 20 years down the road.
It is a hard life once you become an enginner or conductor you will never see your home or family again. You will live a boomers life 24/7 in the cab of a locomotive, no food, no rest, no vacation, no sick leave, and no benafits. Once you sign on you are there until it kills you or you retire. Once you step on that engine you go 12 hours until you reach the end of your shift, but guess what you only get a few hours sleep then you are back in the cab and back on the road. It does not end when you get to an interchange town like Chicago because management will just transfer you to another railroad and you keep on going non stop. You go from the west coast to the east coast Canada to Mexico and every railroad in North America. Once you board a train say goodbye to everything you know and welcome to the life of a boomer on the road. The only guys who get a break are the local crews and the shortlines everyone else is a boomer they live on the road.
geomodelrailroaderIt is a hard life once you become an enginner or conductor you will never see you home or family again. You will be condemed to a boomers life 24/7 in the cab of a locomotive, no food, no rest, no vacation, no sick leave, and no benafits.
Yeah... that's not how any of this works.
Want a bet? I heard stories a railroaders life is the boomers life they never see home they are always on the move and always switching railroads all to get the freight delivered.
Ummm. Yeah, I'll take that bet.
A railroader for the most part is a boomer always going from job to job terminal to terminal railroad to railroad. The only home they see is a second rate hotel they only get 4 hours of sleep then it is back in the cab to the next terminal. I heard guys who went from San Francisco to New York non stop all by train. That is the railroaders life.
If you say so.
geomodelrailroaderA railroader for the most part is a boomer always going from job to job terminal to terminal railroad to railroad. The only home they see is a second rate hotel they only get 4 hours of sleep then it is back in the cab to the next terminal. I heard guys who went from San Francisco to New York non stop all by train. That is the railroaders life.
Maybe on the model railroads. There are Hours of Service and route qualification requirements to be observed on real railroads.
geomodelrailroader A railroader for the most part is a boomer always going from job to job terminal to terminal railroad to railroad. The only home they see is a second rate hotel they only get 4 hours of sleep then it is back in the cab to the next terminal. I heard guys who went from San Francisco to New York non stop all by train. That is the railroaders life.
Also, each road involved in such a move has divisions--and road service employees do not work on more than one division.
Johnny
Here's a link to one of those second rate motels. (Wait until I tell them at the front desk.) https://www.wyndhamhotels.com/baymont/fremont-nebraska/baymont-inn-and-suites-fremont/overview
Almost nothing you have said is even close to the truth. Other than to expect to work a lot because new people usually can only hold an extra board. Even then, you get 10 hours* undisturbed rest between runs. And that's a minimum, you might have more time off depending on traffic requirements and how many vacancies occur on the assignments the extra board protects.
* There is a provision for a engr or condr to be given only 4 hours rest. But that would be considered within one trip/tour of duty. Afterward you don't have another 12 hrs available to work, only what remains when you were tied up for 4 hrs rest. You also have to be told you are being given the 4 hour break. You can't tie up and 4 hours later they are calling to use up any remaining time. It happens, but is rare. I've only done it once in 20 years.
I’d say someone has been reading too many “railroad man” stories from fifty years ago.
My youngest son has been a Class 1 conductor for about 13 months now and, while his diet may not be the best when he’s working road service; that’s more his personal choice than a necessity.
He has never complained (much) about the quality of his away from home lodging although, being qualified on three different districts he has noted lodging is better in two of his away from home terminals than the third. In any case; he has found the rooms to be clean and comfortable.
And in terms of his hours; as others have noted the current hours of service provide for ten uninterrupted hours of rest and after working six consecutive days HOS provides for two days off.
It is true you can be called for a train at just about any hour of the day or night but; he knew that going in and seems to enjoy the variable hours.
jeffhergertHere's a link to one of those second rate motels.
Yeah, looks like a real dump.
I’ve noticed that the non-local UP track crews have mostly moved to the Tehachapi Fairfield Inn the past few years, as opposed to the older Best Western two lots east. That's definitely an improvement. I’ve also learned that when a bunch of UP vehicles are parked there at night, the train watching will be sparse the next day, like none at all until an hour or so before sunset when the parade (usually of westbounds) starts.
jeffhergertHere's a link to one of those second rate motels. (Wait until I tell them at the front desk.) https://www.wyndhamhotels.com/baymont/fremont-nebraska/baymont-inn-and-suites-fremont/overview Almost nothing you have said is even close to the truth. Other than to expect to work a lot because new people usually can only hold an extra board. Even then, you get 10 hours* undisturbed rest between runs. And that's a minimum, you might have more time off depending on traffic requirements and how many vacancies occur on the assignments the extra board protects. Jeff * There is a provision for a engr or condr to be given only 4 hours rest. But that would be considered within one trip/tour of duty. Afterward you don't have another 12 hrs available to work, only what remains when you were tied up for 4 hrs rest. You also have to be told you are being given the 4 hour break. You can't tie up and 4 hours later they are calling to use up any remaining time. It happens, but is rare. I've only done it once in 20 years.
