Nance, I hope your Thanksgiving was enjoyable, too!
I don't have this BNSF calendar, but the only thing I can think of is that the curve was probably "compressed" by a telephoto lens. I'm sure the new line doesn't have much in it to severely restrict train speeds.
I'm sure that somewhere we've had a thread about the sharpest mainline curves to be found; I know that the C&O has a wickedly-sharp one on its main line at Hawk's Nest, West Virginia, that is regularly negotiated by everything from passenger trains to monster coal drags.
As you can imagine, the curves have to be able to handle six-axle locomotives without a problem. Many industrial spurs still are restricted to four-axle locomotives. The sharpness of the curve will dictate the maximum speed that trains can operate over it. Superelevation (banking) of these curves increases the maximum speed, but the superelevation often has been reduced in recent years because trains going slower than the permissible speed can damage the lower (inside) rails. That curve on the old C&O probably has a 25-mph or lower speed limit. UP has some 50-mph reverse curves on the main line between Glen Ellyn and Wheaton; it was a failure to maintain trackage properly on these curves that led to the infamous Glen Ellyn wreck in 1976.
I'm sure Sir Mudchicken could say something about the relationship between the sharpness of the curve, the amount of superelevation, and the authorized speed limits that are considered acceptable.
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
AgentKid Wishing everyone in the Lounge a Happy (US) Thanksgiving. Bruce
Wishing everyone in the Lounge a Happy (US) Thanksgiving.
Bruce
Thanks for the good wishes Bruce, and I echo them back out to everyone myself!
I have a question, prompted by my recent trek through the BNSF 2012 calendar, actually the March photo of, "An intermodal train passing a carload train as it rounds an outcropping on the new main line at Abo Canyon, NM." photo by David Miller
Question is: How sharp of a curve can a train successfully navigate? These look much sharper than I would have guessed was safe, SO I'm thinking something very different than my thought process goes into this.
Does it depend at all on terrain, or just which Class(es) RR operate over it, or what types of trains pass (weight, speed, etc), or...? Thanks, as always.
Nance-CCABW/LEI
“Even if you are on the right track, you’ll get run over if you just sit there.” --Will Rogers
Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, you're right! --unknown
zardoz CNW 6000: I'm going to say eastbound over Buffalo Lake. From what I can determine from Google Maps, I do believe you are correct. Very Good!! Carl, obviously your memory has survived much better than mine; thanks for the refresher course.
CNW 6000: I'm going to say eastbound over Buffalo Lake.
Carl, obviously your memory has survived much better than mine; thanks for the refresher course.
Dan
Saw on a Canadian forum that CP has been hauling old Geeps through Calgary out to Vancouver for scrapping. The units started out as GP7's or 9's, and were rebuilt to become GP9u's in the 70's and 80's. They have been taking them a couple at a time D-I-T in the consists of grain trains. Each unit separated from other units by a couple of loaded grain hoppers.
Seems like you can't get more than 55-60 years out of a good engine anymore.
So shovel the coal, let this rattler roll.
"A Train is a Place Going Somewhere" CP Rail Public Timetable
"O. S. Irricana"
. . . __ . ______
CNW 6000 I'm going to say eastbound over Buffalo Lake.
zardoz CNW 6000: Jim - I did it again today. Driving in to work I caught M342, A446 and Q199 in about 30 minutes. Then, after work just caught M391 and A491. Total time "trackside" was about 45 minutes (total) for 5 trains. It sounded like about 4 went past in the four hours I was at work today. Amazing; just amazing. CNW6000: Thanks Carl. The Adams Sub (between Butler Yard and Adams, WI) is one that's baffled me for a while...finally got a chance to start to figure things out. Give me a few more weekends on there and I'll have times, etc down pretty well. Dan, maybe you will someday be able to tell me where on the Adams sub these were shot:
CNW 6000: Jim - I did it again today. Driving in to work I caught M342, A446 and Q199 in about 30 minutes. Then, after work just caught M391 and A491. Total time "trackside" was about 45 minutes (total) for 5 trains. It sounded like about 4 went past in the four hours I was at work today.
Jim - I did it again today. Driving in to work I caught M342, A446 and Q199 in about 30 minutes. Then, after work just caught M391 and A491. Total time "trackside" was about 45 minutes (total) for 5 trains. It sounded like about 4 went past in the four hours I was at work today.
CNW6000: Thanks Carl. The Adams Sub (between Butler Yard and Adams, WI) is one that's baffled me for a while...finally got a chance to start to figure things out. Give me a few more weekends on there and I'll have times, etc down pretty well.
