Transport Canada Alleges Insufficient Handbrakes Set As Basis For Obtaining Search Warrant Of MM&A

[Anonymous]

edblysard

• In the largest perspective of the news, at least half the general public believes that the political philosophy of deregulation is wrong because it cuts corners in safety; and they believe that the MM&A wreck proves it.  Happy Labor Day.      

Where did you get the figure of “at least half of the general population” and how in the world do you tie deregulation into anything to do with safety?

Can you cite a source for both figures and the statement?

Deregulation had nothing to do whatsoever with crew size, it dealt with the ability to set competitive prices.

Ed,

Further developing my earlier reply to your comments about deregulation, here is an article that sums up the viewpoint of many Canadians regarding the MM&A wreck.  As I mentioned in my earlier reply this seems to be the view of about half of Canada.  I don’t have the numbers, but it strikes me as a very fundamental tug of war between the free market and regulation; and typically tugs of war end up with half on one side and half on the other side.  We are having the same tug of war in the U.S. (In my opinion).  Note that the issue of deregulation is being applied to crew size as well as many other issues, and not just referring to rate regulation.  In fact, I would say that this current blaming of deregulation in Canada has nothing to do with rates.  It is all about health and safety:

http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/maude-barlow/lac-megantic_b_3660794.html

From the article:

A collision of water, oil, and transport deregulation in Lac-Mégantic

How easy it would be to lay the blame for the tragedy in Lac-Mégantic on the engineer who ran the train. But the real responsibility lies with the governments on both sides of the border who have deregulated their transport sectors, gutted freshwater protections and promoted the spectacular growth and transport of new and unsustainable fossil fuels.

Starting back in the 1970s, the US government deregulated rail transport, allowing deep staff reductions, the removal of brakemen from trains and lower safety standards for shipping hazardous materials. Canadian governments followed suit and allowed the railways to self-regulate safety standards and continue to ship oil in the older, accident-prone tanker cars of the kind that crashed into Lac-Mégantic.

Just last year, Transport Canada gave Montreal, Maine and Atlantic Railways the green light to run each train with just one engineer, which explains how one man came to be in charge of 72 cars and five locomotives carrying combustible energy through inhabited communities.

The Harper government, meanwhile, has gutted environmental regulation and freshwater protection in order to speed up the development of the Alberta tar sands.

Its victims include the Fisheries Act, the Navigable Waters Protection Act and the whole environmental assessment process. Ninety-nine percent of all lakes and rivers in Canada, including Lac-Mégantic, are no longer protected from pipelines carrying bitumen or fracked oils near, around or under them.

[daveklepper]

I definitely stand corrected.   It has not been proved that the engineer did not set suffient handbrakes, only that there were too few when the train ran away.  What I should have posted was "If the engineer did not set a sufficient number of handbrakes....."

Even then, the prime responsibility may not be his.   Some, yes, but not the prime responsibility, given that another train was found on a main line with grade without sufficient number of handbrakes according to the applicable rule, although it had not (yet?) run away.   Again, note "may."

I apologize for needing the correction and thank those who pointed out the need.

I think I was actually the first on the forum to point out that there had been two major attempted terrorist attacks on the Canadian railroads that had been foiled by Canadian security people.   For all we know, there may still be an investigation going on in that direction, and of course it would not be made public since secrecy will help the investigation's success.

[Norm48327]

I move this topic be closed until the TSB's final report has been published.

[Anonymous]

Norm48327

I move this topic be closed until the TSB's final report has been published.

 

I second this motion and ask that this topic be closed.

[Anonymous]

daveklepper

I definitely stand corrected.   It has not been proved that the engineer did not set suffient handbrakes, only that there were too few when the train ran away.  What I should have posted was "If the engineer did not set a sufficient number of handbrakes....."

Even then, the prime responsibility may not be his.   Some, yes, but not the prime responsibility, given that another train was found on a main line with grade without sufficient number of handbrakes according to the applicable rule, although it had not (yet?) run away.   Again, note "may."

I apologize for needing the correction and thank those who pointed out the need.

I think I was actually the first on the forum to point out that there had been two major attempted terrorist attacks on the Canadian railroads that had been foiled by Canadian security people.   For all we know, there may still be an investigation going on in that direction, and of course it would not be made public since secrecy will help the investigation's success.

I agree with all of your points.  As I mentioned, I believe that there are five possible causes for the wreck.  One of them is some unknown person(s) releasing the handbrakes after the train was left at Nantes.  I know the authorities have ruled out "terrorism," and maybe they intend that to mean any tampering for any motive.  But if you don't know the cause, how can you rule out a plausible cause? 

I would not conclude that the crew that tied up that second oil train failed to set sufficient handbrakes.  There is no evidence of that unless that train was under 24-hour 100% surveillance. 

The motive to tamper with that train would be as strong or stronger than the motive to tamper with the first train. 

[tree68]

Murray

Norm48327

I move this topic be closed until the TSB's final report has been published.

 

I second this motion and ask that this topic be closed.

I vote in the affirmative.  I would amend the motion to include any future threads on the topic, until the report has been published.

[blownout cylinder]

I'm locking this thread before things get really out of hand...as they have appeared to be.

In the meantime....wait until the report comes out and try to think of other things to discuss....please.