The old Railroad YMCA lodging facilities were all closed down in the mid to late 80's on CSX and lodging facilities were established at local motel/hotels - my understanding is that those that are selected are required to have 24 hour housekeeping staff (and while they may have such at the time they are selected - some will stop it if it suits their needs). They are also 'supposed' to be within walking distance of a source of hot food.
A second issue that happens (or at least happened in the mid-Atlantic towns where the crew bases I worked with) when there is a 'event' in the area that will permit the facility to charge non-railroad guests the max rate that shows on the back of the door - railroad rooms seem to disappear (railroad rooms are rented at a contracted rate).
Railroaders being railroaders would complain if the where put up in the penthouse suite of a 15 strory Hilton. Complaining seems to be a required part of the job, just like it is a requirement of being a part of the armed services.
On a couple of the districts I supervised we did use the 4 hour respite provisions of the HOS law - outbound run would take 4 to 6 hours, intended train back home would be arriving in 2 to 4 hours from the tie up - tell the crew to SHOW UP back on duty X time (4 hours after their tie up time). We could do it reliabely on trains that did not work between the O-D points. If a train was going to work, they crew needed to be fully rested from either origin point.
DeggestyIs somebody pulling your leg?
A member since 2011 with only a few dozen posts, and he's going to tell those with many years of service how their job is done? Yeah.
I'd also like to get in on that aformentioned bet.
zardoz Deggesty Is somebody pulling your leg? Do trolls even have legs? A member since 2011 with only a few dozen posts, and he's going to tell those with many years of service how their job is done? Yeah. I'd also like to get in on that aformentioned bet.
Deggesty Is somebody pulling your leg?
Do trolls even have legs?
From his statements, it seemed to me that he had little knowledge of 12 inch to the foot railroading, and was depending on guff that someone had fed him. As all of you regulars know, I have never worked for a railroad, but over the years have picked up a little understanding from the many who have been in the industry for years.
I am used to seeing the work of trolls on political sites, but cannot imagine why such a creature would even visit Kalmbach, much less post nonsense.
I tried to be nice to him in explaining some of the facts of life--but it may have been a waste of time and keystrokes.
Thanks for your response.
Deggesty I am used to seeing the work of trolls on political sites, but cannot imagine why such a creature would even visit Kalmbach, much less post nonsense.
There have been a couple on here, most notably that guy from Ohio who went through about a dozen accounts in 4 or 5 years, and that Hunter Harrison fanboi who was spouting nonsense over on Frailey's blogs for a while (I think his screenname was 'railroadsaregreat').
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
BaltACD Railroaders being railroaders would complain if the where put up in the penthouse suite of a 15 strory Hilton. Complaining seems to be a required part of the job, just like it is a requirement of being a part of the armed services.
Well yeah, think of the taxi ride to and from the yard in city traffic, what a nightmare. And the company is so cheap that you have to pay for your own room service, what a rip-off!
SD70DudeAnd the company is so cheap that you have to pay for your own room service, what a rip-off!
And to top that off, you can’t take advantage of the honor bar fridge because you may have to give a urine sample after somebody tries to beat you to the grade crossing in their soon-to-be-totaled vehicle.
BaltACD A second issue that happens (or at least happened in the mid-Atlantic towns where the crew bases I worked with) when there is a 'event' in the area that will permit the facility to charge non-railroad guests the max rate that shows on the back of the door - railroad rooms seem to disappear (railroad rooms are rented at a contracted rate).
We've run into that problem before. Our old lodging facility was a locally owned motel. When the College World Series was going on in Omaha they would run out of rooms. With every other hotel/motel filled up, sometimes crew members would end up going a long way from Fremont. I only had to go as far as Missouri Valley, about 30 miles. Some had to go to Lincoln or Columbus. I remember some being sent to Sioux City. Sioux City to Fremont is one crew district.
