Who screwed up here?
We have the BNSF #7777, who in 2006 was just barely removed from the factory, with glorious orange paint:
Then in 2009, the paint is slighty starting to fade, or maybe she is just dirty:
But now, in 2010, just a disgrace to the railroad, paint is peach colored and faded:
So who is at fault? GE for bad paint? The BNSF for an acid wash? Who?
Mechanical Department "No no that's fine shove that 20 pound set all around the yard... those shoes aren't hell and a half to change..."
The Missabe Road: Safety First
Well, maybe it's just a real-life rolling paint-endurance test platform . . .
I wonder if photo post-processing manipulation isn't part of this - all of the units in the 3rd photo kinda look that way, and the photo in general looks 'washed out' to me. Alternatively, maybe the color was super-saturated in the 1st 2 photos. Or, notice that the color on the vertical front of the cab roof by the number boards is a little more 'solid' - so maybe the fading is really road dust that's either whitish or more aggressive to the paint.
But if the paint really faded that much that suddenly, that's an interesting phenomenon . . .
- Paul North.
IIRC CNW had a similar issue with the paint GE applied to its C40-8s that worked out in Wyoming and the North Central Plain states. Something about the intense UV causing fading to happen more quickly out there because of altitude or something to that effect. As long as the loco works fine it's a cosmetic issue. Should something major happen that would necessitate an overhaul the paint may be redone otherwise I'd kind of doubt it.
Dan
You can blame DuPont, not GE, for the paint problems that have been ongoing for years now. The EMD products on the property are suffering a similar fading problem. It was rumored that BNSF even had a lawsuit against DuPont for their advertising that the "premium" paint would last at least 10 years in the harshest climate without fading. Ironically enough, the paint on the Heritage 1 Dash-9's and other older units have held up remarkably well! And it's not just BNSF with this problem. Take a look at UP and CSX units painted a mere 2-3 years ago. They're horrible looking, and getting worse by the day. That's why I try to get pics of units when they're factory fresh; it's a guarantee that they won't stay that way for long!
Joe H. (Milepost S256.0; NS Griffin District)
Pictures: http://anb740.rrpicturearchives.net
Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/anb740
CNW 6000 IIRC CNW had a similar issue with the paint GE applied to its C40-8s that worked out in Wyoming and the North Central Plain states. Something about the intense UV causing fading to happen more quickly out there because of altitude or something to that effect. As long as the loco works fine it's a cosmetic issue. Should something major happen that would necessitate an overhaul the paint may be redone otherwise I'd kind of doubt it.
Interesting points, I would also make the case for the abrasive action of the dust and sand in the Western regions, as well. That would be a big factor in the wearing of the paint. Not to mention the wearability of the specific paints coud be an issue also. Different paint suppliers, and (therefor ingredients in their paint.) At play, as well, is [mandated rules by Government agencies,] and the paint supplier's attempts to meet those regulations. Remember, the exclusion of lead as a paint ingredient by those regulators, the lack effects the durability factors of exterior paints.
You would not want a foamer to loose I.Q. points by sucking the paint on their favorite locomotive,or other railroad equipment because the paint contained lead. I am guessing that a paint chemist could address the problems of modern paint wearing most directly.
As a side note: UNION PACIFIC seems to have pretty good luck with the durability of their paints. I've seen really dirty engines, but cases of really ugly, worn paint seem to have been few, and far between, in my observations.
Might Mr. Buffet have resolved the cosmetic issue of his locomotives, by buying the outfit with the armour yellow paint scheme, rather than the the bunch with the plethora of orange and green schemes?
Paints fade. Some colors more than others. Blacks and blues discolor terribly...and so do reds. And apparently orange! Sun, sand, grime, grease, and how many other thousand pollutants in the air striking ithe surface at speeds up to 80 mph! Your skin would look pretty bad, too.
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Paint has faded and bled since it was invented, it's just more obvious with bright colors. I've seen pictures of any number of freight cars in which the lettering has run like a melting ice cream cone, and these pictures date from the 1950's. I can also remember fading with the dark blue used by N&W on its locomotives in the late 1960's. Similarly, both GM and Ford had a metallic blue paint in the 1960's (called silver blue by Ford) which would flake off the hood down to the primer.
Virtually all paints used today fade or otherwise become unsightly in relatively short order...industrial or automotive. Some of the chemicals previously used in paints have been virtually outlawed because of the HAZMAT nature either during the manufacturing processes or the application processes.
In our day to day world, how many automobiles of 7 to 10 years of age or older have finishes that have serious problems....way more than 30 years ago. Finishes the were surface oxidized 30 years ago could generally be waxed back to health. The finishes today, have their 'clear coat' worn away and no amount of waxing will restore the finish.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
BaltACD has it right. In the last decade or so, a lot of solvents have been eliminated from paints and adhesives. While this makes for a cleaner overall environment, it also makes for less durable paint finishes, and some downright crappy adhesives.
