Is This All?

[blownout cylinder]

selector

Moved a hydrangea just an hour ago.  The deer keep stripping it and it won't thrive out in the open, so I had to relocate it into the garden.  Soaker hoses had to be pulled up from their coiled state inside my raised beds because wife loaded the beds up with compost material that must now be dug into the soil.  I also did that today.

No rest for the wicked

You be lucky. We be sittin' here tryin' NOT to be snowed on---ag'in.

The only gardenin' be done aroun' here is scrapin' all the dang leaves off'n the groun'.And I do mean scrapin'. ever't'ing stuck to t'groun' kinda like---

[zardoz]

Boyd

 I'm building a rocket powered machine to travel down the dormant Zephyrs tracks. I have yet to get permission.

If you install a flux capacitor inline just before the plutonium fuel mix, you might be able to travel the line when it was still active. It might help if you use an old DeLorean.

Be sure to bring your camera.

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

to zardoz's. 

Me - I've been busier than normal recently at work (  to that !), plus still getting settled in and springtime activities around the new house (moved in last Oct.) & yard, helping the wife to clean out and arrange for auction of "stuff" and rehab of the in-laws old house for sale in a couple of months that's been eating up the last several wekends, planning daughter's wedding in Sept., planning at least 1 long vacation trip in early summer, and some lengthy book & article reading from some of the threads here, plus catch-up from some long-deferred reading, and a few professional mandatory continuing education seminars, etc.

So let me toss some topic suggestions out here:

Milwaukee Road's Puget Sound/ Pacific Coast Extension ! 

That one used to always provoke an extended (and heated) discussion . . . OK, maybe that's not fair.  Here's a couple more that have come to mind in the past few days:

"Carbon Tax - Will It Have a Disparate Effect Between Coal-Hauling Railroads ?" - not looking to debate the merits of such a tax (that's a political & global warming discussion), but rather:  If such a tax or fee is enacted, which RR's will be harmed, and which will benefit ?  Specifically, if it's on a "per ton" basis, then maybe the eastern mines with their higher BTU coals won't be hurt as much; but if it's on a "per BTU" (= per carbon atom ?) basis, then maybe they'll all be hurt equally ?  Or not ?  Anybody have insight into this ?

"Railroad Executive Compensation - Is It Appropriate ?" - I've just gotten a bunch of annual reports and proxy statements, and of course that kind of thing takes up a lot of pages.  It might be interesting to contrast & compare, and sound off about how we feel about it.

"Strange Rail Sections" thread - kind of like bird-watching, only with rails instead - post anything you've actually seen and identified, with location, in the recent past that's probably still there. 

 "Rail-Trail Recommendations" - now that nice weather is here, which ones have you been on and liked?  Or not ?  and why ?

I've got some ideas for a John Kneiling thread, one on photos of railroad-oriented sculptures - we've got at least 3 here in the Lehigh Valley alone !, and resurrecting the "Knuckle Coupler" thread with some photos I took last year, after I get reacquainted with my Google Picasa account.  Anybody have any others ?

- Paul North.

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

Here's another possible thread topic:  Yesterday's (Weds., April 8, 2009) Wall Street Journal has a page A-1 & A-2 article about how "Cyber Spies Hacked into U.S. Electric Grid" (or similar). 

How vulnerable do we think the U.S. rail system is to such hacks and cyber-attacks ?  I suppose they couldn't hurt 844 and 3985, but what about the modern GEVO units ?  Can the railroads operate over their own networks, completely isolated from the Internet's nonsense ?

- PDN.

[Railway Man]

 Business systems (payroll, accounting, email) are standard.

Train-control systems are not connected to the internet.  Signal logic in the field is all local.  CTC signal and turnout requests are granted only if they conform with local logic.  CTC codes are transmitted on separate telecom links, not via the internet.  Someone would need to gain physical access to those links.  Office servers are all stand-alone; no connections to other systems.

PTC fundamentally will not change this.  It will still require physical access to the telecom links; you can't dial it up from your basement.

RWM

[mudchicken]

zardoz

Boyd

 I'm building a rocket powered machine to travel down the dormant Zephyrs tracks. I have yet to get permission.

If you install a flux capacitor inline just before the plutonium fuel mix, you might be able to travel the line when it was still active. It might help if you use an old DeLorean.

Be sure to bring your camera.

Zardoz, PDN & Boyd: http://www.denverpost.com/businessheadlines/ci_12091957 (you better buy a Delorean before Steve Wynne gets them all 8000+/- of 'em or consider substituting a Bricklin)

As for the Rails/Trails side of the issue...I keep encountering the seedier side of the issue and how irresponsible some (not all) trails people can be. The quack filing by some people in Seattle yesterday regarding the STB has to take the cake.