The Baymont Inn in Fremont was originally an Oak Tree Inn. That chain had ties to the UP (It was said one of the people on the board of directors started it.) Almost their entire locations were UP crew change locations. There were a few on other lines, BNSF and a couple in CSX territory. Rooms are better sound proofed and the curtains are heavy and have magnets to help keep them closed. The Penny's Diner restaurants were built in many locations that didn't otherwise have 24 hour food service within an easy distance.
Within the last year Oak Tree was sold to Wyndham. The Oak Trees have either become Baymont Inns or Travel Lodges.
Railroaders complain about their lot in life, and I am sure truck drivers do like wise. How about seafarers? Came across the following YouTube Channel published by a Chief Engineer on the high seas and explaining the life of a mariner.
How is life for shortline workers? Is the lifestyle more relaxed than that of a mainline conductor?
I have an interview for a local 50 mile shortline railway so I'm curious if there is more family time working a shortline. Thanks
CamdenBobHow is life for shortline workers? Is the lifestyle more relaxed than that of a mainline conductor? I have an interview for a local 50 mile shortline railway so I'm curious if there is more family time working a shortline. Thanks
Since it is a 50 mile short line - you won't be faced with an away from home terminal. For the most part you will be involved in switching industries and interchange cuts. Observation is that short line personel get some training and practice from most all the aspects of railroading down to and including swing a spke hammer in anger from time to time. You will be covered by the application of the Hours Of Service law, which will limit your on duty work hours to 12 - deadheading after 12 hours constitutes 'Limbo Time' that does not constiture rest time.
geomodelrailroader It is a hard life once you become an enginner or conductor you will never see your home or family again. You will live a boomers life 24/7 in the cab of a locomotive, no food, no rest, no vacation, no sick leave, and no benafits. Once you sign on you are there until it kills you or you retire. Once you step on that engine you go 12 hours until you reach the end of your shift, but guess what you only get a few hours sleep then you are back in the cab and back on the road. It does not end when you get to an interchange town like Chicago because management will just transfer you to another railroad and you keep on going non stop. You go from the west coast to the east coast Canada to Mexico and every railroad in North America. Once you board a train say goodbye to everything you know and welcome to the life of a boomer on the road. The only guys who get a break are the local crews and the shortlines everyone else is a boomer they live on the road.
Lithonia Operator geomodelrailroader It is a hard life once you become an enginner or conductor you will never see your home or family again. You will live a boomers life 24/7 in the cab of a locomotive, no food, no rest, no vacation, no sick leave, and no benafits. Once you sign on you are there until it kills you or you retire. Once you step on that engine you go 12 hours until you reach the end of your shift, but guess what you only get a few hours sleep then you are back in the cab and back on the road. It does not end when you get to an interchange town like Chicago because management will just transfer you to another railroad and you keep on going non stop. You go from the west coast to the east coast Canada to Mexico and every railroad in North America. Once you board a train say goodbye to everything you know and welcome to the life of a boomer on the road. The only guys who get a break are the local crews and the shortlines everyone else is a boomer they live on the road. This is such a huge crock of manure, particularly the part I bolded. Mr. geomodelrailroader, a railroad employee works for a single railroad; they are NEVER sent to work on other lines (except in the rare cases of trains being temporarily detoured over other railroads; but even in that case, they are still employed by the railroad that hired them, and simply on foreign trackage for a while, under the supervision of a host-road pilot-engineer). Even on one's own railroad, a typical train service employee will spend most of their time working only on a single didvision or subdivision of a road (unless they put in for a trasfer to another area). If I'm not mistaken, most regular-job road crews go back and forth, back and forth on a single stretch of line stretching about 200-300 miles. Extra board personnel will float around a bit ,but only on their division. Some men spend thirty years switching in one yard in one city, period! West coast to east coast? Complete nonsense. The majority of train employees on Class 1s never even work on 75% of their own railroad.
Train and engine service employees normally only work the lines assigned to their home terminal, with the run lengths being as you described. Some railroads have multiple seniority districts, and to transfer from one to the other means you go back to the bottom of the list, not a desirable prospect.
An employee can be forced to temporarily work out of another terminal if they are laid off at their current home terminal and another terminal is short of employees at the same time. Employees can also bid these shortages if they wish to work them while still being able to hold at their current home terminal.
When out on a shortage the company pays for your accomodations, and you also get a daily meal allowance and reimbursment for driving miles and time.
Of course I can only speak for my own railroad and seniority district (CN's western Canada lines), your mileage may vary.
One territory I worked had a crew agreement that was confusing to the max.
Savannah - Waycross - Jacksonville - Fitzgerald, GA - Home terminal at Savannah.
