What is life like today as a Conductor Trainee? Norfolk Southern is holding an all day open house for Conductor Trainees in my home town soon and have a daughter interested in applying. Can the experts here fill in some of the gaps as to what are today’s responsibilities/duties for a Conductor (coupling/uncoupling cars, its your job to fix a broken air-hose or coupler knuckle out on the line, paper work, paper work, paper work)?
While I can discuss the history of railroading jobs going back to the hay-burner days, can only give her generalities as to today’s duties. Can someone help me out here with what Conductor's do in the 21th century please?
Thank you.
Check out Norfolk Southern's website. Under "job seekers" there's a video that shows "Brian the conductor" talking about his job and what the job demands and benefits are. It is actually a pretty good video...it doesn't sugar coat it although others here could probably fill in more detail.
One of the blogs I read has a regular segment written by a BNSF conductor who I believe has been working on the railroad only a few years - he's still new-ish. Pretty fascinating first-person narrative reading!
http://www.ogdenbrotherstrains.blogspot.com/search/label/Prototype%20Railroading
I went to one of those NS Conductor Trainee/ Career Open House sessions about 2 weeks ago, and concur with the above comments. In addition, the following points were repeatedly emphasized:
They spent the 1st 2 to 2-1/2 hours with PowerPoint presentations and the "Conductor Brian" video, as well as advice and war stories from the 3 HR guys, 1 PR guy, and 2 TMs who were there. That's a lot of personnel, but they interviewed 22 people that day (I wasn't selected to be in that group) to fill about 20 openings, so maybe it was worthwhile for them. Before the interviews there was also a 'fill out a basic paper application form' session and a timed 75-minute 'assessment' test - like an SAT with reading comprehension, math/ physics, and logic problems, plus a bunch of "agree/ disagree" statements. Recommend that she go to the NS session anyway if it's not too burdensome - maybe even fill out an on-line application first, because they got expedited treatment - it's free, and she can learn something - such as clarifying/ correcting anything above that I mis-remembered.
Perhaps current Conductor zugmann will chime in here, whenever he has a free minute off from work . . . . - or one of our other regulars in the TE&Y positions.
- Paul North.
Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? Years ago when I was living in Kamloops, BC I was train watching from the CP platform. A coal train was stopped there waiting for a crew change, but the headend brakeman was no where to be found. And the train couldn't move without him. Various workers and managers began milling about in a state of agitation, and in those days (1981) there were no cell phones so no one knew if the braker was on his way or if he was not coming in at all. One manager walked past me and jokingly said that if I wanted a brakeman job that I could start right now. They finally called someone else in, but the train was delayed by a couple of hours. I would bet that the brakeman who didn't show had alot of explaining to do if he was able to keep his job at all.
Ulrich Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? ... snip
Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? ... snip
James
I live in Lexington, S.C. and was called to work 3rd trick in Charlotte Yard, about 110 miles from my home. While flying low on Interstate 77 my serpentine belt came off and I had no tools.Luckily, I was only about a mile from an exit, so I was able to get to a pay phone and call the crew caller. He put the next guy on the board on duty while I waited for my brother-in-law to assist me with my car. I DID NOT GET FIRED!!!! Even the railroad understands that s--- happens.
The Butler Ulrich: Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? ... snip When I inteviewed for a job with the C&NW, I was told, "You will be fired if you miss a call for any reason."
Ulrich: Very interesting Paul...what would happen if (for example) you're called to work and your car breaks down enroute? Do they make allowances for that or are you gone after that? ... snip
When I inteviewed for a job with the C&NW, I was told, "You will be fired if you miss a call for any reason."
Must have been a good liar.
Mechanical Department "No no that's fine shove that 20 pound set all around the yard... those shoes aren't hell and a half to change..."
The Missabe Road: Safety First
No held away until 30 hours? Unless there's a side agreement, most times held away begins after 16 hours tied up away from home. The next 8 hours is under pay at the last rate service was performed. Then 16 hours "free" before it begins again. Some places have went to continuous held away. Once you're on, you stay on until back on duty (either train or dead head). Some guys working our North Pool around the holidays last year got 30 plus hours of held away alone.
