IRONROOSTER wrote:But suppose you run cars lettered for someone else's road. As an example, I have all the NMRA's Heritage and Living Legends cars (at least all that were done in S). If I run a G&D boxcar behind my GG1, which I do, am I freelancing?
What about if I model the Ma&Pa and I have a 4-6-0 camelback lettered for the Ma&Pa, even though they never had one?
I am enjoying this thread. Keep on freelancing. You help fulfill the needs of rivet counters. There are a lot of old timers who are frustrated and need someone like you to help them.
rich
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
Right on Paul. You hit the perverbial nail directly "head on"
The "WOBBLY" still liveth, believe me.....................
What ever it is, if you want success - you have to love it.
James:1 Verse:5
R.J.C. from the Great White North
from Saskatchewan, in the Great White North..
We have met the enemy, and he is us............ (Pogo)
IRONROOSTER wrote: It's interesting reading this thread. It appears that many (most?) folks think of free lancing as having your own railroad name. But suppose you run cars lettered for someone else's road. As an example, I have all the NMRA's Heritage and Living Legends cars (at least all that were done in S). If I run a G&D boxcar behind my GG1, which I do, am I freelancing? What about if I model the Ma&Pa and I have a 4-6-0 camelback lettered for the Ma&Pa, even though they never had one?What if some of my buildings are from Bar Mills with a New England look, but I use them in a village on the Southern?How many people are so pure that they never do any of this? Or are we all free lancers?Just curiousPaul
It's interesting reading this thread.
It appears that many (most?) folks think of free lancing as having your own railroad name.
But suppose you run cars lettered for someone else's road. As an example, I have all the NMRA's Heritage and Living Legends cars (at least all that were done in S). If I run a G&D boxcar behind my GG1, which I do, am I freelancing?
What if some of my buildings are from Bar Mills with a New England look, but I use them in a village on the Southern?
How many people are so pure that they never do any of this? Or are we all free lancers?
Just curious
Paul
Paul,If I may.. There are several approaches to the hobby and its up to the modeler to choose his/her own path.
Over the years of observation I have group them as:
Fantasy modeling..This is where anything goes to include a camelback lettered for Ma & Pa or a GG1 lettered for Chessie..
Prototype modeling..This is where a modeler models a given prototype on a generic layout or club layout and not worry if his/her engines are correctly detailed other then minor details such as hood mounted bells and horn type.They model close enough/good enough
Advanced Prototype modeling..This is where the modeler wants 110% accuracy for all locomotives and all freight cars.His/her layout will be a given division, era and year.This is the hardest modeling style because of the strict disciplines needed to model in such fashion..
Freelance..This is where a modeler models a fictitious railroad based on strict disciplines to include area,year,road name,color scheme ect..The thing here is to have a believable freelance railroad.Now a freelance railroad that the owners uses say CSX and CR locomotives this is not a true freelance railroad.It is in truth a paper railroad owned jointly by CSX and CR..Nothing wrong with that approach either..
Free Wheelers..These are the modelers that I enjoy the most..God bless 'em..They have no qualms about running a Big Boy along side of a SD90MAC or a 4-4-0 along side of a GP38-2..
There is no doubt these free wheelers probably have more fun then all other types of modelers put together because they follow no disciplines!
The operating collector..He/she has locomotives from several railroads for a given era and follows no set disciplines other then to collect whatever catches his/her eye..
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
I think we all have a little freelance in us. I model the CB&Q "in the 60's", but I have a steam loco that was scrapped long before that.
Your comments on the buildings are spot on. While there are many folks who scratchbuild and kitbash structures to be very close to the prototype, I would wager most of us have buildings that are "very close" or "a similar type" as stand ins.
I read the post in question and its nothing more than a cheap shot taken from the relative safety of the anonymous internet. It was probably done to stoke the fires of contreversy more than anything else, "lets see if we can get some folks riled up over this one".
Rick
I model a Big Four section of the NYC System in Ohio. It is called the Dayton and Mad River Railroad. It runs from Dayton to Springfield Ohio. The names used are actual place names. The secenery is generally correct for that part of the country. My Terminal in dayton is similar to Lasalle station in Chichago. There are elements from Toledo where I grew up. My rolling stock is predominatly NYC, with motive power NYC also. I do have some equipment lettered in D&MR including engines. They are numbered with NYC series, but none of my D&MR engines have a number of a NYC or its subs. My R_O_W structures are modeled after NYC structures, but did not exist where they are in the real world. Would this be freelanced? I would not build a diesel engine with steam power (stiesel) but I can appreciate the work that went into it. (this is not a personal attack on your work.) I would run it on my layout, which by the way is set up for continous running even though the prototype is not.
My advice would be that you can not please everybody all the time. You are always going to have critics and people you just plain ****-off. The different approaches just get a different set of people critical of your work. You should feel free to model out of bounds all you want. If it were not for the nature of the original post I would not have criticized your stiesel. I think it looks like you put alot of work into your creations, and it is about having fun. With me it is creating pleaslureable feelings about my fictitious facts. You appear to be doing the same thing. Model Railroading is fun, and should be fun for you also. We as a group need to show different facets of modeling, or people will think we are a bunch of nit-picking, got to do it according to some unwritten rules. I have found that is not the case of model railroaders. There are plenty of creative modelers. Model railroaders invented DCC, that was pretty creative. Model Railroaders have come up with standards to make equipment interchangabel between manufactures, model railroaders have even invented American Locomotive Works-ElectroMotive Diesel engines.(Fill in the correct manufactures) Does it have MU capabilities? Have a wonderful day.
Dayton and Mad River RR
pilot wrote:At some point in my life I stopped worrying about what other people think and started concerning myself with what I can do successfully. Works for me, afterall, I'm the one that is going to have to do it.
From the far, far reaches of the wild, wild west I am: rtpoteet
TrainFreak409 wrote:TL, you have a private message from me.
I left a reply Scott. However, if you didn't get it, let me know and I'll try again.
Tracklayer
Scott - Dispatcher, Norfolk Southern
TrainFreak409 wrote:Now...Am I missing something that occured a week ago on the forum. There have been a few mentions of a thread posted by Tracklayer (if I remember correctly after reading everything)...Should I know the story behind that one? I haven't been on the forum in a few weeks...
Yes TrainFreak409. You did miss it. It was a thread entitled WHAT IT TAKES TO BE A MODEL RAILROADER. In it, I stated that in order to be a true model railroader, one should have skills in every aspect of the hobby from being a carpenter, to knowing arts and crafts, wiring, being mechanically inclined so that they could work on their own rolling stock and locos, etc., and several of the members went ballistic on me!... Anyway, Bergie deleted it, and emailed me saying more or less shame on me. I think his concern as always is the possibility of members being driven away by negative threads and replies which might in turn hurt the magazine(s) he works for, and I would never want to do that.
I also included why I wrote it, which was because a totally dysfuctional guy I was trying to help get into the hobby wasn't learning anything, we had words and I gave up on him.
A also added a few of my other talents and things I've done over the years to give the members a better idea of who I was, but that just added fuel to the fire... I think from now on I'm just going to be Tracklayer the model railroader and leave it at that.
tstage wrote: Here we go again. I see this thread going the way of Tracklayer's thread from last weekend. I won't be surprised if this gets into a squabble early on.Tom
Here we go again. I see this thread going the way of Tracklayer's thread from last weekend. I won't be surprised if this gets into a squabble early on.
Tom
Your right Tom. Bergie deleted it too, then sent me a stern little email saying - You shouldn't have to have eight years of college to be a model railroader. It's just a hobby for for crying out loud... I hate to admit it but he was right, I was wrong. Oh well. Live and learn.
If someone wants to get down to it, unless you are working on the real thing it is all a version of freelancing! Not a single prototype loco runs on 12 volts dc with only 1 or 2 motors at most. None of the locos I have ever seen have a plastic, brass, or cast metal body. Let alone DCC and plastic freight cars that don't actually earn their keep. I say let this "brainiac" come to this forum and post using a real name and address and see how quickly he is run off.
As for modeling styles, I prefer my freelance road to anything in the real world. It's my line. I'm the one helping keep the hobby shop in business with my purchases for items that aren't "real". I can build my monster diesels, steamers, electrics, or anything else that seems enjoyable. Oh wait, isn't that the purpose of a hobby; enjoyment? Relaxation. Pleasure. If those aren't the reasons someone is in this hobby, then why is anyone doing it? Huh, I never made the connection. Thanks Mr. Obvious, you're a lifesaver!
In closing, ignore this idiot. Do want you want, I for one enjoy some large, unlikely to be built in the real world motive power, so that's what I have been working on. Good luck, and remember this quote I saw somwhere, "Model Railroading Is Fun!"