Away from home terminals Waycross, Jacksonville, Fitzgerald.
A crew called out of Savannah could be called to Waycross or Jacksonville; a crew called to Waycross could either be tied up for rest or put on another train to tie up in Jacksonville. All crews arriving Jacksonville were tied up for rest.
At Jacksonville crews could be called to move trains to Waycross, Savannah and Fitzgerald. Crews called to Savannah were home when they tied up. Crews called to Waycross could be rested or put on another train destined Savannah. Crews called to Fitzgerald would take rest at Fitzgerald to away trains destined Jacksonville. All crews at Jacksonville were called first in, first out - without regard to the destination of the train
It was possible for a crew to fall into the 'wrong slot' and make more than one round trip to Fitzgerald. Note - to get to Fitzgerald all trains ran through Waycross. There were separate pools that operated trains betweeen Waycross and Fitzgerald and another pool that operated between Waycross and Manchester. Trains that were operated from Jacksonville to Fitzgerald were normally destined to Atlanta or beyond. There was a separate pool that operated Fitzgerald to Atlanta through Manchester.
geomodelrailroader misses two important points:
1. Crews (engineers especially) must be qualified on the territory. They can't just be assigned willy-nilly to any route the railroad wants to send them on. Some old heads may have many miles on which they are qualified, but normally crews will work certain trips, as has already been described.
2. Hours of service laws are pretty specific on hours worked and required rest. A crew that works 12 hours will see at least 10 hours of rest, which I believe includes 8 hours of uninterrupted rest.
Disclaimer - I volunteer on a tourist line. It's rare that we run into HOS issues due to our short runs and regular schedule. I'm familiar enough with HOS to stay out of trouble on our railroad, but when you get out on the Class 1's, things can get more complicated, with deadhead time, limbo time, and a host of other such considerations.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
tree68geomodelrailroader misses two important points: 1. Crews (engineers especially) must be qualified on the territory. They can't just be assigned willy-nilly to any route the railroad wants to send them on. Some old heads may have many miles on which they are qualified, but normally crews will work certain trips, as has already been described. 2. Hours of service laws are pretty specific on hours worked and required rest. A crew that works 12 hours will see at least 10 hours of rest, which I believe includes 8 hours of uninterrupted rest. Disclaimer - I volunteer on a tourist line. It's rare that we run into HOS issues due to our short runs and regular schedule. I'm familiar enough with HOS to stay out of trouble on our railroad, but when you get out on the Class 1's, things can get more complicated, with deadhead time, limbo time, and a host of other such considerations.
Current HOS law requires 10 hours uninterrupted - which, if the crew was not notified to report on their 10 hour expiration means that they will then get a 2 hour notice to report for duty AFTER the 10 hours has expired.
Deadheading to an assignment counts as work time for HOS purposes. Called on duty at A at 0100 with a two hour taxi ride to B to go to work, crew now has 10 hours to work from B. Getting on the train at B to go to Z, train gets to W and is tied down at 1300 on their HOS time. Transportation for the crew arrives at W at 1400 and the crew is transported to Z and ties up at the rest facility at 1500. They were On Duty for 12 hours A to W including the DH. They also get paid for the additional hour required to transport them from W to the rest facility - in doing this they have accumulated 60 minutes of 'Limbo Time'. The HOS law allows for 30 hours of Limbo Time for each employee per month. There are also crew start rules that are too involved to wade into.
Without asking for specific dollar amounts, when an engineer or conductor is assigned to a district or terminal, are they guaranteed a minimum income, or do they get zilch if there is insufficient traffic for them to get a trip? And what benefits do they get? Medical, Dental, Vision, Life insurance? Vacation? Also some short lines don't seem to have enough traffic to have more than 24 hours a week like a part time job. How does that work? Also, if one gets fuloughed, is there any income and/or benefits? Are they eligible for unemployment?