Thanks Carl. The Adams Sub (between Butler Yard and Adams, WI) is one that's baffled me for a while...finally got a chance to start to figure things out. Give me a few more weekends on there and I'll have times, etc down pretty well.
Thanks Jim. I'm going to say eastbound over Buffalo Lake.
Aphorism/ folk saying about human nature from many years ago:
"To a man with a hammer, everything looks like a nail." . . .
You can see the parallel, I'm sure.
- Paul North.
Jim, 291 and 292 were the "Cudahy Turn".
293 and 294 were the "Bain Turn".
You got the Green Bay-via-Fond du Lac numbers right 295, 296, 297, and 298. I used to like 298, because it carried run-through blocks--ore from Black River Falls, autos from Bain, and manifest cars--all for the PC.
The Green Bay trains (via the Lakeshore) were 187 (later 181)/180 and 183/182.
It was 495, not 405, and it went beyond Adams all the way to Rapid City...482 was the return trip.
The Madison trains also served Janesville...at varying times there were two or three runs; perhaps only one went as far as Madison. Westbounds were 591 and 597, with the addition of 595. I think the eastbounds were 594, 596, and 598.
The Twin Cities were served by 477/488 and 483/490.
Itasca/"Head-o-Lakes" was served by 417/406, later supplemented by 415/408.
So Butler had seven runs in each direction (not counting the Fond du Lac trains, which ran through). I never got to Fond du Lac, or Janesville, but Butler used to be very familiar to me. They didn't start running through to Adams until after I got off the extra board and quit getting calls for road runs.
zugmann So I bought myself a 2 gallon air compressor. Didn't really need one, but it was on clearance at the local big box hardware store. Don't know what I'm going to do with it, but maybe I'll buy myself an airbrush for Christmas.
So I bought myself a 2 gallon air compressor. Didn't really need one, but it was on clearance at the local big box hardware store. Don't know what I'm going to do with it, but maybe I'll buy myself an airbrush for Christmas.
I got a similar compressor because I wanted one. It came with a brad/staple gun. Well, OK, since it came with it, but I really wasn't looking for it, and figured I'd rarely use it.
I've gone through several packages of both brads and staples....
Who knew?
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
CShaveRR You got me to thinking about the classifications we used to make at Proviso for points north (and northwest) when I hired out: --Harvard, Janesville, Madison --Waukegan, Kenosha, Cudahy, National Avenue, --Bain, Mitchell Yard, Butler --Sheboygan, Manitowoc, Green Bay --Fond du Lac, Fox River Valley --Adams, Altoona In addition, Minneapolis, St. Paul, and Crawford, SD, were handled by Yard 1. (Each of those names was a separate classification; I just grouped them according to the lines they were on.) So, what northbound classifications did we have when I left? Janesville, Waukegan, Butler, Adams, and South St. Paul.
You got me to thinking about the classifications we used to make at Proviso for points north (and northwest) when I hired out:
--Harvard, Janesville, Madison
--Waukegan, Kenosha, Cudahy, National Avenue,
--Bain, Mitchell Yard, Butler
--Sheboygan, Manitowoc, Green Bay
--Fond du Lac, Fox River Valley
--Adams, Altoona
In addition, Minneapolis, St. Paul, and Crawford, SD, were handled by Yard 1.
(Each of those names was a separate classification; I just grouped them according to the lines they were on.)
So, what northbound classifications did we have when I left?
Janesville, Waukegan, Butler, Adams, and South St. Paul.
Trains 297/298 to Fond du Lac295/296 to Fond du Lac291/292 to Green Bay405/480 to Adams415/490 to Itaska477/488 to Minneapolis"A" Train to Janesville"B" Train to Janesville595/596 to Madison597/598 to MadisonDaily extra 289 to Butler, making all the stops.
I know there were lots more, but right now I can't remember them.
Paul_D_North_Jr Spray-paint over graffiti on railcars . . . Recharge air lines on spotted railcars at random . . . Help a crew with pumping up their train to perform an Initial Terminal Air Test in the winter . . . Drive around and pump up any flat tires you find on the cars of little old ladies and cute young girls . . . Blow snow out of flangeways and switches . . . Hook it up to a diesel loco horn and put in all in the bed of your pickup - or leave it in the garage until the urge strikes to get revenge on noisy neighbors, or to celebrate New Years . . . - Paul North.
Spray-paint over graffiti on railcars . . .
Recharge air lines on spotted railcars at random . . .
Help a crew with pumping up their train to perform an Initial Terminal Air Test in the winter . . .
