I knew what I was getting into when I bought most of the Wakthers cars with the install-em-yourself grabirons I have. For the most part, the freight cars sit, I work my way through the cabooses I need, and the passengers cars are good enuf to run and not worry about it.
But I think that Walthers should offer these already done. It's not that I don't do my share of time at the end of an #80 drill. I'm a narrowgauger, too, so I'm a vet at that. But I tend to spend most of my #80 time building narrowgauge. I can get plenty of other standard gauge rolling stock with the grabs already on, so that's what I tend to by with my time budget thus affecting my expense budget.
Although my reasons are peculiar for wanting the grabs already on my Walthers stuff, and I understand those who just love to drill away because that means they're better model railroaders than wimps like me, but I think the market is shifting and Walthers will offer more Platinum level RTR rolling stock to meet the demand.
EDIT: I forgot to add...
Is it just my imagination, but is the plastic on Wathers cars harder to drill than some other plastics?
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Heartland Division CBnQ wrote:Recently, Walthers advertised their P-S 64-seat coaches for under $20.00. It was about $17.00 each if I recall correctly. Northern Pacific was one of the roads offered
About two frustrating hours later, I had two broken #80 drill bits
Some tips about this.
First, get a good sewing machine needle, clamped in a pin vise to premark the holes. the holes often have paint in them, and sometimes the pin that is supposed to make the hole is broke in the mold.
I use carbide bits from Micromark. They cost more but cut much better. Now, they are very brittle so you cant put any side pressure on them.
Lubricate the drill with a bar of soap or a tiny drop of real cutting fluid(hardware store).
Good lighting is required, and magnification helps a lot.
For securing the grabs, use Microscale Krystal Klear. It drys slowly so you can adjust the depth and dries clear so if you slop a little it won't show.
I finally gave up trying to install grabs on their passenger cars. I figure, "Okay, just IMAGINE they're there!" In fact, they're so tiny, that the only way I'd know they were there in the first place is by feel!
Bought several of their Rio Grande cabooses when they first came out. Went nuts (and innumerable #80 drills trying to put the grab-irons on, only to find out that the trucks were too widely spaced to clear the steps even on 36" radius. They look kind of attractive on my caboose track, though. As long as they STAY there!
I do have several Walthers SP cabooses, though, and I bought the "Platinum" line, with the grabs pre-installed. They are really beautiful, and they run very nicely. Worth the extra money IMO just to ease the frustration level. Now if Walthers would charge an extra $5 or so for their passenger cars and install the little wire devils, I'd be a happy camper, even if I CAN barely see them, LOL!
Walthers says that their cars are made out of ABS. To me, that stands for "ALMOST BESSEMER STEEL". BRASS is easier to drill through, for cryin' out loud!
Tom
Tom View my layout photos! http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm310/TWhite-014/Rio%20Grande%20Yuba%20River%20Sub One can NEVER have too many Articulateds!
Over time and against my better judgement, I bought a number of Walthers cars that needed hand rails and other detail items. After usisng up abut a dozen #80 drills, I decided that Walther's cars that require small wire additions or in the case of a caboose, coupla rails should belong to someone else. I traded all of the cars and will not buy more. There are sufficient versions of rolling stock on the market that I can use as is or modify easliy so that I do not need the Walther's cars
Understandable Loathar, but are you satisfied with their appearance?
Don't be discouraged, I've had few problems with my Walthers Budds. Consider purchasing one or two at a discount dealer and checking them out for yourself.
For installing handrails, it's a good procedure to make a paper templates and pre-drill the holes where the hand rails would go once the template's placed or taped onto the body. (Just like the old Walthers F unit "dress up" kits).
Though I have a powered drill, I prefer to use a pin vise. IT TAKES A WHILE but you have to be patient. Modelers with steady hands can start the holes with pin vises, and finish up with a power drill (the smaller the better). It's critical that the pinvise or power drill not be allowed to wobble while cutting into the plastic.
I plan on purchasing quite a few more in SCL, ACL, and Southern. I like them so much because, imho, they are most realistic, plastic corrugated streamliners I've ever seen. A big step up from their ancestors (the Rivorossi streamliners).