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
I find the beautiful paint scheme to be incongrous with the bland name... BNSF goes better with flat black. .
Murphy Siding BaltACD has it right. In the last decade or so, a lot of solvents have been eliminated from paints and adhesives. While this makes for a cleaner overall environment, it also makes for less durable paint finishes, and some downright crappy adhesives.
1. The fading of color has more to do with pigments used than solvents.
2. If you have ever seen people inadvertently had neurological damage from some of the more exotic solvents (being used lawfully as part of work) , you would realize that it makes for more than a cleaner environment.
3. What is more important: bright, shiny engines or a safe environment, (if that is a necessary forced choice)?
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
schlimm Murphy Siding: BaltACD has it right. In the last decade or so, a lot of solvents have been eliminated from paints and adhesives. While this makes for a cleaner overall environment, it also makes for less durable paint finishes, and some downright crappy adhesives. 1. The fading of color has more to do with pigments used than solvents. 2. If you have ever seen people inadvertently had neurological damage from some of the more exotic solvents (being used lawfully as part of work) , you would realize that it makes for more than a cleaner environment. 3. What is more important: bright, shiny engines or a safe environment, (if that is a necessary forced choice)?
Murphy Siding: BaltACD has it right. In the last decade or so, a lot of solvents have been eliminated from paints and adhesives. While this makes for a cleaner overall environment, it also makes for less durable paint finishes, and some downright crappy adhesives.
Red & Yellow = Orange.
Red pigments are notorious for quickly fading.
Paints:
I seem to have a different memory of at least my experience of the lasting quality of paints {especially automotive paints}, than some in discussion here.
Example: Honduras {sp?}, maroon on some GM vehicles back several decades, {which I really liked}, but had a tendency of fading rather quickly, especially the top surfaces.
Another Example: Traded a decade age car recently and it's clear coat, Pearl White actually still had a deep beautiful gloss to it. Very easy to keep looking that way too...
Quentin
At least they're not turning pink, as the D & H plow in December Trains. Modelcar, not that I have anything against pink...
"Make no little plans; they have no magic to stir men's blood." Daniel Burnham
...........I do have some pink shirts, but otherwise, pink is not on my must have list.
Edit: I really didn't think about it when I wrote the above lines....but look at my Avatar.
My avatar is also troubled... I refuse to type the brand name Amtrak uses. And so I also besiege Mr. Buffet to please buy a vowel? Go for it--Great Western?
I really can not tell the difference between the first two, other than it is clearly not a fresh paint job anymore, but the 3rd really only looks like dust to me.
I mean that "pinkish" fading seems to be on all the locomotives, and seems to be more like dust being kicked up from the "red" ballast. Makes sense that the lead would be get the brunt of the force.
Was it winding that day? Was the ballast freshly dumped?
Doesn't look like dust at all. Look closely.
Quentin:
Remember the Silver (flecked paints) that was pretty in the late 50's thru the 1960's. Looked good when new but went bad after a relatively short time?
Ford's seemd to have a lot of trouble with it and some of their metalic paints as well.
I never get why they paint the trucks silver. They look fine brand new, but give them a day and they look lousy. And it really makes the paint job that much worse. It's a shame because that black swoosh with the black underframe looks totally, like, awesomely sexy.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
coborn35 Doesn't look like dust at all. Look closely.
I am, and it does look like fading I am not disagreeing with that. I just do not think the dust from the ballast should be ruled out. I mean it looks like it could be either one. I mean even the blacks are showing a peach like coloring and considering the red ballast, a peach like dust from the ballast could be the cause.
Maybe it is a combination of both.
samfp1943 Quentin: Remember the Silver (flecked paints) that was pretty in the late 50's thru the 1960's. Looked good when new but went bad after a relatively short time? Ford's seemd to have a lot of trouble with it and some of their metalic paints as well.
Oh, yes...nice looking paints avail. back then, but durability was a problem. Had an all silver Buick {new}, in '83 that had excellent care, and still needed the top redone, several years later.
Ultraviolet light destroys paints. "Silver" (Aluminum flakes) is another color that goes quickly. UV penetrates and reflects off metal flakes within the coating destroying the resin at an accelerated rate.
White provides a more uniform pigmentation and reflects light well. White houses, white utility vehicles, etc. is not simply an artistic statement. It is a statement of practicality.
White does camouflage rust at all. It highlights it.
The 7700s are in captive service, working from Barstow and running trains into the LA Basin from there.
In LA we have oen of the worst grafitti problems in the free world.
I have been told by a number of people that the 7700s (including 7777) are constantly being tagged. When they get back to Barstow, they are cleaned with a solution that removes the grafitti. It is this process that is making these engines fade far, far, far more than any of the other GEVOs on BNSF.
I have no first hand knowledge if this is true... I am just reporting what I have been told.
Charles Freericks
Charles it looks like you were dead on:
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=350581&nseq=1
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