Drive around and pump up any flat tires you find on the cars of little old ladies and cute young girls . . .
Blow snow out of flangeways and switches . . .
Hook it up to a diesel loco horn and put in all in the bed of your pickup - or leave it in the garage until the urge strikes to get revenge on noisy neighbors, or to celebrate New Years . . .
Hmm... I don't think this is the best one for any of those (except the tire one...)
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
zugmann So I bought myself a 2 gallon air compressor. Didn't really need one, but it was on clearance at the local big box hardware store. Don't know what I'm going to do with it, but maybe I'll buy myself an airbursh for Christmas. *** impulse buys..
So I bought myself a 2 gallon air compressor. Didn't really need one, but it was on clearance at the local big box hardware store. Don't know what I'm going to do with it, but maybe I'll buy myself an airbursh for Christmas.
*** impulse buys..
zardoz And yes, Carl, those photos sure do show how the railroad's presence has diminished over the years. Indeed, if one looks at a map of Wisconsin railroads from the 1920's or so, and then compares it with present lines, it is quite amazing to see all the state has lost. It looked as though in the old days, one could get just about anywhere by rail, as long as one wasn't in a hurry.
And yes, Carl, those photos sure do show how the railroad's presence has diminished over the years. Indeed, if one looks at a map of Wisconsin railroads from the 1920's or so, and then compares it with present lines, it is quite amazing to see all the state has lost. It looked as though in the old days, one could get just about anywhere by rail, as long as one wasn't in a hurry.
Don't I know it, Jim! You got me to thinking about the classifications we used to make at Proviso for points north (and northwest) when I hired out:
blhanel Last night I pulled up Google Maps and followed the Adams sub from Butler all the way through Adams and across the Wisconsin River using the satellite view. I came across two or three bridges that were obvious reductions from two tracks to one similar to what's shown in the photos, including the Wisconsin River one, but none of them seemed to match up with this one's configuration. The Wisconsin River bridge has only the south track remaining, but the rail line curves to the north after crossing the bridge, and these pictures show tangent track running for a ways beyond the bridge.
Last night I pulled up Google Maps and followed the Adams sub from Butler all the way through Adams and across the Wisconsin River using the satellite view. I came across two or three bridges that were obvious reductions from two tracks to one similar to what's shown in the photos, including the Wisconsin River one, but none of them seemed to match up with this one's configuration. The Wisconsin River bridge has only the south track remaining, but the rail line curves to the north after crossing the bridge, and these pictures show tangent track running for a ways beyond the bridge.
Brian (IA) http://blhanel.rrpicturearchives.net.
Nice shots, Jim, and nice scenery (breezy day!)! That isn't the Wisconsin River, is it? (I know the railroad crosses the river somewhere west of Adams, but the Adams Sub just goes from BJ to Adams.)
The pictures are, in a way, somewhat depressing--that truncated bridge looks sad. Regardless of how technology has changed, the fact remains that this line was reduced from two tracks to one...there was once more up there. And we know it was better at one time, with ABS, ATS, and at least 60-m.p.h. speed limits.
____________
I'm still trying to get a good cell-phone video of a UP train using the new crossovers in Lombard. Came close today, but was on the wrong side of the tracks to really show it. Today's attempt was with a loaded EDGX coal train that blew through. My video shows just how fast it was going--now I need one of my tech-savvy daughters (or sons-in-law...or grandchildren!) to show me how to upload it here.
CNW 6000 Jim - I did it again today. Driving in to work I caught M342, A446 and Q199 in about 30 minutes. Then, after work just caught M391 and A491. Total time "trackside" was about 45 minutes (total) for 5 trains. It sounded like about 4 went past in the four hours I was at work today.
CNW6000 Thanks Carl. The Adams Sub (between Butler Yard and Adams, WI) is one that's baffled me for a while...finally got a chance to start to figure things out. Give me a few more weekends on there and I'll have times, etc down pretty well.
Flickr link
mudchicken http://www.stb.dot.gov/newsrels.nsf/WEBUNID/67B0EC7439DD13AF8525794C005BEC45?OpenDocument Move over Shelocta, PA ...Looks like R J Corman is looking at seriously going ahead with building 20 miles on new railroad, Wallaceton-Goreton, PA for a waste to energy plant, reviving a long dead railroad line and connecting to another line that they want to pull out of railbanked status. Might be fun to watch. ex-NYC Beech Creek line?