Having been on and around the prototye cars durng the Penn Central and Amtrak era, the Walthers cars really bring back a lot of very fond memories.
"I like my Pullman Standards & Budds in Stainless Steel flavors, thank you!"
Garry:
Yep, bought a Frisco caboose from them during their recent sale, and bought a couple of reefers on ebay last year. Just started with the caboose, and I beat you, only broke one #80 drill bit, but, though I have all of the holes drilled, have a grand total of two(2) irons installed. Haven't even started on the reefers yet. I'm sure some of the vets out there are going to call this whining, but I find it a real pain. By the way, installing the grab irons on my Stewart Baldwin switcher a few months ago, though still requiring my Optivisors, I still found quite a bit easier than those staple diameter grab irons with the Walther's cars.
Jim
Yup, been there, still doing it. I have the Walther's CB&Q 4 window wood waycars as well. One has the grabs added, it was a real pain. The other is still waiting for me to get both the gumption and 4 hour block of time to get em installed. They look nice but dang!
Rick
Well, actually, I knew better. It's not like I didn't already have some Walthers cars, and I have struggled before with those tiny little wire grab irons.
However, I just could not pass up a deal. Recently, Walthers advertised their P-S 64-seat coaches for under $20.00. It was about $17.00 each if I recall correctly. Northern Pacific was one of the roads offered, and my ficticous division on the CB&Q operated through trains with either NP or GN. SO. Why not? A bargain is a bargain.
At first, I operated it without the grab irons as is the case with most of my Walthers cars. However, I have a new coach made by Rapido. It has grabs installed AND lighting installed. So I got a lighting kit for the Walthers coach. That way, I thought, the cars might look okay together in a train. Of course, the greens do not match, but no two manufactureres will match NP greens anyhow.
A couple of nights ago, I was inspired to install the grabs and the lighting kit on my walthers coach. Well, as I said, I had causes to know better.
About two frustrating hours later, I had two broken #80 drill bits and about 2/3 of the grabs installed. Crooked. Out of shape. But, installed nonetheless. I omitted the roof grabs thinking I did not want my screw-ups in plain sight.
Well, I didn't want to spend the entire evening with grabs irons, and the hobby was becoming less of a relaxing endeaver. I decided to move on. Time for the lighting kit!
That's when I found out about part number 17. The car has five #17's in the roof which clip the roof to the car sides. Carefully, following directions, I only broke three of the five #17's. The light bar, itself went into the car easily. Before re-installing the roof, I placed the car on a test track. Lights worked fine.
I re-installed the roof and put the car on the test track again. .......rats! ..lights would not work. Somehow, the electrical contacts separated. ....Off with the roof, and ooops!... one more #17 breaks... I worked on the connection some more, and reinstalled the roof. The lights worked.
Okay, now the car number decals. NP numbers are white. Decal paper backing is white. Can't read the numbers. ......why me?....... I cut out one number and installed it on one side. Next, I cut out one number at a time and wet each one until I found the matching number for the other side. ....
So now I operate my two coaches together. You can tell which is the Walthers car. It has some crooked grab irons and a loose roof. The Rapido car does not have those problems Also, the Rapido car includes some neat window blinds, end gates, and marker lamps which can be placed on the last car of a train.
I've installed grabs on 2 of my Walthers cabooses. It was quite a struggle, with them too. I have 4 more Walthers cabooses in their boxes. I wonder now if I'll ever install grab irons on them.
Lately, my friend who is new to model railroading asked for some help. He said he bought a really nice Walther freight car but it need to have #80 holes drilled and grab irons installed. .................... er, well,.......need help with something else, by chance?....he had to ask that question..... just had to ask............
I wonder why Walthers does not install grab irons at the factory. As I said, Rapido does that. P2K locomotves have grab irons installed. So do others. I add the cost for #80 drills and the lighting kit to my $17.00 or so, and I am well on my way to having enough to buy a Rapido car.
Anybody else have a problem with Walthers grab irons?
GARRY
HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR
EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU