The Times coverage of this has been very fair, in my opinion.
Today there is a front page article which discusses a bypass route thru daRegion which would use the old Michigan Central route. The problem is it would require massive $$$ to get this up and running. There have been discussions in the past about this routing, but the funding hasnt been made available.
I am not sure what route it is, but this might be the motivating factor to get this moving.
I am not defending the woman here, what I think she did was idiotic and stupid. The railroad situation in East Chicago, Whiting, and Hammond leaves a lot to be desired. Many trains passing thru the area are travelling at slow speeds. That causes considerable waiting at grade crossings. Often the trains are stopped and the gates are down or flashers operating (this happened to me this week in EC).
This event could have and should have been avoided with the use of common sense. She deliberately endangered her kids (and killed two). She will be forever punished, if she has a soul...
ed
wabash1 wrote: What everyone has not even thought about is her racing thru a parking lot. Its been mentioned but in reality what if a child was riding a bike watching a train or trains skate boarders very real possibilities, she could have easily killed them if they was there....
What everyone has not even thought about is her racing thru a parking lot. Its been mentioned but in reality what if a child was riding a bike watching a train or trains skate boarders very real possibilities, she could have easily killed them if they was there....
I mentioned she was skyrocketing across the lot, the same thought crossed my mind as well, I also wonder how many stop signs/red lights/etc had been blown thru in the past before this...lot of bad driving habits are suggested by the vid.
Have fun with your trains
Wow..... I just watched the video of the origanal subject. Very disturbing.
I would hate to be that train crew!
What everyone has not even thought about is her racing thru a parking lot. Its been mentioned but in reality what if a child was riding a bike watching a train or trains skate boarders very real possibilities, she could have easily killed them if they was there. this woman killed her kids Manslaughter at the least is what i would suggest the states attourney to charge her with, one person ask how we train service crews deal with it. simple life goes on. after several months of no sleep or very iratic sleep, you start falling back into your old pattern, but you are never the same,
Poppa_Zit wrote: BaltACD wrote: vsmith wrote: Proof positive that most people cannot see something even when its almost directly infront of them...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtVkJ60-bwc&mode=related&search=*edit* Just to show yet another form of idiot behind the wheelIdiot yes! However, I don't think I have ever seen a more dangerous arrangement of a gas station (and convenience store?) with relation to a railroad and a relatively busy road. There appears to be no space between the tracks and the parallel roadway for a car to stop to observe highway traffic without being stopped on the tracks.My guess is it's a lead to an industrial siding and that was a switch crew -- not a main line.
BaltACD wrote: vsmith wrote: Proof positive that most people cannot see something even when its almost directly infront of them...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtVkJ60-bwc&mode=related&search=*edit* Just to show yet another form of idiot behind the wheelIdiot yes! However, I don't think I have ever seen a more dangerous arrangement of a gas station (and convenience store?) with relation to a railroad and a relatively busy road. There appears to be no space between the tracks and the parallel roadway for a car to stop to observe highway traffic without being stopped on the tracks.
vsmith wrote: Proof positive that most people cannot see something even when its almost directly infront of them...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtVkJ60-bwc&mode=related&search=*edit* Just to show yet another form of idiot behind the wheel
Proof positive that most people cannot see something even when its almost directly infront of them...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtVkJ60-bwc&mode=related&search=
*edit* Just to show yet another form of idiot behind the wheel
My guess is it's a lead to an industrial siding and that was a switch crew -- not a main line.
Thats what it looked like to me, but it also looks like theres a very clear field of vision on both approaches before you cross the track, and the train wasnt going that fast, the guy just didnt look both ways before crossing onto the track. Also notice that the stop sign is on the station side, in front of the track, which at least here in LA means you stop before the stop sign, which would have left him in the clear when the train approached.