Two trainmasters who haven't spent an entire holiday at home in six years? Yeah right. Either they are very junior, trying to look indispensable or fibbing a bit. That's one of the good things about working the holidays, hardly anyone's around. And since there's usually less traffic, better trips.
I don't know about other railroads, but when it gets really, really bad weather wise they have been letting people lay off for weather. They started doing this the last few years. Not so much when "driving is not recommended" (anymore they seem to say that after a heavy frost) but for times when the authorities have closed highways and threaten to ticket anyone out. Or worse when the authorities say if you're out and go in the ditch, you're on your own until the weather clears.
Still, it's best to put across the worst case scenarios. Because, depending on locations, some or all of the above can happen at some time or another.
Jeff
PS. Paul, thinking of a career change?
After you have been accepted for employment and begin OJT, you are a probationary employee, normally for 90 days. Probationary employees can be dismissed for any reason or no reason at all, without recourse during their probationary period. You are not a union employee and not covered by any of the contract protections that come with being a union employee. The probationary period is typical in all categories of employment.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
Jeff, I may well have mangled that 30-hour bit - hence my advice to go and hear it in person, and confirm.
One of the TM's said all he had to eat on Thanksgiving was a ham sandwich, too (maybe it's uphill to the tower both ways from the parking lot ?). It's the NS Allentown Yard and eastern PA and northern NJ territory, so there might be some credibility to it anyhow.
They said you'd get some slack for extraordinary circumstances once in a while. But not for saying you couldn't get in during a snowstorm, when the TM had to drive past your place and he got in OK . . .
More like looking for a new employer, while preferably staying in the same location. But since that's where and what the 20 opportunities are - and none of it scared me off, and I like outside work - I figured I had a decent chance, but not so far. Perhaps in another position/ capacity . . .
The accident on the way to work scenario happened to me, so...
Was rear ended at an intersection by a woman on her cell phone, she tagged the rear of my Magnum in her Mercedes SKE at 60mph...the SKE didn't survive, the driver did.
Called the crew caller and was marked off as having called a "relief" which is railroad jargon for marking off after accepting a call or while on duty due to illness, emergency and several other reasons...
Look at it from this point of view, I had accepted the call for work, and while I was not technically on duty, I was on the way there within the 90 minuet call frame, so the carrier has the right to expect me to show.
Because of circumstances beyond my control, I could not report, so I too have the duty to inform the carrier of such, hence I was shown as having called a relief instead of missing a start time.
Most railroads with union contracts work it this way, but if you abuse the system, they will and do fire you for it.
As Paul and other noted, the job requires, for the most part, a willingness to show up no matter what the weather or time, and be ready for duty as soon as your rest time is up, the physical part can be grueling, but it rarely is so tough that a person in reasonable shape couldn't handle most of it...yes, you will have to pick up a 90lb knuckle every once in a while, but that's the exception, not the rule.
Riding the cars, being able to mount and dismount them, and tying hand brakes/lining switches is the normal daily duty...most of the job is mental work, trying to figure out the fastest, easiest and safest way to perform the work, plus the fatigue factor when you work in pool or extra board service.
That will be the hardest part of the whole thing, the lack of quality sleep and relaxation, plus the time away from family.
If she can handle those, she can handle the rest.
23 17 46 11
That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. "..
I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it..
I've been railroading for just a tad under 10 years and for the most part I still enjoy my job. This job isn't back breaking physically demanding work. What it is, is simply following directions that are laid out in these thick rule books we have. I say that because it's not railroading anymore, it's rules compliance.
My schedule is rough on family life. I spend my holidays and weekends in a hotel or on a train, and weather conditions dont matter. Buy a good rain suit. It's 10 degrees hotter than hell on these rocks in the summer, and bone chilling cold in the winter.
Marking off excessively is a no no and could get you fired. We have a 90 minute call, and the carrier expects us to be there on time. They are understanding at times, things happen. Cars break down, tires get flat, maybe you have personal things going on at home.
