best running F3?

[Anonymous]

links to each-
Athearn Genesis
Intermountain
Proto1000
Stewart

P1K seems to be the best value because you get 2 powered units (A and B) for about the same price as Geni or Stew

[tstage]

dingoix,

Of the four, I have to lean towards the Stewart. The new Canon motors are quiet and strong. Let me know if you are looking for a good and very reasonable distributor.

Tom

[Anonymous]

Looks like Stewart is the best. That's good because Stewart made a F3 painted for CGW.

[jrbernier]

The Stewart drive is rock solid. But the truth is that all 4 drives are quite good(including the P1K drive). As far as body shells go, the Genesis is the best, followed by the newer Intermountain(better handrails), Stewart, and then the P1K. Note that the Stewart shells have no handrails, and the P1K shells have molded on handrails. What you want for CGW F3's are the phase 2 version, with either the high or the countersunk fans, depending on the delivery dates. The CGW bought 12 ABA sets of F3's, and then bought 12 additional B units to make them ABBA sets(101ABCD-112ABCD). They later bought 3 ABBA sets of phase 4 F3's(the 'F5' - 113ABCD-115ABCD). They also bought 'passenger' units( a mix of 7 F5/F7 engines - 150-156) with S/G and no D/B. They finished off their passenger purchases with that famous ABBBBBA set of 2 FP7's and 5 F7B's(all with D/B and S/G - 116ABCDEFG). These were all delivered in the maroon/red paint scheme. In the mid 50's the went to a solid maroon scheme, and in 1963 they started painting the F's in the red paint scheme(after delivery of the red GP30's). The original paint scheme used the 'Corn Belt Route' logo, and the solid maroon or red schemes used the 'Lucky Strike' style of logo. In the 60's, I used to watch 6 unit sets of F's leave S St Paul with solid blocks of Swift/Armour meat reefers t the head end of the train, followed by the rest of the mixed freight. Large/Long trains - they called them 'Mortgage Lifters'. BTW, I have never seen a CGQ F with MU on the nose(until after the CNW merger). The 'A' units always ran leading or trailing in the engine consist.

Jim

[moparman48]

I have eight or ten Stewarts, eight P1K, and eight Genesis. (one can never have enough F units).The Stewarts ran good but some including the one I just got on e-bay are very noisy, need to completely take them apart and rework them, after that they are nice. The P1K are nice but lately I had to replce six gears ala GP7. So far the Genesis are great with no work needed. However, we are comparing apples with oranges when it comes to $$$. Everything else being equal, I think the Stewarts pull the best. Now if only Atlas would jump into the "F" market again. I'm always looking for a good ATSF F unit.

[Anonymous]

Jim, you're absolutley right on the CGW info. They didn't have MU hoses on the front of their A units. Must have been cool to see a set of 6 F units.

[Soo Line fan]

I have 2 sets of the Stewarts, add some detail and they are real nice.

Jim

[Anonymous]

One thing I know for sure: the Intermountain drives are the smoothest I have. The Genesis units look better mostly because of the windows: in the IM's, they seem too small. The thing is, they are not, they only seem so b/c of the way they're mounted in the shell. I have two IM Erie F3a units, and i'm looking to painting the inside of the shell black, or grey, where the window is mounted. Does anyone have experience with this?

[tomikawaTT]

Can't speak for the ones you listed. The last F-3 I had was a Varney. (It was one of the best arguments for steam that I ever encountered.)

[Anonymous]

Stewarts hands down, i own three AB sets they are awesome,terrific pullers and so quiet you have to listen to see if they are running. buy a Stewart you will not be sorry.

[bogp40]

A highliner(Genesis) shell on a Stewart/ Kato drive would be the ultimate. 11 of my F's are the Stewart/Kato. Unbelievable runners and never a problem or a noise in the drive, My ABBA F-3s have had some serious use running at shows for hours on end for the past 10 years. Stewart's do need a considerable amount of detailing, however, unlike the Genesis. I have 6 newer Stewarts, the drive is good but nowhere as great as the earlier Kato, 2 of them were somewhat noisey, hope a bit of run in will quiet them. The wiring on the chassis is a bit heavy and stiff, but doesn't seem to affect the truck movement. I can't comment on the Genesis drive, personally, only know that all the ones in the club seem to run very good and no problems so far.
Bob K.

[Anonymous]

I have an ABBA Set of Proto 1000. GN.

I have to report they have have the same rugged performance as an athearn. Mine have encountered a few mishaps and just like the athearns. Bru***he dust off. touch up the paint and they just keep on going down the track.

James

[Texas Zepher]

I own several sets of three of the four. Genesis, P1K, and Stewart (both Kato and Buelher powered).

All three run great.

I had pulling power issues with the Genesis not being able to pull the SuperChief (17 cars) it was designed for.

I agree about the value of P1K. They are possibly the best value in locomotives when not considering sales and the like. In Caboose Hobbies last summer I came across a mother purchasing a train for her boy. They had selected two of the really cheap ones ($11-19) for consideration (Bachmann and Life-Like maybe?). Anyway I had just seen a set of the P1Ks over on the clearance table ($30) so I showed them to her. I explained that even though it wasn't the road name they were looking for the "running" enjoyment was worth the extra $. Then at the clearance price they were probably the best valued item in the entire store. When she still looked a bit undecided I gave her my card and told her if they got them home and didn't like them I would buy them from her. I hope since I haven't heard anything they are still performing for her little boy.

[Anonymous]

Gotta love my Stewarts[:D]

Best thing to MU with Kato and Atlas geeps!!!!!

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the replies. I do intend to buy a P1K because it's such a good deal. But I'll get some Stewarts that are in CGW paint too.

[Anonymous]

Another poll...

