KP LOL
I will requisition the space suits and all the necessary junk food and we can start planning our trip. Funny!
Shoot, no don't do that. We don't need another international incident. All the hype and news about the mars land rover. Pasadena could film documentaries of what's going on on mars via the desert scape around Victorville. True.
Incidentally the road you referred to as having no beginning and no end is where I taught my daughter how to drive. It is a circuitous road which was perfect for learning to slow, brake and steer. It connects with the Hesperia road just west of the last visible curve. I've had heart trouble ever since. COL
From what I can tell as per BNSF's submission earlier, the plans for four lane road have changed dramatically. Do I dare say not a good traffic plan. Time to duck and run.
RickH
BarstowRick.com Model Railroading How To's
K.P.:
All this discussion about a new road and bridge to Apple Valley has been very interesting. So much so that I e-mailed a friend in Victorville who previously had a detailed blog about the Ranchero Road underpass construction, hoping to get some insights from him.
He reports that construction on new bridge over the Mojave River has started, and that, even today, work had been done on driving pillings for the bridge's foundation. He says that the west end of the bridge is very near to his Spring Valley Lake development.
My friend is familiar with this thread and may be able to provide photos to the forum, if anyone is interested.
John
Found this link with some "live" cameras on the project.
http://trafficcctv.com/YuccaLoma.html
Other cameras..
http://trafficcctv.com/
Thanks for the links to the camera views and yes any pictures welcomed.
Look out KP, you might be in for some competition. Mars, still chuckling out loud.
Update as of Friday, August 15, 2014
A Wide Review from Ontario …
… to the City of Industry, CA
Part “A” (of A-H, Overall A-Q)
The Harmony Theory
The Diversion
Pomona Area
This group (Parts A-H) will review some odd things related to the Pomona Diversion, and make the forum aware of what is physically in the area, things that may give us some insight about the future.
Concerning the “Diversion” the NOW not-in-service-yet signal bridges after many, many months of being erected in Pomona …
Above, looking west from downtown Pomona (June 8, 2009)
Above, the east side westbound signals by Humane Way (the west side has a signal bridge too for eastbound movements) (May 13, 2009)
Above, westward from Temple Ave. on the far western side of Pomona (June 3, 2009)
... and also the seeming proliferation of spring frog switches (as opposed to the moveable point frog type) at the future CP AL514 HAMILTON …
Above, February 13, 2010 photo
… has long baffled observers and readers of this thread.
In THIS thread, those tracks and future tracks have been identified south to north (left to right) as “A” to “D.”
Continued in Part B
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- K.P.’s absolute “theorem” from early, early childhood that he has seen over and over and over again: Those that CAUSE a problem in the first place will act the most violently if questioned or exposed.
Part “B” (of A-H, Overall A-Q)
Currently, one track in Pomona, through swing-changing of alignments (lower right to center) …
Westward, October 17, 2009 photo
… is the STRAIGHT THROUGH track, so that trains on the Alhambra Sub (SP) Main 1 (lower right) in the EAST (behind the camera) transition automatically to the Los Angeles Sub (LA&SL) Main 1 on the WEST, and vice versa.
Currently too, because of the MOVEABLE POINT FROG SWITCH at CP C031 OAK, ALL trains utilize a seamless route in that transitioning between subdivisions, IF from Main 1 to Main 1 (above photo), or Main 2 to Main 2 (foreground lower left track of above photo) between those subdivisions.
Just as a refresher for those unfamiliar with moveable point frogs, a December 12, 2011 photo is reshown, the switch happens to be at Sunset Route CP SP598 RIMLON in the Lower Desert of Southern California, in the Thousand Palms area.
One way or another, then, presently ALL passing-through trains touch the trackage of one of those two locations (CP C031 OAK or the STRAIGHT track EAST of CP AL513 POMONA).regardless of how they are routed.
How can the lack of moveable point frogs at the FUTURE spring frog oriented CP AL514 HAMILTON be made to make sense? It simply can’t! Something HAS to radically change!
Consider our Diversion “A” Track, which is the squiggly right track below, looking east from Humane Way. (Photo dated May 13, 2009.)