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

"Asked and answered" competently, thoroughly, and conclusively - I can't even think of a decent follow-up question - by 2 posts in 15 minutes.

It's no wonder Al-in-chgo is noting a lack of threads and post activity !    But I wouldn't advocate ridiculous posts just to string them out.

Thanks for the answer, RWM.  Yes, Virginia, there are advantages to being independent, stand-alone, mostly self-sufficient and self-reliant, and marching to one's own drummer, however unconventional, unpopular, and difficult it may be to continue doing that in today's culture.

- Paul North.

[Murphy Siding]

mudchicken

zardoz

Boyd

 I'm building a rocket powered machine to travel down the dormant Zephyrs tracks. I have yet to get permission.

If you install a flux capacitor inline just before the plutonium fuel mix, you might be able to travel the line when it was still active. It might help if you use an old DeLorean.

Be sure to bring your camera.

Zardoz, PDN & Boyd: http://www.denverpost.com/businessheadlines/ci_12091957 (you better buy a Delorean before Steve Wynne gets them all 8000+/- of 'em or consider substituting a Bricklin)

 

  It appears that fella is building DeLorean dash-2 models.

    I once had a customer that was a candidate for the dumbest man I'd ever met.  He purchased a Delorean, and painted the stainless steel body bright red.

[tree68]

As Carl surmises, I think we're just more or less out of questions and hot news for the moment.  That, and it's spring - people are shaking off their winter doldrums and getting out.  Less time for web surfing, dochaknow!

I'm sure a hot topic will come up before too long and we'll be right back into it.

[Anonymous]

Paul_D_North_Jr

Here's another possible thread topic:  Yesterday's (Weds., April 8, 2009) Wall Street Journal has a page A-1 & A-2 article about how "Cyber Spies Hacked into U.S. Electric Grid" (or similar). 

- PDN.

 

If there is anything to be skeptical about, it is this news that Russia and China have penetrated our power grid by hacking the computer network of the grid.  The story says that they left little bug programs that are sleeping, but can be woken up all at once and shut off our electricity, apparently in coordination with some larger attack, whenever the time is right.  This is a little too spooky by half.  If it were true, do you really think our government would tell us about it?  In the first place, it would be an admission of incompetence—a failure of Homeland Security. 

 

No, this sounds a lot like the need to bailout the financial institutions, or the world economy will collapse by Monday. 

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

Railway Man

 Business systems (payroll, accounting, email) are standard.

Train-control systems are not connected to the internet.  Signal logic in the field is all local.  CTC signal and turnout requests are granted only if they conform with local logic.  CTC codes are transmitted on separate telecom links, not via the internet.  Someone would need to gain physical access to those links.  Office servers are all stand-alone; no connections to other systems.

PTC fundamentally will not change this.  It will still require physical access to the telecom links; you can't dial it up from your basement.

RWM

Got to thinking about this kind of thing a little more over lunch, which led to these follow-up questions:

Another doomsday scenario is an electro-magnetic pulse ("EMP") - as from the detonation of a nuclear weapon high in the atmosphere - that "fries" most electronics and renders their systems impotent.  Does anyone know how vulnerable the railroad systems are to that ?  I presume that signal relays and the like that can survive direct lightning strikes would just shrug it off, as would the electrical drive gear on the locomotives - but what about the control electronics ?  Although, being shielded by all that sheet metal and having to survive in that environment anyway ("If Casey Jones over there hasn't broke it yet, them Rooshians sure aren't going to !"), maybe they too are pretty "hardened" already against that kind of thing ?  Most importantly, communications gear, such as radios and the telecom links for the CTC codes ?

A more likely scenario, though, is a total loss or damage of commercial power and telecom lines over a wide area, such as from ice accumulations (Quebec, NY, and Maine - was it 1998 ?) or hurricane damage (Hugo in the mid-1980s, or pick any of the others).  How would the railroad restore sufficient communications and manage its operations ?  I believe that portable generators were used to recharge the battery backups for grade crossing signals and wayside signals, but those are minor problems in the scenario I'm envisioning.  For instance, what if it was so bad that long-distance phone links were down and the cell phones were out due to tower damage or their back-up generators running out of fuel, etc. ? 

It seems to me that restoring long-distance internal railroad communications would be the key.  Firstly, that would enable the Engineering Dept. people to be able to get out, assess whatever damage there is, coordinate to make repairs, and issue reports of same to the Operating Dept. people so that they can be guided and plan accordingly.  Next, the various division points or equivalent crew dispatch points and key terminals would need to be able to communicate to figure out who is going to run which trains to where and when, and in what priority, and to coordinate crews and locomotives, etc.  In such a worst-case scenario - "dark territory" - I can see starting to run trains again by dispatcher (DS)-issued Track Warrrant Control ("TWC") methods, probably with speeds limited to say 30 or 40 MPH just to be on the safe side.  The radios on the locos should be self-contained and powerful enough for many purposes (with maybe only some repeaters being needed ?), so the train crews could "OS" ("On Sheet") or report their locations as they go by each Control Point so that the DS everyone nearby would know where they are and going.  Yard staffs could re-learn pencil and paper recording of reporting marks and switch lists - tough, but not impossible.  Probably a few "stations" at key CPs or junctions would be manned most hours to facilitate operations there.