Rules. Rules are what you will follow to the T or look for employment somewhere else. Not going by the rules will also get you killed, ever hear about blood rules? Rules written in blood? Well that's the gospel truth. Dont take short cuts, it's not worth it. The railroad is the only job I've ever seen where we have to have run off insurance in case some weed weasel decides we didn't make that move just right, now we're out of service for 30 days(if we're lucky). And it's only going to get worse with conductors going to certification Jan. 1st. Personal fines will be issued for rule violations as well as desertification.
Railroaders complain and gripe, but we earn that right. Hell you would too if you had to put up with the BS we do daily. But overall I still enjoy it, I wouldn't be here if I didn't.
Ulrich That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it..
Only if you dont know how to switch LOL. One is not harder than the other, one just requires a little more thinking and a little more walking.
Georgia Railroader Ulrich: That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it.. Only if you dont know how to switch LOL. One is not harder than the other, one just requires a little more thinking and a little more walking.
Ulrich: That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it..
Easier to stay awake when your walking around.
coborn35 Georgia Railroader: Ulrich: That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it.. Only if you dont know how to switch LOL. One is not harder than the other, one just requires a little more thinking and a little more walking. Easier to stay awake when your walking around.
Georgia Railroader: Ulrich: That sounds more like it...they must allow for emergencies provided they are the exception. Otherwise everyone is eventually fired... i.e .."sorry you just had a heart attack dad but I have to report to work within 90 minutes so see ya later.. ".. I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it.. Only if you dont know how to switch LOL. One is not harder than the other, one just requires a little more thinking and a little more walking.
Yes it is!
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It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
I have been railroading since 11/30/98. Although the 'new' has long since worn off, considering the culture and workplace environment every yr continues to degrade, its still a good--not great--job which can pay a chunk of change for doing so little labor work. This is the reason we are all here to start with. Anyone out there can get hired by a rr. We have a student condr in a class currently doing their 90 days of pre mark up training and this dude is 63 yrs of age! Another item to keep in mind is about three months ago, a new union agreement went in effect of which now new condrs no longer are covered by the union until I think its 60 days after marking up. This changed from after eight wks in student training. Be careful. Anything goes wrong, one can most likely be toast.
Ulrich [snipped] I would think that the job of conductor would vary alot based on the railroad and territory... if you're a conductor on a divsion that involves alot of switching then the job would be harder than being a conductor on a mainline with no branches. Or maybe that's just my understanding of it..
BaltACD After you have been accepted for employment and begin OJT, you are a probationary employee, normally for 90 days. Probationary employees can be dismissed for any reason or no reason at all, without recourse during their probationary period. You are not a union employee and not covered by any of the contract protections that come with being a union employee. The probationary period is typical in all categories of employment.
I am conductor/switchman for a RailAmerica shortline...
The duties of a conductor vary depending on what type of operation you're working in. I, for example, wear several hats over the course of the day. I handle the switching duties, radio communication, customer relations, paperwork, and anything else that goes with getting my job over the road. Most class 1 conductors will not switch a train after they are out of training. They step on a built train, handle the radio work, walk their train if there is a problem and step off and the next crew change point.
I have seen had heard several female conductors on the class 1's we work with. I have only seen 1 female come through our railroad. She had a baby and has not returned since.
I think working for a shortline is better for a person with a family or who doesn't want to travel or sit for extended periods of time. I think the class 1's are for people who want the big money and are not tied down to much at their home terminal.
Once you hold a job or are in a pool your life gets better. While you're on the extra board you can kiss your life goodbye.
Tell her to go for it!
Well it is definitely not as hard as it was when I hired out for NS in 1996. For one conductors have more time off and longer rest periods now as opposed to then. Definitely the hardest part of a railroaders job is the lifestyle. A young conductor can pretty much forget having a social life. Once you qualify you will be on the extraboard with no seniority. You could get called for pretty much anything from road jobs to locals or yard jobs at anytime of the night or day on any day of the week. You could work for six days straight before getting 48 hours rest or you might go for four days without getting out. It is definitely not a 9 to 5 Mon - Fri job so if that is what you are looking for then a railroad life is definitely not for you.