Another view, this one from December 19, 2009:
Continued in Part C
Part “C” (of A-H, Overall A-Q)
The “A” Track (far left) looking west from Temple Ave.:
In the above June 15, 2014 photo, the far left “A” Track ends with just a Maintenance-of-Way switch for the connection
K.P. is inclined to believe that THAT TRACK is an accounting trick, as a railroad contribution to the Diversion, and won’t be used, at least at first.
The “D” Track, the FUTURE northernmost (rightmost) track, which presently is not laid, will go through the CP west of Temple. Ave. and curve to the Alhambra Sub’s original alignment
Previously, the likes of this basic diagraming was illustrated to the forum, as a possible (“possible”) track layout:.
A NEW Diversion concept::
Just as a side note, K.P. has thought in the past that the left, background moveable point frogged switch had been installed in error (above two photos), as it has wood ties while that track otherwise has all concrete ties! The right switch has wood ties too, but that track consists of all wood ties. Because wood ties don’t have the longevity of concrete ties, the wood tied switch was probably (“probably”) install temporarily on the wrong Main to tap its life expectancy, and not rot away in the meantime. When the Diversion tracks finally are all put in order and ready for trains, that wood tied switch likely will be reinstalled over on the wood tied track just to the north (right).
In the above diagram, the SOUTH side “A” Track is unconnected and NOT used.
Basically, on the above diagram right (if it works out that way), trains on Tracks “C” and “D” (Alhambra Sub) SEEMLESSLY (through moveable point frogs) transition to the Los Angeles Sub (Tracks “B” and “C” of the diagram left (WHEN those switchers are obviously in reverse).
The unconnected “A” Track on this west end is also unconnected on the east end, by the present CP C030 ROSELAWN area, which CP will be eliminated. Longtime thread readers may remember this May 10, 2009 Diversion eastbound looking photo at dawn of that background CP, from the then (“then”) accessible Highway 71 overpass and sidewalks for pedestrians.
In the downtown Pomona area, likely the following layout will surface:
Remember, Main B cannot go eastward from the above CP AL514 HAMILTON past Towne Ave. because of the lack of bridging for it.
LA&SL Main A on the right becomes Main B on the left (the A to B note above), the PRESENT alignment by default, because the Main A (on the left) will NOT be used (at first).
Continued in Part D
Part “D” (of A-H, Overall A-Q)
SOMETIME IN THE FUTURE, Main A (that currently ends WEST of Temple Ave., at the western END of the Diversion) likely will be laid west, on the SOUTH (left) side, past Grand Avenue …
… so that there would be THREE tracks.
In the above December 11, 2009 photo with an eastbound UP crossing over, it is unknown if that CP C026 GRAND (M.P. 26.2) will survive. Probably at first, but its long term future is questionable.
Interestingly, the installed switches at the CP west of Temple Ave. seem to be at the west end of the CP, allowing a counterpart pair of crossovers to be installed at the east end. Perhaps (“perhaps”) it will eventually look as such:
But, that may be way off.
Likely, that Main A west of Temple Ave. will NOT have absolute CP signals, only intermediates. The signals for Mains B to D will be absolutes.
West of the above pictured crossing over train at CP C026 GRAND, is a humungously wide track right-of-way underpass overhead bridging.
RIGHT ON TOP of that underpass bridge is where the two LA&SL mains jog in an alignment shift! That jog is seen in this 2009 westward photo shot from the Grand Ave. overpass:
The underpass can be discerned by whitish side ground markers in that angling area.
THAT JOG over an underpass might be the site of a reported future FLYOVER! So, our Main A could flyover Mains B and C (now regularly identified and Mains 1 and 2, north to south), and in that flying over we will change Main A’s identify to Main Z for its north side alignment.
Continued in Part E
Part “E” (of A-H, Overall A-Q)
In the last photo in Part D, a curving to the right is seen. Around that curve is a Metrolink commuter stop!
That above train is westbound, moving away from the camera.
An eastbound view and some of the stop’s covered seating.
Above, look at all the beautiful parking lot trees on the photo left.
But, the beautiful commuter stop’s platform may be on borrowed time! Why?
We have to go DOWN to get more perception! Sidewalk ramps have the fun look that might appeal to children!
Continued in Part F
Part “F” (of A-H, Overall A-Q)
Another look, southward though.
Did you notice at the above photo’s top bridge center support pillars that they include supports for a third track?