Any thoughts or repsonses to this ?

[zardoz]

Paul_D_North_Jr

  Anybody have any others ?

How about the right of railroaders to bare arms while on duty?

 

Or for that matter, bare legs?

[zardoz]

Paul_D_North_Jr

Railway Man

 Business systems (payroll, accounting, email) are standard.

Train-control systems are not connected to the internet.  Signal logic in the field is all local.  CTC signal and turnout requests are granted only if they conform with local logic.  CTC codes are transmitted on separate telecom links, not via the internet.  Someone would need to gain physical access to those links.  Office servers are all stand-alone; no connections to other systems.

PTC fundamentally will not change this.  It will still require physical access to the telecom links; you can't dial it up from your basement.

RWM

Got to thinking about this kind of thing a little more over lunch, which led to these follow-up questions:

Another doomsday scenario is an electro-magnetic pulse ("EMP") - as from the detonation of a nuclear weapon high in the atmosphere - that "fries" most electronics and renders their systems impotent.  Does anyone know how vulnerable the railroad systems are to that ? 

Any thoughts or repsonses to this ?

My only thought is that if an EMP is triggered, we will have lots more to worry about other than railroad operations.  Every automobile and truck with a computer, every airplane, etc. will all be fried.  Our economy would likely collapse to the point where it might never recover.  If it happened during the day, the majority of the population would be stranded at their jobs many miles from home.

From the Federation of American Scientists: http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/nuke/emp.htm

And it is incredibly easy to get the plans to build one: http://www.amazing1.com/emp.htm

 

[Mookie]

zardoz

Paul_D_North_Jr

  Anybody have any others ?

How about the right of railroaders to bare arms while on duty?

 

Or for that matter, bare legs?

I would probably get a bigger thrill out of this than would most of you.....

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

- Point to Mookie !  (one advantage of being one of the few females here, I suppose)

Try this:  Line up a bunch of he-man guys, and have them roll up both their sleeves.

The ones with tanned left arms are truck drivers ( I forgot the "technical" name for that, though).

The ones with the tanned right arms are locomotive engineers.

The ones with both arms tanned are the MOW guys !

- Paul North.

[Paul_D_North_Jr]

zardoz

Paul_D_North_Jr

Railway Man

 Business systems (payroll, accounting, email) are standard.

Train-control systems are not connected to the internet.  Signal logic in the field is all local.  CTC signal and turnout requests are granted only if they conform with local logic.  CTC codes are transmitted on separate telecom links, not via the internet.  Someone would need to gain physical access to those links.  Office servers are all stand-alone; no connections to other systems.

PTC fundamentally will not change this.  It will still require physical access to the telecom links; you can't dial it up from your basement.

RWM

Got to thinking about this kind of thing a little more over lunch, which led to these follow-up questions:

Another doomsday scenario is an electro-magnetic pulse ("EMP") - as from the detonation of a nuclear weapon high in the atmosphere - that "fries" most electronics and renders their systems impotent.  Does anyone know how vulnerable the railroad systems are to that ? 

Any thoughts or repsonses to this ?

My only thought is that if an EMP is triggered, we will have lots more to worry about other than railroad operations.  Every automobile and truck with a computer, every airplane, etc. will all be fried.  Our economy would likely collapse to the point where it might never recover.  If it happened during the day, the majority of the population would be stranded at their jobs many miles from home.

From the Federation of American Scientists: http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/nuke/emp.htm

And it is incredibly easy to get the plans to build one: http://www.amazing1.com/emp.htm

Made my day, man.    But yeah, that's what I was thinking of.  However, here's an excerpt from the webpage at the 2nd link (emphasis added):

"Research is currently being undertaken to disable vehicles thus avoiding dangerous high speed chases. The trick is to generate a high enough power pulse to fry the electronic control processor modules. This could be a lot simpler if the vehicle was covered in plastic or fiber glass rather than metal. The shielding of the metal body offers a challenge to the researcher to develop a practical system. A system could be built that could do this but would be costly, large and produce collateral damage to friendly targets."

So, the electronic gear in the locomotive cabs might be safe enough - the roof and side of the cab, plus maybe the top of the electrical cabinet ? (or whatever you call it)

So I might have to walk or ride my bike home.  But I could probably watch some trains on the way.