BaltACD tree68 geomodelrailroader misses two important points: 1. Crews (engineers especially) must be qualified on the territory. They can't just be assigned willy-nilly to any route the railroad wants to send them on. Some old heads may have many miles on which they are qualified, but normally crews will work certain trips, as has already been described. 2. Hours of service laws are pretty specific on hours worked and required rest. A crew that works 12 hours will see at least 10 hours of rest, which I believe includes 8 hours of uninterrupted rest. Disclaimer - I volunteer on a tourist line. It's rare that we run into HOS issues due to our short runs and regular schedule. I'm familiar enough with HOS to stay out of trouble on our railroad, but when you get out on the Class 1's, things can get more complicated, with deadhead time, limbo time, and a host of other such considerations. Current HOS law requires 10 hours uninterrupted - which, if the crew was not notified to report on their 10 hour expiration means that they will then get a 2 hour notice to report for duty AFTER the 10 hours has expired. Deadheading to an assignment counts as work time for HOS purposes. Called on duty at A at 0100 with a two hour taxi ride to B to go to work, crew now has 10 hours to work from B. Getting on the train at B to go to Z, train gets to W and is tied down at 1300 on their HOS time. Transportation for the crew arrives at W at 1400 and the crew is transported to Z and ties up at the rest facility at 1500. They were On Duty for 12 hours A to W including the DH. They also get paid for the additional hour required to transport them from W to the rest facility - in doing this they have accumulated 60 minutes of 'Limbo Time'. The HOS law allows for 30 hours of Limbo Time for each employee per month. There are also crew start rules that are too involved to wade into.
tree68 geomodelrailroader misses two important points: 1. Crews (engineers especially) must be qualified on the territory. They can't just be assigned willy-nilly to any route the railroad wants to send them on. Some old heads may have many miles on which they are qualified, but normally crews will work certain trips, as has already been described. 2. Hours of service laws are pretty specific on hours worked and required rest. A crew that works 12 hours will see at least 10 hours of rest, which I believe includes 8 hours of uninterrupted rest. Disclaimer - I volunteer on a tourist line. It's rare that we run into HOS issues due to our short runs and regular schedule. I'm familiar enough with HOS to stay out of trouble on our railroad, but when you get out on the Class 1's, things can get more complicated, with deadhead time, limbo time, and a host of other such considerations.
Crew in Balt's scenario is in duty a total of 14 hours. They would show as being relieved at 1300 hrs and released at 1500. Total limbo time would be 2 hours. Limbo time is all time between relieved and released times. They would tie up and be given undesturbed rest for 12 hours. The required 10 hours plus two extra hours for the time being in limbo.
There is a limit to both total hours worked within a month and total limbo time. The total hours worked, I believe it's 276 hours, will require an employee to be laid off the remainder of the month if they run into the limit. The limbo cap doesn't require an employee to be laid off after reaching the limit, but everytime the employee accrues limbo time beyond the cap the railroad can be fined by the FRA. Because of that, some railroads may require an employee to be laid off for the remainder of the month at a basic daily rate of pay.
Electroliner 1935 Without asking for specific dollar amounts, when an engineer or conductor is assigned to a district or terminal, are they guaranteed a minimum income, or do they get zilch if there is insufficient traffic for them to get a trip? And what benefits do they get? Medical, Dental, Vision, Life insurance? Vacation? Also some short lines don't seem to have enough traffic to have more than 24 hours a week like a part time job. How does that work? Also, if one gets fuloughed, is there any income and/or benefits? Are they eligible for unemployment?
Depends on the contracts (or whims of management at non-union railroads) in effect.
The unionized carriers have medical/dental/vision and vacation benefits. The unions also offer some supplemental benefits such as short/long term disability, life insurance, etc. The company's insurance benefits last for up to 3 or 4 months after the last time the employee worked when furloughed. If an employee is furloughed for two months and recalled, works three weeks and is furloughed again, the benefits clock resets.
Most, if not all trainmen's (conductor, brakeman, and switchmen) positions have a guarantee. Some engineer's positions (assigned yard and locals, extra/spare boards) have a guarantee, the road pool engineers don't. Again, this depends on contracts in effect.
The amount of guarantee varies. Some railroads have good guarantees and some don't. Some (like the Iowa Interstate RR) will guarantee 40 hours per week. How it's figured by time can also vary. It can be weekly, by the half (of the month), or by the month.
Miserable. Most of them are OIFR
SFbrkmn Miserable. Most of them are OIFR
Translate OIFR please.
Off In Force Reduction is being on the furlogh board. This is the industry term for being out of work
SFbrkmn Off In Force Reduction is being on the furlogh board. This is the industry term for being out of work
I read on another site, BNSF had sent a letter to all those trainmen with less than 3 years seniority to return their company eqiupment, specifically the electronic items.
A note. There is a clause in the contracts that furloughed trainmen with less than 3 years seniority who haven't worked for one year (365 days) can be dropped from the seniority rosters. That is, they won't be recalled and are in effect, terminated.
I would say that letter is pretty ominious as to what they feel their forseeable manpower needs are.
I'm sorry for any pain I may have caused by asking.. Bummer.! This is not a fun time for too many people. Hope traffic and work return soon.
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