A focused look:
Did you notice towards the right the greenery escapes covering a concrete area, an area that would hold up a bridge section for a third track?
The east indented concrete-work for a third track bridging.
From underneath:
Continued in Part G
Part “G” (of A-H, Overall A-Q)
From the roadway sidewalk, looking back at the back and forth sidewalk for coming down from or going up to the Metrolink stop.
At the current platform, looking westbound, while it is difficult to see, the underpass west indentation for another track’s bridge is seen:
That west indentation is also visible on the top double-stack photo in Part E.
How far west a third-track (our north side Main Z now) would go is anyone’s guess, but the fact that Brea Canyon Rd. has the underpass preparation for a third-track puts an element of certainty to the situation, especially since UP has laid the “A” Track in the Diversion.
By that big bridging where the alignment shifts are at, ALL three tracks could (“could”) just go straight, but if they did, Metrolinks would have to go from Main C to Main A in the CP, and tie up three tracks. Sounds rather impractical! But, a flyover is very practical.
Continued in Part H
Part “H” (of A-H, Overall A-Q)
The Diversion AND EAST
At Humane Way the west side eastbound signal bridge and signal heads thereon have long dumbfounded observers. While all the west side eastbound signals are capable of displaying yellow over green, the KEY for this discussion are the TOP heads for Mains B and D. Below, looking west, from left to right, are heads for Mains A through D.
October 17, 2009 photo
All those TOP heads are capable of displaying GREEN over dark (dark except possible the heads over the “A” Track on the left.). In other words, ALL tracks will eventually go STRAIGHT THROUGH POMONA! But, there is NO bridging for a fourth track at the Towne Ave. underpass.
August 24, 2009 photo
Even if there was, a conflict situation would arise because the Pomona Metrolink stop is on the SOUITH side, but station stops to the east are NORTH side stops. K.P. in the past has suggested side-by-side flyovers in the east downtown Pomona area. He still thinks the flyover concept is the answer, but in light of the new information about west of Grand Ave. and the Diversion west of Temple Ave., K.P. offers a modified flyover arrangement that would kind of solve everything, a single flyover by Towne Ave. that would take Main D over to LA&SL Main 2, with LA&SL Main 1 alignment shifting to become Main A.
Such may be years off, but since the west side eastbound B signal (at Humane Way) has a top green bulb, something will have to give somewhere, and Towne Ave. will eventually have to have some kind of added bridging over it, an east flyover seems most practical. Since Metrolink would be the one entity to benefit most, undoubtedly it would pay for an EAST flyover, as well as a WEST flyover
--------
Parts I-Q are about news spots at and between the PHIMF facility and Ontario, and will be presented Saturday, August 23, 2014 before noon, but could be posted up to 12 hour yearly.
Too Much Space Travel at the Speed of Light …
The series “Update as of Friday, August 15, 2014 -- A Wide Review from Ontario to the City of Industry, CA,” Parts I-Q (9 parts), was incorrectly post-scheduled for Saturday. It will be posted before noon FRIDAY, August 22, 2014, but could be posted up to 12 hour early.
Curve-backing a construction cement truck over the LA&SL tracks at Workman Mill Rd. in the City of Industry, CA
“August 15” was also incorrectly posted as July 14, but has since been edit-corrected.
They say traveling at the speed of light warps time. I guess so …Hey, BarstowRick, did you experience that time warping too? (Hehehe.)
KP,
Yes Sir, a real time warp as all of a sudden my youth is behind me and I have no way back to it. Just one of those warp speed situations that hurls you ever closer to ...well...old age. LOL
Hey, thanks for all the updates and speculation. Funny, I would agree with. In other words you are reading the tell tales the same way I am.
Part “I” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
Workman Mill Rd. and the PHIMF
City of Industry
Related to the Puente Hills Intermodal Facility (PHIMF) and its future trash hauling trains, the crude walling has a couple of sections replaced with the final, decorative walling.
Looking eastbound, the old ballast seems to have been cleared away considerably, but there is no evidence that Main 1 will soon be re-laid or moved over.
Looking westbound:
Continued in Part J
Part “J” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
It is unknown if this is a sign or not, but water trucks were now constantly watering the area.
The lowering cement driveway has a fence and a sign now too.