Move over Shelocta, PA ...Looks like R J Corman is looking at seriously going ahead with building 20 miles on new railroad, Wallaceton-Goreton, PA for a waste to energy plant, reviving a long dead railroad line and connecting to another line that they want to pull out of railbanked status. Might be fun to watch.
ex-NYC Beech Creek line?
Actually, the suspicion is that the prime use will be for rail-borne trash from New York City to a landfill - which was confirmed by the STB report (thanks much for that link, too !) - and a quarry, as well as perhaps some drilling supplies for 'fracking' the Marcellus Shale in the region to recover natural gas, etc.
The 'fun' will be in 2 parts: 1) watching the reconstruction of the rail line, and 2) watching the wailing and gnashing of teeth of the trail advocates who claim the sky will be falling from this restoration of service. As to a claim of loss of history for the Moshannon viaduct and the tunnel, I liked the STB's response, which was essentially: "Their history is being best preserved by returning back to their original use for an active rail line" (with a couple of conditions added to preserve the tunnel portal appearance, etc.).
WIll have to try and get up that way to see it in person after the holidays (and rifle season for deer up there, too !).
CShaveRR [snipped] Does anyone know of a wreck that Amtrak P42 58 was in lately? Lots of paint missing ahead of the cab on the right side, top to bottom.
MC, I saw something yesterday about the Michigan high-speed corridor being opened for engineering bids, with letters of interest due by sometime next month. Not sure what all is entailed there, or what has already been designed.
______________
High winds today, with temperatures near 50 (after barely breaking 30 yesterday). Still, I was out there on my bike, From Facebook:
Lombard was visited by Amtrak's California Zephyr today (just passing through). Its regular route was blocked by a trestle fire in Iowa. The westbound train passed me on Track 1, about ten minutes after the eastbound scoot had gone by on the same track. Up until the new crossovers, it had been on track 2 (where it possibly passed the westbound scoot around Elmhurst). I'm not sure why they needed to cross it over here, as the signals suggested that there was nothing on the line between here and West Chicago.The eastbound will go through here later this evening, probably around D&D time (dark and dinner). Things should be back to normal tomorrow, when the trestle is expected to be repaired.
Does anyone know of a wreck that Amtrak P42 58 was in lately? Lots of paint missing ahead of the cab on the right side, top to bottom.
http://www.stb.dot.gov/newsrels.nsf/WEBUNID/67B0EC7439DD13AF8525794C005BEC45?OpenDocument
Move over Shelocta, PA ...Looks like R J Corman is looking at seriously going ahead with building 20 miles on new railroad, Wallaceton-Goreton, PA for a waste to energy plant, reviving a long dead railroad line and connecting to another line that they want to pull out of railbanked status. Might be fun to watch
.
Paul & Zug - I've seen similar sayings but in chalk on some different WC Boxes and other more "local" rolling stock. I have deduced that it's likely a RR or industry employee doing the writing because the cars in question "only" sit still at the industry and the local yard. That and the notes are in chalk which I've seen several kinds of yardworkers use to mark couplers, shanks, wheels, etc with.
But only 1 car at a time ?
Your last saying on the hopper car reminds me of song lyrics of some kind - like Joni Mitchell*, perhaps ? - but I can't do any better than that right now.
"You don't know what you've got til it's gone", from her [Paved Paradise to Put Up a ] Parking Lot song. But there are still other similar ones . . .
One more that I remember on a hopper:
"You can not be totally free until you've lost it all"
It may not be exactly worded like that, but the meaning was the same. Another thread reminded me of a story our one engineer told me: a friend of this engineer said to them "I saw this train last night at this crossing, and it kept going back and forth like it didn't know where it was going! I think the engineer was drunk!"
To which the engineer had to explain that there was an industry right next to the crossing and that they were switching the cars out. I guess people never realize that the cars from those 150 car trains actually have to go somewhere.
I wondered if there would be detours, Jeff. BNSF had a trestle fire at Thayer, Iowa, that damaged the ties on the bridge. It might be warm enough here today to go have a look.
Carl, Yyu might also see some Amtrak action today on the UP. No 6 is detouring (crew on duty out west) and No 5 is on the line up. Seems to be a one day thing.
Jeff
Carl, have you seen any of the specials handling Kawasaki M-8 motorized passenger cars? They've been running them the past few days. I haven't seen one, but on the line ups they're showing them with one engine and four cars.
Wish I could have been up there to sip some of that lemonade you made, Dan! Great pictures! It looks like the UP main line is shaping up in that area.
My highlight of the day was a unit train of Case and Holland combines headed east with an NS ex-Con in the consist. It crossed over at the control point, on a red-over-flashing-yellow (first time I've seen that aspect!).
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