  Could this be the solution I've been looking for to neutralize those obnoxiously loud bass-thumping cars that cruise down my street at all hours ?  Hide behind a bush and zap them into silence, or better yet, immobilize their pretty toy ?  A triumph of knowledge and sophistication over crude displays of noise ?  Oh, joy !  Thanks !

[Murphy Siding]

Paul_D_North_Jr

  Could this be the solution I've been looking for to neutralize those obnoxiously loud bass-thumping cars that cruise down my street at all hours ?  Hide behind a bush and zap them into silence, or better yet, immobilize their pretty toy ?  A triumph of knowledge and sophistication over crude displays of noise ?  Oh, joy !  Thanks !

  Sign me up for 2 of those please.

    Mr Sulu- set your phaser to *silence*, we're going to go hunting for woofers and tweeters.

[CShaveRR]

Norris, I think I've had a change of heart on this one...perhaps. A few months ago we had to replace the radio in our car, and this new one will blow you away. I don't crank up the volume (too much) or the bass, but you can feel the bass drum, as you should at a live concert. On my way home today, I was listening to The Planets, by Gustav Holst. Very interesting to hear the bass drum and organ pedal on this radio! Still, I'll join the hunt for extraordinary woofers and tweeters, whose sole purpose is to cause earthquake-like effects over entire neighborhoods. Pile drivers have the same effect, but are more productive.

[blhanel]

Murphy Siding

Paul_D_North_Jr

  Could this be the solution I've been looking for to neutralize those obnoxiously loud bass-thumping cars that cruise down my street at all hours ?  Hide behind a bush and zap them into silence, or better yet, immobilize their pretty toy ?  A triumph of knowledge and sophistication over crude displays of noise ?  Oh, joy !  Thanks !

  Sign me up for 2 of those please.

    Mr Sulu- set your phaser to *silence*, we're going to go hunting for woofers and tweeters.

I've long had a desire to obtain such a device as well- the problem with coming up with such a device is designing it to target only the power amplifiers in the offending vehicle's audio system (I want them to be able to drive away after their boom box is toast, and not realize that they were intentionally zapped).

[ChuckCobleigh]

Mookie

zardoz

Paul_D_North_Jr

  Anybody have any others ?

How about the right of railroaders to bare arms while on duty?

 

Or for that matter, bare legs?

I would probably get a bigger thrill out of this than would most of you.....

Whereas others of us might have a hard time nodding off tonight worried that the images zardoz's comment inspires might provoke nightmares!

[Mookie]

Speaking of images....

Maybe Amtrak should give some thought to running a long distance "Ladies Train" occasionally.  A little eye candy serving drinks or just strolling through - and Wow!  Start building your own tracks, Amtrak!     

[zardoz]

Murphy Siding

Paul_D_North_Jr

  Could this be the solution I've been looking for to neutralize those obnoxiously loud bass-thumping cars that cruise down my street at all hours ?  Hide behind a bush and zap them into silence, or better yet, immobilize their pretty toy ?  A triumph of knowledge and sophistication over crude displays of noise ?  Oh, joy !  Thanks !

  Sign me up for 2 of those please.

    Mr Sulu- set your phaser to *silence*, we're going to go hunting for woofers and tweeters.

[Steam Is King]

Mookie

Maybe Amtrak should give some thought to running a long distance "Ladies Train" occasionally.

Ms. Mookie -

I like that idea. They used to have a Ladies Day El, but that was specific to baseball games.

I remember when gum magnate Bill Wrigley used to have Ladies Day every Tuesday when the Cubs were home. Any and all ladies were admitted to the Cubs game for free, grandstand seats! It was in an era (pre-1966 I think) when they had trouble filling the ballpark.

Juicy Fruit Bill figured the ladies otherwise wouldn't come, but if they got in free they'd spend money to buy eats and drinks and also attract single/cheating men to the park, who had to buy a ticket. Prices in those days $3.50 box seat, $1.50 grandstand, $1 upper deck if open and 50 cents in the bleachers. Now bleacher seats go for around $50. My math stinks, but isn't that a 5000 percent difference?  

Now try to get a ticket to any game. Better chance of being invited to the White House.

Chico  

[videomaker]

Thanks, Paul.  Now it makes a lot more sense to me!  -  al

Yeah, it dose..And I worked as a surveyor yrs ago too,I should have known al those abbrevations...

[WSOR 3801]

 

Paul_D_North_Jr

  Could this be the solution I've been looking for to neutralize those obnoxiously loud bass-thumping cars that cruise down my street at all hours ?  Hide behind a bush and zap them into silence, or better yet, immobilize their pretty toy ?  A triumph of knowledge and sophistication over crude displays of noise ?  Oh, joy !  Thanks !

A CB radio with a little bit of help (about 1000 watts or more) can take care of a number of problems...  Just hope your vehicle isn't affected by it.  Vehicles are tested in areas of high RF concentrations, so newer ones may be less affected.