Continued in Part K
Part “K” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
At the Workman Mill Rd. grade crossing, there is a roadway paralleling the tracks that follows the tracks to the 60 Freeway area, where construction is continuing there. Trucks turn around ON THE TRACKS (halfway spooking K.P.) and back down the rail paralleling dirt road
Most Sunset Route trains through New Mexico and Arizona transition to or from the LA&SL now and pass this (above) grade crossing.
A final westbound look with the curving tracks in view. The left track is the new Main 2, between the tracks is the old Main 2 alignment, and the right track the present Main 1.
What looks like cement base parts for a future signal bridge is on the above photo’s lower left.
Continued in Part L
Part “L” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
Revisiting the ‘Up and Over’
The ‘Up and Over’ flyover in the City of Industry still is as it has been for the last few years, with un-activated signals and no second track yet.
From California Ave. (M.P. 499.57) looking westbound:
Continued in Part M
Part “M” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
The left track on the lower right through California Ave. was used for the shoofly when the Up and Over was being built.
Remember the shoofly? Both just below photos dated May 14, 2010.
From California Ave. an engineless, parked intermodal was seen
Above, the rising up of the tracks in the background is the bridging over Hacienda Blvd.
Continued in Part N
Part “N” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
CP C036 ONTARIO
Ontario
For the first time K.P. eye witnessed a yellow over yellow for the west eastbound absolute signal at CP C038 ONTARIO.
Continued in Part O
Part “O” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
The Vineyard Ave. Underpass Construction
From Airport Drive that parallels the Sunset Route by Ontario International Airport, the relocated signal (because of the shoofly) is seen amongst much construction equipment.
Rebar supports are now being brough to the site.
Below, if you look real ground, you can see the old mainline and the present shoofly (background).
Continued in Part P
Part “P” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
A northward view of Vineyard Ave.: It rises over the I-10 Freeway in the background. The near stoplights are at Holt Ave.
Looking south, a great excavation work is seen, where Vineyard Ave. and the future cross Airport Ave. are being dug down.
Continued in Part Q
Part “Q” (of I-Q, Overall A-Q)
The future Airport Drive looking east:
Looking west:
Buried, vertical I-beams are present for an unknown purpose.
A lot of things were covered in this free day. Hopefully, the forum has found something enlightening, and the awareness of what is going on with the Sunset Route was satisfying.
This will conclude the series.
Did K.P. on his recent AZ trip (or has anyone else) noticed any ROW prep in western AZ, indicating the laying of a second main at some future date? Also, I believe eolesen had indicated some time ago that a trip in that area might be possible. So, anybody?
diningcarThe BNSF transcon has been double track with CTC for many-many years. Don't understand your question.
Thanks, cacole. As they say, you took the words right out of my mouth. Actually, I did attempt to reply to diningcar earlier tonight, but I used my tablet instead of my PC and apparently it didn't "take". Some learning to do, apparently. After 35+ years in the IT biz, you would think... Anyway, to be clear I was referring specifically to the track from Estrella to the Yuma area.
Pete
Update as of Friday, August 22, 2014
Part I (of I-III)
The BNSF Trusses
The Grand Terrace, CA General Area
Eastbound Union Pacific C44AC (AC4400) 6821 (physically traveling northward) on the alternate Sunset Route over the BNSF section approaches the new truss bridges over the I-215 Freeway in the Grand Terrace area, and the new cement-work …
… and goes through the present Main 1 truss sections.
A closer view of the three south side cement abutments:
Continued in Part II
Part II (of I-III)
An even closer look:
There are definitely THREE new, additional concrete and rebar supports in the freeway’s center:
Continued in Part III
Part III (of I-III)
The Trusses TO the Sunset Route
Colton, CA
After partially transitioning in Colton (by the Colton Flyover) from the BNSF tracks to the UP Sunset Route (via the Mt. Vernon Connector) to head east …
… the train stops to make a crew change, just west of CP SP540 MT VERNON.
That particular train got to the relief point ahead of the relief crew, and waited. The relief crew showed up several minutes later. And K.P. took off …
K.P. is currently seeing plenty of Sunset Route trains transitioning to or from the LA&SL (via the BNSF and those truss bridges). That may or may not change when the Sunset Route between Fontana and Ontario is two-tracked
This will conclude the brief series. However, some replies follow.
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