Is Amtrak Crash Nevada’s Fault?

[Semper Vaporo]

There used to be (might still be, but I haven't looked) a web site devoted to the advertising campaign.  It listed all the signs (sorted by the year they were first installed).  The signs were almost all removed sometime after 1963 when the company was purchased by an other one.  A few were missed by the crews hired to remove them.

My Dad's favourite was:

Spring
Has sprung
The grass has riz
Where last year's
Careless drivers is
Burma-Shave

It was on a highway between Indianapolis and Salem, Indiana and he would always read it aloud as we passed.  I remember a couple of others along that same route, or an alternate one we would sometimes take.  On a long vacation trip one summer, looking for them was a great passtime for us kids.  I think I have seen about a dozen different ones...don't remember them all, but I copied the web site's list so I have a complete (hope) list to quote from in forums.

 

[Anonymous]

Semper, you seem to be a great Burma Shave aficionado; never saw one of those and I started watching 75 years ago.

The one I treasure is this one:  "When passing schools, take it slow.  Let our little shavers grow."

Thanks for the additions, even though they've come at a bad time.

Art

[Semper Vaporo]

In view of the present situation and the deaths, these might seem a bit crass, but Burma Shave had a few signs like that:

Remember this
If you'd
Be spared
Trains don't whistle
Because they're scared
Burma-Shave

He saw
The train
And tried to duck it
Kicked first the gas
And then the bucket
Burma-Shave

He tried
To cross
As fast train neared
Death didn't draft him
He volunteered
Burma-Shave

Train approaching
Whistle squealing
Pause!
Avoid that
Rundown feeling!
Burma-Shave

Guys whose eyes
Are in
Their backs
Get halos crossing
Railroad tracks
Burma-Shave

Approached
A crossing
Without looking
Who will eat
His widow's cooking?
Burma-Shave

There were a few others with a RR theme, but they do not fit this situation.

 

[selector]

How about a series of signs, say a minimum of two.  The first warns of an upcoming crossing, and maybe 100 yards further, the second would ask, 'Do ya feel lucky, huh?"   Then, for icing, about 100  yards past that, a big screen would replay endless loops of video showing crossing collisions.

Maybe that would work?

(Yes, a bit facetious, but....what else is there to do other than a warning sign that a crossing is coming, and maybe a mandated speed zone/reduction to 30 MPH within 100 yards of the crossing?)

Even so, it is like gun control laws....the bad guys don't read, apparently.

Crandell

[Anonymous]

Ulrich

That's a good point...and maybe the crossing mechanism wasn't working properly.

A signal malfunction is always a possibility, but my premise of this thread is the assumption that the crossing signals were functioning properly.  They just were not up to the job with such high vehicle speeds.   So what is required is to get that speed down in advance of the crossing and raise crossing awareness at the same time. 

[Semper Vaporo]

Many, MANY years ago, Nevada had a "Reasonable and Proper" speed limit for the open road. The premise being that if you had an accident, then your were probably speeding, and conversely, if you did not have an accident then you were traveling at a reasonable and proper speed. Maybe that tradition/mentality has not subsided yet.

I think that Bucyrus has hit upon a good thought. There should be a reduction in the speed limit in the area of RR grade crossings, just like around here there are reductions in the speed limit at major highway intersections (whether signaled or not).

Of course, if drivers pay no attention to the signage, then posting such limits is just a waste of the earth's natural resource, so strong enforcement is a method to help drivers obey the limits, if not for safety, then for protection of the wallet.

But, to say that some official looked the other way, is to imply a criminal act. Not that such could not have happened, but just like the RR rules were written in blood, so are, too often, traffic regulations.

 

[schlimm]

Bucyrus:  Much of what you say about crossings and speed limits, although true in the East and some of the Midwest,  does not apply out West.  If you want to make rails with passenger trains running at 60-90 mph safe from cars and trucks, we need to begin a program of systematically eliminating low volume crossings and grade separating the rest.  It will take time and money, but there really isn't any workable alternative.

[Ulrich]

That's a good point...and maybe the crossing mechanism wasn't working properly. I've seen that happen in downtown Toronto. In my case I called CN and they fixed the problem..after I witnessed  a train almost broadsiding a crowded city bus. The wig wag came down alright...and then went up again...and THEN the train came barrelling through..

Lots could have gone wrong here beyond the obvious.  I hope John Davis has everything in order. It looks like he runs a first class operation judging from the FMSCA info available...but if there's even one discrepency in that driver's log or if there's anything like a missed drug test then he's cooked.  I feel bad for John Davis... looks like a family business built up over years of hard work...only to have this happen... its tragic for them as well..

[cacole]

Lowering the speed limit would be meaningless if it is not enforced.

I've seen rail crossings here in Arizona along the Union Pacific Sunset Route that are so far out in the middle of nowhere, even though they are state highways, that law enforcement rarely, if ever, enforces the posted speed limit simply because there are not enough police to patrol every road.

The Nevada state highway where this accident occurred seems to be a very similar situation.

[zugmann]

I've seen advanced warning lights for crossings on 55-65mph roads. 

 

Even if you lower the limits - it's all about control of your vehicle.  Apparently the first driver didn't have it (or there was a problem out of his control).

[Anonymous]

I am thinking a little more about how this crossing was protected.  Certainly lights and gates are the epitome of crossing protection art.  They should be all the protection that is needed.  As a further measure, they can be set up to prevent running around the gates.

 

What seems relatively unusual with this crash site is the speed limit of the road.  Seventy mph is no big deal, but I can’t recall seeing any roads in my location with an active grade crossing on a 70-mph road.  Around here, seventy is only allowed on some freeways, and never on a two-lane highway.  The two-lane highways are 55-mph speed limit, and they will pull you over at much over sixty. 

 

But out in the wide open, with little traffic, with a long way to go, on a straight highway with a 70-mph limit, and sparse law enforcement, I could see some major vehicle speeds occurring.  Maybe the state is not too concerned about it because each driver is mostly risking only his or her life speeding down the lonely highway. 

 

However, the introduction of an Amtrak train full of people, as a direct obstruction to this fast, lonely highway ought to raise an eyebrow.   I think the state should have recognized this peril and done a little more to prevent it.  It is not to say that it is okay for a truck driver to run 80-100 mph, but if they do so routinely, the state has a responsibility to know about it and act upon it.  They manage the roadways.  Sometimes the blame falls on the last person who could have prevented the accident, but did not. 

 

Authorities always point out that you can see grade crossing lights from such and such distance.  Presumably it is enough distance to stop a vehicle.  It is reported that the lights at this Nevada crossing are timed to start flashing 25 seconds before the train reaches the crossing.

 

But these crossing lamps are tiny features in wide-open country when you first see them upon approach.  And most people driving 80-100 mph tend to concentrate just ahead of their vehicle to make sure it stays on the road as it sucks up the highway like a Shop Vac. 

 

It may be that ultra-fast trucks, requiring extra stopping distance, are capable of simply overrunning the warning of the grade crossing, if only a tiny interval of distraction is introduced that shortens that warning interval.   If that is so, it seems that the method of protection is inadequate.  Authorities need to tromp the speed limit down approaching a grade crossing, especially one that hosts passenger trains.   Every state knocks the speed limit down for going through the smallest of towns.     

 

Regardless of the truck driver’s negligence, the public was inadequately protected in this case.  It seems to me that somebody larger than the truck driver dropped the ball here. 

 

The truck driver could be scapegoated for the negligence of public officials who looked the other way in the face of an obvious road hazard in their state.