I was a conductor for 3 and a half years and then I went to engineer's school. Depending on what territory you hire out in it may be that short or could be a lot longer. On NS every conductor hired after 1985 has to go to engineer's school when it is their time to go and if you don't pass then you will no longer be employed. While I enjoyed being a conductor I for one couldn't wait to go since I love trains! Plus now I don't have to deal with the weather conditions that a conductor does.
Speaking of that I would say that the hardest part about being a conductor would be hanging on to the ladder on the side of a boxcar on a mile long shove move at 2:30 am on a Sunday morning when it is 35 degrees and raining. Yes I did that! Keep in mind I had to hold on with one hand because I had to hold my radio mike in the other giving the engineer instructions over the radio. If you can do that then you can handle anything as a conductor.
As far as duties are concerned a conductor has to have good arm and good back strength. If you are switching cars, you will have to bend air hoses back to couple them together. One girl I trained couldn't do it. I told her I might have to do this one hundred times a night working in the yard. You also have to line switches which sometimes can be hard if they haven't been lubricated in a while. While not very often you may have to change out a knuckle which weighs about 50 lbs. Definitely not fun and you will get dirty! Make sure you have really good boots. Ballast will eat thru cheap boots in no time because you will do a lot of walking especially when you are performing a brake test. Trains can get up to 2 miles in length. A conductor does have to keep up with all of the paperwork. This includes: hazmat information, train consists (wheel reports), dispatcher bulletins, work orders and track authority sheets. You will also be required to keep a bag or grip as we say with all of your necessary items such as rule books, timetables, hazmat books, radio, gloves, lantern, safety glasses, ear plugs...etc. You can be on duty up to 12 hours and there are no drive thru places to get something to eat when you are in the middle of nowhere so you'll need to pack a big lunch. You will more than likely spend a lot of time waiting in a siding or being held out of the yard so it can get kind of boring at times. You are not allowed to use your phone and definitely cannot text while the train is in operation. The FRA could personally fine you up to $17,000 if they catch you. I turn my phone off and store it away before I board the engine.
With all of that being said I still couldn't think of anything I'd rather be doing. Yes the railroad has been hard on my wife and kids and they have had to endure a lot. I've missed ball games and parties and a lot of their lives while they've been young. But it also has been rewarding. My wife now appreciates it more now that I have seniority and my kids are more understanding now. While railroaders can complain about the job it pays the bills and if it is in your blood like mine then you look forward to that 2:30 am call for NS 212 at 4:30 am.
The best advice I could give anyone when looking for a career is to decide what type of job you would enjoy going to everyday and keep trying for it until you get it. It took me three times before NS hired me and I had shortline experience.
Good Luck!
Tim
NS Locomotive Engineer
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jimhandsome I am conductor/switchman for a RailAmerica shortline... The duties of a conductor vary depending on what type of operation you're working in. I, for example, wear several hats over the course of the day. I handle the switching duties, radio communication, customer relations, paperwork, and anything else that goes with getting my job over the road. Most class 1 conductors will not switch a train after they are out of training. They step on a built train, handle the radio work, walk their train if there is a problem and step off and the next crew change point. I have seen had heard several female conductors on the class 1's we work with. I have only seen 1 female come through our railroad. She had a baby and has not returned since. I think working for a shortline is better for a person with a family or who doesn't want to travel or sit for extended periods of time. I think the class 1's are for people who want the big money and are not tied down to much at their home terminal. Once you hold a job or are in a pool your life gets better. While you're on the extra board you can kiss your life goodbye. Tell her to go for it!