Lets face it, a frieght train, any freight train, is a very large object so unless he was legally blind, I dont see how he could have missed seeing a moving object that big when it was less than 20 feet away. What if it was a semi-truck backing out of the first stall in the station? He's clearly at fault, I'm sure the driver told the insurance agent that the train just fell out of the sky and hit him, I can only hope he had a laugh in the guys face when the saw this vid and tore up his claim.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
I read somewhere just last week that Indiana was awarded $16 million for Operation Lifesaver. Looks like they have their work cut out for them.
Funny thing is, how long did it take her to race several blocks to get ahead of the train. It would have been quicker in the long run to wait at the original crossing, as it's obvious that train wasn't stopping, or was it? If she (and others like her) would spend 2 seconds THINKING about the situation, this would have been avoided.
TrainManTy wrote:Wow. That is just sad......... The video, I mean. Kinda funny, as no one got hurt.
Yeah, the vid I posted was funny cause the driver was such a dope!
The vid of the subject accident was just plain criminal as far as I was concerned. It made me extremely angry when I saw it.
If it was up to me, there is no way in Hell I would let this person get away without criminal child endangerment charges being filed. She's guilty of criminal neglect and I have zero sympathy for her sob story. She saw the train, she intentionally had the pedal to the metal, racing at high speed through a parking lot, and intentionally sped across the crossing, even when the lights were flashing, and was so intent on beating the train, she didnt even consider that there might be another train coming from the opposite direction. All because she didnt want to spend a couple minutes waiting for the train to clear, well now she can just sit and stew about what her impatience cost her....Just plain stupid.
PS read the comments posted with that vid, one local resident points out that its pretty obvious she got blocked at a crossing by the train and decided to cut across the minimall lot and beat the train at the next crossing, and its pretty clear you can see the second train plainly when shes approaching the second crossing, and that she still floored it thru the crossing, so she she wasnt trying to beat one train, she was trying to beat BOTH trains, and she got creamed for her efforts.
This story will soon find its way to the morning TV network news. I will be very interested to see how Diane Sawyer frames it. I would not be surprised if she interviews one of the local residents about how dangerous the crossing was, and does not even mention the race to beat the train.
It was just covered on the local news, which said the woman was hit while driving around the barricade. Then they pointed out that the crossing had lights, but no gate. There was no mention of the race through the parking lot or the video that caught it.
cordon wrote: There appears to be some kind of bumper on the eastbound train, unlike a normal pilot or snowplow. Perhaps an attempt to reduce damage in this kind of accident?
There appears to be some kind of bumper on the eastbound train, unlike a normal pilot or snowplow. Perhaps an attempt to reduce damage in this kind of accident?
My .
It appears to me that the car goes into a skid upon entering the parking lot and again just as it makes the hook turn towards the tracks. I find that amazing.
jclass wrote:How do you guys in train service handle the stress of facing all this arrogance/thoughtlessness behind the wheel every trip? You must have ice water in your veins. Thoughts and prayers for you.
Good evening, all...
This unfortunate incident is all too common at the Johnson Ave. and the Hohman Ave. crossings. That particular NICTD/South Shore parking lot is my home station and idiots zoom up and down that lot to beat the CSX trains ALL the time. I've watched them while standing on the platform waiting for the train.
Actually, the only way gates could have prevented this particular accident is if the gates fully blocked Johnson Avenue. A better solution is a full grade separation, but that's cost-prohibitive to CSX, NICTD, the City of Hammond and INDOT.
Honestly, I'm not even sure aggressive Operation Livesaver prevention notices and billboards would do any good, as that's not the first time time someone tried beating the CSX trains at those 2 crossings...you'd think people would learn.
The bottom line is: obey RR crossing signals and don't race trains and you'll stay alive (alas I'm preaching to the choir here at this forum).
Brian
Having been a parent... the first thing I thought of when I saw the car speeding through the parking lot was that one of the children was either sick or in need of the bathroom.