[Don Gibson]

RUNNING?
Stewart and Intermountain.
(Genesis has had QC problems
SHELLS:
Genesis & Intermountain
(Stewart's were tooled what - 15 years ago?)

(New) F-3's: OVERALL? (I like the high fans 

Intermountain                                                                                                                                            Intermoutain (a'puller')
Genesis (lighting)                                                                                                                       Stewart(smooth)
Proto 1K, not 2K (a BB chassis copy)

Varney (long gone orphan)

[AustraliaJim]

I have a P1K A-B unit and they run very poorly. I purchased them new and about two weeks later both the A and B units started making a noise like gear back lash or motor squeel. I contacted Life Like ( I could not send them back as I live in Australia)
Life like sent me two brand new chassis with motors. I put these on my track and straight away they made the same noise. I have removed the motors, pulled them apart and lightly oiled the armatures, I have greased the gears, I have replaced the gears, I have thrown them against the wall, but they still make the noise!
I have also tried selling them on Ebay with the spare chassis but no one wants them.
Any help would be appreciatd???????? (on fixing them)

Australia Jim.

[james saunders]

Australia Jim they arent the Santa fe set on there now are they?

just checking, btw where abouts in Aus are you, im in Brisbane

my names james also

OZJIM

[AustraliaJim]

James, sorry for not replying. I haven't been on these forums for months. The noisy set I "still have" are the NYC lightning stripe ones. I just use the old clunkers to pull my track cleaning cars now. That's all they're good for.

I'm in Melbourne by the way. 

 

Cheers

Jim. 

[twhite]

I have the Genesis powered F-3 A/B set in Rio Grande colors for my BLI Cal Zephyr cars, and I couldn't be happier, either with the detail or the running qualities (I'm strictly DC, so no sound here).  I have no problem pulling the 11-car train up my 2-2.4% grades at all.  Smooth, quiet, beautifully detailed--I'm not much of a diesel fan, but I couldn't ask for a better running set. 

Tom  

[dti406]

My best runing F3 is the Hobbytown Multidrive with Cary Metal Bodies.  This unit can pull plaster off the walls.  I have hauled over 100 cars with this unit.

Regards

Rick 

 

 

 

[don7]

I have units from each of the four and I would rate them as follows:

Intermountain

Genesis

Stewart - Would be 2nd if more detailed.

Proto

By coincidence you will find this is also the order of the pricing

[Lillen]

I got several PCM F3's and are very happy with them. My BLI F7 is one of my most dependable units as well.

 

I think that the Proto F3's lack some detail but they are nice to.

 

Magnus

[Don Gibson]

LifeF-Like's F3's are only available with Proto 1000 chassis, wheras their F7's are only available as Proto 2000's. There is a BIG dfference!

Wheras Intermountain, Genisis, and Stewart offer both F7's & F3's as their top offering, LL. doesn't. Genesis' F3 ATSF freight comes with low fans.

Many neophites like the Genesis' passenger F7's chrome plating , but Intermountain's paint job looks more like actual ATSF's stainless steel, (on display at the Sac. Railway Museum).

[grayfox1119]

I just purchased an InterMountain F3A & B set at my LHS, so it is gratifying to hear the comments from Don7 et al . It is nice to hear comments from those who own all 4 manufacturers, as they can give an unbiased opinion.

[don7]

I just purchased an InterMountain F3A & B set at my LHS, so it is gratifying to hear the comments from Don7 et al . It is nice to hear comments from those who own all 4 manufacturers, as they can give an unbiased opinion.

I do not know why the Intermountain seems to lag behind in popularity, they are superb running engines. 

From my diesel roster I consider my Intermountain F7A-B to be my finest running engine. It is in the Yellowbonnet paint scheme.

[Don Gibson]

I have the Genesis powered F-3 A/B set in Rio Grande colors for my BLI Cal Zephyr cars, and I couldn't be happier, either with the detail or the running qualities (I'm strictly DC, so no sound here).  I have no problem pulling the 11-car train up my 2-2.4% grades at all.  Smooth, quiet, beautifully detailed... I couldn't ask for a better running set. - Tom  

 If you are pleased, good. Tom, the problem with Athearn has been indifferent QC. (SOME units didn't run as good as others). How have you found the Cal. Zepher cars?

I believe ALL Genesis 'F's were powered, A & B. Early units had QSI sound.

[Thommo]

My only experience with F's is with Genesis B&O F3 with DCC and sound. Engine is very nicely detailed and runs smoothly, only thing I am not 100% satisfied is minimum speed, it cannot crawl as some Roco or P2K locos.

Loco has MRC sound&drive decoder, and is run with Roco Multimaus DCC system, so maybe the "not-so-low" minimum speed would be better with more quality decoder or/and DCC system...

[twhite]

I have the Genesis powered F-3 A/B set in Rio Grande colors for my BLI Cal Zephyr cars, and I couldn't be happier, either with the detail or the running qualities (I'm strictly DC, so no sound here).  I have no problem pulling the 11-car train up my 2-2.4% grades at all.  Smooth, quiet, beautifully detailed... I couldn't ask for a better running set. - Tom  

 How have you found the Cal. Zepher cars?

Don--I had a few derailment problems with a couple of the BLI CZ cars, but it turned out that the trucks had been installed too tightly--even for my 34" radii!  It was a simple matter to fix.  Other than that, I'm very satisfied with them--very nice detail.  Right now I'm trying to get the courage to open them up to 'populate' the train, but they don't look easy to get into without possibly damaging them, so I'm leaving that for a future project.  As far as weight and rolling qualities, they're really superb.  I'm hoping that the BLI Dayight cars will run as well--assuming they ever come OUT, of course!

Question--you mentioned QC--is this a problem with the Genesis or just the standard Athearn? 

Tom