Im not sure why you think that, but it couldnt be farther from the truth!
coborn35 jimhandsome: I am conductor/switchman for a RailAmerica shortline... The duties of a conductor vary depending on what type of operation you're working in. I, for example, wear several hats over the course of the day. I handle the switching duties, radio communication, customer relations, paperwork, and anything else that goes with getting my job over the road. Most class 1 conductors will not switch a train after they are out of training. They step on a built train, handle the radio work, walk their train if there is a problem and step off and the next crew change point. I have seen had heard several female conductors on the class 1's we work with. I have only seen 1 female come through our railroad. She had a baby and has not returned since. I think working for a shortline is better for a person with a family or who doesn't want to travel or sit for extended periods of time. I think the class 1's are for people who want the big money and are not tied down to much at their home terminal. Once you hold a job or are in a pool your life gets better. While you're on the extra board you can kiss your life goodbye. Tell her to go for it! Im not sure why you think that, but it couldnt be farther from the truth!
jimhandsome: I am conductor/switchman for a RailAmerica shortline... The duties of a conductor vary depending on what type of operation you're working in. I, for example, wear several hats over the course of the day. I handle the switching duties, radio communication, customer relations, paperwork, and anything else that goes with getting my job over the road. Most class 1 conductors will not switch a train after they are out of training. They step on a built train, handle the radio work, walk their train if there is a problem and step off and the next crew change point. I have seen had heard several female conductors on the class 1's we work with. I have only seen 1 female come through our railroad. She had a baby and has not returned since. I think working for a shortline is better for a person with a family or who doesn't want to travel or sit for extended periods of time. I think the class 1's are for people who want the big money and are not tied down to much at their home terminal. Once you hold a job or are in a pool your life gets better. While you're on the extra board you can kiss your life goodbye. Tell her to go for it!
It depends on where and the kind of assignment you're working. At some terminals the road conductors don't do a lot of ground work unless something goes wrong. Even the "working" road (thru) trains may only mean doubling up or over at the beginning or end of the run. Possibly kicking out a bad order after the train is built.
Other places the road trains may do more intermediate, even local freight type work. Don't forget the yards where class 1 trains originate, terminate and do intermediate work usually have switch engines (and locals) manned by class 1 train/yardmen, some long out of training.
On my territory, many road trains have line of road pick ups and/or set offs - which are performed by the road conductor as nearly all yard assignments are Remote Control crews that under our rules must be in the clear with a crewed train in their working limits. Most all crews originate a train at one end of their run or terminate the train at the other end of their run; all yard moves are performed by the road crew. The local freights all do their own switching on line of road. We have a number of purpose line of road road switchers that handle stone and trash, originating at train, dropping it at a customer - picking up a train from the customer and taking it back to origin - needless to say these crews do all their own work. There are several premium assignments where the trains have priority and little if any line of road work - needless to say these are populated by the small numbers on the seniority roster.
On my carrier and territory - the Conductor's job is far from a get on and ride job.
Thank you and everyone else for the great input! The NS job fair is two days away and my daughter says she it up to it. It'll be her first real job interview, but down or up, she says she can't score a goal unless she takes a shot (she's a want-to-be hockey player.)
Again, eveyone THANK YOU for sharing tails from the cab (would say Cabin Car?)
I have seen women working MOW. Granted that is not an easy task nor were they assigned 'light duty' such as being a flagman. Some of them can work alongside men and handle the task with ease.
I prefer photographing MOW to standing at a crossing waiting for a train.Those folks deserve recognition. The MOW folks are those who keep the railroad running seem to be among those least appreciated and least recognized. Their work is indeed 'back breaking', and I've photographed some small men and women doing things I thought they couldn't.
Norm
Despite their importance, from a operations perspective the are viewed as 'Maintenance in the Way'.
Norm48327 I have seen women working MOW. Granted that is not an easy task nor were they assigned 'light duty' such as being a flagman. Some of them can work alongside men and handle the task with ease. I prefer photographing MOW to standing at a crossing waiting for a train.Those folks deserve recognition. The MOW folks are those who keep the railroad running seem to be among those least appreciated and least recognized. Their work is indeed 'back breaking', and I've photographed some small men and women doing things I thought they couldn't.
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