I also think the video is just a wee bit faster than "real time", though that could just be the result of the extremely low frame rate of the surveilance cameras.
And, yes, I do believe that if she lives herself, she will have to live with the memory of what happened. She may not, though, remember the "WHY" as short-term memory was probably not transfered to long-term memory due to the accident. She may never know why.
My heart breaks for her, regardless of stupidity or not.
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
People never seem to learn....
Never...
She killed two of her children... I hope she can live with that.....
TimChgo9 wrote: What does that make for the Chicago/Northwest Indiana area for the last two weeks? 4 rail-related fatalities now? (Crystal Lake, LaGrange, and now Hammond)
I am pretty sure that in junior high, I sat next to the girl that killed herself in Crystal Lake a week ago. I'm still in shock. Have yet to go digging through my boxes to find the yearbook.
In spite of a "shoulda been gates" statement from an area resident (different from the one PZ posted), Channel 5 here mentioned that NICTD released the footage in the hopes that it would get exposure and prevent other grade-crossing/beat-the-train tragedies (it was NICTD's parking lot--the South Shore trackage is off to the left, parallel to CSX's tracks here).
I suspect that this will rule out any in-car-distraction argument.
Carl
Railroader Emeritus (practiced railroading for 46 years--and in 2010 I finally got it right!)
CAACSCOCOM--I don't want to behave improperly, so I just won't behave at all. (SM)
CShaveRR wrote: That could go either way, PZ. The first thing the video suggested to me is that this woman has done this before--she knew how to use a parking lot (not a street) to get ahead of the train. So, had there been gates, she would have either (1) realized that she'd have to maneuver around the gates or break through them to get around the train, and attempted to do that, or (2) come to the realization somewhere that it wasn't worth it. I doubt that she could have gone through the parking lot much faster than she did. I haven't been at those particular crossings since before the station and lot were built, but it appears that she had to swing around some sort of obstruction to get onto the street. Had she just gone straight over the curb and hung a hard right, she might have made it. She traded a little bump for a tragically big one.I agree with anyone who points out this woman's determination to save a few minutes by beating the train, and all of the other "attributes" associated with that determination.
That could go either way, PZ. The first thing the video suggested to me is that this woman has done this before--she knew how to use a parking lot (not a street) to get ahead of the train. So, had there been gates, she would have either (1) realized that she'd have to maneuver around the gates or break through them to get around the train, and attempted to do that, or (2) come to the realization somewhere that it wasn't worth it.
I doubt that she could have gone through the parking lot much faster than she did. I haven't been at those particular crossings since before the station and lot were built, but it appears that she had to swing around some sort of obstruction to get onto the street. Had she just gone straight over the curb and hung a hard right, she might have made it. She traded a little bump for a tragically big one.
I agree with anyone who points out this woman's determination to save a few minutes by beating the train, and all of the other "attributes" associated with that determination.
Someone should ask her: "What destination/appointment was so important that you did this, risking the lives of your innocent children?"
And yet again, STUPID DOES AS STUPID IS!
n012944 wrote:Well word around the campfire is that the family has already hired an lawyer and is looking into taking CSX to court. One can only hope that once this video is seen the judge not only throws out the case, but makes the family pay all legal fees. If I had my way it would be CSX that would be taking the family to court.
I am thinking that an out of court settlement is on the way.......
An "expensive model collector"
I've often thought the Videos would be educational if they were gory.
A dose of the aftermath of stupidity would leave an indelible mark.
UPDATE: This is where these stories get maddening. The woman's neighbors are still insisting if there were gates present she never would have tried to get across in the first place -- with the implication that then, the kids would not have died. Not one word about her responsibility to her children, though.
She raced the train parallel for a long distance before cutting in front of it, just like in the old movies.
Especially stupid: the neighborhood woman interviewed at 1:15 of this report:
http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=local&id=4822485
Click to start or on some browsers click "Video shows driver racing to beat train" Note: video is not gory.
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