Good Luck, Morpar
Don't worry bout it, seeing as he was so proud of his oppinoin, he couldn't even leave he's real name or address [coward].
Freelancers are what this hobby is made of. Even rivet counters have to do some, to make a small area seem to cover a larger than it it is.
Beside I was invested for murder one time. No charges filed, found to be justified self defense.
inch
http://www.trainboard.com/railimages/showgallery.php/cat/500/ppuser/4309
Scott--
Tell you what, my friend. You get the guy's address from his e-mail, let me know, I'll send my buddies Guido and Thumbs Louie over to his house and let them rip off his front porch with their teeth, okay?
Prototype, free-lance, proto-lance--whatever, it's first and foremost a HOBBY and hobbies are meant to be enjoyed. If I want to number my two Akane M-4 Missabe yellowstones in Denver and Rio Grande and assign them the never-was 3900 series, I'll bloody well DO it! In fact, I have. And my Rio Grande Yuba River sub runs where Rio Grande (or ANY railroad for that matter) never ran, the North Yuba River country of the California Sierra Nevadas. And if THAT upsets anyone, well--whoop-de-effing-do!
Oh, my goodness--is that a Pennsy J-1a hauling a coal train over Yuba Pass? HORRORS!! Yah, right. If whatever kind of 'lancing' we call it is ruining the hobby, then the hobby must have died a really TERRIBLE death with John Allen, back in the 'fifties. Or Bill McClanahan or Malcolm Furlow.
Like I said, let me know, and I'll call up Guido and Thumbs Louie. They work cheap, they'll probably do it for a large sausage and pepperoni pizza.
Tom View my layout photos! http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm310/TWhite-014/Rio%20Grande%20Yuba%20River%20Sub One can NEVER have too many Articulateds!
Pay no heed to the haters. They have no pride of their own so they always feel the need to drag everyone else down to their pathetic level.
As for freelancing I would say just about all of model railroading is freelancing to an extent. Some like to model a completely fictitious railroad in a completely fictitious locale, others like to model a fictitious railroad in a real place. Others still like myself model a real railroad in a fictitious place while even more model a real railroad in a real place as they wish it existed. Even those who go the real railroad, real place route often times model a fictitious segment of the real place. So when you get down to it in a way freelancers are probably the largest part of the hobby.
BRAKIE wrote:Yes the following hobbyist is wanted for murder of the hobby by freelance.Tony Koester-now hiding behind the moniker of NKP Clover Leaf District.Allen McClellandBruce ChubbBill DarnabyEric BroomanDavid BarrowGeorge SelliosLance MindheimBrakieand many John Does.Yup murderers all!
Yes the following hobbyist is wanted for murder of the hobby by freelance.
Tony Koester-now hiding behind the moniker of NKP Clover Leaf District.
Allen McClelland
Bruce Chubb
Bill Darnaby
Eric Brooman
David Barrow
George Sellios
Lance Mindheim
Brakie
and many John Does.
Yup murderers all!
Don't forget Malcolm Furlow (my hero)
tatans wrote:What is the definition of "freelance" ? ? and what does it have to do with model railroading??? I think I understand the meaning of "prototype" which means recreating the EXACT reproduction of the real thing(all of which we know CANNOT be done) so it would seem ALL model railroading is "Freelance" no??????
Like this.These are pictures on my freelance short line Columbus & Hocking Valley.
tatans wrote:What is the definition of "freelance" ? ? and what does it have to do with model railroading???
tomikawaTT wrote:The first of anything, model or 1:1 scale, is a freelance design. Everything of the same design that comes after copies a prototype. Looked at that way, if nobody ever freelanced anything we still wouldn't have chipped flint tools to butcher whatever got dragged back to the cave by the club- and rock-armed hunters.
The first of anything, model or 1:1 scale, is a freelance design. Everything of the same design that comes after copies a prototype. Looked at that way, if nobody ever freelanced anything we still wouldn't have chipped flint tools to butcher whatever got dragged back to the cave by the club- and rock-armed hunters.
Right on target! I really have a deep respect for common sense.
Now, to quote "yeahno@hotmail.com" (Tue Feb 20 01:39:18 EST 2007) at your website...
"It's people like you who are killing our hobby, this fantasy nonsense is for 3-rail Lionel people, and judging from your posts on the MR forum..."
Just an observation...
QUERY: Have you ever run across anyone who says things out loud they haven't thought of yet?
Conemaugh Road & Traction circa 1956